Ulster Bank League 2018-2019 Talk/Gossip/Rumours

Stainalert

D14Rugby wrote: »

Stainalert wrote: »

The key here is the University is allowed provide the scholarship not the university club and that is clearly not the case. There is also no way these scholarships can be considered "academic" as the only reason for the scholarships being awarded is their rugby prowess

And that's what happens at trinity/DUFC. The University offer and award the scholarships that come with the condition of playing for the club. The club supply this list to the IRFU and its all cleared, what are you not getting here

That's not what is stated in this trinity publication as per Lost Sheep's earlier comment above: 
Most of those are funded externally and arent directly funded by the university but by rugby club through bank of ireland scheme.
http://www.universitytimes.ie/2017/10/trinitys-sport-scholarships-still-leave-a-lot-to-be-desired/
So really the university have nothing to do with the rugby

Squidgy Black wrote: »

Is it not seen as an academic scholarship regardless because it's a bursary towards their fees as opposed to a cash bursary?

No in practice no credit is actually applied against fees - scholarship recipients actually receive cash.
scholarships being offered DUFC

D14Rugby

ArmchairQB wrote: »

Yes you did re Academic but not all Scholarships are academic that is the whole point you seem to be missing. How is €1,500 a year to 30 rugby players an academic scholarship in trinity or to over 60 rugby players in UCD?

The IRFU have decided they are academic scholarships so that's it

Stainalert

D14Rugby wrote: »

ArmchairQB wrote: »

Yes you did re Academic but not all Scholarships are academic that is the whole point you seem to be missing. How is €1,500 a year to 30 rugby players an academic scholarship in trinity or to over 60 rugby players in UCD?

The IRFU have decided they are academic scholarships so that's it

That's the point - completely biased system which is no surprise when you learn that Michael Coghlan who has been president of DUFC at least twice is head of the clubs committee.

ArmchairQB

Stainalert wrote: »

That's the point - completely biased system which is no surprise when you learn that Michael Coghlan who has been president of DUFC at least twice is head of the clubs committee.

akin to Turkeys voting for Christmas!! No matter what way you phrase it or spin it, it all quiet simply breaks down to an unfair system which is illegal under Rule 6

D14Rugby

ArmchairQB wrote: »

akin to Turkeys voting for Christmas!! No matter what way you phrase it or spin it, it all quiet simply breaks down to an unfair system which is illegal under Rule 6

Except it doesn't because there is specifically an exemption to rule 6 for it

Stainalert

D14Rugby wrote: »

ArmchairQB wrote: »

akin to Turkeys voting for Christmas!! No matter what way you phrase it or spin it, it all quiet simply breaks down to an unfair system which is illegal under Rule 6

Except it doesn't because there is specifically an exemption to rule 6 for it

When regulation 6 was introduced all clubs were told that the University clubs had to comply with the "spirit" of of regulation 6 which they clearly aren't. We were also told that the IRFU could not adjudicate over scholarships that were awarded by the University body as they were considered by the IRFU an independent third party. What's clear now is that the university body in Trinity is not awarding or funding the rugby scholarships that are being given out by the University club.

D14Rugby

Stainalert wrote: »

When regulation 6 was introduced all clubs were told that the University clubs had to comply with the "spirit" of of regulation 6 which they clearly aren't. We were also told that the IRFU could not adjudicate over scholarships that were awarded by the University body. What's clear now is that the university body in Trinity is not awarding or funding the rugby scholarships that are being given out by the University club.

But they are, they're saying they are, some news article that mentions in in passing by some student wannabe journalist isn't evidence that the college aren't funding the scholarships. Nobody here knows exactly how they're funded, the only ones who do are the college, the club and the IRFU and as far as they're concerned they comply with the rules and I've a family friend who doesn't like the fact these colleges can pretty much pay players and was involved in the IRFU and they said that they're okay by the rules so there's no big IRFU conspiracy theory, they're simply following the rules, there's nothing stopping other clubs doing similar deals with local colleges which is effectively the same as what the college teams in AIL have done

Stainalert

D14Rugby wrote: »

Stainalert wrote: »

When regulation 6 was introduced all clubs were told that the University clubs had to comply with the "spirit" of of regulation 6 which they clearly aren't. We were also told that the IRFU could not adjudicate over scholarships that were awarded by the University body. What's clear now is that the university body in Trinity is not awarding or funding the rugby scholarships that are being given out by the University club.

But they are, they're saying they are, some news article that mentions in in passing by some student wannabe journalist isn't evidence that the college aren't funding the scholarships. Nobody here knows exactly how they're funded, the only ones who do are the college, the club and the IRFU and as far as they're concerned they comply with the rules and I've a family friend who doesn't like the fact these colleges can pretty much pay players and was involved in the IRFU and they said that they're okay by the rules so there's no big IRFU conspiracy theory, they're simply following the rules, there's nothing stopping other clubs doing similar deals with local colleges which is effectively the same as what the college teams in AIL have done

Financially incentivizing players to join Trinity IS against the spirit of Regulation 6. Paying cash bursaries and not fee offsets IS against the spirit of Regulation 6. The publication in question is a Trinity publication so I think it is a safe assumption that the article is well researched. The IRFU committee who rule over this is advised legally by Michael Coghlan and if you don't believe he is conflicted that is very naive. It is an IRFU conspiracy because they are deliberately showing bias to the university clubs. Clubs have been advised by the IRFU that they cannot do "deals" with other colleges as there has to be a direct link between the college and the club.

irishbucsfan

Stainalert wrote: »

Clubs have been advised by the IRFU that they cannot do "deals" with other colleges as there has to be a direct link between the college and the club.

What's the deal with Barnhall and NUIM's partnership in that case?

Stainalert

irishbucsfan wrote: »

Stainalert wrote: »

Clubs have been advised by the IRFU that they cannot do "deals" with other colleges as there has to be a direct link between the college and the club.

What's the deal with Barnhall and NUIM's partnership in that case?

It was pre regulation 6 apparently

D14Rugby

Stainalert wrote: »

It was pre regulation 6 apparently

But the oldest club in the world wasn't?

Level with us here, did they turn you down for a scholarship?

Stainalert

D14Rugby wrote: »

Stainalert wrote: »

It was pre regulation 6 apparently

But the oldest club in the world wasn't?

Level with us here, did they turn you down for a scholarship?

Ha The oldest club in the world has a direct link to the university. 
No actually had a scholarship myself (not Trinity though). I am not against scholarships for one second - my point is all clubs should have equal rights. Any way I think we've done this subject to death and it's not like Michael Coghlan is going to change his mind so let's move on with some actual rugby discussion.

Stainalert

Leinster Senior League kicks off tonight 
Terenure at home to UCD (7pm KO)
Lansdowne play Clontarf in Ballycorus (7.45pm KO)
Malahide v Navan (8pm KO)
Friday 
Old Belvedere v Trinity (7.30pm KO)
Blackrock v Wanderers (8pm KO)
Saturday 
Marys v Naas (3pm KO)
Skerries v Greystones (3pm KO)

D14Rugby

Stainalert wrote: »

Ha The oldest club in the world has a direct link to the university. 
No actually had a scholarship myself (not Trinity though). I am not against scholarships for one second - my point is all clubs should have equal rights. Any way I think we've done this subject to death and it's not like Michael Coghlan is going to change his mind so let's move on with some actual rugby discussion.

Your point was the barnhall maynooth deal predated rule 6 so surely trinity DUFC one does too

Stainalert

D14Rugby wrote: »

Stainalert wrote: »

Ha The oldest club in the world has a direct link to the university. 
No actually had a scholarship myself (not Trinity though). I am not against scholarships for one second - my point is all clubs should have equal rights. Any way I think we've done this subject to death and it's not like Michael Coghlan is going to change his mind so let's move on with some actual rugby discussion.

