Lloyd England exposed was involved in 9/11 false flag event

Cheerful Spring2

Dohnjoe wrote: »

It's a public forum. Some people think that's a ticket to write whatever they want, then get offended when others point out their bad logic

Honestly, if someone says it's just their opinion, I don't mind giving some leeway, but if they are coming in stating nonsense as fact, they get everything they deserve. The internet is full enough of disinfo as it.

Yes, it is a social public forum, nevertheless doesn't give you the right to mock someone else belief system. I don't think the position the buildings were demolished by controlled demolition, is that crazy, when even the mainstream engineers also express this was first time in history a high rise steel structure construction collapsed to just fire. Twin Towers least has some chance of occurrence maybe with the jet fuel and plane impacting the front and the kinectic blast?

What facts are you talking about?
We know now FBI agents were ordered to stop the Saudi 9/11 investigation by their supervisors. How do you learn the facts, when there powerless to talk to the people or arrest those people who were involved in facilitating the attack? Root cause cannot be determined when investigations are not allowed to continue..Maybe you see the world differently to me, but for this just commonsense.

Building seven though still the biggest mystery as the claim is it came down by just a local zone fire. Building seven is a business building, all that will burn is wood and paper, and the fires don't burn continually all day,  they burn and go out and move to the next location When NIST engineers fail to notice; the building experienced free fall after six years you have to wonder how capable are they at doing their job? David Chandler should have to tell them things, that should already know?

King Mob

Cheerful Spring2 wrote: »

When NIST engineers fail to notice; the building experienced free fall after six years you have to wonder how capable are they at doing their job? David Chandler should have to tell them things, that should already know?

But cheerful you are again misrepresenting things and using terms you don't understand.
I don't think it's because you're dishonest, but because you don't actually understand what you're claiming any more.

Dohnjoe

Cheerful Spring2 wrote: »

Yes, it is a social public forum, nevertheless doesn't give you the right to mock someone else belief system.

It's not belief or faith-based, which you seem to confuse it as. You are attempting to revise and deny history.

If you prefaced your views as opinion, then you are entitled to it as opinion. But you aren't, you keep trying to assert your opinions as fact

A french school textbook was recently discovered with one sentence alluding to 9/11 as a conspiracy, it's been quickly addressed. The fact that it made world news should give some clue as to the difference between accepted fact and baseless opinion

In a statement to the BBC it said opinions could "of course be freely expressed in our books but under no circumstances can an inaccurate or unfounded fact be presented as an objective truth".

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-51187970

On a side note, you are abusing this public "safe space" to peddle your personal brand of disinformation and imaginings, so don't act surprised when others call you out on it.

banie01

Cheerful Spring2 wrote: »

Yes, it is a social public forum, nevertheless doesn't give you the right to mock someone else belief system.

Belief system?

You think that your clinging to a discredited and debunked conspiracy theory, is worthy of some sort of "protection" as a belief system?

From your posts on this site, a large number of in the main discredited and debunked theories that are thrown together with an amalgam of factoid, disinformation and imagined nonsense, are what you believe.

You think that you can post nonsense on a social public forum and not be called out as a fantasist?

You may want to find yourself a safe space, one where you can post and not feel so threatened in your "beliefs" by the application of logic or skeptical thinking.

Dohnjoe

banie01 wrote: »

You may want to find yourself a safe space, one where you can post and not feel so threatened in your "beliefs" by the application of logic or skeptical thinking.

Typically they band together on conspiracy forums with conspiracy mods so they can block out normal scrutiny and skepticism

It wasn't so many years back that the conspiracy forum on this site had a rule that conspiracy theorists didn't have to present any evidence of their claims, it didn't last too long if I remember

King Mob

banie01 wrote: »

Belief system?

You think that your clinging to a discredited and debunked conspiracy theory, is worthy of some sort of "protection" as a belief system?

From your posts on this site, a large number of in the main discredited and debunked theories that are thrown together with an amalgam of factoid, disinformation and imagined nonsense, are what you believe.

It also bares pointing out the comments made about conspiracy theories and conspiracy theorists he doesn't agree with.

Words like "crazy" and "stupid" came up.

