Over weight baby - Child abuse?

emilymemily

Theres this woman that I used to go to school with, we're friends on facebook and when we bump into each other we have a quick chat, she's quite heavy and has been since ive known her, the thing is.. and I know its not my business really but her baby is obese, the child is not even one and looks the size of a 3 year old.
Theres no medical conditions, she's the type to post everything from a nappy rash to serious illness and personal stories on facebook. The child is just really really obese, she calls the child 'pud' and 'pudding' in reference to his weight. Id never say anything of course but isnt that child abuse?
When parents over feed their children theyre setting them up for a life time of unhealthy eating habits and a multitude of health problems. If someone underfed their child theyd be accused of neglect and the child would be taken into care, why is it not the same for over feeding children?

wexie

Oh yay, this thread will definitely go well and will be full of polite and well thought out remarks.

Personally I think it's hard to say without seeing the actual babies. Healthy (young babies) certainly usually are pretty chubby which they eventually grow out of, in my experience once they start moving around a bit more and from what I understand this can be more pronounced in bottle fed babies. If it's actually as big as you say it is then of course that's not a good thing.

Whether or not it constitutes child abuse I don't know, I think I'd call it poor or uninformed parenting. Certainly in the eyes of the law/HSE/whatever it wouldn't be considered child abuse but that's not a particularly high bar.

corks finest

emilymemily wrote: »

Theres this woman that I used to go to school with, we're friends on facebook and when we bump into each other we have a quick chat, she's quite heavy and has been since ive known her, the thing is.. and I know its not my business really but her baby is obese, the child is not even one and looks the size of a 3 year old.
Theres no medical conditions, she's the type to post everything from a nappy rash to serious illness and personal stories on facebook. The child is just really really obese, she calls the child 'pud' and 'pudding' in reference to his weight. Id never say anything of course but isnt that child abuse?
When parents over feed their children theyre setting them up for a life time of unhealthy eating habits and a multitude of health problems. If someone underfed their child theyd be accused of neglect and the child would be taken into care, why is it not the same for over feeding children?

Obese kid obese parent

Pac1Man

It is a form of child abuse in my opinion (although not from a legal standing). You're giving them such a disadvantage starting out, both medically and socially. You can't blame a lack of knowledge now either with the information that is available to us.

Graces7

emilymemily wrote: »

Theres this woman that I used to go to school with, we're friends on facebook and when we bump into each other we have a quick chat, she's quite heavy and has been since ive known her, the thing is.. and I know its not my business really but her baby is obese, the child is not even one and looks the size of a 3 year old.
Theres no medical conditions, she's the type to post everything from a nappy rash to serious illness and personal stories on facebook. The child is just really really obese, she calls the child 'pud' and 'pudding' in reference to his weight. Id never say anything of course but isnt that child abuse?
When parents over feed their children theyre setting them up for a life time of unhealthy eating habits and a multitude of health problems. If someone underfed their child theyd be accused of neglect and the child would be taken into care, why is it not the same for over feeding children?

Surely the baby is still being seen by health care? Not sure what the system is here.

There may be factors you are unaware of also.

TheMilkyPirate

100% a form of child abuse. It sickens me to see obese kids, Are there parents just ignoring it or what?

FFred

Scuttery cow .. Scuttery calf

somesoldiers

hummm both our boys were born at big weights, 11 7lbs the eldest. looked quite chubby up to he got more active at 15 months or so, then the puppy fat flew off.
Youngest is going the same way, maybe a bit of this going on also?

I was a big of a fatty myself when the eldest was born though I decided to go the other way and get more active myself, here I am 6st lighter and feeling all the better for it

Hitman3000

emilymemily wrote:

Theres this woman that I used to go to school with, we're friends on facebook and when we bump into each other we have a quick chat, she's quite heavy and has been since ive known her, the thing is.. and I know its not my business really but her baby is obese, the child is not even one and looks the size of a 3 year old. Theres no medical conditions, she's the type to post everything from a nappy rash to serious illness and personal stories on facebook. The child is just really really obese, she calls the child 'pud' and 'pudding' in reference to his weight. Id never say anything of course but isnt that child abuse? When parents over feed their children theyre setting them up for a life time of unhealthy eating habits and a multitude of health problems. If someone underfed their child theyd be accused of neglect and the child would be taken into care, why is it not the same for over feeding children?

