Kids on Flights

omagh776

Saw this on Facebook.

I've experienced a similar situation on a Transavia Flight, Child was acting out in a similar way, one person with Tinnitus was crying from the high pitched screaming (I wouldn't even know how to describe noise) and another women was given a brown bag and had to sit in the jump seat as far away from the child as possible (fear of flying she was trying to get past and she started hyperventilating)

Child was wearing a crash helmet and smashing it's head off the window of the plane and the seats (I think that's what started to freak out the woman with the fear of flying)

Why would you subject yourself ,a 3 year old Autistic Child, a 22 months old baby and an 8 year old to a 3 hour flight.

Do people not realise it's a small pressurised metal tube shared with a bunch of strangers with no opportunity to get off.

If theres a risk of this happening would it not be better to travel by personal transport (car) or something with more space (train/ferry) ?

eviltwin

I'd rather put myself through a three hours flight with the child than an overnight ferry.

osarusan

The child would probably suffer a lot more if they tried to travel to Spain by car. Directly at least.


Kids on flights can be painful, but I'd have a lot of sympathy for them, and their parents, if there is a genuine condition/fear/etc involved and the parents are doing their best to keep the child at ease.

Letting people act the maggot, child (running round the place) or adult (drunk and rowdy) because they just don't give a f**k, annoys me much more.

lazybones32

Having had the stress of travelling on flights with special needs kids, as their carer, i understand that woman's plight and am so unconcerned for the inconvenience caused to those who get upset/pi$$ed off at a child crying.

kurtainsider

It can't have been a pleasant experience for you but I would have taken the view that I only have to endure it for a couple of hours. Imagine how the poor parents and siblings who have to live with it 24/7 must feel.
If you look at it in those terms you won't feel quiet as annoyed or inconvenienced.

Stonedpilot

Put them in a cage.


Seriously it is annoying when people bring their litter with them and treat a place like a creche. Was at several things at an arts festival recently and many of the installations and displays had wild navi's running around on a sugar rush crashing into everyone and sundry parent's in another room at the exhibit!.

Kids in public places should be under control.

kurtainsider

Stonedpilot wrote: »

Put them in a cage.


Seriously it is annoying when people bring their litter with them and treat a place like a creche. Was at several things at an arts festival recently and many of the installations and displays had wild navi's running around on a sugar rush crashing into everyone and sundry parent's in another room at the exhibit!.

Kids in public places should be under control.

I agree with you but we're discussing special needs kids here. There's a ddifference.

osarusan

If I were a parent of a child with some special needs, I imagine my main/only concern would be for that child's welfare and happiness.

So if a particular flight/journey was going to cause them so much suffering/distress that overall, the journey/holiday just wasn't worth it, I'd be thinking about other plans. If we did travel that way, I'd do my best to keep them reassured and at peace - for their own good.

But the issue of inconvenience to other passengers wouldn't weigh heavily on my mind at all.

It's not nice to endure, but it's a million times worse for the parents and the child themselves.

I'm sure loads will decide that they're bad parents for going away with the child at all and should hide away from society in case they inconvenience anyone with their presence, but they deserve a break, the kids deserve a break, and kids with special needs deserve holidays too.

I'd rather be sat beside a child with some struggles than beside a grown adult who thinks the world should revolve around their comfort and that kids with needs should be kept apart from the rest of society.

ThisRegard

Do you know what really, really helps a parent whose child might kick off for a bit on a flight, or anywhere for that matter? A dirty look and a tut to yourself. Works every time, moron.

astrofool

By the same reasoning, why did the person with a fear of flying go on the flight? Why did the person with Tinnitus go in a pressurised metal tube powered by two high frequency gas turbine engines?

Most people are reasonable, and most parents are doing their utmost to get through the flight and people recognise that, children are not rational, and have less self awareness. When there's issues, it's usually a parent problem rather than a child (lack of disciplining the child about being courteous to others).

Sheeple34

omagh776 wrote: »

Why would you subject yourself ,a 3 year old Autistic Child, a 22 months old baby and an 8 year old to a 3 hour flight.

Because maybe with a 3 year old Autistic Child, a 22 months old baby and an 8 year old and dealing with judgemental people, she actually needs a holiday.
Why would you subject your family to an overnight ferry and a long car journey just because you might annoy a snowflake for a few hours.

You can get off the flight in a few hours and forget about it. She is dealing with this 24/7, give her a break.

Annoying drunk people and that attention seeking lady with the brown bag would annoy me a hell of a lot more than an upset 3 year old child.

Sheeple34

Sheeple34 wrote: »

Because maybe with a 3 year old Autistic Child, a 22 months old baby and an 8 year old and dealing with judgemental people, she actually needs a holiday.
Why would you subject your family to an overnight ferry and a long car journey just because you might annoy a snowflake for a few hours.

You can get off the flight in a few hours and forget about it. She is dealing with this 24/7, give her a break.

Annoying drunk people and that attention seeking lady with the brown bag would annoy me a hell of a lot more than an upset 3 year old child.

You had me until that last bit. People can be terrified of flying, it's not something done for attention or that they have any control over, and they deserve a bit of understanding for their own special needs too.

You don't fight judgement with judgement.

fizzypish

Children can be woefully annoying but the thing to always remember is as soon as I step off this train/bus/plane, I don't have to deal with children. I can suck it up. That (made up not the article woman) lady with the 4 screaming kids, she's had enough so that I feel its perfectly reasonable for me to never want to reproduce. We're above quota so I'm off the hook. I can take the crying for 2 hours.

Sheeple34

Candie wrote: »

You had me until that last bit. People can be terrified of flying, it's not something done for attention or that they have any control over, and they deserve a bit of understanding for their own special needs too.

You don't fight judgement with judgement.

Get what your saying, but in this case, this lady is an adult, not a child, she has some control over her fear. She knows she has a fear of flying. She walked onto that plane knowing what was going to happen (unlike the mother of the child who probably deals with it in many situations). She took that childs behaviour and made it about herself, asking for a jump seat away from the child.
And i'm not saying I have no sympathy for her, I just have less.

Sheeple34

Sheeple34 wrote: »

Get what your saying, but in this case, this lady is an adult, not a child, she has some control over her fear. She knows she has a fear of flying. She walked onto that plane knowing what was going to happen (unlike the mother of the child who probably deals with it in many situations). She took that childs behaviour and made it about herself, asking for a jump seat away from the child.

She was just trying to manage her phobia, and people don't always get on flights for holidays, it could have been a work thing. She'd certainly as much right to be there as anyone else and she dealt with her issue by putting distance between herself and the child. I can't fault her for that and I think you're being harsh.

Malari

Christ :eek: Must add earplugs to my list of flight essentials...

Badly Drunk Boy

Sheeple34 wrote: »

Get what your saying, but in this case, this lady is an adult, not a child, she has some control over her fear. She knows she has a fear of flying. She walked onto that plane knowing what was going to happen (unlike the mother of the child who probably deals with it in many situations). She took that childs behaviour and made it about herself, asking for a jump seat away from the child.
And i'm not saying I have no sympathy for her, I just have less.

As Candie said, maybe she was testing herself to see if she could manage her phobia or maybe it was for work, but the mother of that child must have known what her child was going to go through when she booked the holidays. Who says you have to go abroad for a holiday? If the stress to the child was going to be that bad, other arrangements could have been made.

Boom_Bap

I'm going to let everyone in on a little secret here, ssssshhhhh, don't tell anyone else.

We have all been little as$hole kids for a sustained period in our lives where each and every one of us has pissed off an adult or group of people with our childlike behavior.

Permabear

This post has been deleted.

Sheeple34

Badly Drunk Boy wrote: »

As Candie said, maybe she was testing herself to see if she could manage her phobia or maybe it was for work, but the mother of that child must have known what her child was going to go through when she booked the holidays. Who says you have to go abroad for a holiday? If the stress to the child was going to be that bad, other arrangements could have been made.

Yes, Candie made some very good points, and I realise I was probably a bit harsh alright.

But you lost me with this. Your saying the lady with the fear of flying had more right to 'manage her phobia' and get on the flight than the mother of the child did? Maybe the mother doesn't want to stay in Ireland for a holiday!! Why should she. Everyone has an equal right to get on a plane and try live their life to the fullest.

Porklife

Sheeple34 wrote: »

Yes, Candie made some very good points, and I realise I was probably a bit harsh alright.

But you lost me with this. Your saying the lady with the fear of flying had more right to 'manage her phobia' and get on the flight than the mother of the child did? Maybe the mother doesn't want to stay in Ireland for a holiday!! Why should she. Everyone has an equal right to get on a plane and try live their life to the fullest.

Sometimes it's not even a fear of flying per se, more claustrophobia and you may not realise you have it until a situation like the one described happens.

I remember flying to Australia years ago and out of the blue I started to feel really claustrophobic. I think I had looked at the remaining flight time and saw there 7 hours to go and panic started to creep in. The man beside me was wearing a mohair jumper and was reading the paper and every time he turned a page, his hairy arm would rub against my bare skin. I suddenly couldn't catch my breath. I remember standing up and motioning to the air steward in a complete state of panic. I had to be brought to the back of the plane and given an oxygen tank. It was horrible.

My point is that it's not attention seeking. If anything that women probably felt embarrassed and didn't want anybody near her. Panic attacks feel like you're actually about to die. They are truly horrific and can be hard to control. You may think you'll be ok but then a screaming baby or drunk person or even a hairy jumper can set you off!!

I feel sorry for everyone in that situation, the airline staff included.

_Dara_

I was on a flight from Cardiff to Dublin one Sunday evening a few months back. In my vicinity was a baby and a tipsy guy.

When the plane pushed back, the baby started letting out a few little cries. Nothing major. Tipsy guy loudly starts complaining about the baby and how annoyed he was to have to be sitting near all that noise.

The baby then proceeded to quiet down again. Meanwhile Tipsy Joe was incredibly annoying on the flight, being really, really loud, far louder than the baby had ever been. Is there anything more irritating that drunkenness on public transport, especially transport with a completely captive audience? And this is something the adult can control. I'd say every flight attendant has plenty of exasperating stories to tell about drunkenness on their watch.

I don't understand blanket grousing about babies on flights. I understand annoyance at children past toddler age being allowed to run amok but babies and toddlers are different. Unless you can afford a private jet or they start chartering adult-only flights, you just have to suck it up and accept that humans of all sizes might be on your flight.

And with older children, how do you know there isn't some other issue going on like the child described in the OP? What, is that family never supposed to fly because of the child's autism?

It makes me genuinely sad to think of how intolerant people seem to be. Giving out about kids crying or insinuating that parents think the world should revolve around their kids, while at the same time clearly believing it should revolve around them, grown adults.

Kids can be hard, phobias are hard. Life is easier when you cut yourself and others a bit of slack and keep things in perspective.

Heinzer

And that woman with the phobia knew it would be stressful for herself too so by your logic she shouldn't have gotten on the plane in the first place. The family are entitled to a holiday where ever they can choose and are physically able to go to.

bear1

Stonedpilot wrote: »

Put them in a cage.


Seriously it is annoying when people bring their litter with them and treat a place like a creche. Was at several things at an arts festival recently and many of the installations and displays had wild navi's running around on a sugar rush crashing into everyone and sundry parent's in another room at the exhibit!.

Kids in public places should be under control.

What a stupid fcuking thing to post.
Their litter? Are you being a complete dick for the sake of it or trying to get thanks?
The child is autistic ffs, are you suggesting kids with certain conditions should go nowhere as it might inconvenience people like yourself?
Dick thing to post.

ceadaoin.

Stonedpilot wrote: »

Put them in a cage.


Seriously it is annoying when people bring their litter with them and treat a place like a creche. Was at several things at an arts festival recently and many of the installations and displays had wild navi's running around on a sugar rush crashing into everyone and sundry parent's in another room at the exhibit!.

Kids in public places should be under control.

They are children, not animals ffs. This isn't the Victorian times where children should be 'seen and not heard'. They are part of society and have a right to participate in it. Get over yourself. What I find is that the anti kid brigade tend to embellish these incidents of rowdy screaming children in every place they go. It's rare I notice any tbh.

jimgoose

ceadaoin. wrote: »

They are children, not animals ffs. This isn't the Victorian times where children should be 'seen and not heard'. They are part of society and have a right to participate in it. Get over yourself. What I find is that the anti kid brigade tend to embellish these incidents of rowdy screaming children in every place they go. It's rare I notice any tbh.

Me neither. I just wonder if these people have ever been anywhere near an angle-grinder or an electric saw. :pac:

Sephiroth_dude

Stonedpilot wrote: »

Put them in a cage.


Seriously it is annoying when people bring their litter with them and treat a place like a creche. Was at several things at an arts festival recently and many of the installations and displays had wild navi's running around on a sugar rush crashing into everyone and sundry parent's in another room at the exhibit!.

Kids in public places should be under control.

You sound real charming, how about we put you in a cage instead.

BrokenArrows

While I agree that parents need to deal with kids the best they can while traveling taking 3 young children on a flight one of whom is autistic is just asking for trouble and is very inconsiderate of other passengers.

Your taking an autistic child who by the very nature of their condition dont like change (generally this is true), its just asking for trouble.

In her message she said that people were ignorant for complaining, moaning and moving seats. People have every right to be annoyed at her for making an hour of their flight hell.

I wouldnt say they are bad parents, but she is certainly an inconsiderate one who wants to put herself above the comfort of her autistic child and other passengers.

Spider Web

Why do people sometimes refer to a child as "it"?

MagicIRL

Nothing a good pair of earbuds can't solve.

irelandrover

Im generally pretty tolerant of screaming kids as long as the parents make some effort to calm/control them. Kids make noise. We all did it.

However, I'm quite a nervous flier, and id say after 90 minutes of sitting near a screaming child I'd probably give a dirty look as well. It wouldnt be a conscious thing even. It would be me being at the absolute end of my tether.

ceadaoin.

ceadaoin. wrote: »

They are children, not animals ffs. This isn't the Victorian times where children should be 'seen and not heard'. They are part of society and have a right to participate in it. Get over yourself. What I find is that the anti kid brigade tend to embellish these incidents of rowdy screaming children in every place they go. It's rare I notice any tbh.

I'm convinced some of the stories of kids screaming while their parents play candy crush that you sometimes read here are made up, and the majority of the more believable ones are exaggerated. I wouldn't even describe myself as particularly tolerant but it's not something I've encountered much.

I've never had kids ruin my lunch in a cafe, or seen them destroy anything in a museum, or had a flight made unbearable from start to finish, or been deafened by them in a store or on any transport. I must be incredibly lucky or something.

ThisRegard

Candie wrote: »

I've never had kids ruin my lunch in a cafe, or seen them destroy anything in a museum, or had a flight made unbearable from start to finish, or been deafened by them in a store or on any transport. I must be incredibly lucky or something.

Because you don't go looking to be disturbed. The simple fact is that there's people out there who go looking to be annoyed at such things, almost making it an aim for their day out.

ceadaoin.

BrokenArrows wrote: »

While I agree that parents need to deal with kids the best they can while traveling taking 3 young children on a flight one of whom is autistic is just asking for trouble and is very inconsiderate of other passengers.

Your taking an autistic child who by the very nature of their condition dont like change (generally this is true), its just asking for trouble.

In her message she said that people were ignorant for complaining, moaning and moving seats. People have every right to be annoyed at her for making an hour of their flight hell.

I wouldnt say they are bad parents, but she is certainly an inconsiderate one who wants to put herself above the comfort of her autistic child and other passengers.

Yes, I'm sure it would be annoying, but "hell" is a bit of an exaggeration no? I mean, I'm sure those people will get over it, it's an hour or two out of their holiday. Hardly the end of the world. If they are so delicate then maybe they shouldn't be going out in public at all!

bobbyss

eviltwin wrote:

I'd rather put myself through a three hours flight with the child than an overnight ferry.

osarusan wrote:

Letting people act the maggot, child (running round the place) or adult (drunk and rowdy) because they just don't give a f**k, annoys me much more.

Was on a bus recently and a young child was messing around the aisle talking to tourists who tolerated her a lot I thought. She was well away from her mother all the while. About seven seats away I would say. She was very active and talkative. I would say the mother wanted a break from her and wasn't bothered if she was annoying others. I gave her the cold shoulder when she started looking towards me. I wondered why the driver didn't say something about the child and safety. The mother wasn't too interested in her safety anyway. I was going to tell the child to sit in her seat but felt it was the mother's job.

jimgoose

bobbyss wrote: »

Was on a bus recently and a young child was messing around the aisle talking to tourists who tolerated her a lot I thought. She was well away from her mother all the while. About seven seats away I would say. She was very active and talkative. I would say the mother wanted a break from her and wasn't bothered if she was annoying others. I gave her the cold shoulder when she started looking towards me. I wondered why the driver didn't say something about the child and safety. The mother wasn't too interested in her safety anyway. I was going to tell the child to sit in her seat but felt it was the mother's job.

