British Army Corporal Court Martialed for sharing vid of female in training.

DEFTLEFTHAND

Sonics2k wrote: »

So, you're not a real man then?



So, you come along here and open a thread taking shots at a woman who had a tough time on a course you have never experienced. Have no idea how many men struggle with the same course, but after seeing a lone video decide "hey, women can't join the army".

That was my point hedge.

Even the toughest men won't pass basic.


I never claimed to be tough. I'd be eaten alive if I joined the British Army. I'm somewhat physically fit but would't have the mental strength.


I'd end up chinning my Corporal.

Glass fused light

Fuaranach wrote: »

Well, that's some heap of ráiméis - directly from the British Army's Press Office (the "Lisburn Lie Machine"). All major media outlets in the western world were in Belfast that day, and the propaganda from BA's counter-revolutionary misinformation centre tried to claim that two armed, undercover BA officers just "accidentally" came upon the funeral. Bad day on the creativity front for the Defenders of the Realm in the last outpost of their Irish colony.

Look it's not fair to blame the two lads. It's not their fault that map reading was not covered by their basic training. Do you know how hard it was to use in a car, don't talk to us about the shouting matches about 'your other left' and as for folding them back?...... It would not happen today you know, with the new improved PC era, with a woman's voice giving direction.

blinding

DEFTLEFTHAND wrote: »

That was my point hedge.

Even the toughest men won't pass basic.


I never claimed to be tough. I'd be eaten like if I joined the British Army. I'm somewhat physically fit but would't have the mental strength.


I'd end up chinning my Corporal.

If right was right you should get some bonus points for chin-ing the Corporal and he shouldn’t whinge either .

Sonics2k

DEFTLEFTHAND wrote: »

That was my point hedge.

Even the toughest men won't pass basic.


I never claimed to be tough. I'd be eaten alive if I joined the British Army. I'm somewhat physically fit but would't have the mental strength.

Toughness isn't actually a big factor. It's dedication, technique, stamina and determination. I know, because I did it for the RAF.

I've a few relatives and friends in both the Irish and British army, a good few of whom are women.

DEFTLEFTHAND wrote: »

I'd end up chinning my Corporal.

No, you wouldn't. I'd happily say the majority of Corporals in the British army would knock you flat the moment you raised your hand.

DEFTLEFTHAND

I'd a gran uncle Billy O'Connell, RAF, WW2.

I respect that hedge.


My jibe about chinning the Corporal was just that a jibe.


Aint nobody going to square me away hedge. I'm a pure gentleman from good stock, Officer material.

blinding

Sonics2k wrote: »

Toughness isn't actually a big factor. It's dedication, technique, stamina and determination. I know, because I did it for the RAF.

I've a few relatives and friends in both the Irish and British army, a good few of whom are women.



No, you wouldn't. I'd happily say the majority of Corporals in the British army would knock you flat the moment you raised your hand.

Shouldn’t you get brownie points if you did manage to chin him . He is trying to turn you into a tough guy ( among other things )

Glass fused light

yesto24 wrote: »

And she probably passed the assault course and all other required training.
Are you starting to see the point of having standards?

If i dont agree with the basic training standards I take that up with my boss. If I bring my job into my online life and do so in a way they don't agree with I am well aware that I will be subject to a disciplinary. If I did what this guy did, posting a video, to someone I was managing I would expect to be sacked for gross misconduct.

I suspect you will find that the court martial was based on the breach of standards. If he wanted to make a point he could have tweeted away within the rules. This guy was not making a statement about training standards he was just being a A-hole

Sonics2k

blinding wrote: »

Shouldn’t you get brownie points if you did manage to chin him . He is trying to turn you into a tough guy ( among other things )

I've only heard of one case of someone striking an NCO out of anger. He was disciplined (massively, almost got kicked out) and the squad suffered too.

iirc the lightest punishment he got was sock duty, which doesn't sound nearly as bad as it is.

corner of hells

Raquel Breezy Guppy wrote: »

I know a lot of army cooks who could kill thousands without firing a shot

That's you fcuked when next in your barracks...