You could have picked a better forum than AH to put this in, unless you are seeking spiteful nasty responses...

wexie

Graces7 wrote: »

Surely the baby is still being seen by health care? Not sure what the system is here.

There's regular developmental checkups but I don't think the public health nurse would have any powers other than to mention the child is overweight.

TheMilkyPirate wrote: »

100% a form of child abuse. It sickens me to see obese kids, Are there parents just ignoring it or what?

If the parents themselves are obese they'll likely not see it as an issue. You have to remember that there are people out there that think ketchup or chips can be considered one of your 5-a-day....

One eyed Jack

emilymemily wrote: »

Theres this woman that I used to go to school with, we're friends on facebook and when we bump into each other we have a quick chat, she's quite heavy and has been since ive known her, the thing is.. and I know its not my business really but her baby is obese, the child is not even one and looks the size of a 3 year old.
Theres no medical conditions, she's the type to post everything from a nappy rash to serious illness and personal stories on facebook. The child is just really really obese, she calls the child 'pud' and 'pudding' in reference to his weight. Id never say anything of course but isnt that child abuse?
When parents over feed their children theyre setting them up for a life time of unhealthy eating habits and a multitude of health problems. If someone underfed their child theyd be accused of neglect and the child would be taken into care, why is it not the same for over feeding children?

Because people passing judgement excuse themselves of any responsibility by saying it's none of their business, and so it goes unreported, and the parents aren't accused of either child neglect or abuse. That's why children continue to be neglected and abused, because the people who feign concern for the child are simply more interested in criticising and passing judgement on the parents of the child or children in question.

In short - if you actually cared for the welfare of the child, you would have reported it already, rather than posting about it on social media where nobody here can actually do anything about it to help the child in question.

whisky_galore

Know a couple with a kid, now the kid looked 'normal' sized to me, but could not get over the amount of absolute shyte food being dished out as snacks.
Like chocolate / crisps and all that, it wasn't laid out for my visit it appeared to be the everyday routine.

The wife is kind of heavy. Knew yer man from school, he was always a bit stout but now can't get over how much fatter he's gotten. Having changed jobs from mechanic to lorry driver didn't do him any favours.

wexie

One eyed Jack wrote: »

In short - if you actually cared for the welfare of the child, you would have reported it already, rather than posting about it on social media where nobody here can actually do anything about it to help the child in question.

Honest question....

Report it to whom? And what do you think would happen?

I agree by the way about the whole posting on social media, just not too sure what else you might be able to do other than try to speak to the parents and I totally see why people wouldn't want to do that because it's hardly likely to go over well.

seamus

TheMilkyPirate wrote: »

100% a form of child abuse. It sickens me to see obese kids, Are there parents just ignoring it or what?

They don't see it.

Literally, do not see their child as fat.

"Abuse" is too strong a term, it implies malice; either deliberate or incidental.

"Neglect" is a better term as it implies that the child's needs are not being fulfilled because of apathy or ignorance.

My experience is that PHN's are not slow to tell parents when their babies fall outside the bell curve. I have no doubt the woman in the OP is told her baby is fat every time she attends one.

But she doesn't see it, not really. "She's just a bit of a pudding", "It's puppy fat", "She'll grow out of it". and so forth.

But realistically what can the state do? Start taking fat children away? That's a dangerous precedent - what other classes of neglect would be included? 6 year olds who can't count to ten? 12 year olds who don't play any sports?

Certainly something a little more heavy-handed could work, like a mandatory visit from Tusla. But it's not easy to change people's perspective on this.

Neyite

There's usually developmental checks around 18 months or 2 years, and if a child is showing signs of excessive weight for their height /age, the nurse will be blunt on telling the mother about it and giving her a lecture on obesity, given a nutrition book and maybe even a follow up check scheduled.

It's worth pointing out though that some babies that age can get very 'fat' but it usually melts away when they start to become mobile and burn it off. You can't put a baby that on a diet or restrict food, all you can do is give them healthy food.

It does balance out when they are toddlers /kids if parents keep the healthy food choices and not switch to junk.

biko

Are you giving your child meat?
In my vegan opinion that is abuse*

Sugary drinks?
Call da cops!


*everyone is someone else's bad person.

One eyed Jack

wexie wrote: »

Honest question....

Report it to whom? And what do you think would happen?

They could start here:

TUSLA: Contact a social worker

Or make a report in their local Garda station.

If the social worker or the Garda agreed with the OP then an investigation would be carried out, the Gardaí would liaise with social services (for all the criticism they receive as organisations, there are some fantastic people working in both the Gardaí and social services), and both the parents and the children would be offered the help they need if it was decided they actually needed help. Sometimes it's decided that it's in the best interests of the child to temporarily remove them from the family home, but always with the intention that the child or children will return to the family home at some point.

I agree by the way about the whole posting on social media, just not too sure what else you might be able to do other than try to speak to the parents and I totally see why people wouldn't want to do that because it's hardly likely to go over well.

Exactly, they're more concerned for their own welfare than they are the welfare of the child, so nothing is done and the child in their eyes continues to be neglected and abused while they know about it, and do nothing.

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Dravokivich

My nephew could have been considered obese too juding by the OP's observation. But you've to remember they're very small. Most of them will grow out of it. People here talking about them burning it off when getting more active, forget to mention they can also start to lose it as they get taller.

wexie

One eyed Jack wrote: »

They could start here:
If the social worker or the Garda agreed with the OP then an investigation would be carried out, the Gardaí would liaise with social services (for all the criticism they receive as organisations, there are some fantastic people working in both the Gardaí and social services), and both the parents and the children would be offered the help they need if it was decided they actually needed help. Sometimes it's decided that it's in the best interests of the child to temporarily remove them from the family home, but always with the intention that the child or children will return to the family home at some point.

I don't know Jack, I'd love to believe that something would be done, I'm by no means advocating the children being taken away from these parents but if that child is indeed so overweight it's clear these parents could do with a bit of help and a dose of reality.

But from what I gather the resources simply aren't there. I'd would really love to be wrong on that though. There's no denying at this stage that obesity is going to become a very serious health issue (more so than it already is)

heretothere

You can't mention that a child is over weight without people screaming that it is a medical condition etc.

No for most kids it simply is NOT a medical condition it is over eating and under exercising. All you have to do is think back to your own childhood. I was in primary school in the 90s in a class of about 35 one girl was very over weight and one girl was a bit pudgy. The rest of us were whip-its.

LirW

I don't know, I think self-diagnosing overweight in a 1 year old is difficult. My boy was breast fed and that child was MASSIVE. Seriously huge and chubby. As the years went on the pudginess went and it turned out he's a big lad with a pretty solid frame. He's 7 and has the height and the weight of a 10 year old and he's totally in proportion. The nurses closely monitor that and are quite blunt about it, when the kid is on their own individual curve, so be it.
Of course it's more likely to have an obese child when the parents are obese but in such a young age it's a dangerous assumption because it could be that they're just like it.
I got lots of remarks from others too that the kid is so pudgy and big and there was literally nothing I could do about it. He grew out of it and is simply a tall boy with a pretty muscular frame, something that runs in his father's family, They're all between 185 and 200 cm an have athletes frames. The daughter on the other hand is small and petite and more on the small side.

Graces7

Neyite wrote: »

There's usually developmental checks around 18 months or 2 years, and if a child is showing signs of excessive weight for their height /age, the nurse will be blunt on telling the mother about it and giving her a lecture on obesity, given a nutrition book and maybe even a follow up check scheduled.

