Vacant sites / buildings in city..

Zipppy

Following on frm query re vacant site at luas stop thread...
Anyone know what's happening with Smurfit Mills site on botanic rd and old Royal oak pub site on Finglas Rd?
Also any rumours on Botanic Hse pub redevelopment?

pmcc1

No info on the above, but waiting with bated breath for the redevelopment of the old bank on Doyles Corner.
The planned restaurant, Loretta's, looks like the real thing.
www . dublincity.ie/AnitePublicDocs/00673697.pdf
www . dublincity.ie/AnitePublicDocs/00673696.pdf

Zipppy

pmcc1 wrote:

No info on the above, but waiting with bated breath for the redevelopment of the old bank on Doyles Corner. The planned restaurant, Loretta's, looks like the real thing. www . dublincity.ie/AnitePublicDocs/00673697.pdf www . dublincity.ie/AnitePublicDocs/00673696.pdf

hey...yeah looking forward to that..should be great addition to the area...

Chinasea

What's the story with the huge rotting ex Independent Newspaper Building on Abbey Street. How or way is this sitting festering?

Zipppy

Chinasea wrote:

What's the story with the huge rotting ex Independent Newspaper Building on Abbey Street. How or way is this sitting festering?

Mad..great building in a great location...empty years..


I also see lots of demolition on Dominick St along luas line.old Michael H factory and others being levelled..wonder what's going in..

Peregrinus

Chinasea wrote: »

What's the story with the huge rotting ex Independent Newspaper Building on Abbey Street. How or way is this sitting festering?

Changed hands several times after the Indo moved out, during the property bubble years. At one stage I think it was owned by Arnotts, who had a policy of trying to buy up the whole street, and we know how that ended. I'm not sure who has it now.

NyOmnishambles

Zipppy wrote: »

I also see lots of demolition on Dominick St along luas line.old Michael H factory and others being levelled..wonder what's going in..

Both the Michael H site and the old Arnotts warehouse further up are going to be Purpose built student accommodation

Talk is the Hendron building and site will go the same way

Zipppy

NyOmnishambles wrote:

Both the Michael H site and the old Arnotts warehouse further up are going to be Purpose built student accommodation

NyOmnishambles wrote:

Talk is the Hendron building and site will go the same way

More student accommodation? Ah here...

L1011

Zipppy wrote: »

More student accommodation? Ah here...

Every 4-6 beds in student accommodation releases a "normal" property back to "normal" rental. We have an abject shortage of dedicated student accommodation (proper facilities, fast net, sometimes on the college network, appropriate lease lengths) etc in a city with so many educational institutions. Even 6 beds of student accom doesn't take up much more space than a 2 bed apartment.

Accomodation of all types is not a zero sum game. More hotel rooms and particular aparthotel rooms damages the AirBnB market which will release houses/apartments to proper rentals; more social housing removes people from emergency accom which increases hotel rooms available which (see above)....

wakka12

NyOmnishambles wrote: »

Both the Michael H site and the old Arnotts warehouse further up are going to be Purpose built student accommodation

Talk is the Hendron building and site will go the same way

Is the hendron building not protected? I love it, hopes its not knocked.

Muahahaha

Luckily the vacant site levy is on the way soon so hopefully it will mean building gets going on wasted sites around the city
https://www.rte.ie/news/budget-2018/2017/1010/911250-vacant-site-levy-to-more-than-double-to-7/

The vacant site levy is to be more than doubled, rising from the current 3% rate that applies in the first year to 7% for the second and subsequent years.

The measure, announced in Budget 2018, will mean that any owner of a vacant site on the register who does not develop their land in 2018 will pay the 3% levy in 2019 and then become liable to the increased rate of 7% from 1 January 2019.

If land owners continue to hoard land in 2019, they will pay 7% in 2020, resulting in an effective vacant site levy of 10% over the two years.

These new rules will serve to get things moving or else land hoarders are going to see their assets losing value. Selling land with an annual 7% levy will mean the next owner will want to be getting building straight away.

ixoy

Anyone know what's up with the Outlet Store building on South Great Georges Street? It's been abandoned for ages now. Jaipur, next to it, has been vacated for years now too and I'm guessing it's all under one owner. Why has nothing been done with it? It's an eyesore at this point.

BeerNut

ixoy wrote: »

Anyone know what's up with the Outlet Store building on South Great Georges Street?

Nope. Nobody does, by the looks of things. Here's The Inquirer's enquiry on it a couple of years ago.

