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Western Rail Corridor / Rail Trail

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  • Registered Users Posts: 11,622 ✭✭✭✭ Grandeeod


    First in. Just for the craic and obvious sensible discussion.:D A good start would be a re-posting of the flood repair costs from the old thread.


  • Registered Users Posts: 12,363 ✭✭✭✭ Del.Monte


    And this old classic deserves a repeat. :D



  • Registered Users Posts: 4,282 ✭✭✭ westtip


    As this was the last word (thanks for that honour Devnull) on the last thread as I was saying
    More bad news for railway campaigners from the Oireachtas committee rooms, look at the committee this week looking into flooding on Limerick/Athenry line, as Irish Rail tell the committee it will cost 10 million to fix the flooding problem on the branch line from Limerick to Athenry, can't see anyone coughing that up, best way to get a train from Limerick to Athenry, check weather forecast first

    https://www.oireachtas.ie/en/oireach...mmittees/1692/


    At 1.07, Irish Rail start talking about the Ballycar flooding issue he said that the optimum solution for the flooding on the wrc -- raising the track -- would cost 10 million and is unviable.
    He also says that Irish Rail sees greenways as the best option for protecting disused alignments in the medium term avoid the mistakes of the past where incursions caused problems.
    At 1.42 Michael Fitzmaurice asks a direct question about what IR sees as medium term, and whether there was any plan in the medium term to extend the wrc. Irish Rail spokesman said 5 years was medium term and there is no plan to extend the wrc.

    Interesting stuff, I was reminded of Gerry Murray SF cllr for the Charlestown Co Mayo, famously stating on national television five years ago, "The Western Rail Corridor is not up for discussion", he got that one right but perhaps not in the way he meant!


  • Registered Users Posts: 11,622 ✭✭✭✭ Grandeeod


    Del.Monte wrote: »
    And this old classic deserves a repeat. :D


    Stalker!:D


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 652 Muckyboots


    https://www.rte.ie/news/munster/2018/0528/966660-waterford-port/ BALLINA - WATERFORD
    "Late last year, DFDS reduced the rail service to one departure per week to seek to minimise losses while keeping the rail service going.
    "Unfortunately, despite the best efforts of all parties involved, DFDS have now concluded that the rail service cannot continue in its current form and we must cease to operate it."


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  • Moderators, Entertainment Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 13,346 Mod ✭✭✭✭ marno21


    Not sure how recent this is but all level crossing signage and flashing lights at the three level crossings on the N17 between Tuam and Claremorris have now been removed

    One of the level crossings has also had the rails covered in tarmac so that's Tuam-Claremorris now split at two points (at least) along the line


  • Registered Users Posts: 617 ✭✭✭ Drifter50


    Muckyboots wrote: »
    https://www.rte.ie/news/munster/2018/0528/966660-waterford-port/ BALLINA - WATERFORD
    "Late last year, DFDS reduced the rail service to one departure per week to seek to minimise losses while keeping the rail service going.
    "Unfortunately, despite the best efforts of all parties involved, DFDS have now concluded that the rail service cannot continue in its current form and we must cease to operate it."

    This is really not good news for Railfreight in Ireland that was starting to see opportunities to take more freight off the road. Very bad for Waterford and Ballina


  • Registered Users Posts: 12,363 ✭✭✭✭ Del.Monte


    The trouble with rail freight today is that we have long passed the tipping point, yards and gantries swept away, staff gone, sidings gone, wagons gone, locomotives..blah, blah, blah. It has little to do with distances being too short or the so-called motorway network and more to do with the State paying lip service to the railways, carbon emissions etc.etc. blah, blah. :(


  • Moderators, Entertainment Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 13,346 Mod ✭✭✭✭ marno21


    Del.Monte wrote: »
    The trouble with rail freight today is that we have long passed the tipping point, yards and gantries swept away, staff gone, sidings gone, wagons gone, locomotives..blah, blah, blah. It has little to do with distances being too short or the so-called motorway network and more to do with the State paying lip service to the railways, carbon emissions etc.etc. blah, blah. :(
    Wasn't that long ago there was talk of the Manulla branch closing. Hard for any potential customer to take railfreight seriously as an option if the railway line to be used is up in the air. Same with the Waterford-Limerick railway.