It's worth pointing out though that some babies that age can get very 'fat' but it usually melts away when they start to become mobile and burn it off. You can't put a baby that on a diet or restrict food, all you can do is give them healthy food.

It does balance out when they are toddlers /kids if parents keep the healthy food choices and not switch to junk.

Thanks. Much the same as the UK system although some kids fall through the net for various reasons .

farmchoice

One eyed Jack wrote: »

They could start here:

TUSLA: Contact a social worker

Or make a report in their local Garda station.

If the social worker or the Garda agreed with the OP then an investigation would be carried out, the Gardaí would liaise with social services (for all the criticism they receive as organisations, there are some fantastic people working in both the Gardaí and social services), and both the parents and the children would be offered the help they need if it was decided they actually needed help. Sometimes it's decided that it's in the best interests of the child to temporarily remove them from the family home, but always with the intention that the child or children will return to the family home at some point.





Exactly, they're more concerned for their own welfare than they are the welfare of the child, so nothing is done and the child in their eyes continues to be neglected and abused while they know about it, and do nothing.

I'd defiantly go down the cops route, in fact if it was me and i saw a chubby child and i knew what the OP knows about the mother ( her address, bit chunky herself etc) id simply call 999 and report it as a crime in progress.
this is too important to be left to an internet discussion board 999 now and if nothing happens within a few hours call again and sure you might as well call tulsa while you have the phone in your hand.

Hector Bellend

emilymemily wrote: »

Theres this woman that I used to go to school with, we're friends on facebook and when we bump into each other we have a quick chat, she's quite heavy and has been since ive known her, the thing is.. and I know its not my business really but her baby is obese, the child is not even one and looks the size of a 3 year old.
Theres no medical conditions, she's the type to post everything from a nappy rash to serious illness and personal stories on facebook. The child is just really really obese, she calls the child 'pud' and 'pudding' in reference to his weight. Id never say anything of course but isnt that child abuse?
When parents over feed their children theyre setting them up for a life time of unhealthy eating habits and a multitude of health problems. If someone underfed their child theyd be accused of neglect and the child would be taken into care, why is it not the same for over feeding children?

If youre so concerned why didn't you say it to her?

facehugger99

Yeah, I hate seeing fat parents with a fat kid in tow.

It may not be abuse but it's incredibly irresponsible parenting.

You are literally disadvantaging your child whether consciously or not by instilling very damaging and unhealthy eating habits.

I do the shopping and see a lot of fat parents with their trolleys full of cheap, sugary ****e, no fresh fruit or veg, just processed crap. The supermarkets and producers are part of the problem as the amount of 'value deals' that center around buying crap is disgusting.

There's obviously an element of lack of education about food nutrition too.
And topping it all off, there are a bunch a fat obvious,lazy arsehole parents who genuinely don't give a fcuk beyond where there next sugar hit is coming from.

So yeah, it's a complex issue.

wexie

facehugger99 wrote: »

I do the shopping and see a lot of fat parents with their trolleys full of cheap, sugary ****e, no fresh fruit or veg, just processed crap. The supermarkets and producers are part of the problem as the amount of 'value deals' that center around buying crap is disgusting.

I think this is a really big issue, the fact you can go into the supermarket and buy fish fingers, chips and beans for a fiver. Really healthy foods should be cheaper and all the mass produced processed stuff.

Not sure what could be done about it though. But I think it's bizarre you could buy a giant pack of custard creams for less than the price of a bag of apples.

Graces7

wexie wrote: »

I think this is a really big issue, the fact you can go into the supermarket and buy fish fingers, chips and beans for a fiver. Really healthy foods should be cheaper and all the mass produced processed stuff.

Not sure what could be done about it though. But I think it's bizarre you could buy a giant pack of custard creams for less than the price of a bag of apples.

All the supermarkets have a variety of fruit and vegetables at 49 cents. Even SV these days.. Getting kids to eat it is what matters,from an early age

Skyfloater

I think it suits some obese parents to have obese children, so that they can point to them and say "Look you see, I've tried to do something about my own weight, but it's all genetic"

mcmoustache

biko wrote: »

Are you giving your child meat?
In my vegan opinion that is abuse*

Sugary drinks?
Call da cops!


