Lever actions targeted by new offensive weapons act in the UK?

Cass

I seen an updated list of the offensive weapons act in the uk. It goes through the usual suspects of knives, acids, corrosive substances, etc. but towards the end it mentions prohibiting "high energy firearms and rapid firing firearms".

Now it also includes bump stocks and other devices designed to increase the normal rate of fire with a compensation fund to pay for anyone effected, but some people are saying this will effect not only the high end calibers (338, .50 cal, etc), but lever actions.


Personally i don't see how as any firearm such as a lever action can be a "rapid firing firearm" simply because the user/shooter can improve their technique to increase the rate of fire by not mechanical means, but does it directly effect lever actions as feared?

gunny123

Public relations stunt Cass. To the best of my knowledge no 50 bmg or .338 has ever been used in a crime in the uk.

The crime situation in london is down to the fact, that (a) there is not enough coppers on the beat to patrol such a huge city and (b) if they do stop and search someone, they can be hauled over the coals by some right-on mp like diane abbott calling them facists.

These laws will do nothing, but inconvenience people who have legitimate uses for knives or chemicals.

Cass

gunny123 wrote: »

Public relations stunt Cass. To the best of my knowledge no 50 bmg or .338 has ever been used in a crime in the uk. .

I get that part, but some lads are concerned it will effect lever actions, but i'm at a loss.

Granted i did not read any of the documents. There are dozens of pages, and stuff and stuff ..................... Wondering does it actually state lever actions. I#m assuming lads have read it and this is why they are concerned.

gunny123

Good discussion on another forum i do be on occassionally. I think its the semi-semi auto rifle they want to ban. That is rifles that use the propellant gas to remove the spent case from the chamber, and lock the bolt back, you then thumb a lever to release it again and chamber a fresh round.

Again i don't think they have been used in crime either.

Apparently some of the uk Fudds are welcoming this, and some of the uk shooting orgs sadly.

https://www.thestalkingdirectory.co.uk/showthread.php/152728-Offensive-weapons-bill-announced

http://www.shootersrights.org/content/blogposts/troll.pdf

Cass

Cheers for the link.

13,600 joules. Holy Jebus. That would only include 50cals, and probably not all of tthem at that. A 308 with a hot load will produce over 4,500 but triple that is some task. Well if they're worried about criminals using a 37lb .50 cal rifle for a crime then more power to them. :rolleyes:

I mean whomever wrote that is waving goodbye to crazy in the rear view mirror.


I see now my mistake. They are talking about lever RELEASE and not lever action. I thought when a semi auto was converted to straight pull it left the bolt forward and you had to cycle it back and let it slam forward. Didn't know they done this lever activated release of the bolt.

Would there be many of these types?

gunny123

Cass wrote: »

Cheers for the link.

13,600 joules. Holy Jebus. That would only include 50cals, and probably not all of tthem at that. A 308 with a hot load will produce over 4,500 but triple that is some task. Well if they're worried about criminals using a 37lb .50 cal rifle for a crime then more power to them. :rolleyes:

I mean whomever wrote that is waving goodbye to crazy in the rear view mirror.


I see now my mistake. They are talking about lever RELEASE and not lever action. I thought when a semi auto was converted to straight pull it left the bolt forward and you had to cycle it back and let it slam forward. Didn't know they done this lever activated release of the bolt.

Would there be many of these types?

They will be next Cass, some Grand Poobah in a government dept will get the notion and that will be that.

I dunno about how many are over there in the UK, Grizzly45 would be your man to ask about that.

BillBen

Was over in bisley a number of weeks ago and there were a number of people using 9mm leaver release carbines. I got talking to one of the guys and was told that a lot of people in his club have them. By all accounts they are extremely popular

Grizzly 45

It is specifically targeting MARS rifles and lever release. This came directly from the Home office and Assoc of police,as the MARS system was built specifically to t get around the prohibition 100% legally of semi-auto rifles in the UK.:mad:APCO has always had a bee under their helmets about this system and has tried everything to not license them at all. This is the UK coppers throwing their weight about and punishing any innovativeness on shooters parts in a "You build em, we'll make sure we ban em hur hur" attitude.:mad:

Same with this nonsense of the 50 cals.Notice the scary military term of "Anti-material rifle"[make it sound like a yoke from Star Wars] Yeah I can see Abdul and Massoud going into breaking into someone's house to get hold of an antique 20 lb 50 cal Boyes anti-tank rifle and running off with a half scaffolding pole length gun. However, I can see 480 Chetac or the like becoming very popular in the UK, after all California introduced such a ban[Under the governorship of that Austrian idiot Schwarzenegger ]with almost the same legal terms.

Grizzly 45

I see now my mistake. They are talking about lever RELEASE and not lever action. I thought when a semi auto was converted to straight pull it left the bolt forward and you had to cycle it back and let it slam forward. Didn't know they done this lever activated release of the bolt.

