Advertisement
If you have a new account but are having problems posting or verifying your account, please email us on [email protected] for help. Thanks :)
Hello all! Please ensure that you are posting a new thread or question in the appropriate forum. The Feedback forum is overwhelmed with questions that are having to be moved elsewhere. If you need help to verify your account contact [email protected]

Western Rail Corridor / Rail Trail

24567177

Comments

  • Registered Users Posts: 1,610 ✭✭✭eastwest


    marno21 wrote: »
    Just biding their time until Canney is no longer relevant when it will be quietly dropped. Everyone knows it's out of the question.

    Why Canney hasn't done a massive U turn on this is bizarre. There seems to be a clear appetite in Tuam for a greenway on the old line judging by the events of the weekend and it could very well be his undoing at the next election.

    If you look at the west on track website it all becomes a bit clearer. Sean Canney has been associated with WOT pretty much since he got involved in politics, and has his colours nailed firmly to the WOT mast. His loyalty to the rail lobby is obviously much stronger than his loyalty to the people who elect him, but as you say, he will pay a price for that.
    The mood in Tuam appears to be very much for the greenway, judging by recent 'direct action' in particular. Logic is slowly overcoming rhetoric, it seems.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 652 ✭✭✭Muckyboots


    marno21 wrote: »
    Just biding their time until Canney is no longer relevant when it will be quietly dropped. Everyone knows it's out of the question.

    Why Canney hasn't done a massive U turn on this is bizarre. There seems to be a clear appetite in Tuam for a greenway on the old line judging by the events of the weekend and it could very well be his undoing at the next election.

    Popular Tuam based, Cllr Peter Roache has been selected for FG in Galway East. The question with the Canney dissatisfaction camp was always where these votes might go, and how this would effect him. At least 1,000 Tuam town centric votes. Roache has already showed ahead of Canney in opinion polls. With Cannon looking set to pull a sizable surplus, this is big trouble for Canney. Too late for a Greenway U-turn and Ross has thrown his Rail report in the waste paper basket.


  • Registered Users Posts: 4,282 ✭✭✭westtip


    Muckyboots wrote: »
    Ross has thrown his Rail report in the waste paper basket.

    Ah so, he has a strategy to take things forward! Thought as much.:D


  • Registered Users Posts: 4,652 ✭✭✭serfboard


    Muckyboots wrote: »
    Popular Tuam based, Cllr Peter Roache has been selected for FG in Galway East. The question with the Canney dissatisfaction camp was always where these votes might go, and how this would effect him. At least 1,000 Tuam town centric votes. Roache has already showed ahead of Canney in opinion polls. With Cannon looking set to pull a sizable surplus, this is big trouble for Canney. Too late for a Greenway U-turn and Ross has thrown his Rail report in the waste paper basket.
    From the Connacht Tribune report quoted earlier in the thread:
    It shows that Minister Ciaran Cannon of Fine Gael topping the poll on 18.4% of the vote – an increase of almost 3% on his performance last time out.

    Fianna Fail’s Deputy Anne Rabbitte is on 16.6% which is a slight increase on her 2016 vote while Deputy Canney is back on 16% which is a drop of almost 2.5%.

    But the surprise package in this whole scenario is the performance of Fine Gael’s Cllr Pete Roche who polled 15.6% of first preferences which would put him in with ‘a fighting chance’ of taking the third seat.

    And close behind is Fianna Fail’s Cllr Donagh Killilea on a very respectable 15% but he has not decided if he will contest the party convention which is due to be held in the autumn.

    All four are firmly in The Greenway camp.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 652 ✭✭✭Muckyboots


    I don't disagree with some of his vision but his pitch is rambling and incoherent. Double track Athenry to Galway and then on to Athlone to Dublin is a simple and understandable demand but his performance on Newstalk yesterday was embarrassing. I wonder what was that comment from the "Boyle listener" that they couldn't read out, but the presenter found very funny??

    http://connachttribune.ie/galway-needs-rail-link-boost/


  • Advertisement
  • Registered Users Posts: 26,809 ✭✭✭✭blanch152


    Del.Monte wrote: »
    The trouble with rail freight today is that we have long passed the tipping point, yards and gantries swept away, staff gone, sidings gone, wagons gone, locomotives..blah, blah, blah. It has little to do with distances being too short or the so-called motorway network and more to do with the State paying lip service to the railways, carbon emissions etc.etc. blah, blah. :(

    Rail freight was C19.

    Diesel Road freight was C20

    The coming age will see hybrid and electric freight, it is only a matter of time.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,610 ✭✭✭eastwest


    blanch152 wrote: »
    Rail freight was C19.

    Diesel Road freight was C20

    The coming age will see hybrid and electric freight, it is only a matter of time.
    Once they start mining coal in Ballina it will all come right.
    In the meantime, the freight we want coming out of Mayo is measured in bytes and not tonnes.


  • Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators Posts: 14,069 Mod ✭✭✭✭monument


    eastwest wrote: »
    Once they start mining coal in Ballina it will all come right.
    In the meantime, the freight we want coming out of Mayo is measured in bytes and not tonnes.

    Meanwhile, right here in Ballina, Coke are expanding and that will mean more tons being exported from Ballina.

    The way to bump up rail capacity is of course not the western railway, but rather cos-effective measures on the mainline, ie extra passing loops, etc.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,610 ✭✭✭eastwest


    monument wrote: »
    Meanwhile, right here in Ballina, Coke are expanding and that will mean more tons being exported from Ballina.

    The way to bump up rail capacity is of course not the western railway, but rather cos-effective measures on the mainline, ie extra passing loops, etc.
    I'm not sure how much coca cola freight is coming out of Ballina, but I'd hazard a guess that it's no more than one train a day. The notion that this would justify a second line to Mayo is simply not based on reality.
    As you rightly say, a few passing loops will cater for any expansion, as will Irish Rail's trialling of longer trains.
    A second line is not only not needed, it would just be a complete waste if coca cola pulls out of Ballina, which they inevitably will. Remember Asahi?


  • Registered Users Posts: 4,282 ✭✭✭westtip


    monument wrote: »
    Meanwhile, right here in Ballina, Coke are expanding and that will mean more tons being exported from Ballina.

    The way to bump up rail capacity is of course not the western railway, but rather cos-effective measures on the mainline, ie extra passing loops, etc.

    Coke certainly have no interest in shipping from anywhere but east coast ports, so necessity to use claremorrris - Athenry is meaningless for them. The extra passing loops is something many of us pro-greenway, pro-tourism, pro-meaningful railway development have advocated for a long time. I see Eamon O'Cuiv quoted a couple of posts up has started talking some sense about double tracking on the Athlone-Galway line, was he still wittering on about the WRC as well? Ah well I guess sooner or later they will be put out to grass.


  • Advertisement
  • Moderators, Entertainment Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 14,297 Mod ✭✭✭✭marno21


    westtip wrote: »
    Coke certainly have no interest in shipping from anywhere but east coast ports, so necessity to use claremorrris - Athenry is meaningless for them. The extra passing loops is something many of us pro-greenway, pro-tourism, pro-meaningful railway development have advocated for a long time. I see Eamon O'Cuiv quoted a couple of posts up has started talking some sense about double tracking on the Athlone-Galway line, was he still wittering on about the WRC as well? Ah well I guess sooner or later they will be put out to grass.
    I think monument is agreeing with you there westtip.

    As has been said, the Claremorris-Athenry section is not a requirement for increased freight operations from Ballina. The existing railway is very much underused and with passing loops there could be a lot more value achieved from the existing asset (e.g. Portarlington-Athlone-Manulla-Ballina).

    Hopefully there is enhanced freight ops and it helps strengthen the case for double tracking Portarlington-Athlone which would be very beneficial for passenger services also.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 652 ✭✭✭Muckyboots


    http://www.mayonews.ie/news/32369-taoiseach-accused-of-being-at-sixes-and-sevens-over-european-funding

    Leo Varadkar - "But it’s important to say two things. The big single investment that happened in transport in Ireland in the last seven years was the Gort to Tuam motorway … Anyone that is saying that rural Ireland was somehow mistreated compared to other parts of the country really isn’t speaking on the basis of facts …
    “There is also a misunderstanding about Ten-T. Some people seem to think that Ten-T is a big pot of money that we can draw down money for roads and railways. It’s not like structural funds. If you include something on the core network of Ten-T you have to build it and you might get a bit of money from the European Union for it. However, the chances are that the projects that get funding are ones that are trans-European, ones that are cross-border projects for example ports and airports. There isn’t a pot of European money to invest in Irish roads and railways anymore. That era is over."

    " However, Kealan Flynn, a leading authority on the matter and a former Government advisor, said the Taoiseach’s comments are contradictory. It was Mr Flynn’s Freedom of Information request which revealed, earlier this year, that Mr Varadkar had removed the Western Arc from the Core network in 2011 and brought the issue to national prominence.
    “The Taoiseach seems to be at sixes and sevens on the Ten-T,” he told The Mayo News. “On the one hand, he’s saying, mistakenly as it happens, that there is no pot of European money for road and rail infrastructure. On the other, he’s promising to keep the pledge in the Programme for Government, to reapply to get the Western Arc/Atlantic Corridor put back on the EU’s Ten-T Core road, rail, port and airport network map. Which is it? And why is the application still sitting in Dublin two years after it was meant to be sent to Brussels?
    “The EU is investing €500 billion in multi-modal (road, rail, airport and sea port) transport infrastructure from 2014-2020, with a further €250 billion needed to finish the Ten-T Core Corridors by 2030. It’s worrying to hear the Taoiseach say the cross-border element doesn’t exist because Northern Ireland is not a trans-European route. It is. And what is the Brexit backstop for, if it isn’t to protect and defend the special relationship and the all-island economy that requires these trans-European links?
    “Europe is joining the dots – and handing Ireland the pencil. Last May, Ten-T leader Brian Simpson said funding rules were being rewritten for peripheral regions. The EU is now proposing an investment package for a new maritime route to Europe via Cork and Waterford or Rosslare, as the UK will no longer be a common transit area after Brexit. This is to upgrade port and supporting infrastructure, including rail and road. On funding opportunities, Mr Simpson said: “The reality for Ireland now is, in order to get EU money, you have to apply for it. You’re pushing an open door with me. If you do not apply for the funding you will not get it, so please apply.”
    “For the Taoiseach to say there is no more EU funding, is to miss both the point and the opportunity. Ireland should grab, not spurn, the opportunities and partnerships,” said Mr Flynn."


  • Registered Users Posts: 12,363 ✭✭✭✭Del.Monte


    Does this mean that the Waterford/Rosslare Strand line will be reopening or is it needed for a Greenway?


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,610 ✭✭✭eastwest


    Muckyboots wrote: »
    http://www.mayonews.ie/news/32369-taoiseach-accused-of-being-at-sixes-and-sevens-over-european-funding

    Leo Varadkar - "But it’s important to say two things. The big single investment that happened in transport in Ireland in the last seven years was the Gort to Tuam motorway … Anyone that is saying that rural Ireland was somehow mistreated compared to other parts of the country really isn’t speaking on the basis of facts …
    “There is also a misunderstanding about Ten-T. Some people seem to think that Ten-T is a big pot of money that we can draw down money for roads and railways. It’s not like structural funds. If you include something on the core network of Ten-T you have to build it and you might get a bit of money from the European Union for it. However, the chances are that the projects that get funding are ones that are trans-European, ones that are cross-border projects for example ports and airports. There isn’t a pot of European money to invest in Irish roads and railways anymore. That era is over."

