The Sub 4 Support Thread

Kellygirl

theyoungchap wrote: »

Week 2 finished yesterday, going well. Did 8 miles in 1:11:40. I had aimed for 9 minutes a mile so I was glad to come in at 8:57 and not be absolutely spent. I also included a hill which I think would be relatively similar to the Roebuck Road hill towards the end of the run...I presume this is a good idea?

I am aiming for a 4 hr marathon. Given I didn't come back exhausted yesterday (tired, very, exhausted no) and it was very warm, should I be aiming quicker?

Have you input any race times into a calculator to get the paces you should run your various training runs at?

Kellygirl

ewc78 wrote: »

So I persume a good few of ye started Dublin Marathon training this week? How did it all go?
I'm starting tomorrow after a weeks holidays behind me where I only got in one 7km run.
I'll be starting on week 2 of the meno plan.
Here goes nothing!!

I jumped into week 2 of the Boards plan last week - well a modified version with some extra mileage. All grand. Heat was tough so started getting out extra early and my last two runs including my lsr were at 6:30 in the morn and much easier.

Good luck with the meno plan.

theyoungchap

Kellygirl wrote: »

Have you input any race times into a calculator to get the paces you should run your various training runs at?

No not as yet, any suggestions? I had asked earlier in the thread and read a bit online and the LSR's were supposed to be 10 minutes a mile, which was way too slow for me.

I do my short runs at 7.30 for 5k, 8 minutes per mile for 5 miles say.

Kellygirl

theyoungchap wrote: »

No not as yet, any suggestions? I had asked earlier in the thread and read a bit online and the LSR's were supposed to be 10 minutes a mile, which was way too slow for me.

I do my short runs at 7.30 for 5k, 8 minutes per mile for 5 miles say.

This is the one for the Grads plan http://www.runfastcoach.com/calc2/index.php and try McMillan too.

It sounds like to me you are doing them all a bit fast. I’m actually currently reading Advance Marathoning and really explains the reason well there why you need to go slower on your runs. It’s a great read. Recommended at the start of this thread. Easy runs need to be easy and hard runs hard. You could incorporate MP miles into your long run but shouldn’t all be hard. I haven’t gotten to sub 4 myself but just passing on info I’ve learned here.

Just editing to say those paces sound fast for sub 4 but I don’t know how much past sub 4 you are going either!

theyoungchap

Kellygirl wrote: »

This is the one for the Grads plan http://www.runfastcoach.com/calc2/index.php and try McMillan too.

It sounds like to me you are doing them all a bit fast. I’m actually currently reading Advance Marathoning and really explains the reason well there why you need to go slower on your runs. It’s a great read. Recommended at the start of this thread. Easy runs need to be easy and hard runs hard. You could incorporate MP miles into your long run but shouldn’t all be hard. I haven’t gotten to sub 4 myself but just passing on info I’ve learned here.

Just editing to say those paces sound fast for sub 4 but I don’t know how much past sub 4 you are going either!

I'm in a bit of a catch 22 here.....do I aim higher (say, 3:45) or do I slow down a bit.....I would hate to be there on the day saying "damn I should have went quicker in the training".
I have done just over 4hr before but a good few years ago.

Kellygirl

theyoungchap wrote: »

I'm in a bit of a catch 22 here.....do I aim higher (say, 3:45) or do I slow down a bit.....I would hate to be there on the day saying "damn I should have went quicker in the training".
I have done just over 4hr before but a good few years ago.

Well how about you train to your current fitness? The calculators will tell you what your paces currently are. Do some races along the way and the paces should be getting faster then and you’ll have a better time closer to the time. From all the stuff I’ve read here and in the book I’m reading, training too fast doesn’t work as you need to train the body to have a high lactate threshold to keep you going on the day as you don’t want to accumulate too much lactate on the day. Running too fast in training builds up too much lactate and also is working on the wrong energy system in shorter run or sessions. You need to be training your aerobic system for running the marathon.

