Alot of tax increase talk...

The Bishop Basher

LuckyLloyd wrote: »

I definitely am. I just happen to be more than satisfied to pay more for superior social provision.

What is that superior social provision ?

I pay the highest band across the board. I’m laying out well over 50% of everything I earn in tax when you include all the stealth taxes..

I get absolutely nothing in return..

Anything else that I need, I pay for separately..

I see people around me who desperately need help and they get very little if anything at all.

We can’t even take care of our sick children properly..

Just what are these “superior social provisions” ?

Phoebas

lawred2 wrote: »

In that context indeed...

Do you think 100% salary increases are reflective of the broader economy over the last 8 years?

Here are the actual numbers for that period and wage growth has been more or less stagnant, with some modest improvement over the last couple of years as the recovery has taken hold.

So what we have here is a poster who is comparatively doing spectacularly well and saying that people who are living in the actual economy (the one with very modest wage growth) are moaning.

LuckyLloyd

jimmycrackcorm wrote: »

You can pay whatever extra you want but you won't get Superior social protection, instead you'll get better paid public staff.

Better paid public staff will alleviate some of the "squeezed middle" no? Or is the squeezed middle a private sector condition only, adding more layers to divide and conquer?

In any case, I'm interested in superior infrastructure, more social housing, more services. Those things cost money.

Franz Von Peppercorn wrote: »

It depends. It’s not just the dole bit the cost of housing and medical cards (not all people on the median wage get health care through their company). The cost of essential transport etc.

I obviously understand it's not a pure comparison between dole and wages; it's dole + free public services versus wages + tax reliefs. That said, this one doesn't really "depend" much at all. Work that brings you towards marginal rate of tax superior to dole.

Franz Von Peppercorn wrote: »

Try not to assume your own straw man arguments. I’m not a libertarian. I believe in progressive taxation. I also believe in the squeezed middle

Well, you are not the only poster in this thread. A few posts in this thread certainly smack of libertarian rhetoric.

Out of interest: what party comes closest to supporting / representing your views?

Swanner wrote: »

What is that superior social provision ?

I pay the highest band across the board. I’m laying out well over 50% of everything I earn in tax when you include all the stealth taxes..

I get absolutely nothing in return..

Which indicates you're doing well, which is good for you sir.

Everything on the Ireland 2035 menu, anything that would bolster our economy into the future. Those are things you get in return for your tax even if you are not in direct receipt of social services.

Swanner wrote: »

Anything else that I need, I pay for separately..

I see people around me who desperately need help and they get very little if anything at all.

We can’t even take care of our sick children properly..

Just what are these “superior social provisions” ?

Tax policy and the use of tax are separate discussions. We more than adequately fund public health care in this state yet the end quality of service is shocking in many respects. That's an issue with politics. We need change, we need a Government willing to roll up the sleeves and take on Unions on points of work practice, tools, etc. However, the answer certainly isn't to fund it less.

Phoebas wrote: »

Here are the actual numbers for that period and wage growth has been more or less stagnant, with some modest improvement over the last couple of years as the recovery has taken hold.

So what we have here is a poster who is comparatively doing spectacularly well and saying that people who are living in the actual economy (the one with very modest wage growth) are moaning.

Where did you pull that data from? Wages are stagnant in the Public Sector, they are stagnant for low paid work. They are certainly not stagnant for certain sectors and professions.

Franz Von Peppercorn

LuckyLloyd wrote: »

Better paid public staff will alleviate some of the "squeezed middle" no? Or is the squeezed middle a private sector condition only, adding more layers to divide and conquer?

In any case, I'm interested in superior infrastructure, more social housing, more services. Those things cost money.



I obviously understand it's not a pure comparison between dole and wages; it's dole + free public services versus wages + tax reliefs. That said, this one doesn't really "depend" much at all. Work that brings you towards marginal rate of tax superior to dole.



Well, you are not the only poster in this thread. A few posts in this thread certainly smack of libertarian rhetoric.

Out of interest: what party comes closest to supporting / representing your views?



Which indicates you're doing well, which is good for you sir.

Everything on the Ireland 2035 menu, anything that would bolster our economy into the future. Those are things you get in return for your tax even if you are not in direct receipt of social services.



Tax policy and the use of tax are separate discussions. We more than adequately fund public health care in this state yet the end quality of service is shocking in many respects. That's an issue with politics. We need change, we need a Government willing to roll up the sleeves and take on Unions on points of work practice, tools, etc. However, the answer certainly isn't to fund it less.



Where did you pull that data from? Wages are stagnant in the Public Sector, they are stagnant for low paid work. They are certainly not stagnant for certain sectors and professions.

