Duty free cigarettes on sale on moore st

Dr Brown

I can't walk down moore st street without being offered duty free cigarettes and I don't even smoke.

I wonder why the authorities don't clamp down on this of activity ?

Have those in power being paid off to turn a blind eye to the illegal sale of duty free cigarettes ?

Snotty

They turn a blind eye to a lot worse crimes than illegal cigarettes.
The only victims are the state coffers so I can't see the guards being overly bothered.

fritzelly

Maybe they think it's a self policing situation - if you've ever bought them you will never do it again. Or they expect the customers to be all killed off very quickly

Atlantic Dawn

A blind eye is turned for the Salt O'de Earths so to speak, it's like the way diesel laundering was let go in the northern counties, it increases the peace especially in an election year.

SuperSean11

Reads like an advertisement, how many free cigarettes ye getting OP

KungPao

The Man wants the poor to die quicker. Dodgy cigs made primarily of arsenic, asbestos and diesel, and with pretend filters is a good way to do it.

Same with this minimum alcohol rubbish. The poverty stricken will be homemaking poison and keel over in no time.

Get that SW bill down.

Snotty

KungPao wrote: »

arsenic, asbestos and diesel.

So better ingredients than the genuine ones??

Outlaw Pete

Seen them arrested many many times over the last few years but for whatever reason the same folks are back selling within hours.

I note the people that you give the money to NEVER give you the cigarettes and so perhaps they have a well oiled loophole that they exploit and have it down to a fine art.

JenovaProject

Great bargains to be had down d'market.

Fr_Dougal

How much does a carton go for these days?

OldMrBrennan83

This post has been deleted.

Roger_007

When Brexit kicks in, will the duty-free fags be available on the ferries like in the auld days?

MilesMorales1

They are not duty free, they are dodgy fake cigs.

Years ago, I bought a pack off them for a fiver, but they didn't taste right when I was smoking them, and my mate agreed, and he actually ripped one open, and inside it was no tobacco at all except at the front where you'd light it, it was black sludge kinda like oil.

B.A._Baracus

So let me get this straight op...
- You don't smoke.
- See people selling illegal cheaper smokes so want to spoil the fun for everyone.

But of course if they were selling dirt cheap illegal sky sports subscriptions instead you wouldn't have an issue. Ffs.

BillyBobBS

Some people have little to worry about to be honest.

dr.fuzzenstein

The government created a very lucrative market for fake cigs by raising the tax to stupidly high levels.
This will have several knock-on effects.

- Less tax take for the state coffers, since certainly no duty or tax is paid on these
- More expenses for the health service which won't be covered by above tax takes
- More long term illness and deaths caused by those cancer sticks
- Millions needing to be pumped into border security and policing to combat smuggling and criminal gangs
- The rise of immensly rich and powerful gangs
- More gang violence and the inevitable fallout as the odd innocent bystander gets either hit by stray bullets or killed by mistake.

The problem is that the Irish government is incapable of coming up with other solutions than tax and ban. When those don't work, just repeat until they do work. Which they won't. Then stand around, wring their hands and say "Why isn't this working?!" Then rinse and repeat.
So when finally the state is under siege from crime gangs more powerful than it's own enforcement agencies, when the health service is under severe pressure, when gangs run riot and normal, everyday anti-social behaviour by scumbags is all but ignored by the police and the billions spent on useless enforcement, border control and a failing health service are not even nearly enough, one could only hope that the governemnt will see how utterly wrong and shambolic their approach is, but I suspect they will rather ban smoking in even more places and increase the price of a packet of fags to €20.
They will then stand around, wring theirhands and say "Why isn't this working?!" Then rinse and repeat...

Of course when this is pointed out, there will be a lot of huffing and puffing, folded arms, pointed fngers and references to internation studies, consultant's reports and "international best practice". The problem is that politicians see U-turns as signs of weakness. So you MUST prevail with the current course, even if it is wrong, idiotic, useless and even more damaging than doing anything else or even nothing.
For this post I am neither pro nor anti smoking. I stopped smoking myself and I certainly think that not smoking is better than smoking.
But berating people, taxing them to the hilt and parading smug assholes such as Luke Clancy to belittle and ridicule smokers is certainly not helpful.
In fact it contributed to me smoking for at least 5 years longer than I otherwise had. And I was proud of the fact that I bought all my tobacco abroad for very little money and the Irish exchequer gained nothing from me. But it was all technically legal and above board.
But one would have to be pretty desperate to smoke fake Chinese fags.

suicide_circus

^^^^ a perfect summary of government in Ireland. Not a shred of imagination, innovation, forward planning or courage to be different.