Your point was the barnhall maynooth deal predated rule 6 so surely trinity DUFC one does too

Not my point. It was the IRFU's response when questioned on it. 
There is clearly a link between Trinity and DUFC so the time issue is irrelevant where as the link between Barnhall and Maynooth is in some people's eyes (not mine) more spurious.

The Lost Sheep

Anyone at games tonight?
Malahide 12 Navan 38, Lansdowne 31 Clontarf 5, Terenure 29 UCD 16,

Chico Flores

Lansdowne Line Up

1: Dennis Coulson
2: Ronan Kelleher
3: Greg McGrath
4: Josh O'Rourke
5: Oisin Dowling
6: David O'Connor
7: Aaron Connelly
8: Will Earle

9: Alan Bennie
10: Conor Murphy
11: Adam Leavy
12: Mark O'Keefe
13: Harry Brennan
14: Peter Sullivan
15: Eamon Mills

Chico Flores

I believe Coolmine and DCU are trying to set up a rugby link together too

Tarf1234

Tarf team was apparently:
1. Ivan Soroka
2. Dylan Donnellan
3. Martin Kelly
4. James Doyle
5. Cormac Daly
6. Anthony Ryan
7. Adrian Darcy
8. Tom Ryn
9. Andrew Feeney
10. Conor Jennings
11. James Hawkshaw
12. Conor O'Brien
13. Michael Courtney
14. James McKeown
15. Ariel Robles
Subs:
16. Declan Adamson
17. Niall Carson
18. Ben Reilly
19 Vincent Gavin
20. Angus Lloyd
21. Matthew Darcy
22. Jack Power

shoutman

Tarf1234 wrote: »

Tarf team was apparently:
1. Ivan Soroka
2. Dylan Donnellan
3. Martin Kelly
4. James Doyle
5. Cormac Daly
6. Anthony Ryan
7. Adrian Darcy
8. Tom Ryn
9. Andrew Feeney
10. Conor Jennings
11. James Hawkshaw
12. Conor O'Brien
13. Michael Courtney
14. James McKeown
15. Ariel Robles
Subs:
16. Declan Adamson
17. Niall Carson
18. Ben Reilly
19 Vincent Gavin
20. Angus Lloyd
21. Matthew Darcy
22. Jack Power

Strong enough team put out...

Tarf1234

shoutman wrote: »

Strong enough team put out...

Ye, still lots missing. Very strong bench, you'd imagine at least 4 of them would be starting in UBL.

D14Rugby

Wasn't there but apparently Terenure tore UCD apart. Sam Dardis, Ted O'Donaghue and Stephen O'Neil at 10 were some of the notable names.

As an aside the back pitch at Lansdowne Road is currently being relaid.

ArmchairQB

D14Rugby wrote: »

Wasn't there but apparently Terenure tore UCD apart. Sam Dardis, Ted O'Donaghue and Stephen O'Neil at 10 were some of the notable names.

As an aside the back pitch at Lansdowne Road is currently being relaid.

Surprisingly big loss for Tarf with that team but silly season. UCD would still be quiet light this time of year so no surprise there and hardly a shoreline that suggests they tore them apart. Would expect Belvo to do similar to trinity tonight for similar reasons. Hard tomread into results this time of year. Would expect Ternure to come out top of that group, Belvo could be stronger this time of year than most of the others in the other group.

ArmchairQB

D14Rugby wrote: »

Wasn't there but apparently Terenure tore UCD apart. Sam Dardis, Ted O'Donaghue and Stephen O'Neil at 10 were some of the notable names.

As an aside the back pitch at Lansdowne Road is currently being relaid.

Hopefully UCD divert some of their scholarship money and redo their Astro as it is beyond brutal

Stainalert

Belvo 40 Trinity 36

Apparently Belvo were 40-3 up and then made loads of changes

Skerries 20 Greystones 59

Marys 25 Naas 17

The Lost Sheep

Connacht senior league
Buccaneers 35 Sligo 34
Corinthians 22 Ballina 10

Chico Flores

I imagine quite a few teams this weekend would have been missing lads who were at Electric Picnic etc. In particular student teams, or younger ones, so hard to look too much into results.

stellenbosch

D14Rugby wrote: »

Wasn't there but apparently Terenure tore UCD apart. Sam Dardis, Ted O'Donaghue and Stephen O'Neil at 10 were some of the notable names.

As an aside the back pitch at Lansdowne Road is currently being relaid.

Apparently G Mullin injured shoulder in that match for UCD and out for 6 weeks

The Lost Sheep

Wesley beat Seapoint 60-5 in LSL Division2A tonight

Stainalert

The Lost Sheep wrote: »

Wesley beat Seapoint 60-5 in LSL Division2A tonight

Big win. Any team details?

Chico Flores

Stainalert wrote: »

Big win. Any team details?

From the Wesley site

In the first competitive match of the season the Seniors enjoyed a comprehensive and confident win over Seapoint in the Leinster Senior League.

Wesley crossed for 10 tries on the night by James Donovan, Jack Maybury, Craig Telford, Rory Stynes Andrew McCrann, new recruits Paul Derham (2), Tom Kearsey and Jack Donovan, and Daragh Forster, a graduate from last season’s under 20’s. Kearsey and Maybury added the conversions.

The Lost Sheep

Chico Flores wrote: »

From the Wesley site

In the first competitive match of the season the Seniors enjoyed a comprehensive and confident win over Seapoint in the Leinster Senior League.

Wesley crossed for 10 tries on the night by James Donovan, Jack Maybury, Craig Telford, Rory Stynes Andrew McCrann, new recruits Paul Derham (2), Tom Kearsey and Jack Donovan, and Daragh Forster, a graduate from last season’s under 20’s. Kearsey and Maybury added the conversions.

Kearsey and Donovan are from Waterpark and Nenagh but played elsewhere for past few years. Will be interesting to see how much AIL time each gets.

Stainalert

The Lost Sheep wrote: »

Chico Flores wrote: »

From the Wesley site

In the first competitive match of the season the Seniors enjoyed a comprehensive and confident win over Seapoint in the Leinster Senior League.

Wesley crossed for 10 tries on the night by James Donovan, Jack Maybury, Craig Telford, Rory Stynes Andrew McCrann, new recruits Paul Derham (2), Tom Kearsey and Jack Donovan, and Daragh Forster, a graduate from last season’s under 20’s. Kearsey and Maybury added the conversions.

Kearsey and Donovan are from Waterpark and Nenagh but played elsewhere for past few years. Will be interesting to see how much AIL time each gets.

Kiersey played with Waterpark last season and before that played with Lansdowne . Very decent player

stellenbosch

The Lost Sheep wrote: »

Wesley beat Seapoint 60-5 in LSL Division2A tonight

Tarf beat Trinity 31-5-in saying that Trinity were quite good-missing lots of players called up to Leinster A - score was 7 nil at HT with Tarf butchering a number of chances. Osborne very good for Trinity at 9. Tony Ryan and Michael excellent for Tarf-there were 6 of last years Trinity players playing for Tarf-Finlay/M Kelly/Tom Ryan/A Lloyd/J McDermott and M Courtney

stellenbosch

stellenbosch wrote: »

Tarf beat Trinity 31-5-in saying that Trinity were quite good-missing lots of players called up to Leinster A - score was 7 nil at HT with Tarf butchering a number of chances. Osborne very good for Trinity at 9. Tony Ryan and Michael excellent for Tarf-there were 6 of last years Trinity players playing for Tarf-Finlay/M Kelly/Tom Ryan/A Lloyd/J McDermott and M Courtney

Michael Courtney

Stainalert

stellenbosch wrote: »

Michael Courtney

Did Ryan Baird play for Trinity?

stellenbosch

Stainalert wrote: »

Did Ryan Baird play for Trinity?

