Is this rust normal or too much? Advice for buying a used bike

FEid

Hey guys, hope everyones staying wrapped up and warm in this crap going on outside. Before the storm started, I went to view this used bike I was very interested in. It's a 1.5 year old MT03, with only around 8k Kms on the clock, so basically in new condition. Bike is wonderful to look at, and I've done all of my basic checks (brakes, forks, suspension, lights and electrics, brake fluid and oil level, chain lube and tension) and all seems to be fine. 3000 km since last service at 5k, and bike still taxed and under manufacturers warranty for another few months till july. The one and only issue I've seen on it that I didn't like was the substantial amount of rust on the headers for 1.5 year old bike. Now this could be the fact that I've never ridden this class of bike before and maybe the headers are normal to rust this way, but thought I'd ask what you guys think. Here is a picture of em:
https://imgur.com/K47BH3Y

Thanks and stay safe!

Max Headroom

That's a savage amount of corrosion in general...looks 5 years old and not looked after imo...is it an import..?

FEid

Max Headroom wrote: »

That's a savage amount of corrosion in general...looks 5 years old and not looked after imo...is it an import..?

It is not. Bought brand new by the current owner July 2016 from megabikes. I took the VIN and called the dealer to see what it has been through, and they say the owner has been really good with servicing and has a load of extras fitted by them. They say it's been through nothing and is clean as of last service. I realize its been used in all conditions during the 1.5 years but it feels a bit much for the time frame. Could it be a warranty covered issue or is that asking for much? Here are a couple snaps from the bike.

https://imgur.com/a/8InF6

https://imgur.com/a/jFleX

cantdecide

The guy must work at a salt mine. That's pretty shocking.

CJhaughey

Thats pretty normal for a bike that has been ridden all year round, the fasteners are pretty chalky as well which would indicate a certain level of corrosion.
The Yamaha's built in Italy are always a bit more prone to corrosion than the Japanese ones.

FEid

cantdecide wrote: »

The guy must work at a salt mine. That's pretty shocking.

I know right? and as far as the owner and service history as well as general condition of everything else tells me he's taken care of it. Other than the headers everything is literally shiny like.... I just dunno why

FEid

CJhaughey wrote: »

Thats pretty normal for a bike that has been ridden all year round, the fasteners are pretty chalky as well which would indicate a certain level of corrosion.
The Yamaha's built in Italy are always a bit more prone to corrosion than the Japanese ones.

Even when it's still this young? I suppose our salty winter roads really do take their toll quickly?

CJhaughey

FEid wrote: »

Even when it's still this young? I suppose our salty winter roads really do take their toll quickly?

The headers are mild steel, bikes run hot these days with lean mixtures for emissions.
Couple that with salty spray from the front wheel and lack of washing and you get rust in a very short time.

FEid

FEid wrote: »

Hey guys, hope everyones staying wrapped up and warm in this crap going on outside. Before the storm started, I went to view this used bike I was very interested in. It's a 1.5 year old MT03, with only around 8k Kms on the clock, so basically in new condition. Bike is wonderful to look at, and I've done all of my basic checks (brakes, forks, suspension, lights and electrics, brake fluid and oil level, chain lube and tension) and all seems to be fine. 3000 km since last service at 5k, and bike still taxed and under manufacturers warranty for another few months till july. The one and only issue I've seen on it that I didn't like was the substantial amount of rust on the headers for 1.5 year old bike. Now this could be the fact that I've never ridden this class of bike before and maybe the headers are normal to rust this way, but thought I'd ask what you guys think. Here is a picture of em:
https://imgur.com/K47BH3Y

Thanks and stay safe!

It's fine and completely normal on our roads.

So what if they rust you can pick up a used set for about 80 quid online if you need

Constantly heating, salt and water leave headers looking like crap no matter how old the bike

I'd buy the bike if you like it mate

All the rust from the pics is surface corrosion, if you were bothered a wire brush on a drill would have it off in 10 seconds

zubair

This is easily sorted with some autosol and some elbow grease. They will be spanking. The only thing is, if I was selling the bike I would have done it myself before showing it. If everything else is ok and it has a decent service history I don't see a problem.

arybvtcw0eolkf

Easily sorted, and some would [rightly] say that its bad for a newish bike.