Dr Brown

Snotty wrote: »

They turn a blind eye to a lot worse crimes than illegal cigarettes.
The only victims are the state coffers so I can't see the guards being overly bothered.

I'd say the gardas must be getting backhanders from the cig dealers on moore st to turn a blind eye.

Cee-Jay-Cee

They’re not duty-free! They’re illegally smuggled cigarettes from Eastern Europe and China. At least with duty free cigarettes your getting the genuine article albeit without the duty having being paid but with the smuggled cheap smokes you haven’t a clue what your actually buying. I watched some exposé programme on them a while back and the people behind the manufacturer of these cigarettes can and will copy any genuine cigarette packet design right down to the customs seal on the back of them.

Dr Crayfish

Who sells them anyway? The same people selling knock off stuff?

MilesMorales1

Dr Crayfish wrote: »

Who sells them anyway? The same people selling knock off stuff?

Yeah. Or rather, those people standing there that yell 'CIGARETTES, TOBACCO' over and over. They couldn't possibly be selling dodgy cigarettes could they.

Wheety

The stalls on Henry Street at Christmas are awful. Selling knock off stuff too and yet they get their licence every year. Because it's tradition.

They're an eye sore.

boombang

I think the situation is embarrassing. It shows the authorities can't implement the law and it panders to criminals.

Regarding the Henry Street stalls: there's been a while thread on those.

Get Real

Outlaw Pete wrote: »

Seen them arrested many many times over the last few years but for whatever reason the same folks are back selling within hours.

^Exactly this.

Arrests are being made. But those people are back out on the streets. People really, really need to sit in on court at the ccj in their free time. It's open to all citizens to watch.

Firstly, if you look at crimes like selling tobacco, assaults, thefts, criminal damage, burglary. Those people show up, it's 5 minutes, then are bailed to appear in court again on another date. There may be 3 or 4 dates for one case. So it could be months or a year before any consequences (if any) are felt. In the meantime, these people are just back out and about.

In this article from 1997: A man was fined 1,600 Irish Pounds for selling smuggled cigarettes. https://www.irishtimes.com/news/1-600-fine-for-illegal-sale-of-cigarettes-1.115357?mode=amp it was his second offence of doing this.

In 2016, more recent times, a man was caught selling smuggled cigarettes. He had 43 previous convictions. He was not fined, and received a suspended sentence of 6 months. Meaning for that crime, he walked out free, no prison time, no fine.https://amp.independent.ie/regionals/fingalindependent/news/man-caught-selling-illegal-cigarettes-34657382.html

There's huge focus in the media and during elections on crime stats and resources. They are still lacking. But you could double the budget and it would be pointless if at the end of the system there are no real consequences for actual offenders with 43 previous convictions.

RasTa

Garda are down there sometimes. I went to buy some tobacco and didn't realise the person standing beside her was an undercover Garda.

I did ask her for some but he didn't say anything. He must have confiscated 5 packs off her so not sure if it's worth the time putting her in front of a judge.

Flandria is ok, Belgian stuff. Mostly immigrants buying stuff on Moore street these days, fruit+veg and fish including the smokes.

The Irish have become too posh.

Dakota Dan

SuperSean11 wrote: »

Reads like an advertisement, how many free cigarettes ye getting OP

They have been selling cheap tobacco in Moore st since the great flood. I thought everyone knew that unless you just dropped out of the sky.

rgodard80a

Last year Fianna Fail TD Declan Breathnach proposed that when people buying those cigarettes/alcohol/solid fuels were caught, they would be fined €100.

Can't post a link, but search for "Proposed new law could see fines in place for those who buy illegal cigarettes and alcohol on the black market" from thesun.ie

Much like fining people who use prositutes, turn the fines around the other way.

Dakota Dan

rgodard80a wrote: »

Last year Fianna Fail TD Declan Breathnach proposed that when people buying those cigarettes/alcohol/solid fuels were caught, they would be fined €100.

Can't post a link, but search for "Proposed new law could see fines in place for those who buy illegal cigarettes and alcohol on the black market" from thesun.ie

Much like fining people who use prositutes, turn the fines around the other way.

€100, that will deter them alright, it would take a long time to save that on cigeratte taxes. They put out some other nonsense that illegal cigarettes were poisonous, sure the heavily taxed one aren't.

Dr Crayfish

Why don't they just dock their dole for a year or so? Same if you're selling knock offs. Or maybe that would just people commit more crimes like this. It's kind of annoying that some people are above the law though.

boombang

Get Real wrote: »

People really, really need to sit in on court at the ccj in their free time. It's open to all citizens to watch.

I thought this an interesting post. Much of what I hear about law and is implementation makes me think it is not being run for the common good. So much seems inefficient and lacking. Where's the drive to so things right?

Phil.x

Dr Brown wrote: »

I can't walk down moore st street without being offered duty free cigarettes and I don't even smoke.

I wonder why the authorities don't clamp down on this of activity ?

Have those in power being paid off to turn a blind eye to the illegal sale of duty free cigarettes ?

If you were born in Dublin it's part of your heritage.

thereality

Snotty wrote: »

They turn a blind eye to a lot worse crimes than illegal cigarettes.
The only victims are the state coffers so I can't see the guards being overly bothered.

Do you not think container loads of cigarettes coming into the likes of Dublin Port are not being funded by serious organised crime? Apparently gangs have moved from drugs to cigarettes, as cigs are highly profitable and the prison sentences are a lot lighter

Do you think Revenue should have turned a blind eye to diesel laundering by allegedly carried out by the IRA as there was more serious things to focus on?

I would hazard a guess that Rita selling counterfeit cigs on Moore St is on the scratcher too.

A packet of cigarettes is about 75-80% tax. It is costing the taxpayer a fortune between lost tax revenue and the scumbags selling it likely on welfare(I doubt someone is giving up potential paid employment to sell cigarettes)

wawaman

Dr Brown wrote: »

I can't walk down moore st street without being offered duty free cigarettes and I don't even smoke.

I wonder why the authorities don't clamp down on this of activity ?

Have those in power being paid off to turn a blind eye to the illegal sale of duty free cigarettes ?

Believe it or not but a lot of action is taken. It’s ultimately pointless tho because when the sellers go to court the maximum fine they get is a couple of hundred euro. The same applies to the people caught bringing them in from abroad, it’s worth the risk to them of having 5 people bringing them in with the knowledge that if one person is caught it’s only a few hundred euro they are down and they will make that back in an hour on Moore street.

boombang

wawaman wrote: »

Believe it or not but a lot of action is taken. It’s ultimately pointless tho because when the sellers go to court the maximum fine they get is a couple of hundred euro. The same applies to the people caught bringing them in from abroad, it’s worth the risk to them of having 5 people bringing them in with the knowledge that if one person is caught it’s only a few hundred euro they are down and they will make that back in an hour on Moore street.

If this is the case then the Guards and Revenue should seek to have the fines increased. It drives me crazy that people know what the problems are, but don't apply pressure to change the system. At the very least they should speak up to get media to put the pressure on politicians to sort it.

I can think of some analogy whereby we can imagine how long Holland would have lasted if every Dutch person who spotted a leak in a dyke just shrugged and went on their way (I don't really know if dykes spring leaks).

Fann Linn

boombang wrote: »

If this is the case then the Guards and Revenue should seek to have the fines increased. It drives me crazy that people know what the problems are, but don't apply pressure to change the system. At the very least they should speak up to get media to put the pressure on politicians to sort it.

I can think of some analogy whereby we can imagine how long Holland would have lasted if every Dutch person who spotted a leak in a dyke just shrugged and went on their way (I don't really know if dykes spring leaks).

I know some dykes who spring leaks and the ain't Dutch either.

imme

There used to be a coterie of older ladies plying their wares in this endeavor at the ILAC entrance on Moore Street.

I recently entered the ILAC by this door and was struck by a younger man with great diction offering the same service.

I was struck by that.

Its not exactly the problem of our age OP but is wrong on many levels.

Wheety

boombang wrote: »

I think the situation is embarrassing. It shows the authorities can't implement the law and it panders to criminals.

Regarding the Henry Street stalls: there's been a while thread on those.

Just realised, I started that thread 2 years ago. I guess I really don't like those stalls

myshirt

Wait until the op finds out what's for sale on Meath Street!

imme

myshirt wrote: »

Wait until the op finds out what's for sale on Meath Street!

?

you have to tell us now

mikemac2

The genuine black maket cigarettes are “da illegals”
The fake made in some third world back street factory are “da illegal illegals.”

Was all explained by man of the people Joe Duffy

Dr Brown

imme wrote: »

?

you have to tell us now

"Head shop" drugs.

tracey turnblad

I’ve seen revenue or customs I can’t rememeber which one, in moore st a few times. They wear high vis vests when they are down there so the sellers just move away and return when they go

Dick Rimmington

the problem which needs to be addressed is the extortionate price of cigarettes/tobacco.
you can either go and pay around 17 euro for 30g of tobacco in the shops OR you can get a 50g pack for nearly a fiver less in the likes of moore st.
if youre on a budget and the 'fake' ones taste fine then its a no-brainer. im sure a lot people would rather buy them at the shops if they werent so expensive, much more convenient too depending on where youre living.

BillyBobBS

Dr Crayfish wrote: »

Why don't they just dock their dole for a year or so? Same if you're selling knock offs. Or maybe that would just people commit more crimes like this. It's kind of annoying that some people are above the law though.