I hope I’m making sense! Just learning myself and hope I’m not spouting rubbish but it gave me more understanding. Also explains why running too slow is pointless so the calculators are a fairly good guide to get you on the straight and narrow I think. Some of the more experienced guys I’m sure can give better advice.

theyoungchap

Kellygirl wrote: »

Well how about you train to your current fitness? The calculators will tell you what your paces currently are. Do some races along the way and the paces should be getting faster then and you’ll have a better time closer to the time. From all the stuff I’ve read here and in the book I’m reading, training too fast doesn’t work as you need to train the body to have a high lactate threshold to keep you going on the day as you don’t want to accumulate too much lactate on the day. Running too fast in training builds up too much lactate and also is working on the wrong energy system in shorter run or sessions. You need to be training your aerobic system for running the marathon.

I hope I’m making sense! Just learning myself and hope I’m not spouting rubbish but it gave me more understanding. Also explains why running too slow is pointless so the calculators are a fairly good guide to get you on the straight and narrow I think. Some of the more experienced guys I’m sure can give better advice.

I'm all ears, don't worry. Having read the reviews of the book, I am afraid to change much at present because I am a little bit injury prone typically, although I am feeling better this time than others. I definitely have less pain after the LSR's. I have found a good physio which is probably helping.

Kellygirl

theyoungchap wrote: »

I'm all ears, don't worry. Having read the reviews of the book, I am afraid to change much at present because I am a little bit injury prone typically, although I am feeling better this time than others. I definitely have less pain after the LSR's. I have found a good physio which is probably helping.

I’m not following the plans in the book but they only come at the end. Before that is all the explanation and reasoning about types of training and nutrition and all sorts. It really is good.

The right physio is the job. I’ve a great one now too whereas spent a fortune on somebody useless a couple of years ago.

Murph_D

theyoungchap wrote: »

I'm in a bit of a catch 22 here.....do I aim higher (say, 3:45) or do I slow down a bit.....I would hate to be there on the day saying "damn I should have went quicker in the training".
I have done just over 4hr before but a good few years ago.

You have a recent HM of 1:51 according to your earlier posts. That certainly points towards a 4-hour target, but you won't get there doing all your runs at faster than marathon pace. Long runs should be around 10 mins/mile +

It's unlikely you will be telling yourself on the day that you should have targeted a faster time - but if it happens there is always the next one!

Testosterscone

theyoungchap wrote: »

I'm in a bit of a catch 22 here.....do I aim higher (say, 3:45) or do I slow down a bit.....I would hate to be there on the day saying "damn I should have went quicker in the training".
I have done just over 4hr before but a good few years ago.

theyoungchap wrote: »

I'm all ears, don't worry. Having read the reviews of the book, I am afraid to change much at present because I am a little bit injury prone typically, although I am feeling better this time than others. I definitely have less pain after the LSR's. I have found a good physio which is probably helping.

These generally tend to go hand in hand and is a common mistake in marathon training. Paces early on feel okay to an extent but you don't have the endurance to hold them as the mileage creeps up, all of a sudden niggles start creeping in because muscles fatigue early on in Long runs and you put undue pressure on your body with poor form. Unlike cycling or swimming more often that not your fitness won't hold you back in terms of training it's you body not being able to keep up.

Generally I would tend to have my marathon runners in around the 4hr mark around 10-10.30 pace. Might seem slow but your body can't tell the difference of about 30 sec for physiological benefits especially in those without a large aerobic background but your body will tell you if you go too hard so you tend to have nothing to gain but everything to lose from a fitness/injury perspective.

judeboy101

5 weeks out from Longford marathon did hm @ 1:55 due to due 19 miler this weekend aiming for 9:50/mile. I reckon I'm looking at a 4:10 ish full but hoping some good pacers might pull me with them.

theyoungchap

Murph_D wrote: »

It's unlikely you will be telling yourself on the day that you should have targeted a faster time - but if it happens there is always the next one!

The only problem is I think this might be my last marathon! I am possibly going to start cycling more after this I think with Mizen/Malin being my next endurance event!

Kellygirl

theyoungchap wrote: »

The only problem is I think this might be my last marathon! I am possibly going to start cycling more after this I think with Mizen/Malin being my next endurance event!

I suppose comes down to what you want most out of it then and smart training for it. If you go for 3:45 and blow up you could come in a good bit after 4 hours. If you got for 3:55 you could do it and a bit faster but much more enjoyable.

theyoungchap

Kellygirl wrote: »

I suppose comes down to what you want most out of it then and smart training for it. If you go for 3:45 and blow up you could come in a good bit after 4 hours. If you got for 3:55 you could do it and a bit faster but much more enjoyable.

