Draining Boggy Land

farmer2018

I have to drain about 10 acres of boggy ground with springs in the fields. What is the best/cheapest option? Is that connaught agri pipe a good option?

discodaveirl

Open drains and then level the field like the top of a load of bread. Have a fall to each drain from the centre of the field.. pipes in bog arent too succesful and the return isnt in it

longgonesilver

What's the soil like?
Was it drained before?
What's growing in it now?
Is there somewhere to drain it to?

farmer2018

longgonesilver wrote: »

What's the soil like?
Was it drained before?
What's growing in it now?
Is there somewhere to drain it to?

It is peaty soil with clay a few feet down in parts.
Was drained last about 20 years ago. All drains that were opened and closed in are all blocked up. Grass and rushes now! There is a open drain in the bottom/sides of the fields.

orchard farm

Having plenty of this land myself I know it's difficult to manage but can throw up serious grass when drained can be great veggie ground too.clean out open drains first.cheapest way is to try get fall to these drains by sloping the ground,heard bad reports of how brittle c agri pipes are,others have suggested make your own with roll of terram and normal pipes,cud be a goer.stones are a wast of money as will eventually block up but on the plus bogland is easy to drain and will improve tenfold

farmer2018

orchard farm wrote: »

Having plenty of this land myself I know it's difficult to manage but can throw up serious grass when drained can be great veggie ground too.clean out open drains first.cheapest way is to try get fall to these drains by sloping the ground,heard bad reports of how brittle c agri pipes are,others have suggested make your own with roll of terram and normal pipes,cud be a goer.stones are a wast of money as will eventually block up but on the plus bogland is easy to drain and will improve tenfold

Yes the parts that are dry grows great grass. So the terram and normal pipes without gravel is the way to go you reckon?

The good thing is the all fields can be drained into open drains, the question is the best way of doing it.

amacca

connacht agri themselves have stopped doing the pipes but will supply you with the membrane to cover the usual pipes you can buy in any agri stores afaik

yewtree

Dig a test hole see what the soil profile is like.
If you put any kind of pipe into the peat layer you are burning money as it will have no effect I have learnt from painful experience
Drainage pipes should only go into the soil layer that the water is moving in.
If that layer is below your out let you will have to look at mole drainage but that is seriously expensive.
Every drainage job is different I have found what works in one field might not work in the field next to it.

orchard farm

farmer2018 wrote: »

Yes the parts that are dry grows great grass. So the terram and normal pipes without gravel is the way to go you reckon?

The good thing is the all fields can be drained into open drains, the question is the best way of doing it.

I'd say it's the best way to go as long as it's black ground gravel is a waist of money others may disagree

893bet

Spend the same money reseeding an already dry field will prob yield a better return.

farmer2018

orchard farm wrote: »

Having plenty of this land myself I know it's difficult to manage but can throw up serious grass when drained can be great veggie ground too.clean out open drains first.cheapest way is to try get fall to these drains by sloping the ground,heard bad reports of how brittle c agri pipes are,others have suggested make your own with roll of terram and normal pipes,cud be a goer.stones are a wast of money as will eventually block up but on the plus bogland is easy to drain and will improve tenfold

Where can a roll of this Terram be got? Would you use it with 4 inch JFC pipe?

Connacht Agri do not sell that pipe anymore, they are just selling the sleeve which is 12 euro for 6 meters.

orchard farm

farmer2018 wrote: »

Where can a roll of this Terram be got? Would you use it with 4 inch JFC pipe?

Connacht Agri do not sell that pipe anymore, they are just selling the sleeve which is 12 euro for 6 meters.

Your local farm/building supply shop should be able to get a roll for you

kerry cow

In bog , we dig down till you meet the mud layer .
Pop in a 80 mm pipe , roll out a bale of 4x4 straw .pike it in on top of the pipe . Back fill .use a sewer pipe at the open end .work perfect .has been here for 25 yrs .and watch the water flow when it rains .
Place 3 m apart

Eamonn8448

kerry cow wrote: »

In bog , we dig down till you meet the mud layer .
Pop in a 80 mm pipe , roll out a bale of 4x4 straw .pike it in on top of the pipe . Back fill .use a sewer pipe at the open end .work perfect .has been here for 25 yrs .and watch the water flow when it rains .
Place 3 m apart

got me thinking there, instead of straw would rushes do the same job ? Im guessing they'd be down too deep for any spores to germinate and if would be a good way of getting rid of the ba***rds....