  • Registered Users Posts: 11,151 ✭✭✭✭ DaCor


    Ciaran Cannon calling for an end to the talk of extending the WRC on foot of the DFDS move

    https://galwaybayfm.ie/galway-junior-minister-says-western-rail-corridor-extension-should-be-abandoned/


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  • Registered Users Posts: 12,363 ✭✭✭✭ Del.Monte


    DaCor wrote: »
    Ciaran Cannon calling for an end to the talk of extending the WRC on foot of the DFDS move

    https://galwaybayfm.ie/galway-junior-minister-says-western-rail-corridor-extension-should-be-abandoned/

    Another visionary politician. :rolleyes:


  • Registered Users Posts: 11,622 ✭✭✭✭ Grandeeod


    Del.Monte wrote: »
    Another visionary politician. :rolleyes:

    In fairness DFDS aren't making money on the route and that particular freight traffic was used by WRC campaigners as a reason to reopen to Claremorris. If you know of another reason why it wasn't a success, I'm all ears.

    This particular politician is like many of them and they are never visionary anyway. However since the Ennis - Athenry part reopened, the argument was doomed. The only way and it is the only way, to successfully reopen any railway in Ireland, is to subsidize it to the hilt. But as you well know that is an entirely different argument/debate. Personally I'd have no problem with any reopening, once the sitting Government is happy to subsidize it and not at the expense of more justifiable reopenings/vital rail projects. Oh and lets not forget that the CIE dinosaur needs to be dismantled, melted down and sunk into a concrete bunker before anything happens.

    #greenway.:D


  • Registered Users Posts: 10,484 ✭✭✭✭ Jamie2k9


    Excellent news about WRC!


  • Registered Users Posts: 11,151 ✭✭✭✭ DaCor


    Some news about the Connemara greenway and the support of landowners along the route.

    I think it's safe to say that the days of the WRC as a railway from Athenry northwards are numbered. Once Galwegians see the benefits it bring to Connemara they'll be clamoring for the Western Rail Trail to be developed


  • Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 21,073 Mod ✭✭✭✭ bk


    Del.Monte wrote: »
    The trouble with rail freight today is that we have long passed the tipping point, yards and gantries swept away, staff gone, sidings gone, wagons gone, locomotives..blah, blah, blah. It has little to do with distances being too short or the so-called motorway network and more to do with the State paying lip service to the railways, carbon emissions etc.etc. blah, blah. :(

    What kills rail freight is how little heavy industry we have here in Ireland. What little industry we do have is mostly light industry and in the modern world that is all about just in time delivery, which rail freight isn't well suited to. The short distances in Ireland and motorways are the nail in it's coffin.

    Light industry simply has no need for rail freight and it is very hard to justify the cost of maintaining those yards, gantries, sidings, wagons, locos, trackbeds, staff for how little heavy industry we have. There just isn't the scale to justify it, specially when you can just roll a truck up to your factory load it up and have your freight anywhere in Ireland in just 3 to 4 hours.

    The environmental argument is also pretty weak. After all rail freight locos use the same Diesel that trucks do and in fact trucks most meet much stricter pollution regulations (Euro 5 and 6 engines) then old rail freight locos which likely have zero filtration.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 652 Muckyboots


    Del.Monte wrote: »
    Another visionary politician. :rolleyes:

    I reckon the Greenway advocates just need a priest or a monsignor to back their idea and it will be done and dusted. The missing link all along.


  • Registered Users Posts: 4,366 ✭✭✭ serfboard


    Muckyboots wrote: »
    I reckon the Greenway advocates just need a priest or a monsignor to back their idea and it will be done and dusted. The missing link all along.
    I'm not so sure about that.

    Monsignor Horan (Knock Airport) 1 - Monsignor McGreil (WRC) 1/2


  • Registered Users Posts: 4,282 ✭✭✭ westtip


    To save the effort of going to Galway Bay FM and the fact the podcast will drop off the GBFM site in due course, here is the Ciaran Cannon interview of May 30th for posterity transferred to You Tube;

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TkTT1DjcG1w&feature=youtu.be


  • Registered Users Posts: 4,282 ✭✭✭ westtip


    This is just an interesting comment on this thread and its huge (2) predecessors.
    The original thread was called
    The Western Rail Corridor, when that closed down (the thread!) we all moved on to the second thread which got to 10,000 posts called the
    The Western Rail Corridor (all disused sections)

    We now are just at the start of our third thread or chapter in this saga and what is the thread called:

    Western Rail Corridor/Rail Trail.