But the built quality of the whole MT range is awful, that and an owner who won't stay on top of regular cleaning [hope my son is reading this, won't clean his bike for love 'nor money, so dad does it] ~ I'd expect this.

two wheels good

Easy to paint or replace the header pipes. My concern would be the condition of the studs. Are the nuts seized, could you be facing a sheared stud?
Which reminds me of an overdue job .. cleaning and Copperslip-ing my own header studs.

FEid

Jerry Green Dewdrop wrote: »

It's fine and completely normal on our roads.

So what if they rust you can pick up a used set for about 80 quid online if you need

Constantly heating, salt and water leave headers looking like crap no matter how old the bike

I'd buy the bike if you like it mate

All the rust from the pics is surface corrosion, if you were bothered a wire brush on a drill would have it off in 10 seconds

Yeah that does sound right. I suppose I'm thinking more of the fact that my little GN125 did not look that bad despite being the same age. Then again the GN exhaust is literally the most prominent feature and maybe its actually made of better materials? Be surprising considering the price difference between a premium Yamaha MT and a budget GN125 wouldn't you think?

FEid

zubair wrote: »

This is easily sorted with some autosol and some elbow grease. They will be spanking. The only thing is, if I was selling the bike I would have done it myself before showing it. If everything else is ok and it has a decent service history I don't see a problem.

I'm with you on that. I suppose he is a slightly older dude who has a long hours job and doesn't seem to have the time or the willpower to sit down and start scrubbing bikes down. It was literally taken to the dealer for every nook and cranny, which is never a bad thing when buying used.

FEid

Lorelei Tight Grocery wrote: »

Easily sorted, and some would [rightly] say that its bad for a newish bike.

But the built quality of the whole MT range is awful, that and an owner who won't stay on top of regular cleaning [hope my son is reading this, won't clean his bike for love 'nor money, so dad does it] ~ I'd expect this.

Ah I'd say don't bother cleaning it for a bit, let him see how bad it can get and he can pay for a replacement exhaust, that'll teach him :p

Anyway, do you know for a fact that the build quality is awful? By that do you mean rust or is it gonna snap in an accident? Not to sound worried but I am getting this bike as a replacement for a bad crash and not really looking for something that's gonna start falling apart?

FEid

two wheels good wrote: »

Easy to paint or replace the header pipes. My concern would be the condition of the studs. Are the nuts seized, could you be facing a sheared stud?
Which reminds me of an overdue job .. cleaning and Copperslip-ing my own header studs.

Whether the nuts are seized or not is something that remains to be seen when work is being done on it I suppose. I mean they that whole section does have a fair bit of corrosion, but I'm hoping that doesn't mean that the nuts are ****ed as well cuz that suddenly makes matters worse. I have my doubts of it being THAT bad under the surface in a year and a half, but then again it shouldn't look like this after a year and a half......hmmmmm decisions decisions...

Cienciano

Clean them with harpic max 10, then a very handy going over with autosol. Minimal elbow grease required

arybvtcw0eolkf

FEid wrote: »

Ah I'd say don't bother cleaning it for a bit, let him see how bad it can get and he can pay for a replacement exhaust, that'll teach him :p

He's loaded, it wouldn't bother him.

FEid wrote: »

Anyway, do you know for a fact that the build quality is awful? By that do you mean rust or is it gonna snap in an accident? Not to sound worried but I am getting this bike as a replacement for a bad crash and not really looking for something that's gonna start falling apart?

Just my opinion, don't take it as gospel.

When my son was starting out we looked at buying a new MT-07 and couldn't believe how cheap and nasty the plastics and paint/graphics was. I looked at the MT01 and MT10 with a view to us both having Yamaha MT's but I was disappointed at those too.

That said the MT03 was the nicer of the lot!.

Take my opinion with a pinch of salt and enjoy the new bike

zubair

See if you can use this to get the price down but either way these can be as good as new in less than hour with a bit of a polish. Its just surface corrosion, it would take 20 years for them to rot through. Ive cleaned downpipes that looked worse on much older bikes plenty of times. Doesn't matter if the bolts are seized unless you're taking them off and why would you be doing that. I would definitely chance my arm at getting the price down as it's a genuine concern for you or the dealer should clean them for you if he's not willing to drop the price.

FEid

Lorelei Tight Grocery wrote: »

He's loaded, it wouldn't bother him.



Just my opinion, don't take it as gospel.

When my son was starting out we looked at buying a new MT-07 and couldn't believe how cheap and nasty the plastics and paint/graphics was. I looked at the MT01 and MT10 with a view to us both having Yamaha MT's but I was disappointed at those too.

That said the MT03 was the nicer of the lot!.

Take my opinion with a pinch of salt and enjoy the new bike

Like to be honest, the way it's looking for me so far, my options seem to be this or back to the 125. what do you think :D:D

FEid

zubair wrote: »

See if you can use this to get the price down but either way these can be as good as new in less than hour with a bit of a polish. Its just surface corrosion, it would take 20 years for them to rot through. Ive cleaned downpipes that looked worse on much older bikes plenty of times. Doesn't matter if the bolts are seized unless you're taking them off and why would you be doing that. I would definitely chance my arm at getting the price down as it's a genuine concern for you or the dealer should clean them for you if he's not willing to drop the price.

Yeah if it was from a dealer I would definitely be putting up a bit more of a fight. It is a private seller who bought it brand new from the dealer 1.5 years ago, and he's already willing to let it go for quite a good price really, including a few nice extras. Other than the exhaust bike has barely ran and looks great. I'd say if I try and bargain him even more he'll just shoot me or something:D:D still probably no harm in trying a bit, I was so happy till I called liberty and they hit me with the substantial insurance switch cost the *****...

CJhaughey

FEid wrote: »

Like to be honest, the way it's looking for me so far, my options seem to be this or back to the 125. what do you think :D:D

Have you totally discounted the Honda CBF?

FEid

CJhaughey wrote: »

Have you totally discounted the Honda CBF?

Tbh I went for a few CBF viewings, and I just didn't really like what I saw. One had corroded all across the engine and bolts and brackets and just looked tired. Didn't really like how long the cold start took as well.

2nd one was better, but I noticed that there was oil on one of the forks which means a seal problem that I cannot be arsed for.

3rd one was pretty good, buy guy was selling it for not so much less than this, and this one is 9 years younger.
I think with my current college schedule and part time work and all that I just really am not ready for buying something used and have it give me occasional mechanical issues that render the bike out of commission for a few days. Newer is more expensive but in most cases you buy with a little more peace of mind. I dont think id mind a cb500f but again the newer ones are quite more expensive and insurance costs are higher still....

zubair

CJhaughey wrote: »

Have you totally discounted the Honda CBF?

Or the restricted A!?

galwaytt

FEid wrote: »

Even when it's still this young? I suppose our salty winter roads really do take their toll quickly?

Yes, Spanish-built Honda's suffer similarly, e.g. Deauvilles.

two wheels good

FEid wrote: »

Whether the nuts are seized or not is something that remains to be seen when work is being done on it I suppose. I mean they that whole section does have a fair bit of corrosion, but I'm hoping that doesn't mean that the nuts are ****ed as well cuz that suddenly makes matters worse. I have my doubts of it being THAT bad under the surface in a year and a half, but then again it shouldn't look like this after a year and a half......hmmmmm decisions decisions...

Instead of just throwing in a possible problem I could have added a possible solution.
Explain your concern to the seller. Ask him if he or a mechanic can check that the nuts are free and studs in good nick.
A mechanic could give the bike a check over too. Any reasonable seller would agree to a buyer getting it checked. Wouldn't they?
If the headers are your only concern it seems a pity to pass up an otherwise good bike. Small cost involved but could be worth it.

There is no way the nuts and studs will be ****ed on a bike so young, the rust is just surface rust. One you buy it undo the nuts and put copper grease on them just in case for future

Is this a private sale or garage? If it's a private sale don't be surprised if he tells you to go jump, if someone tried to haggle me on rusted headers that's the response they would get.

blade1

Scouring pad(like the one below) would get those exhausts in good nick I reckon.
Buy a can of Silkolene Silkopen and go over every nut and bolt.
And finally, just keep on top of that kind of thing.

Max Headroom

IMO..and i'm no expert, but i reckon those downpipes are fcuked, much more than surface rust and those studs are too badly corroded to touch...maybe the reason he's selling....

zubair

Max Headroom wrote: »

IMO..and i'm no expert, but i reckon those downpipes are fcuked, much more than surface rust and those studs are too badly corroded to touch...maybe the reason he's selling....

You're mad!

FEid

zubair wrote: »

Or the restricted A!?

Not that it was disregarded, but I went to see this bike and (disregarding the headers) just really really liked it, and the price is very reasonable for the age and mileage. It's also just good for what I need and doesn't have much of a fuel consumption difference. An inline 4 would be wonderful, but just that taad bit over what I need. Plus, I MAY (not excited for this) be getting my brother to be insured on this bike, and his insurance starting off on an inline 4 would be astronomical :D

FEid

Max Headroom wrote: »

IMO..and i'm no expert, but i reckon those downpipes are fcuked, much more than surface rust and those studs are too badly corroded to touch...maybe the reason he's selling....

Sounds just a little overkill wouldn't you think?

FEid

Jerry Green Dewdrop wrote: »

There is no way the nuts and studs will be ****ed on a bike so young, the rust is just surface rust. One you buy it undo the nuts and put copper grease on them just in case for future

Is this a private sale or garage? If it's a private sale don't be surprised if he tells you to go jump, if someone tried to haggle me on rusted headers that's the response they would get.

It is a private sale, and I think it's already a good price. Exactly what you said, I feel like haggling for the headers might push him away...

FEid

two wheels good wrote: »

Instead of just throwing in a possible problem I could have added a possible solution.
Explain your concern to the seller. Ask him if he or a mechanic can check that the nuts are free and studs in good nick.
A mechanic could give the bike a check over too. Any reasonable seller would agree to a buyer getting it checked. Wouldn't they?
If the headers are your only concern it seems a pity to pass up an otherwise good bike. Small cost involved but could be worth it.

Might not be a bad shout. My mechanic said he'd look over it for me if I bring it over after sale, might see if he'd be up to taking it there himself presale. Only thing is I'm not hopeful as for him its a bit of a trek from his place.

Max Headroom

FEid wrote: »

Max Headroom wrote: »

IMO..and i'm no expert, but i reckon those downpipes are fcuked, much more than surface rust and those studs are too badly corroded to touch...maybe the reason he's selling....

Sounds just a little overkill wouldn't you think?

Fair enough...let us know how he get on with it.....;)

Max Headroom

FEid wrote: »

Max Headroom wrote: »

IMO..and i'm no expert, but i reckon those downpipes are fcuked, much more than surface rust and those studs are too badly corroded to touch...maybe the reason he's selling....

Sounds just a little overkill wouldn't you think?

Fair enough...let us know how ye get on with it.....;)

CJhaughey

If you buy it get a big bottle of ACF 50 and after washing it down a few times and copper greasing the studs to the head apply the ACF all over the engine and fasteners anywhere you see white corrosion starting.
If you do this it will hold the corrosion at bay for a lot longer.
I can see paint flaking off the waterpump already so preventative maintenance is a good thing.
There is a guy who does a bike valet and ACF treatment in Dublin AFAIK so it might be worth budgeting for that, its money well spent when it holds the bike finish through winter and into spring.

Max Headroom

Max Headroom wrote: »

IMO..and i'm no expert, but i reckon those downpipes are fcuked, much more than surface rust and those studs are too badly corroded to touch...maybe the reason he's selling....

No offense but no expert exactly. Neither am I but I have a fair idea of most things on bikes and that sounds ridiculous. Rusted headers, Jesus you'd swear the motor has shot a ring. Who cares if the headers have a bit of rust, lad is never going to touch them anyway unless he wants more performance in which case he would buy a better bike instead of sticking new pipes on it.

So what if the studs were corroded? Swap them out for new ones, takes a few hours. Anyway they aren't shot, that's not possible on a few years old bike.

FEid

FEid wrote: »

It is a private sale, and I think it's already a good price. Exactly what you said, I feel like haggling for the headers might push him away...

Mate if it's in Dublin and you want some one to give the bike a once over pm me and I'll meet you

Max Headroom

Max Headroom wrote: »

Fair enough...let us know how he get on with it.....;)

I'm sure he will get on absolutely fine with his slightly rusted headers.

Max Headroom

Jerry Green Dewdrop wrote: »

Mate if it's in Dublin and you want some one to give the bike a once over pm me and I'll meet you

Why waste your time....bike is mint but for his worry over the pipes....:p

Jerry Green Dewdrop wrote: »

I'm sure he will get on absolutely fine with his slightly rusted headers.

Youre right (as usual:p) its the poor bastard that has to change them for him....i've had 30 yo bikes with better looking studs.....youre forgetting these things dont get better if not addressed...

FEid

CJhaughey wrote: »

If you buy it get a big bottle of ACF 50 and after washing it down a few times and copper greasing the studs to the head apply the ACF all over the engine and fasteners anywhere you see white corrosion starting.
If you do this it will hold the corrosion at bay for a lot longer.
I can see paint flaking off the waterpump already so preventative maintenance is a good thing.
There is a guy who does a bike valet and ACF treatment in Dublin AFAIK so it might be worth budgeting for that, its money well spent when it holds the bike finish through winter and into spring.

I'll have a look at that, ACF sounds like a good shout!

FEid

Jerry Green Dewdrop wrote: »

Mate if it's in Dublin and you want some one to give the bike a once over pm me and I'll meet you

I'll keep it in mind dude, thanks a lot for the offer

FEid

Max Headroom wrote: »

Why waste your time....bike is mint but for his worry over the pipes....:p




Youre right (as usual:p) its the poor bastard that has to change them for him....i've had 30 yo bikes with better looking studs.....youre forgetting these things dont get better if not addressed...

Yeah like I'm planning to give them a good scrub down and spray if I do end up getting it, not something I want to keep and allow to get worse

Max Headroom

FEid wrote: »

Yeah like I'm planning to give them a good scrub down and spray if I do end up getting it, not something I want to keep and allow to get worse

Deffo......if poss replace the nuts asap with copper ones..;)

Cienciano

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZXcM6g-JaBo

FEid

Cienciano wrote: »

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZXcM6g-JaBo

Definitely gonna give that a shot, cheers madude

Max Headroom

Cienciano wrote: »

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZXcM6g-JaBo

State of the bike lad....exhausts are the least issue on that bike..those SS pipes would come up the same in 5 years..soap and water would do the same job...

So you got the bike then..??

FEid

Max Headroom wrote: »

State of the bike lad....exhausts are the least issue on that bike..those SS pipes would come up the same in 5 years..soap and water would do the same job...

So you got the bike then..??

I did end up getting it, had to make a decision and took it. I've only had it a day to be honest and I really do like it. Got my mechanic to take a 2nd look and he says that he wouldn't worry about the exhaust its mostly cosmetic, but to replace the bolts as soon as possible in case they seize. Will get on that maybe during the week. Hopefully not seized already...

zubair

Well wear pal!

If you do intend to tackle the bolts sooner rather than later, give them a scrub now in advance and treat them with penetrating oil a few times over the next few days, make sure your wrench has plenty of leverage, you could use a pipe to extend it too. If it all goes well you might find they're fine but it will certainly make changing them easier, add some copper grease to the thread if you decide they're ok.

Cienciano

FEid wrote: »

Definitely gonna give that a shot, cheers madude

Mine came up with a great finish after I did them. I used autosol afterwards, but they were clean after the harpic. Just use loads of water to make sure you get all the harpic off when you're finished, it contains shít that you don't want to leave on your bike long term.