Mtx

Hard to know who is right, heard people say straw never worked

Limestone Cowboy

farmer2018 wrote: »

Where can a roll of this Terram be got? Would you use it with 4 inch JFC pipe?

Connacht Agri do not sell that pipe anymore, they are just selling the sleeve which is 12 euro for 6 meters.

Does the sleeve only come in 6 meter lengths? I'd love to try it on an acre to see if it works.

farmer2018

Any other thoughts on this? Some drains that were filled with 4 inch pipe and shale are blocked up that were done 10 years ago. Any one with experience on draining this type of ground and have been successful?

Gudstock

From what I have seen, for bog or peat ground that was originally raised bog cutaway, if you do a trial hole when the ground is wet you will see how the water collects from the clay layer up into the peat - it can't get though the clay hence why the bog formed in the first place.

You need your perimeter open drains to be deeper than the clay below the bog.
Then your piped drains across the field should have the pipe laid in the clay layer with stone backfill up just above the clay layer just into the peat.
Ensure that the clay dug out is well mixed up with the peat when backfilling so that it doesn't clog the stone you've put in.

When reseeding and after use gran lime only instead of ground, gran won't soften the peat surface like ground does and avoid poaching at all costs.

This type of ground well drained and cared for can surprisingly grow huge volumes of grass.

Good loser

Gudstock wrote: »

From what I have seen, for bog or peat ground that was originally raised bog cutaway, if you do a trial hole when the ground is wet you will see how the water collects from the clay layer up into the peat - it can't get though the clay hence why the bog formed in the first place.

You need your perimeter open drains to be deeper than the clay below the bog.
Then your piped drains across the field should have the pipe laid in the clay layer with stone backfill up just above the clay layer just into the peat.
Ensure that the clay dug out is well mixed up with the peat when backfilling so that it doesn't clog the stone you've put in.

When reseeding and after use gran lime only instead of ground, gran won't soften the peat surface like ground does and avoid poaching at all costs.

This type of ground well drained and cared for can surprisingly grow huge volumes of grass.

That seems to me to be the way to go. Just I'd add terram on top of the stones.
Can buy a terram type product called Weed Out (or something like that) comes in 15 m rolls 1metre wide. Cut in half with a hacksaw gives just the right width and easy to handle if there's wind.

Markcheese

Has anybody cleaned out ,or jetted drainage pipe ?
Or is it pointless ?

Gudstock

Markcheese wrote: »

Has anybody cleaned out ,or jetted drainage pipe ?
Or is it pointless ?

Not us, but some neighbours do it on large flat fields with I'm guessing flat or poor fall in the drains.
I think the dutch are fans. There are some tractor powered jetters out there.

TooOldBoots

I discovered old drains in a boggy field. Basically they were all dug by hand, two flat stones either side and a larger flag on top. Water travels along the clay on the bottom. Drains worked perfectly for years, I'd say they might have been there for over 100 years.
Enter the 2000s and the modern farmer in me had the contractors in making round bale silage with those big tractors and made **** of all the drains. field went back to bog and rushes again within 2 years.
I spent a long Summer with a small mini digger reopening and replacing those same drains. Lesson learnt the hard way.

cacs

Great insights but how do you drain bog

farmer2018

Lads, I am finding it hard to see the whole purpose of a pipe in peaty soil. Will clean stone not just work better?

Bass Reeves

farmer2018 wrote: »

Lads, I am finding it hard to see the whole purpose of a pipe in peaty soil. Will clean stone not just work better?

Clean stone may or may not work. Biggest issue is stone or pipe getting clogged . In the overall budget for a drainage job pipe adds about 15-20% to the cost.

I see you have clay below the big/soil. Open drains will only drain soon much and have to be cleaned every 10-20years. If you are land draining dig drain put in pipe, fill drain to top of clay level and use straw or membrane from allowing peat/disturbed clay blocking drains.

Stone only drains may also work but again using membrane/straw to form barriers to stone is advisable. On stone round sandstone is better than crushed limestone

farmer2018

Should you have to be cleaning out open drains every few years realistically? What depth are your open drains in general? I notice any drains that are deep enough that have met stone do not need to be cleaned but other open drains fill with mud/weeds again in no length.

farmer2018

farmer2018 wrote: »

Should you have to be cleaning out open drains every few years realistically? What depth are your open drains in general? I notice any drains that are deep enough that have met stone do not need to be cleaned but other open drains fill with mud/weeds again in no length.