That is the conundrum alright. I might stick to my 9 minute miles for now, until the distances get a bit higher, then I will see how I am feeling, if I have to I can drop down a gear....

I will do a half-marathon race and report back from that...... thanks for your help folks.

Murph_D

theyoungchap wrote: »

That is the conundrum alright. I might stick to my 9 minute miles for now, until the distances get a bit higher, then I will see how I am feeling, if I have to I can drop down a gear....

I will do a half-marathon race and report back from that...... thanks for your help folks.

Completely up to you, but if it’s going to be your last marathon, would you not consider training properly for it? The approach you are taking is almost certainly going to end in tears. Have seen it happen over and over to other runners, in my club, on boards, and elsewhere.

Good luck all the same!

theyoungchap

Murph_D wrote: »

Completely up to you, but if it’s going to be your last marathon, would you not consider training properly for it? The approach you are taking is almost certainly going to end in tears. Have seen it happen over and over to other runners, in my club, on boards, and elsewhere.

Good luck all the same!

You are probably right. I might ease off the throttle a bit.

RayCun

No-one is really going to care whether you ran a marathon in 3:49 or 3:59 (or 3:09 or 4:39), and if you are not going to keep running you won't really care yourself in a couple of years.

What you will remember of the marathon is the last 5-10 miles - you'll remember feeling strong, passing people, enjoying the experience. Or you'll remember walking, in pain, taking forever to get to the end. Choose the race strategy that gives you an experience you'll enjoy remembering.

seanin4711

missed out on first 4 weeks of BGP due to calf strain(very slow to heal).
going to start on week 5 and take it super easy.

best of luck to all!

HelenAnne

RayCun wrote: »

No-one is really going to care whether you ran a marathon in 3:49 or 3:59 (or 3:09 or 4:39), and if you are not going to keep running you won't really care yourself in a couple of years.

What you will remember of the marathon is the last 5-10 miles - you'll remember feeling strong, passing people, enjoying the experience. Or you'll remember walking, in pain, taking forever to get to the end. Choose the race strategy that gives you an experience you'll enjoy remembering.

This is SO true! My (one & only) marathon time isn't THAT bad (well, non-runners think it's not that bad ), but as Ray describes above, I had about 18-20 good miles, and then the rest was just about struggling to the finish (thinking 'Stop clapping, I'm in despair!' as all the lovely supporters cheered me on )

Because of that, I just remember the whole thing as a 'bad marathon'; I'd say if I'd run an even pace and felt strong at the end I would have had a great sense of achievement ... and maybe gone on to do more marathons!

I'd say do your long runs slow, get the time on your feet under your belt, don't worry too much about time in the marathon, just try to run comfortably and feel good in the last 8 to 10 miles. Good luck!!

Alorra

Hi All

A few random/ varying questions. I see there was a bit of chat regarding P&D a little earlier, so thought i might put this here. I have dutifully got the book and read it a few times (thanks for the recommendation) and decided to give the up to 55 miles program a crack for the DCM this year. I am a novice but decided i liked the plan so went with it.

A few things puzzle me while i read it:

1) Training by heart rate levels: ( I am sure there is a science to this)
Firstly the book by and large perscribes a suggested heart rate for each run. I have calculated the heart rates based on what i think my Max was (approx 188) and resting (approx 49) ( i have a garmin 235 with the built heart rate things so was going by those readings).

I have only used this approach a few times but found it a bit disconcerting- i was off chasing a heart rate to get my rate up (at the start, this translated into quicker than expected splits), then i was slowing down as the run was going on to keep the rate in the desired zone. Any ways it felt like it was all over the shop.

Is there a source of info that i should look to try and find out more about training via the heart rate?

I think some of the issue is, i am setting my warm up too short (1 mile), it definitely takes longer than this to get going properly so it was buzzing away on my wrist.

Is a wrist based heart rate monitor actually accruate enough?

In the end i think i have decided to just run to paces based on those calculators and see where i get to.

2) Why for the tempo runs does it say that slower runners should run to 15k pace and quicker half marthon pace. Say my best hm pace would be 7.50/ 7.55 currently. i consider my self slow - which means i should run this at 7.40 pace on Thursday night.