    " However, Kealan Flynn, a leading authority on the matter and a former Government advisor, said the Taoiseach’s comments are contradictory. It was Mr Flynn’s Freedom of Information request which revealed, earlier this year, that Mr Varadkar had removed the Western Arc from the Core network in 2011 and brought the issue to national prominence.
    “The Taoiseach seems to be at sixes and sevens on the Ten-T,” he told The Mayo News. “On the one hand, he’s saying, mistakenly as it happens, that there is no pot of European money for road and rail infrastructure. On the other, he’s promising to keep the pledge in the Programme for Government, to reapply to get the Western Arc/Atlantic Corridor put back on the EU’s Ten-T Core road, rail, port and airport network map. Which is it? And why is the application still sitting in Dublin two years after it was meant to be sent to Brussels?
    “The EU is investing €500 billion in multi-modal (road, rail, airport and sea port) transport infrastructure from 2014-2020, with a further €250 billion needed to finish the Ten-T Core Corridors by 2030. It’s worrying to hear the Taoiseach say the cross-border element doesn’t exist because Northern Ireland is not a trans-European route. It is. And what is the Brexit backstop for, if it isn’t to protect and defend the special relationship and the all-island economy that requires these trans-European links?
    “Europe is joining the dots – and handing Ireland the pencil. Last May, Ten-T leader Brian Simpson said funding rules were being rewritten for peripheral regions. The EU is now proposing an investment package for a new maritime route to Europe via Cork and Waterford or Rosslare, as the UK will no longer be a common transit area after Brexit. This is to upgrade port and supporting infrastructure, including rail and road. On funding opportunities, Mr Simpson said: “The reality for Ireland now is, in order to get EU money, you have to apply for it. You’re pushing an open door with me. If you do not apply for the funding you will not get it, so please apply.”
    “For the Taoiseach to say there is no more EU funding, is to miss both the point and the opportunity. Ireland should grab, not spurn, the opportunities and partnerships,” said Mr Flynn."
    Does Mr flynn not get it? An Taoiseach was pointing out that any infrastructure funding on that route will go into the N17. Apart from making the most sense, this is what most people want.
    Nobody is going to rebuild a victorian railway that nobody was using. When will that sink in with the few remaining diehards?


  • Moderators, Entertainment Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 14,297 Mod ✭✭✭✭marno21


    What's the speed limit on the stretch of line between Swinford and Kiltimagh?


  • Registered Users Posts: 6,549 ✭✭✭Pete_Cavan


    "The Taoiseach seems to be at sixes and sevens on the Ten-T,” he told The Mayo News. “On the one hand, he’s saying, mistakenly as it happens, that there is no pot of European money for road and rail infrastructure. On the other, he’s promising to keep the pledge in the Programme for Government, to reapply to get the Western Arc/Atlantic Corridor put back on the EU’s Ten-T Core road, rail, port and airport network map. Which is it?
    Thats not what Varadkar said at all. He was clearly pointing out that it isn't a case of slap a TEN-T sticker on a project and the EU will throw money at it. We have to be selective in which projects we are putting forward for funding and are prioritising cross border link projects which have the best chance of getting funding.

    He can keep the pledge in the Programme for Government to reapply to put it back on Ten-T but that won't make a blind bit of difference. There is no way it is getting funding as the amount needed would be huge and the benefits negligible.
    For the Taoiseach to say there is no more EU funding, is to miss both the point and the opportunity.

    Again, that's not what he said. He's saying we aren't going to be given an €X00m One4All voucher to spend on whatever we want. It shouldn't be that difficult to understand.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,610 ✭✭✭eastwest


    marno21 wrote: »
    What's the speed limit on the stretch of line between Swinford and Kiltimagh?

    To answer that I'd need to know what speed a grazing cow can reach.


  • Registered Users Posts: 4,282 ✭✭✭westtip


    marno21 wrote: »
    What's the speed limit on the stretch of line between Swinford and Kiltimagh?

    Or it depends if the grazing cow gets in the way of a velorail cart travelling at about 5 kph.

    Whatever happened to the €300K Michael Ring threw at that velorail project? Was anybody ever held accountable for the way that money was spent, maybe it will all come out when their planning application is examined???:D


  • Registered Users Posts: 12,363 ✭✭✭✭Del.Monte


    Interesting photograph included in this upbeat piece about the Velorail project: http://www.con-telegraph.ie/news/roundup/articles/2017/12/13/4149722-completion-of-velo-rail-project-in-kiltimagh-is-on-course/ as there's not a concrete sleeper to be seen between Claremorris and Collooney.

    I'm looking forward to my first trip on the Velorail. :D


  • Moderators, Entertainment Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 14,297 Mod ✭✭✭✭marno21


    Another question, how much remedial work would be required at the cattle loading stations along the line to make them suitable for a TEN-T Core passenger rail route in the 21st century?

    Obviously some investment would also be required to protect passengers from the high speed freight trains and the risk of electrical shock from the high voltages of the catenaries.


  • Advertisement
  • Registered Users Posts: 1,610 ✭✭✭eastwest


    marno21 wrote: »
    Another question, how much remedial work would be required at the cattle loading stations along the line to make them suitable for a TEN-T Core passenger rail route in the 21st century?