Who said they were. That’s median income as far as I know. Or average.

All we are getting from you is a variation of “I’m all right Jack, so everybody else is”

You are the one denying the squeezed middle exists. Then you go off tangent when questioned saying that people should pay more taxes. You should pay more taxes. The squeezed middle shouldn’t.

blanch152

Swanner wrote: »

What is that superior social provision ?

I pay the highest band across the board. I’m laying out well over 50% of everything I earn in tax when you include all the stealth taxes..

I get absolutely nothing in return..

Anything else that I need, I pay for separately..

I see people around me who desperately need help and they get very little if anything at all.

We can’t even take care of our sick children properly..

Just what are these “superior social provisions” ?

http://health.gov.ie/publications-research/statistics/

Number of people with a medical card: 1,626,702
Number of people with a GP visit card: 484,674

Over 2.1 million people in Ireland have access to free GP care out of a total population of 4.8 million.

The Bishop Basher

blanch152 wrote: »

Over 2.1 million people in Ireland have access to free GP care out of a total population of 4.8 million.

I know..

And it's all paid for by a very small minority of the population who also have to find the few bob to pay for their own healthcare and insurance while they're at it.

I've no problem paying for those who need it.

Half the population don't need it.

Idbatterim

Better paid public staff will alleviate some of the "squeezed middle" no? Or is the squeezed middle a private sector condition only, adding more layers to divide and conquer?

cut the marginal rate, that will help all workers on the marginal rate. FG claim to be pro business and enterprise, I would beg to differ on the insane marginal rate here and Varadkar that clown, has repeatedly highlighted the issues around the marginal rate here...


LuckyLloyd you mentioned your salary increase, interesting article on that and the lack of relief for the squeezed middle, below...
http://www.davidmcwilliams.ie/there-will-be-no-relief-for-the-squeezed-middle/

Its not just the welfare handed out as cash, the medical card, the housing, its outrageous! What stress do those people have, then other people going out working, having a lower living standard, stressed out of their minds! Rent hikes, no security etc!

Idbatterim

Swanner wrote: »

I know..

And it's all paid for by a very small minority of the population who also have to find the few bob to pay for their own healthcare and insurance while they're at it.

I've no problem paying for those who need it.

Half the population don't need it.

so a huge amount of people get it free and other low paid workers struggling, avoide going to a GP or fork out E60 a pop!

There should be a charge per visit for everyone, of E20 or so! They can afford it for the smart phone and sky package!

I also agree with idbatterim about voting for Renua. Most on this thread should be doing exactly that, as they are the only political party running on a platform of increased regressive / flat taxation and a full catchment taxation net. Continuing to vote for parties that have no inclination or interest in giving you what you want while moaning about it...some gall to be talking down your nose at 'professional protesters' in that context.

they are not running with the flat tax proposal any longer!

Also this term "regressive" what do you want? maybe everyone under 50k a year should be exempt from paying tax?

Idbatterim

http://www.davidmcwilliams.ie/redbrick-envy-the-rise-of-phibsboro-as-the-new-it-housing-market/

blanch152

Idbatterim wrote: »

http://www.davidmcwilliams.ie/redbrick-envy-the-rise-of-phibsboro-as-the-new-it-housing-market/

What point are you trying to make with this link?

Is it something you agree with? Or is it something you disagree with?

The LPT, as originally designed, operates in accordance with this principle. If Phibsboro, or anywhere else, sees prices rise faster than the rest of the city, then the LPT bill will also rise faster.

Another question relates to another post you made about Renua's tax proposals. You said they no longer favour a flat tax. Is there any clarity on what they do favour?

Idbatterim

blanch152 wrote: »

What point are you trying to make with this link?

Is it something you agree with? Or is it something you disagree with?

The LPT, as originally designed, operates in accordance with this principle. If Phibsboro, or anywhere else, sees prices rise faster than the rest of the city, then the LPT bill will also rise faster.

Another question relates to another post you made about Renua's tax proposals. You said they no longer favour a flat tax. Is there any clarity on what they do favour?

I totally agree with his point on a site value tax. Did you read the article? the below is also very much, worth a watch. The scum arent the vulture funds, its are our own government, pretending that they represent us... My mates many who have never been unemployed in their lives, early thirties, are f**cked with this crisis in Dublin! Its disgusting and maybe the FF minister was right, when he said FG were too egotistical to do anything about it!
I highly recommend viewing the below "Real estate for ransom"

https://youtu.be/XL3n59wC8kk

I just went onto their page (Renua), they have a video from ages ago, with what they do propose, Ill try find it...

https://www.facebook.com/renuairl/videos/943438245757653/

They U turned on Flat rate tax, said it was way too radical for this country and they are right! the video is 40 minutes long, I will put it this way, they dont want to do anything drastic, other than make work pay and reward those contributing the most!

blanch152

Idbatterim wrote: »

I totally agree with his point on a site value tax. Did you read the article? the below is also very much, worth a watch. The scum arent the vulture funds, its are our own government, pretending that they represent us... My mates many who have never been unemployed in their lives, early thirties, are f**cked with this crisis in Dublin! Its disgusting and maybe the FF minister was right, when he said FG were too egotistical to do anything about it!
I highly recommend viewing the below "Real estate for ransom"

https://youtu.be/XL3n59wC8kk

I just went onto their page (Renua), they have a video from ages ago, with what they do propose, Ill try find it...

https://www.facebook.com/renuairl/videos/943438245757653/

They U turned on Flat rate tax, said it was way too radical for this country and they are right! the video is 40 minutes long, I will put it this way, they dont want to do anything drastic, other than make work pay and reward those contributing the most!

In saying they want to make work pay and reward those contributing the most, those are platitudes unless they are backed up by hard policies. It is noticeable that the only time the taxpayer got anything back from the State was when the PDs were in power.

On Dublin property, very few can live in the centre of London or Paris or Rome either. It is a price to pay for being a successful city. The problem is the lack of investment in public transport and the failure to build higher density housing.

Idbatterim

the housing crisis or "opportunity" if you are FG, is going to go from very, very bad, to extreme! Im sick of listening to Varadkar and Murphy "any year it will be alright now" ... eh, it wont...

https://www.irishtimes.com/opinion/generation-rent-locked-out-of-home-ownership-1.3464772?mode=amp

Doltanian

What needs to happen is half Government surpluses be spent on Debt repayment and the other half pumped into infrastructure only, new Motorways, New Railways in Dublin, Fibre to the Home broadband, Cull 50-100,000 useless public servents. Social Housing should not be a priority. What should be a priority is tax incentivise the building of new homes with emphasis on building tall in Dublin, there should be at least 100-200 highrisers built upto 50-70 floors high. Take the current city planners and fire the whole lot of them.

blanch152

Idbatterim wrote: »

the housing crisis or "opportunity" if you are FG, is going to go from very, very bad, to extreme! Im sick of listening to Varadkar and Murphy "any year it will be alright now" ... eh, it wont...

https://www.irishtimes.com/opinion/generation-rent-locked-out-of-home-ownership-1.3464772?mode=amp

When will people realise that not everyone can live within walking distance of their workplace.

Two things need to happen:

(1) The Dublin councils need to get their fingers out of their arses and approve high-rise high density housing in close proximity to public transport.

(2) They need to build the Metro, electrify the Maynooth line, divert the Belfast and Dundalk trains to the Docklands and fix the signalling problems at Connolly.

Idbatterim

blanch152 wrote: »

When will people realise that not everyone can live within walking distance of their workplace.

Two things need to happen:

(1) The Dublin councils need to get their fingers out of their arses and approve high-rise high density housing in close proximity to public transport.

(2) They need to build the Metro, electrify the Maynooth line, divert the Belfast and Dundalk trains to the Docklands and fix the signalling problems at Connolly.

Of course not everyone can. But a hell better f a lot more could have. Had we simply had rescinded heights... the docklands is comedy!

blanch152

blanch152 wrote: »

build the Metro, electrify the Maynooth line, divert the Belfast and Dundalk trains to the Docklands and fix the signalling problems at Connolly.

Their is a thread on here about Iarnrod Eireann called "Unions warn of train strike as staff demand pay increase".

They seem to be totally unable to run increased frequency on the DART for the last 2 years despite (1) having the drivers recruited and (2) having the rolling stock.


So for your four suggestions I say "LOL, Christ.... Good luck with that" :pac::pac::pac:

blanch152

Idbatterim wrote: »

Of course not everyone can. But a hell better f a lot more could have. Had we simply had rescinded heights... the docklands is comedy!

That is down to the left-wing domination of Dublin City Council over the last decade.

Geuze

Doltanian wrote: »

What needs to happen is half Government surpluses be spent on Debt repayment and the other half pumped into infrastructure only, .

Note that a fiscal surplus is determined after capital expenditure.

So a surplus can't be spent on capital expenditure.

FreudianSlippers

Geuze wrote: »

Note that a fiscal surplus is determined after capital expenditure.

So a surplus can't be spent on capital expenditure.

It's also worth noting that the EU is basically begging us to increase capital expenditure and has been for a few years now.