If there's a problem here I'm not seeing it, chief.

irelandrover

jimgoose wrote: »

If there's a problem here I'm not seeing it, chief.

There's a young child unrestrained in the aisle of a bus. Thats dangerous, whatever about annoying passengers.

jimgoose

irelandrover wrote: »

There's a young child unrestrained in the aisle of a bus. Thats dangerous, whatever about annoying passengers.

Oh, I see. Right, taser ever-loving Hell outta that shiz-nit! :pac:

bear1

BrokenArrows wrote: »

While I agree that parents need to deal with kids the best they can while traveling taking 3 young children on a flight one of whom is autistic is just asking for trouble and is very inconsiderate of other passengers.

Your taking an autistic child who by the very nature of their condition dont like change (generally this is true), its just asking for trouble.

In her message she said that people were ignorant for complaining, moaning and moving seats. People have every right to be annoyed at her for making an hour of their flight hell.

I wouldnt say they are bad parents, but she is certainly an inconsiderate one who wants to put herself above the comfort of her autistic child and other passengers.

Again, are people with kids, especially those with special needs, not allowed to travel because it can be a bit annoying for passengers?
She mentioned people began swearing too but for some reason you aren't quoting that part - passengers of course can be annoyed and before I became a parent it also annoyed me but I'd hardly start swearing because of it.
There was obviously space within the plane for them to move around so instead of making a fuss and acting stupid about it they could simply move and get on with their lives.

suicide_circus

Don't blame people for giving out, it's only natural.

The parents made a judgement call and they judged that their convenience and need for a holiday trumped the convenience and peace of the other passengers.

Ficheall

Spider Web wrote: »

Why do people sometimes refer to a child as "it"?

Because "he", "she", "they", and "ze" are offensive to some people who have nothing better to complain about.

bobbyss

jimgoose wrote:

If there's a problem here I'm not seeing it, chief.

Child playing along the aisle of a bus travelling at what, 120 kp? Bus driver makes no announcement re safety and seat belts. I think it's required by law. Mother allowing this child to continue for this three hour journey unbelted talking to other passengers.

Do you see the problem now?

ThisRegard

ThisRegard wrote: »

Because you don't go looking to be disturbed. The simple fact is that there's people out there who go looking to be annoyed at such things, almost making it an aim for their day out.

I think you're spot on, it's a sort of sense of entitlement they have, that the world should just accommodate them and no one else matters. I'm just always amazed there are so many people who seem to hate not just kids, but their parents too, just for existing.

Hopefully it's confined to online spaces like this and isn't a thing in the real world, but you'd wonder about people who talk about kids like they're animals, as illustrated earlier in the thread.

jimgoose

bobbyss wrote: »

Child playing along the aisle of a bus travelling at what, 120 kp? Bus driver makes no announcement re safety and seat belts. I think it's required by law. Mother allowing this child to continue for this three hour journey unbelted talking to other passengers.

Do you see the problem now?

Oh, you mean what us oul' fellas would call a coach, more of an inter-city bus sort of thing. Yeah, I have you now.

Pat Mustard

Kids who cause trouble should have one parent executed for each transgression. Starting with Ned.

Wheeliebin30

Why can't they have a section on a plane for parents and kids only?

Pat Mustard

Wheeliebin30 wrote: »

Why can't they have a section on a plane for parents and kids only?

The wings of the plane are restricted for health and safety reasons.

Except in India.

Spider Web

bear1 wrote: »

Again, are people with kids, especially those with special needs, not allowed to travel because it can be a bit annoying for passengers?

Well nobody said anyone isn't allowed - of course they're allowed.
It's dishonest to say "a bit" annoying too.

Personally I think the public have to get over it when children are noisy in public. Children can be noisy, that's part of being a child, which we all were. However, I don't get why the parents in this case chose a holiday requiring plane travel (it isn't the only type of holiday/travel) when they risked such distress for their child with autism.

I don't understand parents choosing to go on plane journeys with very small children full stop (unless necessary of course) given the distress it causes the children and the parents themselves.

I don't think this view is the same as being intolerant otherwise of children being noisy in public in general - I'm not. It's the distress for the child I'm referring to anyway, not the passengers.

stimpson

Was sitting behind a crying baby on the way back from Italy this year. Instead of bitching and moaning I played peek-a-boo with here. Calmed her right down. Life's too short to worry about that type of thing.