Vendor left waste furniture behind

Cash_Q

Hi
We've just bought a house that had been rented out. The tenant left and landlord cleared out the majority of stuff. There is a mattress, couple of wardrobes and other bits and pieces of waste furniture left behind. Also 3 overflowing wheelie bins.

We have been quoted up to 200euro to have this stuff removed. Where do we stand? I'm badgering the estate agent non stop but not getting anywhere as he keeps saying he hasn't heard back from the vendor.

Homer

Im afraid its your rubbish now! Not a hope the vendor will clear it out if the sale has completed I would guess. Unless it was specified in the contract or similar?

Cash_Q

**** sake! We stupidly paid 250 for white goods and sofas and are now left with those costs! I'm going to go to the estate agents right now **** this.

Wheety

Would be quicker and less hassle just to get rid of it yourself. Could advertise for the furniture or if you want to dump it all check your local amenity centre. If you could borrow a van, the one in Ballymount charges €60 for a medium van and €84 for a large van. At least you'd know it was going to the right place too rather than just being dumped.

lordgoat

This happened us, we just rang the bin company and told us the old tenants left their bins behind. They came collected them (full) and I presume charged previous owners.
Signed up with same company same day. No problem at all.

Hitman3000

Cash_Q wrote:

We have been quoted up to 200euro to have this stuff removed. Where do we stand? I'm badgering the estate agent non stop but not getting anywhere as he keeps saying he hasn't heard back from the vendor.

The estate agent has no liability, not sure why you think badgering them will further things along for you. Unless it was stated in your contract of sale that house was to be left devoid of all possessions of pervious owner ( or similar wording) the furniture is now yours to dispose of. Less hassle just rent a van and do it yourself.

DebDynamite

Same thing happened us when we got the keys to our house. Now, ours was a bad case - clothes, furniture, garage full of crap... It was like the sellers moved out of the house and just brought an overnight bag with then. We rang our solicitor immediately and she put a stop to the money. In the end, the estate agent ended up getting someone in to clear the house, and I presume (hope), he passed on the cost to the sellers. Maybe things are too far gone for you though to do that.

emeldc

Any time I bought a house (5) it was always agreed between the parties that my solicitor would hold the funds until the house was inspected. Sure what if carpets, curtains and white goods were included in the sale and then you turn up after the money is handed over and they're not there. Would that just be tough as well. Solicitor sounds sloppy to me.

pxdf9i5cmoavkz

Cash_Q wrote: »

**** sake! We stupidly paid 250 for white goods and sofas and are now left with those costs! I'm going to go to the estate agents right now **** this.

OT; Another reason why Ireland needs to stop the backwards practice of furnished rentals and sales.

Cash_Q

Well when I went to the final inspection these items were in the house but I naively thought they were being removed when told the vendor needed an extra week to clear out. Collected the keys and arrived to find them there.

As for the wheelie bins yes they'll take them but will charge US not the previous account holder 20.

We can't hire a van and do it ourselves i am pregnant so can't lift any of the ****.

Estate agents are being really cheeky and unhelpful about it. I'm just having a rant so if you've no helpful advice then please don't come at me with blame on our part. Is it too much to expect that someone would not leave behind a filthy mattress and broken wardrobes?

listermint

Erm, did you specify any of this in the sales negotiation . i.e taking furniture and clearing it out.

because unless you did then its your sunk cost.

Claw Hammer

There is a failure to give you vacant possession of the property. You may have the right to sue the vendor and possibly his solicitor. You can also threaten to report the agent to the PSRA for misrepresentation.

vandriver

Claw Hammer wrote: »

There is a failure to give you vacant possession of the property. You may have the right to sue the vendor and possibly his solicitor. You can also threaten to report the agent to the PSRA for misrepresentation.

For something that can be solved for 2 ton.LOL

Hitman3000

Claw Hammer wrote:

There is a failure to give you vacant possession of the property. You may have the right to sue the vendor and possibly his solicitor. You can also threaten to report the agent to the PSRA for misrepresentation.

I don't think vacant possession means what you think it means. Threaten the Agent?

spaceHopper

It's this simple, you've been stung for 200 quid to get it taken away. Have you looked in the attic?

Dial Hard

Claw Hammer wrote:

There is a failure to give you vacant possession of the property.

That's not what vacant possession means, at all.

feedthegoat

spaceHopper wrote: »

It's this simple, you've been stung for 200 quid to get it taken away. Have you looked in the attic?

Good point, we bought house and all was well until went to put our own stuff in attic, all the baby\ toddler stuff of the previous occupants was there, filled a mini skip!

Claw Hammer

Dial Hard wrote: »

That's not what vacant possession means, at all.

It certainly is. There have been court decisions on it.

gmisk

feedthegoat wrote: »

Good point, we bought house and all was well until went to put our own stuff in attic, all the baby\ toddler stuff of the previous occupants was there, filled a mini skip!

Had the same issue....house relatively clear...but took me 3 days to clear the attic.

Bandana boy

Dublin city council will do a bulk waste collection for 40 euro ,up to 5 items .

Will get rid of mattress and lockers and the like and allow you to run the balance to the dump , which is 25 euro for a car

Will get you in well below 200 bills

Hitman3000

Claw Hammer wrote:

It certainly is. There have been court decisions on it.

Since vacant possession is not defined in Irish law maybe you could give a few examples of those court cases and outcomes.

IBrows89

Happened with our house recently as well, they brought it an extra wheelie bin and it was filled up with rubbish and left a couple of old chairs, they then went out of their way to take old curtains down from the bed rooms. So annoying.

I checked the attic straight away thinking it would be full, luckily we dodged a bullet there as there was nothing.

FionnB

Ask your solicitor where you stand. Same thing happened us - a room full of broken furniture, a cupboard full of old shoes, a superser canister in the porch, even an unpaid milk bill. I am still annoyed with myself years later that I didn't do anything about it.

Damiencm

Claw Hammer wrote:

It certainly is. There have been court decisions on it.

Claw Hammer wrote:

It certainly is. There have been court decisions on it.

I always thought vacant possession simply meant that the property would be untenanted when the sale completed.

testicles

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McGrath5

Nothing you can do about it OP, one of the pitfalls of purchasing a house.

It is good practice to complete an inspection just before the sale closes to avoid scenarios like this, you live and learn.

Cash_Q

Attic is clear

Did complete inspection before closing. House was clear except these items which is basically one item per room. I really thought I'd be pointing out the obvious to ask for these to be removed and presumed I wouldn't have to as the vendors asked for an extra week to clear out the property. They got their week but cleared none of that stuff.

Our solicitor is contacting their solicitor tomorrow.

Cash_Q

Bandana boy wrote:

Dublin city council will do a bulk waste collection for 40 euro ,up to 5 items .

I presume this is in their area only? We are South Dublin Co Co.

As a pregnant hormonal person I'm definitely over reacting to this but it's a pain in the ars3

Claw Hammer

Hitman3000 wrote: »

Since vacant possession is not defined in Irish law maybe you could give a few examples of those court cases and outcomes.

How do you know it is not defined?

Hitman3000

Claw Hammer wrote:

How do you know it is not defined?

It's quite easy really. Just acquaint yourself with the law. Don't make up stuff.

Samuel T. Cogley

Claw Hammer wrote: »

How do you know it is not defined?

Because you're not linking the definition? :pac:

Hitman3000

Cash_Q wrote:

As a pregnant hormonal person I'm definitely over reacting to this but it's a pain in the ars3

Of course it's a pain in the backside. Don't let a minor issue ruin your enjoyment of your new home. No point creating avoidable annoyance for yourself.

Claw Hammer

Samuel T. Cogley wrote: »

Because you're not linking the definition? :pac:

So you are guessing.

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Claw Hammer

There is a definition but it is not online since, like a lot of property law it predates the advent of the internet. Bailii has very few cases older than 20 years. Some people here purport to know what it means but haven't offered any definition of their own either.

Samuel T. Cogley

Claw Hammer wrote: »

So you are guessing.

Absolutely. I've no idea, never covered it in Land Law, or if we did I was off that day. So please do enlighten us all.

Samuel T. Cogley

Claw Hammer wrote: »

There is a definition but it is not online since, like a lot of property law it predates the advent of the internet. Bailii has very few cases older than 20 years. Some people here purport to know what it means but haven't offered any definition of their own either.

https://www2.le.ac.uk/library/find/databases/b/britishandirishlegalinformationinstitutebailii

Coverage
UK and Ireland
Date
1220 to date

Hitman3000

Claw Hammer wrote:

So you are guessing.

If everyone else is wrong or guessing, you can of course link the cases and judgements you feel backup your position.

Samuel T. Cogley

Hitman3000 wrote: »

If everyone else is wrong or guessing, you can of course link the cases and judgements you feel backup your position.

Citation will do I'll look it up on Justis/Westlaw.

Claw Hammer

Samuel T. Cogley wrote: »

https://www2.le.ac.uk/library/find/databases/b/britishandirishlegalinformationinstitutebailii

Last time I looked it had very few Irish cases pre 1999. Your land law teaching must have been of the usual standard of land law teaching in Ireland. Can you link to the definition of murder in Ireland or were you missing when they were teaching criminal law?

Hitman3000

Claw Hammer wrote:

Last time I looked it had very few Irish cases pre 1999. Your land law teaching must have been of the usual standard of land law teaching in Ireland. Can you link to the definition of murder in Ireland or were you missing when they were teaching criminal law?

Mason, Hayes and Curran have quite a clear eplaination available online. Their website is mhc.ie

Samuel T. Cogley

Claw Hammer wrote: »

Last time I looked it had very few Irish cases pre 1999. Your land law teaching must have been of the usual standard of land law teaching in Ireland. Can you link to the definition of murder in Ireland or were you missing when they were teaching criminal law?

I was missing most of the time tbh two bars within walking distance of college. However the definition of Murder is given in various common law cases the names and citation of which I'd be happy to provide if I could find my Criminal Law manual, it's probably propping up a table or something.

England and Wales have codified it and I'm sure the LRC have something intelligent to say on the matter.

Also as my LL teaching was so bad, could I have a citation or two please?

boombang

Depending on how crap the old furniture is you might be surprised who might take it for free. At the very least it could reduce the amount of stuff you have to fight over. I've got rid of stuff that I thought I'd need a skip for by offering it through the free section of Adverts.ie

Some people are magpies for junk.

rgodard80a

Had the same thing happen to us.

Our solicitor pulled out all the stops to complete the sale of our old house and purchase of the new house on the same day... on a Friday no less.

We had everything in the truck and they wouldn't give us access until the funds went through.
When we got the keys at 6pm that day, the next day we saw that they left huge desks, a tonne of crap in the garden and sheds.

It's too much hassle to chase it up.... they're scumbags.

If you receive any post for them, just write return to sender and scratch out the address with "Unknown addressee" now and give it back to the postman / drop in a postbox.

Our ex-house owners had the cheek to expect us to drop their post into the neighbours house (who they were still pally with).

Legally you can't.

Claw Hammer

Samuel T. Cogley wrote: »

I was missing most of the time tbh two bars within walking distance of college. However the definition of Murder is given in various common law cases the names and citation of which I'd be happy to provide if I could find my Criminal Law manual, it's probably propping up a table or something.

England and Wales have codified it and I'm sure the LRC have something intelligent to say on the matter.

Also as my LL teaching was so bad, could I have a citation or two please?

If you could find a book. People don't go around with this type of stuff in their heads.

Cash_Q

boombang wrote:

Depending on how crap the old furniture is you might be surprised who might take it for free. At the very least it could reduce the amount of stuff you have to fight over. I've got rid of stuff that I thought I'd need a skip for by offering it through the free section of Adverts.ie

Yeah but the hassle of getting rid of anything on Adverts isn't worth it. Idiots messaging who aren't genuine. Waiting on someone to wait on someone to collect it for them and then that falls through bla bla. Too much hassle.

The principle of it is as bad as the cost and hassle.

No skip bag will fit a double mattress and we could not be ****ed smashing up their furniture.

We have enough to be doing to pack up and clear our own own house never mind sorting out their crap which is occupying our space. So annoying.

pauldavis123

Cash_Q wrote: »

Yeah but the hassle of getting rid of anything on Adverts isn't worth it. Idiots messaging who aren't genuine. Waiting on someone to wait on someone to collect it for them and then that falls through bla bla. Too much hassle.

The principle of it is as bad as the cost and hassle.

No skip bag will fit a double mattress and we could not be ****ed smashing up their furniture.

We have enough to be doing to pack up and clear our own own house never mind sorting out their crap which is occupying our space. So annoying.

Glass half empty...

Hitman3000

Cash_Q wrote:

We have enough to be doing to pack up and clear our own own house never mind sorting out their crap which is occupying our space. So annoying.

Won't you have the use of a large vehicle to move your big pieces of furniture? Easy fill it for a trip to the local council facility.

There are (legally operating) lads out there that will fill a trailer of your sh/te and get rid of it. They pull up, do the filling of the trailer themselves, and leave. I got a price for a chap locally (Louth) and he wanted €150 to fill his trailer (a skip the same size would cost €230). And he'll help fill it.


Would it be better to just get someone like that (just make sure they've a waste permit number, etc.).



I always assumed that no matter how you put it to the seller, you were always gonna end up with a skip to fill when you buy a house? I regularly see 'sale agreed' signs in the garden and houses that havent been touched in ages, and all of a sudden there's a skip in the garden and it's being filled up.

If you just bought a house chances are you're after parting ways with over €100,000. Will €200 really be a make or break? Why let it sour anything.

izzyflusky

Something like that happened to my parents years and years ago. The vendor left full bins, bags of rubbish around the house and the attic full of stuff they didnt want. They went back to their solicitor who was able to get a check off the vendor's to cover the costs of removing everything.