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"Gender Neutral" VMA's backfire

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  • 28-08-2017 7:58am
    #1
    pjohnson
    Registered Users Posts: 23,202 ✭✭✭✭


    So after a massive complaint over years of putting men and women in different categories. This year featured them merged and the women duly won LESS than the men causing more grumbling from those who wanted "neutrality".


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    #2
    tigger123
    Registered Users Posts: 4,441 ✭✭✭tigger123


    That'll learn the wimens.


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    #3
    Canis Lupus
    Registered Users Posts: 9,893 ✭✭✭Canis Lupus


    pjohnson wrote: »
    So after a massive complaint over years of putting men and women in different categories. This year featured them merged and the women duly won LESS than the men causing more grumbling from those who wanted "neutrality".

    Any linky links to the grumbles? Can't see anything online about it.


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    #4
    jimgoose
    Registered Users Posts: 20,174 ✭✭✭✭jimgoose


    Anyone else think "VMA" was an old DEC operating system??


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    #5
    super_furry
    Registered Users Posts: 27,321 ✭✭✭✭super_furry


    I'm just surprised that MTV have anything to do with music nowadays.


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    #6
    diomed
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,744 ✭✭✭diomed


    jimgoose wrote: »
    Anyone else think "VMA" was an old DEC operating system??
    Yes. When you have to Google the opening post it becomes too much.


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    #7
    judeboy101
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 3,246 ✭✭✭judeboy101


    diomed wrote: »
    Yes. When you have to Google the opening post it becomes too much.

    Funny how women not pushing to be in the best actor category in Oscars despite insisting on been called actors instead of actress.


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    #8
    Boom_Bap
    Moderators, Music Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 25,730 Mod ✭✭✭✭Boom_Bap


    Yeah but, did the best person win in each category?


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    #9
    BoJack Horseman
    Registered Users Posts: 12,248 ✭✭✭✭BoJack Horseman


    judeboy101 wrote: »
    Funny how women not pushing to be in the best actor category in Oscars despite insisting on been called actors instead of actress.

    Funnily enough we hear of little clamour for more women coal miners & steel smelters either.
    What is called 'feminism' today is rather selective.

    Anyway, bring on gender neutral everything.... especially sport..... let the equality of merit reign.
    I'm sure they will be happy.


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    #10
    Biggest lickspittle on boardz
    Closed Accounts Posts: 558 ✭✭✭Biggest lickspittle on boardz


    super_furry wrote: »
    I'm just surprised that MTV have anything to do with music nowadays.




    They're more into massive racist and sexist generalisations these days. It's a growth industry:






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    #11
    Alun
    Registered Users Posts: 21,422 ✭✭✭✭Alun


    diomed wrote: »
    Yes. When you have to Google the opening post it becomes too much.
    Any post where you have to Google what the hell it's about is a sure sign that it's a load of fuss about nothing.


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    #12
    Victor
    Registered Users Posts: 78,266 ✭✭✭✭Victor


    BoJack Horseman wrote: »
    Funnily enough we hear of little clamour for more women coal miners & steel smelters either.
    Actually, there is little clamour for any coal miners & steel smelters. There are no coal mines and no smelters in Ireland and the general trend across Europe is towards closure. That said, the last miner I met was a female 19 year old truck driver for a mine in Wisconsin (I'm not sure, but it might not have been a coal mine).


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    #13
    jacksie66
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,988 ✭✭✭jacksie66


    This post has been deleted.


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    #14
    osarusan
    Registered Users Posts: 16,553 ✭✭✭✭osarusan


    jacksie66 wrote: »
    Does a day go by these days that someone isn't offended, causing uproar and generally being a little bitch?

    The thing is though, that these threads aren't started by people who are apparently offended at whatever it is, they are started by people who are lamenting that taking of offence - which, if it even exists, isn't in AH.

    So I wish the people starting these threads would take their fight to wherever that offence is actually happening, rather than starting threads here, where it isn't.


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    #15
    Hector Bellend
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,667 ✭✭✭Hector Bellend


    super_furry wrote: »
    I'm just surprised that MTV have anything to do with music nowadays.

    They didn't to begin with


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    #16
    Your Face
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7,277 ✭✭✭Your Face


    I'm so angry but I can't find an appropriate link to post.


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    #17
    Larbre34
    Registered Users Posts: 23,822 ✭✭✭✭Larbre34


    A strangle self-inflicted wound.

    Many actresses don't like the term actress, prefering actor, but you can be damn sure they wouldn't agree with taking away the category of 'Best Actress / Supporting Actress' from the big awards ceremonies.

    However, it is always amusing when the PC generation out-PC themselves and are left scratching their heads with the outcome.


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    #18
    twill
    Registered Users Posts: 587 ✭✭✭twill


    Larbre34 wrote: »
    Many actresses don't like the term actress, prefering actor, but you can be damn sure they wouldn't agree with taking away the category of 'Best Actress / Supporting Actress' from the big awards ceremonies.
    The thing is, roles for women are not at the same level in Hollywood as roles for men, so as the system isn't equal, there are good arguments against a gender neutral awards structure.


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    #19
    jimgoose
    Registered Users Posts: 20,174 ✭✭✭✭jimgoose


    twill wrote: »
    The thing is, roles for women are not at the same level in Hollywood as roles for men, so as the system isn't equal, there are good arguments against a gender neutral awards structure.

