Green fees: how do we stop the golf consultants ruining golf?

golfguy1

FixdePitchmark wrote: »

50 to 100 euro

Being generous at the 100 end. But would have no issue with 100 euro.

Do u not think it's unfair on the best courses in the country having to reduce their rate by 50-75%
What would u do with the cheap courses would u still want a 50-75% reduction.
Take dungarvan golf club in Waterford for example
Their current rate in €20. Do u also think they should give golf to gui members for €5-€10

lawred2

wonder was €150 in the OP the cost for a fully formed 4 ball? i.e. about 35 quid each

I've seen courses not wanting lads heading out on their todd over the weekend

FixdePitchmark

golfguy1 wrote: »

Do u not think it's unfair on the best courses in the country having to reduce their rate by 50-75%
What would u do with the cheap courses would u still want a 50-75% reduction.
Take dungarvan golf club in Waterford for example
Their current rate in €20. Do u also think they should give golf to gui members for €5-€10

They should put the price up.

There is a problem at the other end with people expecting golf at ridiculously low rates. Below 20 euro for any round is a joke.

Another group that go around like lords and almost expect free golf are senior players.

To show I'm not a total loony lefty. I'd ban senior events. It is ageist. I've seen a few senior opens at 45 euro for a 4 ball :eek: Total bandits too

Royal Dublin have opens - but only for senior players. Comical stuff.

You then have other lads who just jump onto courses and play for free. :eek:

I see your logic of argument - but 20 euro to 300 euro is some leap in logic.

golfguy1

I see your logic of argument - but 20 euro to 300 euro is some leap in logic.[/quote]

Totally agree with all you said. But surely it has to be the same rules/discount for all courses and not just the ones we all want to play

FixdePitchmark

golfguy1 wrote: »

I see your logic of argument - but 20 euro to 300 euro is some leap in logic.

Totally agree with all you said. But surely it has to be the same rules/discount for all courses and not just the ones we all want to play[/QUOTE]

But there is a discount for 95 % of courses in the country

An Open.

Hoboo

FixdePitchmark wrote: »

Totally agree with all you said. But surely it has to be the same rules/discount for all courses and not just the ones we all want to play

But there is a discount for 95 % of courses in the country

An Open.[/QUOTE]

True. But why have an open at €50 a head when you can charge a fourball €1000? Why have 160 people on a course when you can have 40 for the same fees? Add to that less damage and wear to the course, less overheads with staffing, and in all probability more spend in the pro shop with expensive souvenirs and not just a crested marker, not to mention food and drink other than a soup and sandwich and a pint.

I agree it would be great to have access to the best courses now and again, but from a business perspective, it makes no sense. If it did, then it would be done.

Webbs

Hoboo wrote: »

But there is a discount for 95 % of courses in the country

An Open.

True. But why have an open at €50 a head when you can charge a fourball €1000? Why have 160 people on a course when you can have 40 for the same fees? Add to that less damage and wear to the course, less overheads with staffing, and in all probability more spend in the pro shop with expensive souvenirs and not just a crested marker, not to mention food and drink other than a soup and sandwich and a pint.

I agree it would be great to have access to the best courses now and again, but from a business perspective, it makes no sense. If it did, then it would be done.[/QUOTE]

Surely the top courses would have way more staff in way of greenkeepers etc. for example Adare has 50 greenkeepers on its staff!!

Hoboo

Webbs wrote: »

True. But why have an open at €50 a head when you can charge a fourball €1000? Why have 160 people on a course when you can have 40 for the same fees? Add to that less damage and wear to the course, less overheads with staffing, and in all probability more spend in the pro shop with expensive souvenirs and not just a crested marker, not to mention food and drink other than a soup and sandwich and a pint.

I agree it would be great to have access to the best courses now and again, but from a business perspective, it makes no sense. If it did, then it would be done.

Surely the top courses would have way more staff in way of greenkeepers etc. for example Adare has 50 greenkeepers on its staff!![/QUOTE]

They do. And thats to keep the place in pristine condition without having the level of damage an Open would bring compared to exclusive green fees. Moreover their time can be better utilised rather than fixing pitchmarks and divots from 160 people rather than 40.

Id love to play these courses all the time too but its entirely up to a private club to set their prices, and manage the level of use.

(This is all just opinion btw, could be completely wrong!)

thewobbler

50 Greenkeepers?

I read somewhere that Troon have 17, and maybe twice that during the Open Championshio.

I’m not saying you’re wrong, but if they’ve 50 men looking after their golf course there’d be no room for golfers on the course.

——

As the OP I’ll stress again that I’ve no problem with the market dictating green fee rates. Whether we can afford it or not, or are willing to pay it but, €200 is a gift of a price for a bucket list course, and that’s pretty much the max rate in ireland.

Where my issue was and is, is when clubs in the middle range of the market implement a pricing strategy that is clearly insane. Seapoint would no doubt want to be seen as an elite links. But it isn’t. It may want to ride on the coat tails of Baltray and turn Drogheda into an overnight stop for Americans. But it’s not far enough away from Dublin, I would believe, for this to be a pull. Americans operate on a vast scale would consider Baltray and RCD to be neighbours.

So I believe they’ll always be dependent on the Irish market to generate green fee income. And pricing a 4-ball at €600 in february will not help them attract that market.

Hoboo

thewobbler wrote: »

50 Greenkeepers?

I read somewhere that Troon have 17, and maybe twice that during the Open Championshio.

I’m not saying you’re wrong, but if they’ve 50 men looking after their golf course there’d be no room for golfers on the course.

——

As the OP I’ll stress again that I’ve no problem with the market dictating green fee rates. Whether we can afford it or not, or are willing to pay it but, €200 is a gift of a price for a bucket list course, and that’s pretty much the max rate in ireland.

Where my issue was and is, is when clubs in the middle range of the market implement a pricing strategy that is clearly insane. Seapoint would no doubt want to be seen as an elite links. But it isn’t. It may want to ride on the coat tails of Baltray and turn Drogheda into an overnight stop for Americans. But it’s not far enough away from Dublin, I would believe, for this to be a pull. Americans operate on a vast scale would consider Baltray and RCD to be neighbours.

So I believe they’ll always be dependent on the Irish market to generate green fee income. And pricing a 4-ball at €600 in february will not help them attract that market.

Agreed. Ive yet to see that price at Seapoint, had a look after your OP and couldn't find anything but I don't doubt you and it wouldn't surprise me. Baltray possibly had a bus load in around the same time and gave them the heads up? Im just guessing.

Played it a few weeks ago in an open fourball, €30pp it was a sloppy mess. How it calls itself is a links is nothing short of fraud, the last 4 holes are fantastic, a few ok holes beforehand, but the rest is poor parkland. Went in to get some grub afterwards, no kitchen, just some sandwiches delivered that morning, and a bowl of soup (both of which were crap). Other than our four ball, and the barman, it was empty. Not good, and certainly not worth €15 never mind €150.

RoadRunner

Never played seapoint & know nothing about them. Many businesses will experiment with pricing to help find the correct pricing model. For most it's foolish to not even try. New websites such as teetimes are an excellent way for courses to do this. Even if zero greenfees went for that high price, great knowledge can still be gained by them. They may know, with actual data, the max price point people will pay for their product. Perhaps they sold a few greenfees at that price, and they might be able to analyse whether high fees but lower traffic is a better model for them.

If you just simply ask people what they'd pay, the data you get is not reliable. Look through this exact thread to see how polarisingly opposite the opinions are of the people here and we are all from the same subset of potential customers! :eek: