Seriously, does anyone give a ****

realdanbreen

Just turned on the radio and more reporting of yet another inquiry/tribunal whatever coming from Dublin Castle. This one is about guards/ whistleblowers and who said what and when. I am sick of them and the only one certainty is that all of the participants, guards, politicians, judges, barristers,etc will all have big salaries and will have fat pensions to look forward to regardless of the outcome. Meanwhile the never ending problems of healthcare, housing needs etc rumble on. And you know what (and I have NEVER heard a politician say it) all of these issues would be resolved if all the citizens of this country contributed a FAIR share, that's all just a fair share.

Hande hoche!

Solicitors and solicitor's accountants.

One eyed Jack

realdanbreen wrote: »

Just turned on the radio and more reporting of yet another inquiry/tribunal whatever coming from Dublin Castle. This one is about guards/ whistleblowers and who said what and when. I am sick of them and the only one certainty is that all of the participants, guards, politicians, judges, barristers,etc will all have big salaries and will have fat pensions to look forward to regardless of the outcome. Meanwhile the never ending problems of healthcare, housing needs etc rumble on. And you know what (and I have NEVER heard a politician say it) all of these issues would be resolved if all the citizens of this country contributed a FAIR share, that's all just a fair share.

Really I stopped giving a shìte about all of those things a long time ago.

Zebra3

Can’t understand why we don’t have criminal enquiries if people are suspected of breaking the law instead of gravy train toothless tribunals.

Benildus

Only the perennially outraged on Twitter seem to care: the GemmaOd's, the leftwing Anti-everything Alliance nutters

kneemos

We do contribute to health care. The best funded health service in Europe.

vicwatson

RTE have 10 political correspondants, 10

Nettle Soup

They should be criminal inquiries but our government is afraid to take on the corrupt Gardai. They way McCabe has been treated for years is despicable. Hopefully he finally gets some level of "justice".

kneemos

vicwatson wrote: »

RTE have 10 political correspondants, 10

They have a US,UK,Middle Eastern,European,Northern Ireland correspondants etc.
Not sure what they all do bar tell us occasionally what we can read on news reports anyway.
Looks good to have somebody on the ground I suppose.

Odhinn

realdanbreen wrote: »

Just turned on the radio and more reporting of yet another inquiry/tribunal whatever coming from Dublin Castle. This one is about guards/ whistleblowers and who said what and when. I am sick of them and the only one certainty is that all of the participants, guards, politicians, j.

Well then, all the people who have had their careers and/or lives ruined by Martin callinan will just have to fuck off and take their shite with them. We can't have you being annoyed, can we.

wexie

Zebra3 wrote: »

Can’t understand why we don’t have criminal enquiries if people are suspected off breaking the law instead of gravy train toothless tribunals.

I've never understood this?

What's the point in having a Tribunal if there are no consequences at the back end of it? (and there generally don't seem to be are there?) Just so we know?

Lots of time, effort and money to tell someone they have (or haven't) been a naughty boy and send them on their way?

Is this a purely Irish thing?

TallGlass

Never really understood them, they get answers. Usually criminal answers and nothing ever seems to happen ever.

Then again, when you go and break the law and go before a court it seems nothing happens either.

Waste of money really.

RayCon

Lenny Henry once described us as White Jamaicans ... hard to argue with that.

McMurphy

McCabe looks like he was subjected to the most vile, repulsive smear campaign, involving accusations that amount to the most serious accusations anyone could be accused of (abusing a child) because he tried to speak out about malpractice going on with his employers, who also happen to be the state's police service.

Yet the tail end of the OP seems to be wedging in a fairly thinly veiled dole sponging reference/ need for people to pay their fair share?

What the actual fcuk?

corner of hells

If I ever get arrested , I'm going to ask for tribunal instead of a trial.

donegaLroad

You are asking me do I give a **** OP, yes I do... very much so. There are people that would say 'whats another €10 million at this stage, considering that The Moriarty Tribunal (for example) has cost €57.7 million to date'.

In 2009, the government at the time failed to allocate €10 million in funding to Crumlin Children's Hospital, resulting in the closure of a wing of the hospital.

Thats only 1 example of hundreds that could be posted on this thread.


Moriarty Tribunal will cost another €10m this year, despite taking place 20 years ago

THE MORIARTY TRIBUNAL kicked off in 1997 to look into the financial affairs of Charlie Haughey and Michael Lowry – and twenty years on, it continues to cost the State money.

Taoiseach Enda Kenny told the Oireachtas Finance Committee yesterday the Moriarty Tribunal has cost €54.7 million to date.

This year, an additional €10 million for legal costs will be spent.

Hector Bellend

realdanbreen wrote: »

Just turned on the radio and more reporting of yet another inquiry/tribunal whatever coming from Dublin Castle. This one is about guards/ whistleblowers and who said what and when. I am sick of them and the only one certainty is that all of the participants, guards, politicians, judges, barristers,etc will all have big salaries and will have fat pensions to look forward to regardless of the outcome. Meanwhile the never ending problems of healthcare, housing needs etc rumble on. And you know what (and I have NEVER heard a politician say it) all of these issues would be resolved if all the citizens of this country contributed a FAIR share, that's all just a fair share.

Dude are you seriously suggesting that the good people of Ireland contribute to running of their own country?

Are you out of your mind?

You really expect some people to pay their way?

realdanbreen

Johnny Dogs wrote: »

McCabe looks like he was subjected to the most vile, repulsive smear campaign, involving accusations that amount to the most serious accusations anyone could be accused of (abusing a child) because he tried to speak out about malpractice going on with his employers, who also happen to be the state's police service.

Yet the tail end of the OP seems to be wedging in a fairly thinly veiled dole sponging reference/ need for people to pay their fair share?

What the actual fcuk?

Anyone that knows me around here knows that I don't do 'thinly [EMAIL="veiled'@m"]veiled'[/EMAIL]
( I spend a lot of time banned from here as a result) . I am making no reference to the dole. I mean what part of 'everyone ' contribute fairly can you not figure out?

Franz Von Peppercorn

wexie wrote: »

I've never understood this?

What's the point in having a Tribunal if there are no consequences at the back end of it? (and there generally don't seem to be are there?) Just so we know?

Lots of time, effort and money to tell someone they have (or haven't) been a naughty boy and send them on their way?

Is this a purely Irish thing?

It’s worse than that. Some of the tribunals might in fact make a trial impossible because of prejudice. These are investigative bodies with no teeth.

realdanbreen

Odhinn wrote: »

Well then, all the people who have had their careers and/or lives ruined by Martin callinan will just have to fuck off and take their shite with them. We can't have you being annoyed, can we.

So you don't think Callinan or whoever is found to have done wrong should be punished/jailed , they should just go through this charade and at the end walk off into the sunset!

twinytwo

Franz Von Peppercorn wrote: »

It’s worse than that. Some of the tribunals might in fact make a trial impossible because of prejudice.

This is what they aim for.... no one in power ever has to take responsibility for anything.

Yet they get two more pay increases this year.

But then what do you expect from a country with a history of political corruption that always get brushed under the carpet.

A country mind you where a TD can openly commit purjury on the witness stand and the same legal system decides there is no case for him to answer.

Ireland.. a fantastic country to live in so long as you are rich and have no morals.

topper75

Odhinn wrote: »

Well then, all the people who have had their careers and/or lives ruined by Martin callinan will just have to fuck off and take their shite with them. We can't have you being annoyed, can we.

HOLD ON! I don't think OP has an issue with justice on the matter!!!

More with the supposed means of attaining it that has fallen flat so many times before in other cases.

Tribunal is not just a fudge, it is a transfer of money we were were all taxed on to legal people who create little or no value.

Complaint is more than valid.

blanch152

Odhinn wrote: »

Well then, all the people who have had their careers and/or lives ruined by Martin callinan will just have to fuck off and take their shite with them. We can't have you being annoyed, can we.

Your post is very strange, you seem to think the Tribunal is necessary, yet........

Has the Tribunal already reported with its findings on Martin Callinan?

If it hasn't, what is the point of the Tribunal, if you have already made up your mind?

AlanG

I think there is far too little coverage of the current tribunal. The Garda are the most powerful body in the country and identifying any corruption there is vital to having a free democracy. This particular tribunal is money very well spent.

Just because there may not be enough evidence to secure a criminal prosecution does not mean the tribunal is a waste of time. People in very powerful positions can corrupt a country even if they are not breaking the law. The alternative to this tribunal is outrage on the internet and a lot of false information with no examination.

Odhinn

blanch152 wrote: »

Your post is very strange, you seem to think the Tribunal is necessary, yet........

Has the Tribunal already reported with its findings on Martin Callinan?

If it hasn't, what is the point of the Tribunal, if you have already made up your mind?

No idea what you're on about.

Odhinn

topper75 wrote: »

HOLD ON! I don't think OP has an issue with justice on the matter!!!

More with the supposed means of attaining it that has fallen flat so many times before in other cases.

.

Showing that the word of Martin Callinan & Noirin O'Sullivan means nothing is vital, to the many people condemned behind their back by whispering campaigns led by the same two. There's far more than mccabe that have suffered that fate over the last 30 years.

Franz Von Peppercorn

Odhinn wrote: »

Showing that the word of Martin Callinan & Noirin O'Sullivan means nothing is vital, to the many people condemned behind their back by whispering campaigns led by the same two. There's far more than mccabe that have suffered that fate over the last 30 years.

Yeh but tribunals are a farce. Corrupt themselves. Prejudicial to trials.

We need to get another police force involved - and hire them as separate investigators in Ireland. Ex members of the PSNI perhaps.

blanch152

Odhinn wrote: »

No idea what you're on about.

You are at it again:

Odhinn wrote: »

Showing that the word of Martin Callinan & Noirin O'Sullivan means nothing is vital, to the many people condemned behind their back by whispering campaigns led by the same two. There's far more than mccabe that have suffered that fate over the last 30 years.

You have made conclusions about the outcome of the Tribunal before the Tribunal has reported. So why do we need a Tribunal if you already have all the answers?

Odhinn

blanch152 wrote: »

You are at it again:



You have made conclusions about the outcome of the Tribunal before the Tribunal has reported. So why do we need a Tribunal if you already have all the answers?

According to you not long ago, Frances Fitzgerald had nothing to apologise for - pull the other one.

blanch152

Odhinn wrote: »

According to you not long ago, Frances Fitzgerald had nothing to apologise for - pull the other one.

We will see what the judge says, but from the evidence so far, there is nothing to suggest she has anything to apologies for.

http://www.disclosurestribunal.ie/en/DIS/(n)%20and%20(o)%20report.pdf/Files/(n)%20and%20(o)%20report.pdf

We have already seen in the case of Garda Harrison that not everything said by a whistleblower should be taken as being reasonable.

Odhinn

blanch152 wrote: »

We will see what the judge says, but from the evidence so far, there is nothing to suggest she has anything to apologies for.

.

As I said, pull the other one.

blanch152

Odhinn wrote: »

As I said, pull the other one.

We will see.

ChikiChiki

kneemos wrote: »

We do contribute to health care. The best funded health service in Europe.

That reads like an excuse for our **** health system

To put it frankly our politicians are inept and useless. There is NO political will for will change in healthcare.

RustyNut

blanch152 wrote: »

We have already seen in the case of Garda Harrison that not everything said by a whistleblower should be taken as being reasonable.

It would seem to be a lot more reliable than anything the commissioner has to say.

Auguste Comte

realdanbreen wrote: »

Just turned on the radio and more reporting of yet another inquiry/tribunal whatever coming from Dublin Castle. This one is about guards/ whistleblowers and who said what and when. I am sick of them and the only one certainty is that all of the participants, guards, politicians, judges, barristers,etc will all have big salaries and will have fat pensions to look forward to regardless of the outcome. Meanwhile the never ending problems of healthcare, housing needs etc rumble on. And you know what (and I have NEVER heard a politician say it) all of these issues would be resolved if all the citizens of this country contributed a FAIR share, that's all just a fair share.

How do you suggest that issues like what appears to be a massive cover up of corrupt behaviour in the Guards and the apparent character assassination of the people who disclosed it should be dealt with?

professore

AlanG wrote: »

I think there is far too little coverage of the current tribunal. The Garda are the most powerful body in the country and identifying any corruption there is vital to having a free democracy. This particular tribunal is money very well spent.

Just because there may not be enough evidence to secure a criminal prosecution does not mean the tribunal is a waste of time. People in very powerful positions can corrupt a country even if they are not breaking the law. The alternative to this tribunal is outrage on the internet and a lot of false information with no examination.

So praytell what will improve because of the tribunal?

boombang

I know it's not exactly the point the OP is making, but whenever I consider the McCabe and other Garda scandals I often think "where's the outrage?"

This was a man trying to do the right thing against a totally toxic culture and the top brass framed him as a peedo.

I agree that we should probably just sack guilty individuals without their pensions rather than lining lawyers pockets in toothless enquiries. Still, I do want to see McCabe's name held up.

RobbingBandit

Who will guard the gardai.

_Whimsical_

boombang wrote: »

I know it's not exactly the point the OP is making, but whenever I consider the McCabe and other Garda scandals I often think "where's the outrage?"

This was a man trying to do the right thing against a totally toxic culture and the top brass framed him as a peedo.

I agree that we should probably just sack guilty individuals without their pensions rather than lining lawyers pockets in toothless enquiries. Still, I do want to see McCabe's name held up.

It actually takes an attention span of more than 20 seconds to glean what went on. Not enough people have that anymore. It's obvious that several people commenting on this thread have no idea what happened to McCabe and what implications that has for their society or their own safety in the long run. If half of the people on these platforms took some time out of spewing their uninformed opinions and instead read a little we might have a decent country.

But then I suppose we are only living with a police force willing to overlook crime for their buddies, too lazy to do their jobs and happy to fill in forms pretending they've done them, all presided over by top brass who had no problem silencing anyone who tried to right those wrongs with accusations of being a paedophile...
No big deal really.

realdanbreen

Another thing that pisses me off, this minister naughton apparently said something in a phonecall that he shouldn't have said. I haven't been paying much attention but apparently it was'nt a life & death situation. However since yesterday it is the main news item, the FF spokesman Dooley , the leader of SF and the leader of Labour have been on the TV/Radio non stop attempting to have him sacked. I'm all for holding a government to account but all parties and deputies when in opposition seem to have their main focus on screwing whatever Government is in power. I'm sick of this ****e anyway.

Auguste Comte

realdanbreen wrote: »

Another thing that pisses me off, this minister naughton apparently said something in a phonecall that he shouldn't have said. I haven't been paying much attention but apparently it was'nt a life & death situation. However since yesterday it is the main news item, the FF spokesman Dooley , the leader of SF and the leader of Labour have been on the TV/Radio non stop attempting to have him sacked. I'm all for holding a government to account but all parties and deputies when in opposition seem to have their main focus on screwing whatever Government is in power. I'm sick of this ****e anyway.

Any suggestions on how to improve the system?

Bob Harris

Whistleblower
Smear campaign
Tribunal

All word I am sick to my bollocks of hearing.

garbo speaks

Who the hell cares about these tribunals? There are never any consequences and the guilty and corrupt are never punished. These things are just displays of optics for the media.

smurgen

Bob Harris wrote: »

Whistleblower
Smear campaign
Tribunal

All word I am sick to my bollocks of hearing.

Thank god no one cares about your bollocks then

Agricola

We don't do accountability in Ireland, never have, probably never will. We're too small a place, everyone knows everyone, there's a culture of subconscious doffing of the cap to white collar/high level crimes, "ah shure, fair play to him, if I was in his position I'd probably do the same"
We like to rant and rave on Joe Duffy, but in truth we're a nation of rogues who pay lip service to fairness and transparency.

But tbf, when it comes to corruption, we're in the ha'penny place compared to lots n lots of other countries.....so I suppose til be grand shure!

_Whimsical_

Agricola wrote: »

We like to rant and rave on Joe Duffy, but in truth we're a nation of rogues who pay lip service to fairness and transparency.

But tbf, when it comes to corruption, we're in the ha'penny place compared to lots n lots of other countries.....so I suppose til be grand shure!

We are not people who destroy a man's career and his public reputation by tarnishing him as a "kiddy fiddler" who abuses his own kids with no evidence what so ever to support that, and to literally anyone who'll listen in order to discredit him though.

Tribunals of inquiry are far from perfect but they do at least signal back to those in power what will be tolerated by the public and what won't. People involved in this smear campaign deserve our utter derision. If people actually listen to this and don't just hold up their hands and say "boring!" something might change. It's far from dull too. It only takes one person at work to call you a pedophile to destroy every aspect of your career and life, "you couldn't trust his decisions, he's a pedo", "you couldn't let him run a project, he's a pedophile", " you couldn't take his safety concerns seriously he's a..." and on it goes. It could be any of us. The tribunal might have no effect other than to publicise what happened, the public reaction, individuals being aware enough to stand up and say "hold on where's the evidence" when someone's credibility is called into question, creating a climate where those things aren't allowed happen again ,those are things that the public can change...if they're willing to listen.

Bob Harris

smurgen wrote: »

Thank god no one cares about your bollocks then

That is not true.