Would there be many of these types?[/QUOTE]

The first you describe is a Straight pull bolt action rifle IE it's using the return spring, along with the cam action to keep the bolt locked. That's not affected under this legislation, as it is no different from a Swiss K31 action that is well over 100-year-old design. The rifle can look any way you want, apart from it not being allowed to use semi-auto mechanical parts in the UK.So no welded up gas portholes from a genuine AR15 barrel, gas block, or bolt carrier with a gas port key.

Manual Actuated Release Systems [MARS] is wholly different. Best described as a "Semi" semi-auto rifle. The cycle of the semi-auto is interrupted in which you have in a semi-auto, bolt release, bolt picks up a round and chambers, fires, extract and eject, recoils repeat. A MARS goes bolt release, bolt picks up a round chamber, fires,extracts&ejects, recoils.STOPS.Until either a lever is pressed to release the bolt forward again. The lever can be either a thumb lever or a 2stage trigger. Best explained in this video Also,they are hideously expensive.

gunny123

The browning maral has a system where you pull the bolt handle back manually after the shot and let go, the bolt springs forward and chambers a new round. I wonder will they be banned ?

Grizzly 45

No,its a straight pull action.

gunny123

I cannot believe someone actually got up and spoke against a ban, the world has gone mad

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HYHA_lSfoOQ

Grizzly 45

Keep writing and lobbying...But you noticed the home sec brought up NI use of the Barrett 50 cal in NI by PIRA? And other "experts from police and security" about the MARS?In the end who do you think a bunch of wooden tops will listen to in Westminister?The "respectable and knowledgeable experts of the Plod and HO"? or some bunch of wannabe rambos, who want some sort of semi-auto thingy?Or a rifle that "could shoot thru" their armoured limos?

You can see how daft this lot are by saying that bump fire stocks attached to a bolt action make it full auto!:eek:

The only reason there is this harassment of both 50 cals and MARS is because of the UK chief constables not wanting them,and because they are peed off that the MARS and lever release specifically does give the poor Brit shooter some sort of CF semi-auto experiance[at great cost to purchase] They have even said that in their Home Office briefings.

Cass

gunny123 wrote: »

I cannot believe someone actually got up and spoke against a ban, the world has gone mad

There are an estimated 2 million regsitered/legal firearms in the UK and some 6 million air rifle (a lot of which are not classed as firearms so no registration) which puts their shooting community at about 8,000,000. That is a 1:10 ratio of firearm ownership compared to our 1:33 (allowing for multiple ownership).

IOW a much, much bigger shooting community and a far larger voice for combating change. That and the ban is bat sh*t crazy. A publicity stunt.

Grizzly 45

But, with more special interest groups than you could shake a stick at,and their key groups are still led by the day before yesterday's men. Fuddism and appeasement still reign supreme. Wasnt it BASC that applauded the ban on bumpfire stocks? What exactly were they thinking people were going to attach them to? You need a CF SA for them to work, and the UK hasn't had those since 1987.:rolleyes:
Were you to ratio this out in numbers, this affects as many UK shooters as it would CF SA shooters over here.MARS and 50 cal owners would be even less than us semi-auto owners and pistoleros over here.And we know how easy it is for minorities to be chucked to the wolves by a majority when the sht is about to get real...

cosieman

Hopefully this law does not affect us but our politicians like to copy the English politicians fuddism is a deadly disease.

Grizzly 45

At the moment, bar a doomsday scenario like a massacre with a restricted CF firearm. On the things to do list of Irish politics its somewhere past the top200 of important stuff.

cosieman

Our gun crime is somewhat high and adding more unrelated gun control actually makes them look like they give a ****.

Grizzly 45

With a possible election coming up?Dont think a solo run would be a smart thing career wise.Esp as the last debacle didnt go too well for those who tried the same stunt in the last general election. IE Mr Mc Grath and his NI road signs in his constituency.

gunny123

It turns out the reason for the proposed ban on .50's, is down to the fact there was a Birmingham gun dealer who was selling ammunition usually, but occasionally firearms too, to organised crime gangs in the west midlands area in the UK.

When he was raided and arrested, he had a .50 bmg, legitimately, in stock. This has caused the big-wigs to have a conniption. But somehow i don't see winston or jamal shooting a 20-30 lb .50bmg rifle off the back of a moped, but police seem to have a common sense bypass when in training.

So going by their logic, if he had 12 bore shotguns and .22 bolt action rifles in stock also, shouldn't they be banned too ?

Grizzly 45

Hasn't anyone pointed out that a 12 gauge in imperial measurement somewhat larger than 50 cal. [0.729 in] to the PTB in the UK?;)
Ergo they have been liscensing much bigger cal than 50 cal for decades with little or no problems.

gunny123

Grizzly 45 wrote: »

Hasn't anyone pointed out that a 12 gauge in imperial measurement somewhat larger than 50 cal. [0.729 in] to the PTB in the UK?;)
Ergo they have been liscensing much bigger cal than 50 cal for decades with little or no problems.

A bit more power in terms of power though. What does make this ridulous though, is they throw out some statistic like "a .50 bmg can kill at three miles" or " with a .50 you can shoot a helicopter down".

Yeah if you are a very experienced, well trained shot. Not a drugged up little scroat running around backstreets.