    Obviously some investment would also be required to protect passengers from the high speed freight trains and the risk of electrical shock from the high voltages of the catenaries.

    Because it will also be going up the hill to the very blessed knock airport, protection against electric shock will be by means of indulgences and holy water.


  • Registered Users Posts: 15,476 ✭✭✭✭whisky_galore


    marno21 wrote: »
    Another question, how much remedial work would be required at the cattle loading stations along the line to make them suitable for a TEN-T Core passenger rail route in the 21st century?

    Obviously some investment would also be required to protect passengers from the high speed freight trains and the risk of electrical shock from the high voltages of the catenaries.

    :rolleyes:

    Stick to the day job, stand up doesn't suit you.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,610 ✭✭✭eastwest


    :rolleyes:

    Stick to the day job, stand up doesn't suit you.

    The entire wrc concept is a joke at this stage, but some people just don't get it.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 652 ✭✭✭Muckyboots


    eastwest wrote: »
    The entire wrc concept is a joke at this stage, but some people just don't get it.

    I was criss-crossing the auld WRC alignment on the trusty rusty rothar recently and a thought struck me (not a train) that, in the unlikely event of trains running again, a large number or recently built family homes would find themselves gated in on minor country roads where the onus was previously on farmers to open and close gates safely. We're talking 40-50 families that would be effected. There are at least seven of these crossings between Tuam and Milltown alone. Planners and the house owners obviously didn't factor the return of steel on steel and they were 100% correct.


  • Registered Users Posts: 49 jmlfc


    Who will look after the anti social behaviour along this greenway and dogs sh1te, Because that is sure to evolve as time goes on, children and teenagers. They'll discourage people from using the greenway, well the tourists will be well disgusted, some stretches will be ok, but those along side villages will be filled with torment


  • Registered Users Posts: 49 jmlfc


    Muckyboots wrote: »
    I was criss-crossing the auld WRC alignment on the trusty rusty rothar recently and a thought struck me (not a train) that, in the unlikely event of trains running again, a large number or recently built family homes would find themselves gated in on minor country roads where the onus was previously on farmers to open and close gates safely. We're talking 40-50 families that would be effected. There are at least seven of these crossings between Tuam and Milltown alone. Planners and the house owners obviously didn't factor the return of steel on steel and they were 100% correct.

    Farmers took it upon themselves to claim land and let their cattle, horses, sheep roam freely.
    Houses took land which was not rightfully theirs and built driveways.
    That is the truth whatever you read on here, land was robbed from CIE/State


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,610 ✭✭✭eastwest


    jmlfc wrote: »
    Who will look after the anti social behaviour along this greenway and dogs sh1te, Because that is sure to evolve as time goes on, children and teenagers. They'll discourage people from using the greenway, well the tourists will be well disgusted, some stretches will be ok, but those along side villages will be filled with torment
    Antisocial behaviour hasn't been an issue on Waterford, despite the warnings of the prophets of doom, and despite hitting a quarter of a million visitors in the first year.
    Abandoned railways, on the other hand, do have a reputation as not being safe places to go.


  • Registered Users Posts: 49 jmlfc


    eastwest wrote: »
    Antisocial behaviour hasn't been an issue on Waterford, despite the warnings of the prophets of doom, and despite hitting a quarter of a million visitors in the first year.
    Abandoned railways, on the other hand, do have a reputation as not being safe places to go.

    Ahh the sunny south east. a 2 stars out of 5 on trip-advisor instances


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,610 ✭✭✭eastwest


    jmlfc wrote: »
    Farmers took it upon themselves to claim land and let their cattle, horses, sheep roam freely.
    Houses took land which was not rightfully theirs and built driveways.
    That is the truth whatever you read on here, land was robbed from CIE/State

    Robbed from us, to be exact.


  • Advertisement
  • Closed Accounts Posts: 652 ✭✭✭Muckyboots


    jmlfc wrote: »
    Who will look after the anti social behaviour along this greenway and dogs sh1te, Because that is sure to evolve as time goes on, children and teenagers. They'll discourage people from using the greenway, well the tourists will be well disgusted, some stretches will be ok, but those along side villages will be filled with torment
    "When you smell the red fish you know victory is near" - Eric Cantona


Advertisement