Cheerful Spring2

King Mob wrote: »

But cheerful you are again misrepresenting things and using terms you don't understand.
I don't think it's because you're dishonest, but because you don't actually understand what you're claiming any more.

Why would i listen to someone who doesn't watch videos with NIST speaking?
I know my claim not false- David Chandler question was read out during the NIST/ draft of the report conference and NIST answered the chandler question.
I can hear NIST answer. So i know you guys are clueless about what took place.

 Watch it.

Dohnjoe

Cheerful Spring2 wrote: »

I know my claim not false- David Chandler question was read out during the NIST/ draft of the report conference and NIST answered the chandler question.
I can hear NIST answer. So i know you guys are clueless about what took place.

You are misrepresenting the information, and taking it out of context.

No matter how many times this is explained to you - you ignore it. So why should anyone bother?

Cheerful Spring2

Dohnjoe wrote: »

You are misrepresenting the information, and taking it out of context.

No matter how many times this is explained to you - you ignore it. So why should anyone bother?

Wrong, when you tune in to NIST words, what I have mentioned will become more clear. They ruled out free fall based on their own calculations, estimates and judgements, and there was structural resistance underneath stopping freefall. 

King Mob

Cheerful Spring2 wrote: »

Why would i listen to someone who doesn't watch videos with NIST speaking?
I know my claim not false- David Chandler question was read out during the NIST/ draft of the report conference and NIST answered the chandler question.
I can hear NIST answer. So i know you guys are clueless about what took place.

 Watch it.

Again, this is a misrepresentation of what was said.
This has been explained to you many times.

They ruled out free fall based on their own calculations, estimates and judgements, and there was structural resistance underneath stopping freefall.

A few posts ago, this was exactly what you were claiming happened.

https://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=112260881&postcount=1105

Dohnjoe

Cheerful Spring2 wrote: »

Wrong, when you tune in to NIST words, what I have mentioned will become more clear.

It's not wrong, it's you. You are either deliberately or inadvertently misunderstanding the situation. Doing so helps bolster the conspiracy for you. So I am leaning toward deliberate.

Cheerful Spring2

banie01 wrote: »

Belief system?

You think that your clinging to a discredited and debunked conspiracy theory, is worthy of some sort of "protection" as a belief system?

From your posts on this site, a large number of in the main discredited and debunked theories that are thrown together with an amalgam of factoid, disinformation and imagined nonsense, are what you believe.

You think that you can post nonsense on a social public forum and not be called out as a fantasist?

You may want to find yourself a safe space, one where you can post and not feel so threatened in your "beliefs" by the application of logic or skeptical thinking.

What can't you understand?
Fire records and engineering does not side with the community of Skeptics.
On 9/11 was the first time in history, a high rise of steel structure collapsed due to fire.
Many high rises composed of structural steel have caught fire and survived. All of them stood up and never collapsed- 9/11 this changed. Truthers question why?
Since fire is the cause of the collapse according to NIST and others, we have to figure out why did engineering history change on 9/11?

King Mob

Cheerful Spring2 wrote: »

On 9/11 was the first time in history a steel structure of steel collapsed due to fire.

One, not true.
Secondly, it's also the first time in history any structure collapsed due to secret demolition using secret fictional nanothermite.

Why do you keep bringing this silly factoid up when it would also disprove your conspiracy theory?

King Mob

Cheerful Spring2 wrote: »

On 9/11 was the first time in history, a high rise of steel structure collapsed due to fire.
Many high rises composed of structural steel have caught fire and survived. All of them stood up and never collapsed- 9/11 this changed. Truthers question why?
Since fire is the cause of the collapse according to NIST and others, we have to figure out why did engineering history change on 9/11?

Also, a new thought occurs.
If this held and was true and that it's not possible for a steel framed building to collapse due to fire, why did they use all that fireproofing in the buildings? Seems like that would be a bit pointless.

Cheerful Spring2

King Mob wrote: »

One, not true.
Secondly, it's also the first time in history any structure collapsed due to secret demolition using secret fictional nanothermite.

Why do you keep bringing this silly factoid up when it would also disprove your conspiracy theory?