Theres some here with 40 years and never been touched,while others are silted up after 5

Hoping to get em cleared this year,and tap few more springs aswell

farmer2018

Any other thoughts on draining peaty soil? Other opinions welcome on what has worked for people.

farmer2018

I found some old flagstone drains from doing a bit of investigating the last few days. The area over the flag is wet and they are about a half of a foot down from top of the soil. What would be the best thing to do with these try find the mouth and clean it out?

Can anyone help with this?

farmer2018

Have opened some drains since last year. I am told to put clean stone and a 4 inch JFC pipe. Is that the way to go?

farmer2018

orchard farm wrote: »

Having plenty of this land myself I know it's difficult to manage but can throw up serious grass when drained can be great veggie ground too.clean out open drains first.cheapest way is to try get fall to these drains by sloping the ground,heard bad reports of how brittle c agri pipes are,others have suggested make your own with roll of terram and normal pipes,cud be a goer.stones are a wast of money as will eventually block up but on the plus bogland is easy to drain and will improve tenfold

So you are saying just to use a pipe and no gravel? What has worked for you?

farmer2018

kerry cow wrote: »

In bog , we dig down till you meet the mud layer .
Pop in a 80 mm pipe , roll out a bale of 4x4 straw .pike it in on top of the pipe . Back fill .use a sewer pipe at the open end .work perfect .has been here for 25 yrs .and watch the water flow when it rains .
Place 3 m apart

Interesting, so you put straw over the pipe with no stone? JFC pipe I presume? Have you any pictures please.

PMU

Markcheese wrote: »

Has anybody cleaned out ,or jetted drainage pipe ?
Or is it pointless ?

3/4 inch water pipe and shove it in and out. 2 men working in sync can do a lot of cleaning

PMU

farmer2018 wrote: »

Any other thoughts on draining peaty soil? Other opinions welcome on what has worked for people.

it takes a year or two to dry out properly, so dont use heavy animals or heavy machines until the surface gets a "skin" ( firm surface)

older by the day

Have boggy land here too. I have a good bit turned. I did three acres last year. Mixed the clay and bog and heaped it up for a year, then level it out. You will see where the springs rise, quarry pipe and 4 inch stone, a little waste straw or hay on top of the stone to slow the silt going down. 2 1/2 acres perfect 1/2 one middling. It's expensive but it's the only long term method

farmer2018

Another question lads, straight 4 inch jfc pipe vs roll of 4 inch pipe?

Track9

kerry cow wrote: »

In bog, we dig down till you meet the mud layer.
Pop in an 80 mm pipe, roll out a bale of 4x4 straw .pike it in on top of the pipe. Backfill .use a sewer pipe at the open end .work perfect .has been here for 25 yrs .and watch the water flow when it rains.
Place 3 m apart

---

Just saw the 3 meters apart. Wow, that's a good job. Here in W Cork, we tend only to tap into the springs & follow the ground. The next pipe could be 100 meters away.
Our problem is silting after about yr ten. The Stone & pipe become a Jelly like mud /slurry that blocks everything ????
Any advice? How can we keep the silt / boggy particles out of stone etc ??

kerry cow

Track9 wrote:

Just saw the 3 meters apart. Wow, that's a good job. Here in W Cork, we tend only to tap into the springs & follow the ground. The next pipe could be 100 meters away. Our problem is silting after about yr ten. The Stone & pipe become a Jelly like mud /slurry that blocks everything ???? Any advice? How can we keep the silt / boggy particles out of stone etc ??

we use straw in the bog ,dig down to mud

Omallep2

Track9 wrote: »

---

Just saw the 3 meters apart. Wow, that's a good job. Here in W Cork, we tend only to tap into the springs & follow the ground. The next pipe could be 100 meters away.
Our problem is silting after about yr ten. The Stone & pipe become a Jelly like mud /slurry that blocks everything ????
Any advice? How can we keep the silt / boggy particles out of stone etc ??

Use sandstone not limestone

Bass Reeves

Track9 wrote: »

---

Just saw the 3 meters apart. Wow, that's a good job. Here in W Cork, we tend only to tap into the springs & follow the ground. The next pipe could be 100 meters away.
Our problem is silting after about yr ten. The Stone & pipe become a Jelly like mud /slurry that blocks everything ????
Any advice? How can we keep the silt / boggy particles out of stone etc ??

As Kerrycow and Omallep advise. Round sandstone is the best stone for drainage. However it is expansive. I say in West cork you would get crushed sandstone fairly compeditively. Put straw in top of the stone it forms a cake and prevents dirt and silt getting into the stone. There is a q product called builders paper you can get but never saw it.nit is supposed to be used when found a percolation area. Seen a lad use 1 meter wide rooked of that weed block as water will go to through it but if you ever need to do back at it it's a mess to pull out of the drains

Mooooo

Track9 wrote: »

---

Just saw the 3 meters apart. Wow, that's a good job. Here in W Cork, we tend only to tap into the springs & follow the ground. The next pipe could be 100 meters away.
Our problem is silting after about yr ten. The Stone & pipe become a Jelly like mud /slurry that blocks everything ????
Any advice? How can we keep the silt / boggy particles out of stone etc ??

Linking drains in to one outlet can keep a constant flow as well and keep things clear

JohnChadwick

Have a 4 inch drainage pipe coming out of what must be a spring underground, and it's constantly running. I want to use this water for cattle further downhill and not racking my brain how to get a 4 inch down to a 1 inch pipe. Does anyone know how to do this?

Sugarbowl

older by the day wrote: »

Have boggy land here too. I have a good bit turned. I did three acres last year. Mixed the clay and bog and heaped it up for a year, then level it out. You will see where the springs rise, quarry pipe and 4 inch stone, a little waste straw or hay on top of the stone to slow the silt going down. 2 1/2 acres perfect 1/2 one middling. It's expensive but it's the only long term method

How much an acre do you reckon you spent on it?

Murang

JohnChadwick wrote: »

Have a 4 inch drainage pipe coming out of what must be a spring underground, and it's constantly running. I want to use this water for cattle further downhill and not racking my brain how to get a 4 inch down to a 1 inch pipe. Does anyone know how to do this?

Build a small dam I have one here built in a drain with 2 4 inch soap blocks and the pipe is coming out underneath the little dam is only 4 inches high so excess water just flows over it

Good loser

Track9 wrote: »

---

Just saw the 3 meters apart. Wow, that's a good job. Here in W Cork, we tend only to tap into the springs & follow the ground. The next pipe could be 100 meters away.
Our problem is silting after about yr ten. The Stone & pipe become a Jelly like mud /slurry that blocks everything ????
Any advice? How can we keep the silt / boggy particles out of stone etc ??

Use Terram or WeedBlock as Bass says.

It comes in 1 metre wide rolls (and wider). The 1 m roll can be sawn in half to bring it to 0.5m wide and this is rolled out on top of the stone before backfill.

Always a success for me over 10 years now.

farmer2018

Would lads try clean stone with no drainage pipe?

tellmeabit

JohnChadwick wrote: »

Have a 4 inch drainage pipe coming out of what must be a spring underground, and it's constantly running. I want to use this water for cattle further downhill and not racking my brain how to get a 4 inch down to a 1 inch pipe. Does anyone know how to do this?

I have land drain from spring flowing into a blue barrel in the dyke with 3/4 attachment about 6 inches from the bottom of barrel to try stop and mud going into trough.
I should be heading to that field over next few day ,will try get pic. Have used 20ltr drums before on their belly if didn't have much fall to work with.

2smiggy

farmer2018 wrote: »

Would lads try clean stone with no drainage pipe?

110 mm perforated drainage pipe costs between 6/7 euros a metre. If you go to the bother digging and stoning it, you are better off putting in the pipe.

farmer2018

2smiggy wrote: »

110 mm perforated drainage pipe costs between 6/7 euros a metre. If you go to the bother digging and stoning it, you are better off putting in the pipe.

€12 a 6m pipe is the best quote I got.

2smiggy

farmer2018 wrote: »

€12 a 6m pipe is the best quote I got.

my mistake, just looked it up there, it was €9.25 an 6 metre length, but that was buying 400 pipes together and nearly 2 years ago since I got them.

Edit: 9.25 plus VAT

farmer2018

farmer2018 wrote: »

Would lads try clean stone with no drainage pipe?

Is it water bubbling up or surface water not soaking is the problem?