Western Rail Corridor / Rail Trail Discussion

Lord Glentoran

westtip wrote: »

And there are votes to be had in creating jobs in the tourism and services industries, which is exactly what the QMG will do.

Just not the “wrong” sort of tourism, which is why the anti-rail lobby are targeting Kiltimagh.

serfboard

Lord Glentoran wrote: »

Just not the “wrong” sort of tourism, which is why the anti-rail lobby are targeting Kiltimagh.

So you support spending half a million of the public's finances on the velo-rail simply because it involves rails?

Come on. It's a scandalous waste of money.

Lord Glentoran

serfboard wrote: »

So you support spending half a million of the public's finances on the velo-rail simply because it involves rails?

Come on. It's a scandalous waste of money.

Velorail works elsewhere but not in Ireland is the logic of your position. I am reminded of the one track thinking exhibited at a meeting I was at in my old town in Kildare where one public representative was aghast at spending money on a children’s playground for the town, on the basis that “sure the GAA is there”. Zero sum mentality.

Sam Russell

Lord Glentoran wrote: »

Velorail works elsewhere but not in Ireland is the logic of your position. I am reminded of the one track thinking exhibited at a meeting I was at in my old town in Kildare where one public representative was aghast at spending money on a children’s playground for the town, on the basis that “sure the GAA is there”. Zero sum mentality.

The velorail will be operating on a one track railway. How do the velo bikes pass each other?

The velo bikes would work just as well with rubber wheels on a greenway, but not just as well, but significantly better. Why do they need to be on rails?

marno21

Sam Russell wrote: »

The velorail will be operating on a one track railway. How do the velo bikes pass each other?

The velo bikes would work just as well with rubber wheels on a greenway, but not just as well, but significantly better. Why do they need to be on rails?

Because the greenway requires the removal of the rails and the end of the dream of rail services to Knock Airport.

L1011

Supporting the ludicrous velo-rail as a tourism initiative over a Greenway is effectively deciding to artificially limit the number of tourists for the sake of keeping a set of effectively unusable rails on the ground - rails that would be removed before any reopening anyway.

Emotion has long since overridden sense here.

Sam Russell

marno21 wrote: »

Because the greenway requires the removal of the rails and the end of the dream of rail services to Knock Airport.

But that does not answer the question raised. Why not rubber wheel based Velo bikes?

If there is a sufficient demand for a rail service to Knock Airport, the rails can be reinstated. Remember, there is currently no rail service to Dublin Airport, Shannon Airport, or Cork Airport, all of which have far more passengers and aircraft movements than Knock Airport.

Dublin Airport, with passenger numbers of over 3 million, plus staff numbers, is expected to get a rail connection in 2027. Shannon is expected to get one -- well, it's not expected to get one. As for Cork, ..... well, they are looking for a motorway to Limerick and are not looking for a rail connection currently.

serfboard

Lord Glentoran wrote: »

Velorail works elsewhere but not in Ireland is the logic of your position.

It certainly is not.

But aside from misrepresenting my position, I see that you still haven't answered the question as to whether you support the velorail, and the spending of half a million of public money on it.

XPS_Zero

blanch152 wrote: »

There shouldn't be commuters travelling to work over long distances. No more rural housing, just build up the cities of Galway, Limerick, Cork and Waterford as well as some of the larger towns as service centres.

Do you remember decentralization?


It started off as the following:
Stop (through planning laws) Dublin moving any further out, up only.


Do the same for Galway, Limerick, Cork.



Have a regional development strategy encouraging new everything to locate in one of those four cities, that way a new WRC or even the reactivated one might have some justification down the road.


BUT THEN....


People started whinging "what about Kerry" and "what about Sligo" and "what about Offally" and off we went, and for political not geospatial reasons it got watered down so it was no longer a regional development plan to rebalance the island and instead became a way to avoid losing votes, or buy votes, in every micky mouse town in Ireland with the public service decentralization spread so thin they eventually realized it wasn't worth fighting the PS Unions over relocation and just gave up.


We would need to tackle how our population is planned and our planning laws for housing and get rid of the Irish distrust of high rise BEFORE going anywhere near a WRC plan again. They'd literally need to be starting major construction in these areas ^ around the stations BEFORE you will get anyone authorizing the required money.


The reason they keep asking for new reports is political, kick the can down the road so don't actually spend the money but say you are in favor of it, the money instead gets spent in Dublin OR more likley on a pointless vote buying extra 10er on childrens allowance or pension or jobseekers.


They won't even finish the Dublin parts of T21 that are crying out to be done because of creaking population, they don't even have the guts to put a stimulus plan building things like metro during the recession included in the bailout, even now they wont' stand up to the NIMBY'ism even though they've the constitutional power to just take the damn land...if they are leaving the Swords corridor creaking demanding Metro, and leaving Green and Red line Luas commuters behind on platforms, why would they spend money on this:
(the line inspection video)

I've worked in emergency planning and the landscape here ^ looks like the kind of projections we had if a nuclear war had gotten going and the fallout was so big in the US it was able to cross the atlantic and large parts of Ireland had to be evacuated, that's how deserted it looks along there.




I'm not against a WRC, but I have the same attitude towards it I do to universal healthcare, you need major reform first, I'd not throw another 6b (full cost on top of what we pay now for an Irish NHS, perfectly doable if you are not attached to said 10ers every budget) at the HSE until it was radically reformed, same here with planning laws etc it would be a waste of money.

serfboard

XPS_Zero wrote: »

We would need to tackle how our population is planned and our planning laws for housing and get rid of the Irish distrust of high rise BEFORE going anywhere near a WRC plan again. They'd literally need to be starting major construction in these areas ^ around the stations BEFORE you will get anyone authorizing the required money.

Correct. Proper Planning first.

Galway County has a population of 260,000 of which 80,000 live in the city. The other 180,000 are scattered to the four winds from Clifden to Ballinasloe and from Gort to Tuam, and mostly in one-off rural housing of people who do not work on the land.

Until we develop critical mass in our towns and cities in the West of Ireland, rail, a volume form of public transport, which I enthusiastically support where it makes sense, will not be needed, and spending money on it would be a waste.

Lord Glentoran

serfboard wrote: »

It certainly is not.

But aside from misrepresenting my position, I see that you still haven't answered the question as to whether you support the velorail, and the spending of half a million of public money on it.

What is this, the Ayn Rand fan club in the Morket Bor? I’ll answer what I like, sonny.

Lord Glentoran

serfboard wrote: »

Correct. Proper Planning first.

Galway County has a population of 260,000 of which 80,000 live in the city. The other 180,000 are scattered to the four winds from Clifden to Ballinasloe and from Gort to Tuam, and mostly in one-off rural housing of people who do not work on the land.

Until we develop critical mass in our towns and cities in the West of Ireland, rail, a volume form of public transport, which I enthusiastically support where it makes sense, will not be needed, and spending money on it would be a waste.

Preventing it from happening again would be a waste, and a criminal one at that.

Lord Glentoran

Lord Glentoran wrote: »

What is this, the Ayn Rand fan club in the Morket Bor? I’ll answer what I like, sonny.

Actually there’s a good idea. A pi55-take on Dublin’s Ayn Randians called “Atlas Shagged”

serfboard

Lord Glentoran wrote: »

What is this, the Ayn Rand fan club in the Morket Bor?

Lord Glentoran wrote: »

Actually there’s a good idea.

Good man, you keep praising yourself there :rolleyes:

what_traffic

Lord Glentoran wrote: »

Actually there’s a good idea. A pi55-take on Dublin’s Ayn Randians called “Atlas Shagged”

Does it sound very lyrical in an East Belfast accent Lord Glentoran?

unit 1

If people wont take the new motorway from tuam to galway, what chance is there in them taking a train that follows roughly the same route as the motorway they wont take?

JCX BXC

unit 1 wrote: »

If people wont take the new motorway from tuam to galway, what chance is there in them taking a train that follows roughly the same route as the motorway they wont take?

They don't choose the route the train takes.

Lord Glentoran

serfboard wrote: »

Good man, you keep praising yourself there :rolleyes:

If self-praise is no praise, where does that leave self-abuse, seeing as you are clearly such a master debater?

Sam Russell

Mod:

@ Lord Glentoran and What Traffic:

Cut it out. Name calling is against the charter. Cards will be issued.

Hotblack Desiato

Sam Russell wrote: »

Dublin Airport, with passenger numbers of over 3 million,

A typo, it was over 31 million last year.

Shannon, Knock, Cork all suffer from the 'one for everyone in the audience' politics. They're all fighting each other over a catchment population barely enough to sustain one decent international airport.

whisky_galore

Hotblack Desiato wrote: »

A typo, it was over 31 million last year.

Shannon, Knock, Cork all suffer from the 'one for everyone in the audience' politics. They're all fighting each other over a catchment population barely enough to sustain one decent international airport.

Dublin centric people will never be happy until the rest of the country is a rural theme park without facilities so they can drive down to point and laugh at the yokels.

Probably secretly jealous some village called Cork has so much industry going on right now.

westtip

L1011 wrote: »

Supporting the ludicrous velo-rail as a tourism initiative over a Greenway is effectively deciding to artificially limit the number of tourists for the sake of keeping a set of effectively unusable rails on the ground - rails that would be removed before any reopening anyway.

Emotion has long since overridden sense here.

Hey you want to see what the IRD in Kiltimagh proposed to Mayo county council as an extension of the idea for the Velorail before it even got up and running - and before it got planning permission ----which it now needs to go and get.

Attached letter of December 2016 is one of the best yet, motorised velorail carts to run from Kiltimagh to Charlestown, will they not stop at anything to keep those rusting tracks in place! thankfully even Mayo coco turned this mad cap idea down...see attached letter obtained under FOI

Sam Russell

westtip wrote: »

Hey you want to see what the IRD in Kiltimagh proposed to Mayo county council as an extension of the idea for the Velorail before it even got up and running - and before it got planning permission ----which it now needs to go and get.

Attached letter of December 2016 is one of the best yet, motorised velorail carts to run from Kiltimagh to Charlestown, will they not stop at anything to keep those rusting tracks in place! thankfully even Mayo coco turned this mad cap idea down...see attached letter obtained under FOI

How would they pass each other on the sigle track? I presume the motorised vehicle would not be the only one on the track.

Would it have a Velocuiser driver? A daft idea if I ever saw one.

Sam Russell

Sam Russell wrote: »

How would they pass each other on the sigle track? I presume the motorised vehicle would not be the only one on the track.

Would it have a Velocuiser driver? A daft idea if I ever saw one.

Something like this I would imagine.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ilJAczgfmHk

Lord Glentoran

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Something like this I would imagine.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ilJAczgfmHk

Looks pretty cool, TBH.

Sam Russell

Deleted User wrote: »

Something like this I would imagine.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ilJAczgfmHk

That has to be a bad joke if a major tourist project is to be based on this kind of mickey mouse system. Try geting insurance cover for that.

Already €400 k spent on this junk.

Sligo eye

Looks like the velorail concept is a positive thing to have for Kiltimagh. Can’t think why that campaigner guy is trying to stall it. Must be anti tourism I guess.

Muckyboots

Lord Glentoran wrote: »

Looks pretty cool, TBH.

You know and I know that the clip is not from a disused railway line - which makes it even cooler.

Sligo eye

Sligo eye wrote: »

Looks like the velorail concept is a positive thing to have for Kiltimagh. Can’t think why that campaigner guy is trying to stall it. Must be anti tourism I guess.

Yeah, that's it, exactly that, no other logical reason, lol

westtip

Sligo eye wrote: »

Looks like the velorail concept is a positive thing to have for Kiltimagh. Can’t think why that campaigner guy is trying to stall it. Must be anti tourism I guess.

Ask the people in KM, MCC and the IRD didn't. Interesting post though Sligoeye where have you been after 3 years and two months of last making a post - you come up with this gem as your 7th post on boards. I guess the moral of the story is they never stop watching...Have a look at what KM people think of the IRD tourism attaction, not lot is the answer.....

https://www.change.org/p/peter-hynes-mayo-county-manager-put-a-walking-and-cycling-path-for-everyone-to-enjoy-parallel-with-kiltimagh-velorail