*everyone is someone else's bad person.

This isn't really the same though. The parents are turning their kid, who has no choice in the matter, into a fat-assed pudgy thing who'll have difficulty getting a shift, let alone a ride. At best he'll be resigned to riding other lard-arses and that's not pretty.

heretothere

facehugger99 wrote: »

The supermarkets and producers are part of the problem as the amount of 'value deals' that center around buying crap is disgusting.

I often get a salad box for lunch in Mace it's €4.50 they've a great selection of diff salads and are not stingy at all so I think it's pretty good. But a hot chicken fillet roll, coke and crisps is €4! Madness

I think the main key will be education though, you can do a massive healthy shop just as cheaply as a junk shop.

BrokenArrows

Yes it is abuse.
If you're fat as a child it's likely you will spend your whole life fighting with weight gain.

c68zapdsm5i1ru

I think abuse is a bit extreme.

But I do think parents who fill their children with fattening sugary food, even when the child is obviously twice the size of their peers, are inadequate as parents. There was a programme on one of the English channels a couple of years ago about really youngl children having to have most of their teeth removed because they were rotten due to sugar consumption. Those parents really weren't equipped to have full charge of their children. Neither are the parents whose children are waddling around, wearing clothes for children several years older than them, and who can't seem to understand that those children need to lose weight and start eating properly.

I think a lot of the time it's ignorance and low intelligence. But it's also parents who have developed really bad eating habits themselves and are just in denial about the whole thing. But intervention is definitely needed, for the children's sake.

c68zapdsm5i1ru

Duplicate post

Akrasia

Children come in different sizes. My young fella looked like a potato in his first passport photo, he's as skinny as a rake now, I've got nephews who are in the top 2% in weight for their age, but that's because they're broad and tall but they're not fat at all.

New parents have home visits from the public health nurse and these can be more frequent depending on the health of the child or any concerns the public health nurse has about the parenting habits of the parents.

If the child is obese at a very young age, those parents are probably within the radar of the public health nurses in their area.

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wexie

....... wrote: »

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4 euro?

https://www.tesco.ie/groceries/Product/Details/?id=299598018

56 cents for a cheese and ham pizza

how do they manage to make a cheese and ham pizza for 56 cents, distribute it and sell it. And that's not a special offer? And quite what nutritional value does one get from 56 cents worth of pizza?

Something really very odd about our societies and economies these days

(just for comparison a cucumber is 59 cents https://www.tesco.ie/groceries/Product/Details/?id=253558972, love cucumber with the weather like this so I do)

DEFTLEFTHAND

heretothere wrote: »

I often get a salad box for lunch in Mace it's €4.50 they've a great selection of diff salads and are not stingy at all so I think it's pretty good. But a hot chicken fillet roll, coke and crisps is €4! Madness

I think the main key will be education though, you can do a massive healthy shop just as cheaply as a junk shop.

People know that really.

The crap tastes nice and is simple to prepare.

People take the lazy option. Human nature.

Graces7

BrokenArrows wrote: »

Yes it is abuse.
If you're fat as a child it's likely you will spend your whole life fighting with weight gain.

This is a baby?

Bredabe

According to my research on child nutrition/growth, 1 in 3 children has 2 or more allergies before they start school. some allergies like wheat/milk cause extreme bloating that they look and weight heavier than they do when they stop taking the allergen. Allergies have a genetic component and as such awareness of them in a family maybe lacking or dismissed.

Lots of small kids dislike veg/fruit and if they are allergic to these which may or not be the case in Op, then forcing them to eat these things could set up a body crisis over time(where the body has an extreme reaction to fruit/veg{think peanut allergy})

Working with a dietitian for years who tells me nothing wrong with fish fingers(assuming there is not an allergy to the coating) IF its the only way to get fish into a child who is fish tolerant but not fish acceptant.