3) Clubs v Marthon training plan
Soooo. i have popped down to a local club a few times this year. Did not get down really due to work (other excuses) so did really get to join properly. (i will go back)

Now i am finding that say Tuesday night the plan is for a 10 miler.- it will be something speedy if i go to the club, so for the last 5- 6weeks i have just been heading out (base training for the marathon).

Is there a place to go down to the club in the middle of this? i do like the atmosphere of the clubs.

Currently moving into week 3 of the plan and enjoying it.

Murph_D

Lot of questions there!

1. Heart rate -others may differ, but in my opinion maybe hold off until your next marathon or the one after before taking the HR approach. You need to establish some aerobic fitness in a sustained way before your HR will be reliable enough to train to. Maybe. Also as you suspect, the wrist HRM is not always reliable. Gives me terribly unreliable and inconsistent readings anyway.

2. Tempo - for Pfitzinger, tempo pace is what you can sustain for about an hour. This of course varies between runners. For novices, somewhere between 10k-15k pace. What are your recent race times? This will give you a clue.

3. In my opinion you will benefit from the club session, as long as you combine it with the plan effectively, swapping out a like for like session, depending on whether the club is doing speed work or tempo stuff. Talk to one of the club coaches for advice there. (Don’t be surprised though if they try to talk you out of P&D!) Anytime I used P&D myself, I always combined with club speed sessions (which are always available on Tuesdays at my club). The more you do this, however, the less you are following the plan, obviously, and you risk having no plan, or at best a different plan.

Good luck!

shotgunmcos

+1 on heart rate. I use it but have trained with heart rate for years. When I look back on using my first HRM I relied on hr too much and neglected how the run actually felt vs the hr and vs pace amongst other things.

Even knowing your max and resting hr its hard to know without specifically testing zones and thresholds. From what I have read and written out in P&D (good to hear you are enjoying the plan) it is based on hr and paces. No harm in using hr to help control the plan but not to govern the plan. In another book I remember a quote likje "we don't train to hold a certain hr for a marathon we train to maintain a certain pace to hit, usually a pretty specific time goal". Can't remember which one as I've read a bunch if them lately.

3 weeks down and enjoying it, good luck!

HelenAnne

Murph_D wrote: »

Lot of questions there!


3. In my opinion you will benefit from the club session, as long as you combine it with the plan effectively, swapping out a like for like session, depending on whether the club is doing speed work or tempo stuff. Talk to one of the club coaches for advice there. (Don’t be surprised though if they try to talk you out of P&D!) Anytime I used P&D myself, I always combined with club speed sessions (which are always available on Tuesdays at my club). The more you do this, however, the less you are following the plan, obviously, and you risk having no plan, or at best a different plan.

Good luck!

If you do join a club, and if they’re a club with a lot of marathoners, you could just follow the club plan? Then you’d be doing the same as everyone else, and it takes all the planning hassle out of it.

I know a lot of the first marathon times from people in my club who just did their marathon training along with everyone else (particularly the long runs and the mid-week medium-long runs) were sub-4.

Alorra

Murph_D wrote: »

Lot of questions there!

2. Tempo - for Pfitzinger, tempo pace is what you can sustain for about an hour. This of course varies between runners. For novices, somewhere between 10k-15k pace. What are your recent race times? This will give you a clue.

3. In my opinion you will benefit from the club session, as long as you combine it with the plan effectively, swapping out a like for like session, depending on whether the club is doing speed work or tempo stuff. Talk to one of the club coaches for advice there. (Don’t be surprised though if they try to talk you out of P&D!) Anytime I used P&D myself, I always combined with club speed sessions (which are always available on Tuesdays at my club). The more you do this, however, the less you are following the plan, obviously, and you risk having no plan, or at best a different plan.

Good luck!

Thanks for replies.
I think those comments make sense and will run with the suggested paces and a half eye on them heart rate gauge to make sure I am not going way out of whack for the planned type of run.

Re the race paces, I have not ran a race in ages, i would think i can do a 5k in approx 21mins to 21.30 now.
I am doing the liberties fun run 4 miler next week and then the 10k of the race series at the end of that week. So i should have a better idea of current fitness levels then.

I will look at trying to make the club thing work/ fit in, I think the more people around the easier will be the journey.

Alorra

HelenAnne wrote: »

If you do join a club, and if they’re a club with a lot of marathoners, you could just follow the club plan? Then you’d be doing the same as everyone else, and it takes all the planning hassle out of it.

I know a lot of the first marathon times from people in my club who just did their marathon training along with everyone else (particularly the long runs and the mid-week medium-long runs) were sub-4.

This is true too:),
hmmm, right now i will keep to the current plan and see if i reckon i can get it all fitted in.

The Black Oil

TFBubendorfer wrote: »

Best tip I can give you, any anyone else, is to buy this book, read it from cover to cover and start training:

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Advanced-Marathoning-Peter-Pfitzinger/dp/0736074600

It worked for me, and a lot of other runners. When someone talks about P&D, this is what they're talking about.

Came in the post today. Time to start reading.

ewc78

Did the meno Wednesday workout tonight as football was apparently coming home last night so wanted to watch that. Turns out it isn't coming home at all now....:)
The workout went very well. Found it tough but more manageable than when I did it a few weeks ago as a trial run.

Pomplamousse

ewc78 wrote: »

Did the meno Wednesday workout tonight as football was apparently coming home last night so wanted to watch that. Turns out it isn't coming home at all now....:)
The workout went very well. Found it tough but more manageable than when I did it a few weeks ago as a trial run.

Is that the week 2 progression session? I really enjoyed that one. Which is more than can be said for the week 1 and 3 sessions:o

Football must be really homesick by now:p

ewc78

Pomplamousse wrote: »

Is that the week 2 progression session? I really enjoyed that one. Which is more than can be said for the week 1 and 3 sessions:o

Football must be really homesick by now:p

Yeah the progression workout.

The Black Oil

This is what I came up with from the progression in week 2. Will say more in my log. Didn't find it tiring, tbh.

1:27:39, 8.29 miles at 10:34
Warm up 2.09 miles at 11:42

Rep|Time|Distance|Paced - aimed for (min/mi)|Actual
1|8.13|0.87|9:40|9:28
2|8:05|0.86|9:27|9:27
3|8:11|0:89|9:04|9:10
-|0:14|0.03|9:48|watch user error
4|8:48|1.03|8:38|8:34

Cool down 2.53 miles at 11:44

ewc78

I dunno how to do fancy tables but these are my average paces for each 8 minute interval.(min/km pace in brackets)

1 - 8mins @ Steady Pace 9:26 min/mile. (5:52)
2 - 8mins @ Marathon Pace 8:54 min/mile (5:32)
3 - 8mins @ Half Mara Pace 8:12 min/mile(5:06)
4 - 8mins @ Hard Pace 7:01 min/mile(4:22)

Also did warm up and down at about 10 min/mile pace.

Murph_D

The Black Oil wrote: »

This is what I came up with from the progression in week 2. Will say more in my log. Didn't find it tiring, tbh.

1:27:39, 8.29 miles at 10:34
Warm up 2.09 miles at 11:42

Rep|Time|Distance|Paced - aimed for (min/mi)|Actual
1|8.13|0.87|9:40|9:28
2|8:05|0.86|9:27|9:27
3|8:11|0:89|9:04|9:10
-|0:14|0.03|9:48|watch user error
4|8:48|1.03|8:38|8:34

Cool down 2.53 miles at 11:44

Well if you found it easy, maybe you found out something about yourself!

These paces are for someone targeting more like 4:15, though, not sub-4?

The Black Oil

Murph_D wrote: »

Well if you found it easy, maybe you found out something about yourself!

These paces are for someone targeting more like 4:15, though, not sub-4?

They've from the calculator off of a 10k (53:39 - May 2018). Had I gone with 5k (23:06 - June 2018) calculator stuff, then it would have been:

Steady 8:30
MP 8:28
HMP 8:08
10k/hard 7:44

It's been kicking around my head a bit re whether to use the 5k or 10k paces for midweek stuff, or just pick one or the other overall, including for long runs. There are some MP miles later in the meno plan, both midweek and on Sundays. I'm was thinking of using the 10k times there. So yeah, I dunno. Overthinking it? 5k paces would be good too, unless this would heighten injury risk somehow. I do enjoy training a lot and want to get something out of it. With longer runs coming up, and at my 10k easy pace, I can imagine hitting close to 4 hours, or more with the 18, 20, 22 milers.