JupiterKid

The fact that there are derelict/vacant sites on O’Connell St, our national main urban thoroughfare, should be a source of deep shame.

Mind you, I’m old enough to remember the sheer level of urban blight in inner city Dublin in the 1980s, prior to the urban renewal boom. It was utterly shocking.

Zipppy

JupiterKid wrote:

Mind you, I’m old enough to remember the sheer level of urban blight in inner city Dublin in the 1980s, prior to the urban renewal boom. It was utterly shocking.

So things are much better now....
In time it'll all be good.

wakka12

Zipppy wrote: »

So things are much better now....
In time it'll all be good.

Better than the third world city it was yes
Dublin has been a very wealthy city for decades now so there shouldn't be vacant sites in the CBD, there only is some because of greed /poor planning

Muahahaha

Yes agreed but the forthcoming vacant site levy should make a difference and at the very worst Revenue will be taking income off any developer who is hoarding sites. A developer who does not build by 2021 will have to pay Revenue 17% of the site value. It is a significant sum of money and it should concentrate minds. Plus it seems to be solid legislation- even the Law Society have a derelict site on Benburb St worth 5.2m and they challenged the vacant site levy recently. DCC had earmarked it as unused land and also as suitable for housing and therefore listed it on the Register of Vacant Sites. The Law Society appealed the listing of their land and tried to convince An Bord Plenala that the site was not in a ruinous or neglected condition. Their appeal was rejected and they face levies from Jan 2019 onwards.

So with any hope other developers will see how the Law Society failed in their bid to be removed from the Vacant Site Register and either get building or get selling.

The register can be seen here. http://www.dublincity.ie/sites/default/files/content/Planning/Documents/VacantSitesRegister.pdf
If you click into the reference number on each listing it will bring you to a map with the site clearly shown

JupiterKid wrote: »

The fact that there are derelict/vacant sites on O’Connell St, our national main urban thoroughfare, should be a source of deep shame.

I presume you are thinking the old Carlton cinema and surrounds? That site is the developer Joe OReilly and has been added to the vacant sites register. IIRC he got a 10 year extension to planning permission sometime around 2010 but he still has not built on it, possibly using the court case on Moore Street as an excuse not to. Map of the site here http://www.dublincity.ie/LocationPublisher/default.aspx?topicname=Planning&Featureid=VS-0098

BeerNut wrote: »

Nope. Nobody does, by the looks of things. Here's The Inquirer's enquiry on it a couple of years ago.

That site has been added to the register here http://www.dublincity.ie/LocationPublisher/default.aspx?topicname=Planning&Featureid=VS-0113 Gosram Properties Ltd are listed as the owner

Another one on the register is Aldi owning a site near Premier Square in Finglas, I guess they are planning a supermarket there and them being added to the Vacant Sites Register should speed that up. The register also shows large parcels of land in Ashtown & Royal Canal Park as well as the vacant John Players site on South Circular Road.

VonLuck

There's another site in a prime location on Richmond Street which has been vacant for a long long time: https://goo.gl/maps/d4zdJo1Fy8y

It's an absolute eyesore. I know there were some art installations there occasionally, but I don't think that should qualify it from being off the vacant site register.

wakka12

Theres a plan for it

Oakmount Construction

I like the black brick. Quite refreshing really

But yeh it looks absolutely dreadful the way it is and combined with the derelict social housing and the kind of ruin-y looking bernard shaw the whole street looks a wreck

VonLuck

wakka12 wrote: »

I like the black brick. Quite refreshing really

But yeh it looks absolutely dreadful the way it is and combined with the derelict social housing and the kind of ruin-y looking bernard shaw the whole street looks a wreck

I see that site is under construction, but the one I was talking about is around the corner, on the same street as Aussie BBQ.

It's surprising the area has so many derelict buildings/sites seeing as it has a lot of footfall. There was supposed to be a Wetherspoons on the same street but that's been in the pipeline for a long while and no signs of it happening. Must be something I'm missing.

Zipppy

and now we'll have a vacant Waltons site to view as well

wakka12

VonLuck wrote: »

I see that site is under construction, but the one I was talking about is around the corner, on the same street as Aussie BBQ.

It's surprising the area has so many derelict buildings/sites seeing as it has a lot of footfall. There was supposed to be a Wetherspoons on the same street but that's been in the pipeline for a long while and no signs of it happening. Must be something I'm missing.

Oh right sorry didn't even look at your link just assumed it was that when i heard you say richmond street
Yeh just another big gaping hole in dublin!
Yeh I hope the wetherspoons happens soon. some of the georgian buildings it was supposed to occupy are really nice looking but in bad condition and they bring down the street in the condition they are in now

BeerNut

wakka12 wrote: »

Yeh I hope the wetherspoons happens soon

Opening 2019, according to the company magazine. There was a light on inside the other day, if that means anything

NyOmnishambles

wakka12 wrote: »

Is the hendron building not protected? I love it, hopes its not knocked.

I would hope so
I only found out recently how old it is, I had always assumed it was built in more modern times, it is a big site so I wouldn't be surprised to see something done there though

wakka12

NyOmnishambles wrote: »

I would hope so
I only found out recently how old it is, I had always assumed it was built in more modern times, it is a big site so I wouldn't be surprised to see something done there though

How old is it? It looks like early modern to me like 1920's or 30's

NyOmnishambles

wakka12 wrote: »

How old is it? It looks like early modern to me like 1920's or 30's

I remember seeing a black and white photo of the area (probably from a thread here on Boards), taken from Constitution hill looking back up to the Hendrons site, I assumed it was early 1900's (the photo, not the building) and showed that there was a building occupying the site

So in my mind for some reason the Hendron building seems a lot older but it seems construction started in 1945-46 and went on in stages for many years

The building isn't much to look at but it houses a rabbit warren of artists/small business's that might struggle to find a home elsewhere so for that reason i would prefer to see it used as is, though maintained better, than turned into student accommodation

L1011

1946 according to this

All that's protected on that end of Dominick Street is a few houses and Cumiskey's pub

optogirl

Zipppy wrote: »

More student accommodation? Ah here...

Honestly - why they think shoving students in shoeboxes is going to help I don't know. Surely it would be better for all if they built family homes that can also be used for students. Students, in my experience, prefer a houseshare over a bedsit/single unit & it's surely better for their mental health & development to learn how to live with people and all the fun & responsibility that brings with it.

L1011

Most of these *are* communal units - they're bedrooms with ensuites and otherwise shared facilities. They usually have a small number of fully self contained for those who specifically want that

Families dislike living beside student rentals. Proper student accommodation will free up family homes elsewhere nearby

delta_bravo

Had a skim of that register. I'm very suprised the vacant building that lies at the junction of Townsend St and Lombard Street isn't there. It has been in ruins for over 10 years

ollaetta

delta_bravo wrote: »

Had a skim of that register. I'm very suprised the vacant building that lies at the junction of Townsend St and Lombard Street isn't there. It has been in ruins for over 10 years

Only speculating but it might be to do with the size of it. To be included in that register a site must exceed 0.05 of a hectare.

Teyla Emmagan

wakka12 wrote:

But yeh it looks absolutely dreadful the way it is and combined with the derelict social housing and the kind of ruin-y looking bernard shaw the whole street looks a wreck

I love the ruiny looking Bernard Shaw : -)

Zipppy

Whats going in where Break for the border used to be?

VonLuck

wakka12 wrote: »

Is the hendron building not protected? I love it, hopes its not knocked.

I'm all for protecting buildings with some historic or architectural value, but in all honesty, what does it bring to the area? It's a fairly bland industrial building in a prime area that could do with some development.

Am I missing something?

wakka12

VonLuck wrote: »

I'm all for protecting buildings with some historic or architectural value, but in all honesty, what does it bring to the area? It's a fairly bland industrial building in a prime area that could do with some development.

Am I missing something?

Each to their own I suppose, I think its a very interesting and aesthetically pleasing looking building, and a breath of fresh air from the bland glass boxes that every modern building seems to be

But I suppose if it had merit it'd be protected though.

Spanish Eyes

Ormond Quay is a dilapidated disaster. City centre, Luas next door, wtaf. That hotel has been vacant since Adam was a boy.

And DCC is across the way looking at it every day too. Shakes head.

odyssey06

L1011 wrote: »

Families dislike living beside student rentals. Proper student accommodation will free up family homes elsewhere nearby

True but it would count double if foresight had been shown and instead of ramming more students into Dublin City... places like Athlone could have been expanded.

Muahahaha

Spanish Eyes wrote: »

Ormond Quay is a dilapidated disaster. City centre, Luas next door, wtaf. That hotel has been vacant since Adam was a boy.

And DCC is across the way looking at it every day too. Shakes head.

Yeah the Ormond Hotel is an eyesore at this stage. AFAIK the whole building cannot be saved but the facade has to be preserved. Which begs questions of the council about how they are letting developers sit on buildings to the point that they virtually fall down. Further down the quay you also have the former Zanzibar/Bondi beach Club. Must be at least 2,000sqm in size and its just sitting there shut for several years. DCC themselves state on their website that:-

The Derelict Sites Act defines a derelict site as any land that “detracts, or is likely to detract, to a material degree from the amenity, character or appearance of land in the neighbourhood of the land in question because of ”:

Structures which are in a ruinous, derelict or dangerous condition, or
The neglected, unsightly or objectionable condition of the land or of structures on it, or
The presence, deposit or collection of litter, rubbish, debris or waste

DCCs register for Derelict Sites (as opposed to the Vacant Sites Register) is here
http://www.dublincity.ie/sites/default/files/content/waterwasteenvironment/derelictsites/pages/DerelictSites.pdf

wakka12

Ormond hotel is being completely demolished, facade isn't protected, I think it was beyond the point of saving



https://www.dublinlive.ie/news/iconic-ormond-hotel-knocked-down-13023906

Cant say its a big loss the new building looks just as good if not better



Bondi club also has planned redevelopment..sorry couldn't find the render.but its being converted into an aparthotel, and several setbacks are being built on top of it

ollaetta

wakka12 wrote: »

Ormond hotel is being completely demolished, facade isn't protected, I think it was beyond the point of saving

Didn't stop some head the balls trying to have the facade protected due to links with James Joyce. Completely ignored the fact that the current facade dates from a 1930s expansion rather than the much smaller hotel which would have been there at the time of Ulysses.

miamee

It's a wonder more people haven't helped themselves to the granite on the facade of Ormond Hotel, there's already a sizeable chunk of it missing. I don't know how they managed it tbh! The planned new building looks fairly bland but it'll be an improvement on the empty wreck that's there now. Does it make me very old that I remember when the hotel was still open?

L1011

miamee wrote: »

It's a wonder more people haven't helped themselves to the granite on the facade of Ormond Hotel, there's already a sizeable chunk of it missing. I don't know how they managed it tbh! The planned new building looks fairly bland but it'll be an improvement on the empty wreck that's there now. Does it make me very old that I remember when the hotel was still open?

The missing bits were, mostly, done deliberately to check what was beneath the render and prove that it is actually mostly a 1930s building and hence not the building from Ulysses.

odyssey06

Should we really be even thinkin about saving a facade just cos it was mentioned in a famous book??? I dont want lose buildings of genuine importance or beauty or significance but I hardly think Mr Joyce would turn in his grave ...

L1011

odyssey06 wrote: »

Should we really be even thinkin about saving a facade just cos it was mentioned in a famous book??? I dont want lose buildings of genuine importance or beauty or significance but I hardly think Mr Joyce would turn in his grave ...

Joycean tourism is huge - however, which is more useful for Joycean tourism, an operating hotel with bar, restaurant etc or a rotting closed down one? Think its pretty obvious...

miamee

L1011 wrote: »

The missing bits were, mostly, done deliberately to check what was beneath the render and prove that it is actually mostly a 1930s building and hence not the building from Ulysses.

That makes more sense, it was disappearing in odd shaped chunks but I just looked at a photo of it there and it looks more uniform now that it's stopped.

I've attached the image but not embedded it cos it's huge. I left it big for the details. Taken April 2017.

wakka12

L1011 wrote: »

Joycean tourism is huge - however, which is more useful for Joycean tourism, an operating hotel with bar, restaurant etc or a rotting closed down one? Think its pretty obvious...

Part of the planning conditions is that the new hotel has 'joycean themes' , not sure what that particularly might entail but interesting I suppose, if anyone hadn't heard

Chinasea

20180313_135503.jpg

This is just an example of a centrally located abandoned prime site.

Was quoted €367.00 for a one night stay in the Spencer hotel mid May.

Bonkers.

Muahahaha

Where is that one ?

L1011

Muahahaha wrote: »

Where is that one ?

Former Plough pub, corner of Lower Abbey Street and Marlborough Street.

Was semi-derelict when it was open too!

Muahahaha

Jaysis it looks a complete mess. Wonder if it is on the Derelict Sites register? If not it should be

Zipppy

Work has started on Smurfit site on Botanic rd...apparently planned park and retail not being built now?