Fat is not always about calories:

metaoblivia

I think abuse is a stretch, but I wish there was more support for families struggling with obesity. My aunt has been obese for most of her life. She was diagnosed with a thyroid condition when she was a teenager, so that's part of the issue. Both of her daughters grew up obese and as they've grown into adults, they've stayed obese. And not for lack of trying! Both of my cousins have really tried to lose the weight with varying levels of success, but it's never translated long term.

The problem is - and studies have shown this - once your body settles into being obese or even overweight, it becomes much harder to shift that weight because your body is constantly fighting to go back to the weight it had settled on. It requires much more willpower to lose weight as an obese person than it does to maintain weight as a thin person who's never been obese. So when people start out obese as children, it puts them on a really tough path, even if they learn healthy habits later on.

But I don't think the solution is to label these parents abusers, because I think the majority of the time, they're simply living the life they know how to live. So I prefer to see it in terms of support - what can we do as a community to offer these families support? We can encourage healthy eating habits and physical activity at schools. We can offer healthy living programs to parents and families - things like showing them how to cook quick, healthy, flavorful meals. That leaves it in the hands of the parents to follow through, and not all of them will. But at least there would be something there. I think anything further would be seen as government overreach. And the body positive moment is currently in a state where many of them refuse to even acknowledge the health issues that go along with obesity. They would absolutely see this issue as an attack on them.

jigglypuffstuff

It will never be considered child abuse ... but it should be because the statistics from the GUI study really are a shocker

Then again...take a look at the obese/overweight rate amongst the adult population...it's frightening really

ED E

I get angry when I see owners with dogs carrying an extra 40% bodyweight, fat babies are just depressing.


I'll get ripped a new one for this but as a nation we need to stop excusing obesity. Say anything and you're fat shaming. You wouldn't applaud somebody when they say they have cancer so why do it when they say they're 150kg and "body proud".

Drink driving became unacceptable socially and has fallen off a cliff. Time to do the same with obesity.

Cupcake_Crisis

Abuse is far too strong a word, especially for a one year old. My niece was basically a potato with a face for the first 18 months but as soon as she started tearing around the place it all started to come off, now she’s a whip of a thing. Her mother, being on the heavy side herself, used to get awful looks. People assumed she was over feeding the child (she wasn’t) because she was big herself. There’s a lot of factors at play but people are too quick to judge and not very quick to try and change anything.

facehugger99

There are certain Irish mammies that have a 'fat baby = healthy baby' thing going on.

My SIL was like this, constantly shoveling cow and gate into her baby. Would start fretting if he didn't finish the jar and would be back at him 5 minutes later trying to cram a couple more spoons in.

Kid is 7 now and a chunky little fecker to boot. Terrible diet too, only seems to eat chicken nuggets and chips from what I can make out.

meeeeh

Young children come in contact with health professionals quite a bit. It's their job to confront or advise parents if there is an issue. It's not a job of judgemental busybody who knows nothing about the child but likes to criticise others to make themselves feel a bit better. There are so many so called concerned obesity 'experts' that we would eradicate obesity decades ago if their approach worked.

facehugger99

D

meeeeh wrote: »

There are so many so called concerned obesity 'experts' that we would eradicate obesity decades ago if their approach worked.

It’s hardly that complicated.

Eat less crap, exercise more.

Not exactly rocket science.

meeeeh

facehugger99 wrote: »

D

It’s hardly that complicated.

Eat less crap, exercise more.

Not exactly rocket science.

Right, how many did you cure?

facehugger99

facehugger99 wrote: »

D

It’s hardly that complicated.

Eat less crap, exercise more.

Not exactly rocket science.

Unfortunately obesity often has a large psychological component to it. Eating less and exercising more is not always the easy solution.

Cupcake_Crisis

facehugger99 wrote: »

D

It’s hardly that complicated.

Eat less crap, exercise more.

Not exactly rocket science.

If it was that easy no one would be overweight

ED E

Its not easy but it is simple. There's no voodoo magic involved, just effort and control.