Are Am Eye

Sonics2k wrote: »

No, you wouldn't. I'd happily say the majority of Corporals in the British army would knock you flat the moment you raised your hand.

Except for this particular Corporal. Who is prone to leaving his flank open.

antiskeptic

DEFTLEFTHAND wrote: »

He posted on Twitter, You want females on the front line, this is what I've to deal with.

The vid was of a young female recruit who was incapable of passing the assault course in basic British army training. She was blubbering and snubbering and her Corporal was giving her hell.


It poses the question. Should women be in the military?

I think it would be best if there were only women in the military.

blinding

antiskeptic wrote: »

I think it would be best if there were only women in the military.

I have argued this point often . Women can be very nasty and if this was channeled correctly they would be devastating to all and every enemy .

They would be perfect for the uniform and the ceremonial side of Military forces .

And if both sides were women only forces it would take them that bit longer to get ready , so that the Politicians may have time to come up with a peaceful solution .

Nobody will want two armies of bad ass women cutting loose .

Barry Badrinath

Military training is tough. A lot of people who have never gone through it cannot appreciate the complexities of it and thats fine.

It's not the stereotypical 'idiot' job anymore and it's not just a case of doing what you are told.

Recruit training is the transition from civilian to military life, its vastly different. It's a chalenging environment meant to test your physical robustness and mental fortitude. It exposes all character types and exploits all your strengths and weaknesses.

That in turn, allows the NCO's to focus on your weak parts and work on it until it is one of your strengths.

If someone consistently under performs and are not fit to soldier, let the training diary capture it and it will speak for itself. There is no need to capture the moment and upload it for the purpose of humiliation and to send a message of your own agenda.

Some women play to their gender, some dont. Some are capable soldiers, some accidentally got through the net. The same can be said of some men. Regardless, a good NCO or Officer will utilise each soldiers strengths instead of writing either of them off.

Soldiering doesnt begin and end at running around with a load of kit and a weapon. The military is made up of different Corps, Infantry, Cavalry, Signals, Medical, Artillery, Engineers etc.

Although all Corps complete Infantry Recruit Training as the basic building blocks to becoming a soldier, not all soldiers regularly perform "Infantrylike" tasks. A weak Recruit who barely makes the standard may very well go on to out perform people in another Corps or indeed the Infantry Corps as his or her career progresses.

Anyway, the NCO was wrong in what he did.

wes

Wow, amazing to see misognists make this about Women as opposed to an idiot posting a video he shouldn't to social media. What he did is out of order and they are right to court marshal him. The Woman in the video has a right to privacy that was violated. They can hardly trust this guy now, who knows what other sensitivie info he could post online?

arybvtcw0eolkf

Had a look at the video just now.. Tbh that's pretty much a routine part of recruit life, esp when you're out on the ground.

The guy was a dick for recording that and will pay a heavy price.

But that clip had nothing to do with her being a woman, or show women are the weaker sex (if that's the way some are thinking). I've seen lots of 18 yr old male recruit breaking down and crying like that.

Much of recruit training is horrible, esp when you're out on the ground. But tbh it has to be very robust, and someone screaming and cursing in your face like that is all part and parcel of the experience.

Filming that and ridiculing the poor girl online like the cpl did was totally out of order and way too serious to be dealt with by his Commanding Officer's orders. Any CO would kick that up to a court martial.

Barry Badrinath

Yeah just watched the video too.

That has absolutely nothing to do with being a female recruit/soldier.

The NCO was putting pressure on the Recruit as is expected. She started crying probably with relief when she was told it was over (I have seen it before) the NCO then continued the exercise once he seen her crying.

This is very much a non story. Speaking as a soldier, as a person who has gone through Recruit Training, as an Instructor who has trained hundreds of Recruits...his instruction was standard, however, his actions of videoing the event was completely wrong.