    Yes indeed. Apparently many women start finding good roles hard to come by by the time they're forty-odd or so, which is grossly unnecessary and unfair on them. I heard the breathtaking Marina Sirtis (she's 62) on the radio the other day talking about this very thing, but she was saying it could be a lot worse in her case because she's able to play Israeli/Arab because of her colouring.


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    #20
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    jimgoose wrote: »
    Anyone else think "VMA" was an old DEC operating system??

    Ha.

    You're old.


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    #21
    jimgoose
    Registered Users Posts: 20,174 ✭✭✭✭jimgoose


    Deleted User wrote: »
    Ha.

    You're old.

    Ha! The fact that you knew that meant I'm old means you're old too. So ner! :P


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    #22
    Sonics2k
    Registered Users Posts: 8,239 ✭✭✭Sonics2k


    Hector Bellend wrote: »
    They didn't to begin with

    I don't want to be a smartarse here, but I'm taking it as you were either very young or not around in the mid 80's through to the mid 90's?

    MTV used to play a load of music back in the day. They eventually just found there is a lot more money in terrible TV shows.


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    #23
    PistolsAtDawn
    Registered Users Posts: 335 ✭✭PistolsAtDawn


    Biggest lickspittle on boardz wrote: »
    They're more into massive racist and sexist generalisations these days. It's a growth industry:





    This is shocking


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    #24
    the beer revolu
    Registered Users Posts: 16,780 ✭✭✭✭the beer revolu


    Actors act. Why do we need different terms for male and female ones?
    An actor is an actor.

    Like motorist, jockey, nurse, doctor, golfer etc etc.

    The term actress is stupid and unnecessary.


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    #25
    pjohnson
    Registered Users Posts: 23,202 ✭✭✭✭pjohnson


    osarusan wrote: »
    The thing is though, that these threads aren't started by people who are apparently offended at whatever it is, they are started by people who are lamenting that taking of offence - which, if it even exists, isn't in AH.

    So I wish the people starting these threads would take their fight to wherever that offence is actually happening, rather than starting threads here, where it isn't.

    What? I'm not taking any fight anywhere. Just posted about idiots being idiots with their faux-equality nonsense. What on earth OP are you reading?


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    #26
    hatrickpatrick
    Registered Users Posts: 17,797 ✭✭✭✭hatrickpatrick


    How the hell is getting rid of male and female categories considered progressive? All it means is fewer awards overall, and a guarantee of one gender winning more awards than the other. The whole point of having separate categories is to acknowledge the very real and basic fact in mainstream pop music that men and women tend to cultivate and cater to very different audience profiles.


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    #27
    Banjo
    Registered Users Posts: 10,485 ✭✭✭✭Banjo


    the beer revolu wrote: »
    Actors act. Why do we need different terms for male and female ones?
    An actor is an actor.

    Like motorist, jockey, nurse, doctor, golfer etc etc.

    The term actress is stupid and unnecessary.

    Roles are written for men or for women
    Until there is gender neutrality in roles, you cannot have gender neutrality in the awards for people playing those roles or, arguably, the people playing those roles.

    And with that in mind, may I present Al Pacino as Queen Elizabeth I in Scent of a Monarch.


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    #28
    silverharp
    Registered Users Posts: 17,840 ✭✭✭✭silverharp


    Banjo wrote: »
    Roles are written for men or for women
    Unless there is gender neutrality in roles which nobody wants so will never happen, you cannot have gender neutrality in the awards for people playing those roles or, arguably, the people playing those roles.

    And with that in mind, may I present Al Pacino as Queen Elizabeth I in Scent of a Monarch.

    FYP :D

    A belief in gender identity involves a level of faith as there is nothing tangible to prove its existence which, as something divorced from the physical body, is similar to the idea of a soul. - Colette Colfer



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    #29
    hatrickpatrick
    Registered Users Posts: 17,797 ✭✭✭✭hatrickpatrick


    Banjo wrote: »
    Roles are written for men or for women
    Until there is gender neutrality in roles, you cannot have gender neutrality in the awards for people playing those roles or, arguably, the people playing those roles.

    And with that in mind, may I present Al Pacino as Queen Elizabeth I in Scent of a Monarch.

    I'd argue the same for music in a lot of ways though. Because of the different cultural expectations of male and female gender roles, a lot of songs would sound weird or downright cringey if the genders of the performers and the subjects were flipped. In fact, and this is something I personally find to be a very unfair double standard, I'm pretty sure if a man had written Taylor Swift's "You Belong With Me" about a woman, he'd have been attacked as a creepy, bitter "pseudo nice guy" type.

    So in other words, as long as societal gender roles exist, there'll be every bit as much a divide among musicians in terms of subject matter, target audience etc, as there is in acting roles.


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    #30
    Noveight
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,813 ✭✭✭Noveight


    I don't think complete gender neutrality is the answer to any of our problems tbh.


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    #31
    drake70
    Registered Users Posts: 656 ✭✭✭drake70


    jimgoose wrote: »
    Anyone else think "VMA" was an old DEC operating system??
    Deleted User wrote: »
    Ha.

    You're old.
    jimgoose wrote: »
    Ha! The fact that you knew that meant I'm old means you're old too. So ner! :P

    I think you mean VMS. I am also old. :)


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