    As you know the famous quote from SF Charlestown Mayo Cllr Gerry "not up for discussion" Murray, I think we can clearly say the Western Rail Corridor is most definitely up for discussion!

    Interesting how debate and words change history.


  • Registered Users Posts: 11,151 ✭✭✭✭ DaCor


    Canneys on the ropes
    Shock poll shows TD’s seat under threat

    http://connachttribune.ie/shock-poll-shows-tds-seat-under-threat-687/

    A prominent Galway East TD is in danger of losing his seat at the next general election if an opinion poll conducted in the constituency is anything to go by.

    The sample poll of 1,500 has revealed that Independent TD Sean Canney could face an uphill struggle to retain his seat – despite being a poll topper back in 2016.

    The poll, conducted by senior Fianna Fail party members last month, shows that Fine Gael will be putting in a strong bid to win a second seat in the three-seater constituency which has experienced even further boundary changes since the last general election.

    It shows that Minister Ciaran Cannon of Fine Gael topping the poll on 18.4% of the vote – an increase of almost 3% on his performance last time out.

    Fianna Fail’s Deputy Anne Rabbitte is on 16.6% which is a slight increase on her 2016 vote while Deputy Canney is back on 16% which is a drop of almost 2.5%.

    But the surprise package in this whole scenario is the performance of Fine Gael’s Cllr Pete Roche who polled 15.6% of first preferences which would put him in with ‘a fighting chance’ of taking the third seat.

    And close behind is Fianna Fail’s Cllr Donagh Killilea on a very respectable 15% but he has not decided if he will contest the party convention which is due to be held in the autumn.

    It is thought that party member Ned Burns from Abbeyknockmoy, who has strong ties to Deputy Anne Rabbitte, will allow his name go forward having been nominated and could well be the second FF candidate in the constituency.

    Canney has been hit on two fronts. Since the last general election there have been further boundary changes with more of Galway East going into the Roscommon-Galway constituency.

    Areas like Dunmore, Brownsgrove, Clonberne, Moylough and Mountbellew are no longer part of Galway East and Canney has lost around 1,000 first preferences in the process – in 2016 he topped the poll with almost 8,500 votes.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 1,610 ✭✭✭ eastwest


    DaCor wrote: »
    Canneys on the ropes

    If he tried representing the electorate and not his cronies, he could be at the trough for life. But he will be kicked out, and should be. In fact if current speculation is anything to go by, he could be gone in weeks.


  • Moderators, Entertainment Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 13,346 Mod ✭✭✭✭ marno21


    Shane Ross response to Tony McLoughlin yesterday:
    Shane Ross wrote:
    As the Deputy is aware, both the "Programme for a Partnership Government" and the recently-published "National Development Plan" commit to independent review of the costings for a proposal to extend the existing Western Rail Corridor.

    My Department is currently at an advanced stage in developing an approach for progressing such a review in line with these commitments, and I expect to be in a position shortly to decide on the approach to be taken. I am also cognisant of the need for stakeholder consultation as part of the process, and can assure the Deputy that this will be an integral part of the review's arrangements. Once the process is complete, the findings of this review will be submitted to Government for consideration in the usual way.

    https://www.kildarestreet.com/wrans/?id=2018-06-13a.416


  • Registered Users Posts: 11,151 ✭✭✭✭ DaCor


    I'll be making a submission to that consultation for a greenway and I know plenty of others who will be doing so too


  • Registered Users Posts: 11,151 ✭✭✭✭ DaCor


    There's some new players on the field, though I am unsure of what game they are playing, charades maybe?

    http://connachttribune.ie/minister-cannon-comes-under-fire-for-supporting-greenway-000/
    Minister Cannon comes under fire for supporting greenway

    A Government minister has come under fire for lending his support for the provision of a walking and cycling greenway on the old Western Rail Corridor.

    Junior Minister Ciaran Cannon has been accused of adding to the current gridlock that exists in and around Galway city by his stance on abandoning the rail track.

    Minister Cannon recently rubbished any suggestion that the Western Rail Corridor should be reopened to train traffic and he said that the provision of a greenway from Athenry all the way to Enniskillen was the way to go.

    And he added that “a small cohort” of individuals who are advocating rail traffic on the line were doing “a disservice” to a lot of people who could benefit from a greenway.

    But an organisation called Future Looking Athenry Group (FLAG) have made contact with the Connacht Tribune and say that the closure of the Tuam to Athenry railway line in the 1970s is now a major contributory factor in the current congestion.

    A statement signed by Seamus Mulkerrins, Noel Doherty and Kevin Higgins says that while motorways are great, they add to the bottlenecks around cities like Galway by moving traffic more efficiently.

    They believe that Athenry can be the centre for rail travel in the west and that is why they are totally opposed to the rail corridor being used for any other purpose.

    Minister Cannon said that there will not be any trains running along the Western Rail Corridor “in our lifetime” and he also went on to dismiss the prospect of it being used for freight traffic.

    He said that the biggest rail freight company in the country had recently scaled back their demand for a service between Ballina and Waterford Port to just one a week and now there was no service required.

    However, the members of FLAG say that Minister Cannon along with fellow greenway advocate Deputy Anne Rabbitte of Fianna Fail did not judge the views of the country in the recent referendum very well and they believe that they have called it wrong on this occasion as well.

    “We are not against a greenway but we just don’t accept that it should be provided on the old railway line.

    “Those people old enough can still remember the destruction of the Galway to Clifden railway line and the tram lines in Dublin.

    “We reject strongly his assertion that a small cohort of individuals are advocating rail traffic. The closure of the Tuam to Athenry line is a major contributory factor in the current traffic congestion.

    “There have been occasions recently of traffic back-ups as far as Oranmore, Derrydonnell and, indeed, as far back as Athenry on the approach to Galway.

    “This, we suggest, is a sign of future traffic congestion around Galway and imagine what it will be like in 20 years time when the population of the country is expected to double,” the group stated.

    They are of the opinion that the Galway to Limerick rail service is very well utilised and that the closure of the Western Rail Corridor would be short-sighted in the future.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,610 ✭✭✭ eastwest


    DaCor wrote: »
    There's some new players on the field, though I am unsure of what game they are playing, charades maybe?

    http://connachttribune.ie/minister-cannon-comes-under-fire-for-supporting-greenway-000/

    A small group.of Sean Canney supporters in athenry with their heads firmly stuck in the sand.
    They won't like this morning's news from.Tuam!
    https://m.facebook.com/story.php?story_fbid=2000745290000364&id=398227776918798


  • Registered Users Posts: 11,151 ✭✭✭✭ DaCor


    eastwest wrote: »
    A small group.of Sean Canney supporters in athenry with their heads firmly stuck in the sand.
    They won't like this morning's news from.Tuam!
    https://m.facebook.com/story.php?story_fbid=2000745290000364&id=398227776918798

    Holy crap lol

    I look forward to the reaction


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,610 ✭✭✭ eastwest


    DaCor wrote: »
    Holy crap lol

    I look forward to the reaction

    People are tired listening to 5hite.


  • Registered Users Posts: 4,282 ✭✭✭ westtip


    marno21 wrote: »
    Shane Ross response to Tony McLoughlin yesterday:



    https://www.kildarestreet.com/wrans/?id=2018-06-13a.416

    That was on June 13th look what he wrote to me in APRIL 26th! Ross is so full of BS it's untrue.

    Our Ref: SR/18/21898

    Dear Mr Quinn

    On behalf of the Minister for Transport, Tourism & Sport, Shane Ross, T.D., I wish to thank you for your email of 19 April 2018 regarding the review of the western rail corridor, the contents which have been noted. My Department is currently at an advanced stage in developing an approach for progressing this review.

    Yours sincerely,


    Chris Smith
    Private Secretary to Minister Shane Ross


  • Registered Users Posts: 4,366 ✭✭✭ serfboard


    DTTAS wrote:
    My Department is currently at an advanced stage in developing an approach for progressing this review.
    I bet there was a bonus in the office that day for whoever could come up with the most meaningless sentence.

    "An advanced stage in developing an approach for progressing a review". Wow! Sir Humphrey of Yes Minister would be proud.

    This is civil service code for: "This will never happen".


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  • Moderators, Entertainment Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 13,346 Mod ✭✭✭✭ marno21


    Just biding their time until Canney is no longer relevant when it will be quietly dropped. Everyone knows it's out of the question.

    Why Canney hasn't done a massive U turn on this is bizarre. There seems to be a clear appetite in Tuam for a greenway on the old line judging by the events of the weekend and it could very well be his undoing at the next election.


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