If it was incorrect, Dohnjoe would be posting links to examples nonstop.  He noticed one example in Iran after 9/11 that was a concrete and steel building a composite.  No constructions of similar type to the Twin Towers and WTC7 has ever fallen down due to fire in Europe or America, and pretty much everywhere else in the world. 

You ignore buildings come down from controlled demolition. We can spot some of the features you expect to see if a building has been rigged for controlled demoition example freefall.

King Mob

Cheerful Spring2 wrote: »

No constructions of similar type to the Twin Towers and WTC7 has ever fallen down due to fire in Europe or America, and pretty much everywhere else in the world. 

Cheerful Spring2 wrote: »

You ignore buildings come down from controlled demolition. We can spot some of the features you expect to see if a building has been rigged for controlled demoition example freefall.

Cool.
Please point to the many examples of these demolitions that:
1. Had "constructions of similar type to the Twin Towers and WTC7"
2. Were done in secret.
3. Involved any type of thermite.
4. Occured after the building was hit by airliners/ had large skyscrapers collapses next to them.

Links and videos would be great.

Also, freefall is not a feature of controlled demolition. This is a lie that has been explained to you before.

Dohnjoe

Cheerful Spring2 wrote: »

On 9/11 was the first time in history, a high rise of steel structure collapsed due to fire.

It was the first time in history that skyscrapers were deliberately rammed with airliners

Something happening for the first time in history is not an argument that it couldn't have happened.

This has been explained to you countless times. This might come as a shock to you, but the history of event itself is entirely separate from your (mis)understanding of it.

The Nal

Due to the passage of time, people are slowly realising that there was no conspiracy, the appetite is dwindling, the movement is running out of steam thankfully. Not a jot of evidence in 19 years to suggest it was a controlled demolition so the truth movement (lol) is dying out.

Dohnjoe

As evidenced by the fact that we are down to a handful of people on boards, with only really one repeatedly posting. Which consists entirely of a ping-pong game of "convince me, I'll never accept it".

The passage of time part is telling also. The longer something vast is kept under wraps the more likely over time that it will be revealed.

The Nal

Dohnjoe wrote: »

As evidenced by the fact that we are down to a handful of people on boards, with only really one repeatedly posting. Which consists entirely of a ping-pong game of "convince me, I'll never accept it".

The passage of time part is telling also. The longer something vast is kept under wraps the more likely over time that it will be revealed.

And looking at the Trump impeachment, the amount of leaks, whistle blowers and info they have is staggering. The idea that that many people (Cheerful estimate several hundred) could keep a conspiracy this big airtight for that long is simply impossible.

The only people left are people like that bottom feeding fraud Hulsey who are just out to sift through the remains for the last few dollars.

Dohnjoe

>The only people left are people like that fraud Hulsey who are just out to sift through the remains for the last few dollars.

$300,000. He would have got a serious chunk of that. All this paranoia and it doesn't seem to have crossed believers minds that for that amount of money there will always be at least one expert somewhere in the world willing to produce the desired results. Especially when the target audience isn't all that science, or logic, literate.

Cheerful Spring2

King Mob wrote: »

A few posts ago, this was exactly what you were claiming happened.

https://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=112260881&postcount=1105

NIST submitted the draft of the building seven report on August 2008, NIST denied free fall at this conference.

In Nov 2008, they revised their study and included in free fall, and the three stages and were accepting of it, but only under the premise it had taken place during the progressive collapse!

The complication with this is they'd ruled it out three months earlier based on their own calculations, conclusions and judgements! They even said free fall can only materialize when resistance was removed completely and that was not the case here because there was slow progressions of failures that most occur first. 

So NIST undoubtedly missed the freefall, but evaded the implications, to fit it in with a fire scenarion no matter how impossible it was. 

King Mob

Cheerful Spring2 wrote: »

NIST submitted the draft of the building seven report on August 2008, NIST denied free fall at this conference.

In Nov 2008, they revised their study and included in free fall, and the three stages and were accepting of it, but only under the premise it had taken place during the progressive collapse!

The complication with this is they'd ruled it out three months earlier based on their own calculations, conclusions and judgements! They even said free fall can only materialize when resistance was removed completely and that was not the case here because there was slow progressions of failures that most occur first. 

So NIST undoubtedly missed the freefall, but evaded the implications, to fit it in with a fire scenarion no matter how impossible it was. 

Misrepresentation. You are conflating things either because you are dishonest or because you have trouble with reading comprehension or a combination of both.
You are also ignoring the contradiction your statements lead to.
You previously were saying the exact same thing as the NIST without realising it.

Dohnjoe

Cheerful Spring2 wrote: »

NIST submitted the draft of the building seven report on August 2008, NIST denied free fall at this conference.

In Nov 2008, they revised their study and included in free fall, and the three stages and were accepting of it, but only under the premise it had taken place during the progressive collapse!

The complication with this is they'd ruled it out three months earlier based on their own calculations, conclusions and judgements! They even said free fall can only materialize when resistance was removed completely and that was not the case here because there was slow progressions of failures that most occur first. 

So NIST undoubtedly missed the freefall, but evaded the implications, to fit it in with a fire scenarion no matter how impossible it was. 

Deliberately repeating a misunderstanding doesn't make it any less a misunderstanding.

Deliberately repeating a deliberate misunderstanding, that's something special

Cheerful Spring2

Dohnjoe wrote: »

Deliberately repeating a misunderstanding doesn't make it any less a misunderstanding.

Deliberately repeating a deliberate misunderstanding, that's something special

Fact- video evidence. Watch it listen. Embarrassing people still defend NIST.

Cheerful Spring2

Dohnjoe wrote: »

>The only people left are people like that fraud Hulsey who are just out to sift through the remains for the last few dollars.

$300,000. He would have got a serious chunk of that. All this paranoia and it doesn't seem to have crossed believers minds that for that amount of money there will always be at least one expert somewhere in the world willing to produce the desired results. Especially when the target audience isn't all that science, or logic, literate.

Hulsey final study will be published with comments from people who wrote to them. So it be interesting when the final report released to see if they changed anything? I know some of skeptics like Oystein have replied and we see then, if his questions was answered. They're also producing a documentry to be released soon. 

King Mob

Cheerful Spring2 wrote: »

Hulsey final study will be published with comments from people who wrote to them. So it be interesting when the final report released to see if they changed anything? I know some of skeptics like Oystein have replied and we see then, if his questions was answered. They're also producing a documentry to be released soon. 

But it's not going to be peer reviewed.
It wasn't open and isn't open.

You ran away from the thread when you were again backed into a corner you couldn't weasel out of.

And now they're going to milk more money out of people with a documentary? lol

Cheerful Spring2

The Nal wrote: »

And looking at the Trump impeachment, the amount of leaks, whistle blowers and info they have is staggering. The idea that that many people (Cheerful estimate several hundred) could keep a conspiracy this big airtight for that long is simply impossible.

The only people left are people like that bottom feeding fraud Hulsey who are just out to sift through the remains for the last few dollars.

FBI never investigated the claim. 
How many would be informed about demolition crews entering the buildings pre 9/11 and rigging them for demolition?
I never claimed several hundred.
I think even 30 people maybe too high?
4 teams of 4 men= 16 trained guys- maybe a few top guys at the top- and a back up crew of watchers and spotters. That enough to get the job done pre 9/11 

King Mob

Cheerful Spring2 wrote: »

FBI never investigated the claim. 
How many would be informed about demolition crews entering the buildings pre 9/11 and rigging them for demolition?
I never claimed several hundred.
I think even 30 people maybe too high?
4 teams of 4 men= 16 trained guys- maybe a few top guys at the top- and a back up crew of watchers and spotters. That enough to get the job done pre 9/11 

And what is that based on?
The other secret demolitions?

Still waiting for those examples you said you had.

Dohnjoe

Cheerful Spring2 wrote: »

Hulsey final study will be published with comments from people who wrote to them. So it be interesting when the final report released to see if they changed anything? I know some of skeptics like Oystein have replied and we see then, if his questions was answered. They're also producing a documentry to be released soon. 

Who cares? it's not peer reviewed, no one in the academic world seems to be taking the slightest bit of notice to it. The only people who are interested are an absolutely tiny community of remaining 911 truthers (who funded it) and the community of sadists who debate with them.