Nope with 20s and neither did any of the 6 guys with Leinster A or Colm Hogan or Ruben Pim or Rob Russell-lots of players to come in

The Lost Sheep

Munster senior cup round 1 today. Nenagh well beaten by Highfield, Cashel beat Bohs and Dolphin beat Midleton 3-0

The Lost Sheep

Sundays Well v Bruff is next week.
Old Crescent 39 Thomond 17, Highfield 34 Nenagh 10, Midleton 0 Dolphin 3, UL Bohs 16 Cashel 23

Cashel play Dolphin and Old Crescent host Highfield next weekend in second round. winners of those second round games and winner of Well Bruff go into quarters with 5 division 1 sides.

The Lost Sheep

Interesting to see in paper today Leinster have asked the IRFU to postpone for a season the change in AIL regulations to increase the number of contracted players in match-day squads.
https://www.independent.ie/sport/rugby/ ... 97026.html

Stainalert

Leinster Senior League Division 1

UCD 17 St Marys 22
Naas 17 Terenure 20
Old Belvedere 10 Lansdowne 39

Chico Flores

Leinster Senior League Div 2 Results

Old Wesley 24-13 Skerries
Greystones 41-8 Seapoint
Wanderers 37-10 Tullamore
Barnhall 26-7 Malahide

ArmchairQB

Midleton 0 Dolphin 3

Must have been a real thriller! An unusual score line in early season these days great defense or poor attacking play?

Chico Flores

ArmchairQB wrote: »

Midleton 0 Dolphin 3

Must have been a real thriller! An unusual score line in early season these days great defense or poor attacking play?

Possibly awful weather?

The Lost Sheep

ArmchairQB wrote: »

Midleton 0 Dolphin 3

Must have been a real thriller! An unusual score line in early season these days great defense or poor attacking play?

Awful weather and iirc the Midleton pitch can be shocking if there's quite a bit of rain

The Lost Sheep

Below is from Sean McMahon(writes on Pundit Arena) on twitter
Interesting findings from @IrishRugby and @UL looking into injuries from men & women's 2017/18 AIL.

- A male player would have to play 15 matches to sustain 1 injury
- A female player would have to play 16 matches to sustain 1 injury
- 54% of match & training injuries a result of the Tackle
- 54% of tackle related injuries sustained by the Ball Carrier
- 46% of tackle related injuries sustained by the Tackler
- Majority of male training injuries a result of tackling and contact drills
- Majority of female training injuries a result of non-contact / set-piece drills
[Male]
- 6.1/1,000 player hours: Concussion
-5.7/1,000 player hours: Ankle ligament sprain
- 4.1/1,000 player hours: Hamstring strain

Stainalert

The Lost Sheep wrote: »

Below is from Sean McMahon(writes on Pundit Arena) on twitter
Interesting findings from @IrishRugby and @UL looking into injuries from men & women's 2017/18 AIL.

-  A male player would have to play 15 matches to sustain 1 injury
-  A female player would have to play 16 matches to sustain 1 injury
- 54% of match & training injuries a result of the Tackle
- 54% of tackle related injuries sustained by the Ball Carrier
- 46% of tackle related injuries sustained by the Tackler
- Majority of male training injuries a result of tackling and contact drills
- Majority of female training injuries a result of non-contact / set-piece drills
[Male]
- 6.1/1,000 player hours:            Concussion
-5.7/1,000 player hours:             Ankle ligament sprain
- 4.1/1,000 player hours:            Hamstring strain

Very interesting stats - lower than I would have expected

D14Rugby

Just noticed on the 7s squad list Billy Dardis is officially registered to Terenure now

stellenbosch

D14Rugby wrote: »

Just noticed on the 7s squad list Billy Dardis is officially registered to Terenure now

Makes sense-hes no longer in UCD

Stainalert

Clontarf beat Old Belvedere last night 38 - 13