You've proof of course these people are on the dole?

andekwarhola

Duty Free is one way of describing them. I guess.

Dr Crayfish

BillyBobBS wrote: »

You've proof of course these people are on the dole?

Oh will you just give it over seriously

5starpool

dr.fuzzenstein wrote: »

The government created a very lucrative market for fake cigs by raising the tax to stupidly high levels.
This will have several knock-on effects.

- Less tax take for the state coffers, since certainly no duty or tax is paid on these
- More expenses for the health service which won't be covered by above tax takes
- More long term illness and deaths caused by those cancer sticks
- Millions needing to be pumped into border security and policing to combat smuggling and criminal gangs
- The rise of immensly rich and powerful gangs
- More gang violence and the inevitable fallout as the odd innocent bystander gets either hit by stray bullets or killed by mistake.

The problem is that the Irish government is incapable of coming up with other solutions than tax and ban. When those don't work, just repeat until they do work. Which they won't. Then stand around, wring their hands and say "Why isn't this working?!" Then rinse and repeat.
So when finally the state is under siege from crime gangs more powerful than it's own enforcement agencies, when the health service is under severe pressure, when gangs run riot and normal, everyday anti-social behaviour by scumbags is all but ignored by the police and the billions spent on useless enforcement, border control and a failing health service are not even nearly enough, one could only hope that the governemnt will see how utterly wrong and shambolic their approach is, but I suspect they will rather ban smoking in even more places and increase the price of a packet of fags to €20.
They will then stand around, wring theirhands and say "Why isn't this working?!" Then rinse and repeat...

Of course when this is pointed out, there will be a lot of huffing and puffing, folded arms, pointed fngers and references to internation studies, consultant's reports and "international best practice". The problem is that politicians see U-turns as signs of weakness. So you MUST prevail with the current course, even if it is wrong, idiotic, useless and even more damaging than doing anything else or even nothing.
For this post I am neither pro nor anti smoking. I stopped smoking myself and I certainly think that not smoking is better than smoking.
But berating people, taxing them to the hilt and parading smug assholes such as Luke Clancy to belittle and ridicule smokers is certainly not helpful.
In fact it contributed to me smoking for at least 5 years longer than I otherwise had. And I was proud of the fact that I bought all my tobacco abroad for very little money and the Irish exchequer gained nothing from me. But it was all technically legal and above board.
But one would have to be pretty desperate to smoke fake Chinese fags.

So you smoked for 5 years just to spite some people? That's clever.

What other solution would you put in place that has had lots of success elsewhere?

dr.fuzzenstein

5starpool wrote: »

So you smoked for 5 years just to spite some people? That's clever.

What other solution would you put in place that has had lots of success elsewhere?

Quite honestly a health warning should be put on people like Luke Clancy, this man can give you ear cancer.
Along the same lines is Grainne Condon if anyone remembers her. You'd need a joint after listening to her for 5 minutes.
Getting rid of smug assholes on the anti smoking side would be a good start. And I say this as an ex smoker.
Just picture a vegan preaching at you every day that meat is murder and we are savages for eating burgers and bacon. Grating people's nerves is certainly not a great strategy.

Hector Bellend

Dont smoke. STFU

5starpool

dr.fuzzenstein wrote: »

Quite honestly a health warning should be put on people like Luke Clancy, this man can give you ear cancer.
Along the same lines is Grainne Condon if anyone remembers her. You'd need a joint after listening to her for 5 minutes.
Getting rid of smug assholes on the anti smoking side would be a good start. And I say this as an ex smoker.
Just picture a vegan preaching at you every day that meat is murder and we are savages for eating burgers and bacon. Grating people's nerves is certainly not a great strategy.

That doesn't answer anything. I have no idea who those people are, so it is very easy to avoid them it seems, but to spite them (without them knowing or caring about you specifically) is a silly reason to smoke when you'd otherwise give them up as you said.

I'd like to hear your ideas for better systems which would work in tandem with making prices cheaper for people.

I am not saying this should be done, but I don't get why governments who say they don't want people to smoke at all don't just ban cigarettes entirely? Yes, they don't want to lose tax revenue, blah, blah, blah, but given the aims of having no one smoke (unrealistic) surely the best way to do that is to ban them?

Illegal smuggling will increase, yes, but this isn't a reason, it is a consequence. Government policy should be that they don't care who smokes, bu they are going to charge them excessively for it.

dr.fuzzenstein

Luke and Grainne were around quite a while ago.
I'm pointing out the effects of current government policy and pricing of cigarettes. Can't give you any more than that. And as laid out, the policy can't be reversed even if they wanted to.