DEFTLEFTHAND

US Army Rangers lowered their standard for females, as did the Marine Corps. A disgrace imo and besmirches the uniform.

The one crowd who refused to lower their standard were the Navy and their SEAL programme.


They opened up selection to women , but to date none have passed the 3 weeks pre Buds selection.

Buford T. Justice XIX

Mod note: Right, folks, I've checked the title of the thread and the discussion is in relation to a British Army NCO sharing a video of a female recruit. There is NO correlation with the incident in the Northern incident, now decades ago, where two soldiers were killled by the IRA.


Just to emphasise that, NONE!


Now work away with the discussion WITHOUT ANY REFERENCES to that incident, please.


Buford T. Justice

AttentionBebe

manonboard wrote: »

Why are we using a single physically incapable women as a representive of all women?

Why are we not doing the same for guys?

Because #notallmen obviously. But this one incidence = all women.

blinding

Very few women could carry me out of a situation where I need to be carried .

A lot more men could carry me out .

I would prefer a lot more men in my unit in that situation .

bodice ripper

DEFTLEFTHAND wrote:

US Army Rangers lowered their standard for females, as did the Marine Corps. A disgrace imo and besmirches the uniform.

"Excuse me, but aren't you all a bunch of ****ing hired killers? Shut up! You are thugs, and when we need you to go blow the **** out of a nation of little brown people, we'll let you know."

riffmongous

Professional armies should have high standards yes, but when you look to reports of women fighting in non-professional armies there are many examples of them proving capable; the Russian snipers mentioned earlier, Kurdish units and I was just re-reading Ilyas Akhmadov's book on the Chechen Conflict a few days ago and this passage seemed appropriate. During the First Siege of Grozny

There were two women in the Presidential Guard who had gone through the entire battle in the city and the men regarded as their comrades and did not want them to leave. There was a battle brewing between Akhmed, the Presidential Guard Commander and the 'Zampolit'. There were many Chechen women fighting in Grozny, and they were just as brave and capable as the men. I had witnessed small, frail looking women crawl into impossible spaces and pull men out. I don't know if it would be the same in a professional army abroad, but in their own territory, Chechen women were very good fighters. For the most part the women in the war: fighters, nurses and the technical personnel were saints. On rare occasions there were cases of loose morals but that is a different case altogether. The overwhelming majority of women came to fight because they had lost family members and were seeking revenge. They know that being at the front, they would constantly have to prove they deserved to be there, that they were brave enough, and tough enough. It was much harder for the women that it was for the men; no one questioned why we came there but the women had to prove to us that they were braver

pitifulgod

DEFTLEFTHAND wrote: »

US Army Rangers lowered their standard for females, as did the Marine Corps. A disgrace imo and besmirches the uniform.

The one crowd who refused to lower their standard were the Navy and their SEAL programme.


They opened up selection to women , but to date none have passed the 3 weeks pre Buds selection.

You had a soldier respond just above you who says that she was not remotely at fault and that main concern was the video and posting it online. You got a problem with women by any chance?

riffmongous

Anyway the BA has to address the video as they have been getting an awful lot of bad press the last few years over sexism, bullying and sexual assault in the ranks.

Tom Mann Centuria

riffmongous wrote: »

Anyway the BA has to address the video as they have been getting an awful lot of bad press the last few years over sexism, bullying and sexual assault in the ranks.

It's been a going on for decades, since multiple "suicides" at Deepcut barracks so I don't expect any huge change in culture soon.

DEFTLEFTHAND

bodice ripper wrote: »

"Excuse me, but aren't you all a bunch of ****ing hired killers? Shut up! You are thugs, and when we need you to go blow the **** out of a nation of little brown people, we'll let you know."

"brown people'?

Arabs are technically cacauscoid. Dont use that slur please.


Call them arabs or people of middle eastern appearance.

bodice ripper

DEFTLEFTHAND wrote:

Call them arabs or people of middle eastern appearance.

Weird that that's the part of that quote you took issue with.