Murph_D

The Black Oil wrote: »

They've from the calculator off of a 10k (53:39 - May 2018). Had I gone with 5k (23:06 - June 2018) calculator stuff, then it would have been:

Steady 8:30
MP 8:28
HMP 8:08
10k/hard 7:44

It's been kicking around my head a bit re whether to use the 5k or 10k paces for midweek stuff, or just pick one or the other overall, including for long runs. There are some MP miles later in the meno plan, both midweek and on Sundays. I'm was thinking of using the 10k times there. So yeah, I dunno. Overthinking it? 5k paces would be good too, unless this would heighten injury risk somehow. I do enjoy training a lot and want to get something out of it. With longer runs coming up, and at my 10k easy pace, I can imagine hitting close to 4 hours, or more with the 18, 20, 22 milers.

Well, you should stick to what the recent race result is telling you, assuming you went out and raced it hard? So that time points towards a 4:05-4:10 marathon if you can scale it up - although the drop-off between your 5 and 10k suggests you need to work on the endurance aspect. Then again, if you found that session easy, maybe that 10k was not representative. Your next tune up race should give you a good idea of where you are at.

Bluesquare

Good luck guys !!

I’m not running a marathon this year but will be following this thread closely as hopefully this will be my goal next year !!

The Black Oil

Murph_D wrote: »

Well, you should stick to what the recent race result is telling you, assuming you went out and raced it hard? So that time points towards a 4:05-4:10 marathon if you can scale it up - although the drop-off between your 5 and 10k suggests you need to work on the endurance aspect. Then again, if you found that session easy, maybe that 10k was not representative. Your next tune up race should give you a good idea of where you are at.

The 10k was a warm afternoon and I was reluctant to hit the accelerator, as I often am. 5k - I could have given more, really. I didn't fully, in WW-speak (:pac:) give it a good rattle. FD10 in Sept will probably be the next race. I picked up the pace with my easy runs yesterday and this morning. Now have some fatigue on the scoreboard...

Hedgehoggy

Hope everyone is getting on well with their training. Was hoping someone could help me with a question!
I've decided to follow the meno plan as well. Last week I had a niggle in my calf - a trip to the physio, lots of foam rolling and some exercises have cleared it up. As recommended by the physio I dropped the session from the 2nd week of the meno plan - but I did three easy runs and the long run (14m). My overall mileage for the week was in the recommended range - although it was lower than I had been doing over the past few weeks. Last week I got back on plan and did the 3x3 session and the 16 miler as well a number of other runs - no trouble with the calf etc.

Hopefully I'm not reading the plan wrong but this week seems to be a bit of a step back week - with a 10 mile long run and a speed session (10x400@3-5k pace) - As last week was a bit of a step back - I'm wondering if I should actually do the session that I missed from the previous week (progression session) or should I just stick to the plan? I've read elsewhere not to go chasing miles that you missed.......

ewc78

First off it sounds to me that you're a week ahead. This week should be week 3 and the 3*3 session is in this week's plan unless you are doing thr 10k race at the weekend then there is alternative plan for the week.

Hedgehoggy

ewc78 wrote: »

First off it sounds to be that you're a week ahead. This week should be week 3 and the 3*3 session is in this week's plan unless you are doing here 10k race at the weekend then there is alternative plan for the week.

Ya - I was wondering that when I was reading the post here this week.... hmmmm not sure how I managed that....

Murph_D

If you’re a week ahead and feeling good I’d repeat the week you’ve just done. But bearing in mind the calf issue, maybe good to take it extra easy and give it some more recovery time as you don’t want to push things injury-wise this early (or anytime really). If it were me (and I’m conservative) I’d err on the easy side. Maybe do the session as just 1x3k tempo, and take the LR handy again.

(By the way, not sure where you’re getting plan from, but my google doc version has links to original post so you can get more insights into the schedule - as well as people’s questions and feedback at the time this plan was originally playing out).

Hedgehoggy

Murph_D wrote: »

If you’re a week ahead and feeling good I’d repeat the week you’ve just done. But bearing in mind the calf issue, maybe good to take it extra easy and give it some more recovery time as you don’t want to push things injury-wise this early (or anytime really). If it were me (and I’m conservative) I’d err on the easy side. Maybe do the session as just 1x3k tempo, and take the LR handy again.

(By the way, not sure where you’re getting plan from, but my google doc version has links to original post so you can get more insights into the schedule - as well as people’s questions and feedback at the time this plan was originally playing out).

Cheers, I'll do this and will look up the links too. I've read your old log on your experience of meno as well which was really useful and a very good read!

I love to hate 2mile repeats. They're tough but so effective. Was happy with how the session went last week. Splits were 7.20, 7.20 and 7.24., so overall happy with consistency. Will be good to repeat the session this week.

ewc78

So I did tonight's Wednesday workout which for anyone doing race series 10k at the weekend is a 10mile easy run with strides.
I've never done strides so wondering if I did them right. I finished my run and then I did 10x30secs at a fast but manageable pace, I walked 45secs in between each.
The plan calls for strides every week so just want to make sure I have them right.

RayCun

That's about it, but also think of the strides as an opportunity to practice good running form

The Black Oil

I did the tempo of week 3 (meno) tonight. 3x2 miles at 8:13, 8:11, 8:17. Happy enough with that. Legs a bit tired now.

ewc78

How's everyone getting on? Did the meno plan Wednesday workout tonight. 10 miles with 6 @MP
Went great. Very warm out though.

judeboy101

19mile lsr at 10min mile pace last week. Hoping to do 22mile lsr 10@mp rest at 10:15min mile in morn , 4 weeks to Longford.

Kellygirl

ewc78 wrote: »

How's everyone getting on? Did the meno plan Wednesday workout tonight. 10 miles with 6 @MP
Went great. Very warm out though.

I’m going well. Changed my plan and signed up with a coach for a personalized plan. I’ve said sub 4:10 for now and will see how I’m going. Running the Killarney HM on Saturday but as a training run. Will be happy to do it at a consistent 9 min mile.

The Black Oil

Tonight was 10x 400m @3-5k pace (step back version of week 4). Did most in a housing state and a little incline dented the pace a bit. Generally only notice tiredness when I sit down at home. Looking forward to 10 miles with 6MP on Sunday. Sleep's been a bit iffy lately.

Weeks seem to be flying by.

ewc78

The Black Oil wrote: »

Tonight was 10x 400m @3-5k pace (step back version of week 4). Did most in a housing state and a little incline dented the pace a bit. Generally only notice tiredness when I sit down at home. Looking forward to 10 miles with 6MP on Sunday. Sleep's been a bit iffy lately.

Weeks seem to be flying by.

I did the race series 10km at the weekend so I have a different plan to follow this week. 16mile lsr this Sunday !

ariana`

The Black Oil wrote: »

I did the tempo of week 3 (meno) tonight. 3x2 miles at 8:13, 8:11, 8:17. Happy enough with that. Legs a bit tired now.

ewc78 wrote: »

How's everyone getting on? Did the meno plan Wednesday workout tonight. 10 miles with 6 @MP
Went great. Very warm out though.

judeboy101 wrote: »

19mile lsr at 10min mile pace last week. Hoping to do 22mile lsr 10@mp rest at 10:15min mile in morn , 4 weeks to Longford.

Kellygirl wrote: »

I’m going well. Changed my plan and signed up with a coach for a personalized plan. I’ve said sub 4:10 for now and will see how I’m going. Running the Killarney HM on Saturday but as a training run. Will be happy to do it at a consistent 9 min mile.

The Black Oil wrote: »

Tonight was 10x 400m @3-5k pace (step back version of week 4). Did most in a housing state and a little incline dented the pace a bit. Generally only notice tiredness when I sit down at home. Looking forward to 10 miles with 6MP on Sunday. Sleep's been a bit iffy lately.

Weeks seem to be flying by.

ewc78 wrote: »

I did the race series 10km at the weekend so I have a different plan to follow this week. 16mile lsr this Sunday !

Wow, I have to admit reading these posts is a real eye opener. Everyone is doing fairly serious long runs with lots of mp miles and sessions. 4:10 is a more realistic target for me i'd have thought but reading this i'm seriously doubting even 4:10 off the back of the training i'm doing. My plan (grads) has 2hrs easy this weekend - at my pace off the calculator (if i stick to it) that would be 11.25 miles... I was planning to add on 15-30 minutes and make it 13-14 miles but 13 miles easy still doesn't really cut it compared to the super training going on here :eek: Best of luck all, I'll be back in a few years :pac: