Irish people with English accents

P. Breathnach

steddyeddy wrote: »

In fairness both Terry and Gay had accents.

Yes. Everybody has an accent.

What I meant was they had/have Irish accents without any strong regional characteristics.

bobbyss

P. Breathnach wrote: »

Yes. Everybody has an accent.

What I meant was they had/have Irish accents without any strong regional characteristics.

I think we could add Pat Kenny, Anne Doyle and Mike Murphy to that list. Neutral. However if you heard them on BBC you would instantly hear an Irish accent.

The idea of class and social mobility is interesting too I think. I mean where exactly did Kenneth Brannagh get his accent? Would it have hindered his career to have retained his Northern accent? James Nesbitt is another northerner with a very strong Irish accent. He has lived in England too I would assume but has retained it. I wonder if the two of them ever discussed accents? Wouldn't Nesbitt have had the same exposure as Brannagh? Yet look at the differences? Why is that? I simply don't know.

Yamanoto

bobbyss wrote: »

Wouldn't Nesbitt have had the same exposure as Brannagh? Yet look at the differences? Why is that? I simply don't know.

Branagh apparently acquired Received Pronunciation to avoid bullying at school, when he moved to England in his youth. I'd imagine his training at RADA & involvement with RSC also had quite an influence on how he sounds today. It's unlikely you could have played Hamlet in an RSC production sounding like Frank Carson.

Nesbitt by contrast didn't move to Britain 'til he was 19 or 20 & had spent his formative years in Ballymena, where the accent's distinctive & particularly thick.

ceadaoin.

Lia_lia wrote: »

Most of the hippie crowd down in West Cork have English accents. A parent/both parents would have been English but these people have lived in Ireland their whole lives and have proper English accents. It's a bit weird.

I was born in England and lived there for a few years. Had an English accent till I was about 11 but started putting on an Irish accent till it became my accent. Having an English accent in school in Kerry is bullying material!

Similar here. Born in Ireland but lived in the U.K. until I was 7 or so. Moved back to Ireland and developed an Irish accent at school but still spoke with my manchester accent at home for some strange reason. Eventually just became Irish all the time. Lived back in the U.K. As an adult for 5 years and have lived in the US for 4, still have an Irish accent

bobbyss

Yamanoto wrote:

Branagh apparently acquired Received Pronunciation to avoid bullying at school, when he moved to England in his youth. I'd imagine his training at RADA & involvement with RSC also had quite an influence on how he sounds today. It's unlikely you could have played Hamlet in an RSC production sounding like Frank Carson.

He could put on an accent for the play too. Many Americans were smazed to discover that Damien Lewis who was in Homeland was British, so convincing was his American accent.
But this is the strange thing. Brannagh acquired RP, yet you can also live in England as long as him and not 'acquire' it. What does aquire mean anyway?

LordSutch

ceadaoin. wrote: »

Similar here. Born in Ireland but lived in the U.K. until I was 7 or so. Moved back to Ireland and developed an Irish accent at school but still spoke with my manchester accent at home for some strange reason. Eventually just became Irish all the time. Lived back in the U.K. As an adult for 5 years and have lived in the US for 4, still have an Irish accent

So you might well have ended up with a Hiberno-Mancunian accent.

Of all the accents in the UK, from London to Cornwall, from Belfast to Glasgow, from Derry to Birmingham, the Mancunian accent isn't the worst IMO.

Can't stand the Brummy accent though.

noaddedsugar

Rayne Tart Cockpit wrote: »

Irish and English people seem to be mutually incapable of picking up each other's accents. The West Cork people are probably the best example, there are God knows how many Poles, Nigerians, Americans, Brazilians etc walking around with Cark biy accents after being here five years and then those limey bastards there for decades sounding like they just stepped off the plane.

There certainly is an element of class and social mobility to it, just how ferociously some Irish people sneer at some accents and dialects, mostly the "culchie" ones and also the "rough" ones is weird. Whether it's insecurity, internalised anti-Irishness or what the fcuk, I don't know.

I don't think it is weird at all to not want to speak with some accents. Some people need subtitles their accents are so strong, why wouldn't you want to speak in a clear manner with proper pronunciation so everyone can understand you? You wouldn't say it is insecurity that leads people to want to spell words correctly, why should it be any different when you say words?

bobbyss

LordSutch wrote: »

So you might well have ended up with a Hiberno-Mancunian accent.

Of all the accents in the UK, from London to Cornwall, from Belfast to Glasgow, from Derry to Birmingham, the Mancunian accent isn't the worst IMO.

Can't stand the Brummy accent though.

Can we extend that to the ROI and say the Cork accent. Dreadful stuff.
Also whatever accent those clowns with the caps from Kerry. Listowel? Killarney?

Grayson

P. Breathnach wrote: »

Yes. Everybody has an accent.

What I meant was they had/have Irish accents without any strong regional characteristics.

I have that too. Except for a few words that randomly have a thick accent. I have a problem, like many Irish people, with TH's. And for some reason when I say water it sometimes comes out really flat in a midlands accent. Occasional words come out with the slightest ting of an English accent.

My history has something to do with it. I was born in the UK to Dublin parents. I grew up in the midlands in Ireland. And as a 4 year old I had meningitis which left me partially deaf for a few years. I had speech therapy when I was 5 and moved to the midlands and that meant I never picked up the accent there.

When I'm abroad Irish people don't recognise the accent as Irish but other nationalities do.

Lia_lia

noaddedsugar wrote: »

I moved to Ireland when I was 4 and am now in my 30s and still have an English twang in my accent. You'd never guess I was from Yorkshire though, just that I am English. My kids are born here with an Irish dad, go to school here etc and have an English accent in somethings that they say. It's just that I am their primary caregiver and the person they hang out with the most. As they get older and hang out with their friends more their accent is becoming more and more Irish, generic kind of Irish though you wouldn't be able to pin down where they are from.

My accent is now one of those Irish accents that you couldn't really put a place on. Some people do say it sounds a bit English sometimes. Probably sounding more Cork than anything these days as I live in Cork and my OH is from Cork city with a strong enough accent..

I was brought up mainly by my Mother who is from Killarney. But she has a fairly neautral Irish accent as her Mother is English! Lived in England and France during my childhood and my Dad is English with a very neautral accent. Saying that my Brother is 3 years younger than me and has one of the strongest Kerry accents I've ever heard..

Accents always amazed me. I'm originally from Dublin and lived there originally until I was 12. Despite living in Listowel for a little over 10 years, I never lost my Ballyfermot accent.

On the other hand, I once dated a girl from Clondalkin who lived in Killarney for around the same amount of time and you'd never know she was from Dublin, a strong Kerry accent on her.

I've noticed that several of the names mentioned in the OP are Protestant; maybe grammar school education has something to do with it?

Del.Monte

Karsini wrote: »

Accents always amazed me. I'm originally from Dublin and lived there originally until I was 12. Despite living in Listowel for a little over 10 years, I never lost my Ballyfermot accent.

On the other hand, I once dated a girl from Clondalkin who lived in Killarney for around the same amount of time and you'd never know she was from Dublin, a strong Kerry accent on her.

I've noticed that several of the names mentioned in the OP are Protestant; maybe grammar school education has something to do with it?

Ross, Norris, Mansergh and De Burgh never saw the inside of a Grammar school but they are indeed Anglo Irish.

RhubarbCrumble

I was brought up in the country (Limerick) have lived in the city suburbs for about 15 years now but still have a culchie accent that I don't think I'll ever shake off. I frequently get asked what part of Cork/Kerry I'm from.

uch

RhubarbCrumble wrote: »

I was brought up in the country (Limerick) have lived in the city suburbs for about 15 years now but still have a culchie accent that I don't think I'll ever shake off. I frequently get asked what part of Cork/Kerry I'm from.

Do you say schhhtuff instead of stuff

BeerWolf

I'm Irish, but when people see me they think I'm Spanish, and if they hear me they think I'm American... :pac:

uch

BeerWolf wrote: »

I'm Irish, but when people see me they think I'm Spanish, and if they hear me they think I'm American... :pac:

Sorry about that

Was listening to the superb Documentary on One series on RTRadio 1 today. For the first time I couldn't, like, continue, like listening. It was, like, about, like, Wesley Disco, like, and she goes, like, you know, like, every like two minutes like.

For fuck sake. Where did this accent come from? Every accent across this country is part of a clear pattern or gradiated difference as you move along from village to village. It makes sense. They all have a place, they all belong here. But this horrid, vacuous "like, you know" affected accent stuff?

Likewise with people who spend most of their lives here and make a point of not speaking with an Irish accent. Get over yourselves. It always reminds me of William Lecky's (1838-1903) famous observation that even the "most worthless" member of his own community "even if he had nothing else to boast of, at least found it pleasing to think that he was a member of a dominant race". The parents of Shane Ross, who sent him to Rugby in England for an education, are classic examples of this sort of chump. The parents of Henry Mountcharles in Slane, who sent him to Harrow in England, are another two. It's as political a statement of their unionism as it is an ethnic statement of who they are not.

Grayson

Karsini wrote: »

Accents always amazed me. I'm originally from Dublin and lived there originally until I was 12. Despite living in Listowel for a little over 10 years, I never lost my Ballyfermot accent.

On the other hand, I once dated a girl from Clondalkin who lived in Killarney for around the same amount of time and you'd never know she was from Dublin, a strong Kerry accent on her.

I've noticed that several of the names mentioned in the OP are Protestant; maybe grammar school education has something to do with it?

My sister will pick up a new accent after going somewhere for a few days.

Del.Monte

Deleted User wrote: »

Was listening to the superb Documentary on One series on RTRadio 1 today. For the first time I couldn't, like, continue, like listening. It was, like, about, like, Wesley Disco, like, and she goes, like, you know, like, every like two minutes like.

For fuck sake. Where did this accent come from? Every accent across this country is part of a clear pattern or gradiated difference as you move along from village to village. It makes sense. They all have a place, they all belong here. But this horrid, vacuous "like, you know" affected accent stuff?

Likewise with people who spend most of their lives here and make a point of not speaking with an Irish accent. Get over yourselves. It always reminds me of William Lecky's (1838-1903) famous observation that even the "most worthless" member of his own community "even if he had nothing else to boast of, at least found it pleasing to think that he was a member of a dominant race". The parents of Shane Ross, who sent him to Rugby in England for an education, are classic examples of this sort of chump. The parents of Henry Mountcharles in Slane, who sent him to Harrow in England, are another two. It's as political a statement of their unionism as it is an ethnic statement of who they are not.

Surely people are entitled to send their children to school wherever they like? In a community increasingly threatened by absorption in the Republic it's hardly surprising that those who can afford to send their children to England do so? The Republic is still a cold place for many in the the minority population and no amount of rhetoric about the meaning of the green, white and orange on the flag will alter that.

Erik Shin

BeerWolf wrote: »

I'm Irish, but when people see me they think I'm Spanish, and if they hear me they think I'm American... :pac:

Not you, but this is a phenomenon that is becoming more common amongst children...English and American accents from watching kids shows on television

Erik Shin

Erik Shin wrote: »

Not you, but this is a phenomenon that is becoming more common amongst children...English and American accents from watching kids shows on television

Definitely. My sister has an American twang despite growing up in Kerry. Also, a family friend has a daughter who speaks with what seems like a full-blown American accent despite never living there, she grew up in Phibsboro.

suicide_circus

Rayne Tart Cockpit wrote: »

then those limey bastards there for decades sounding like they just stepped off the plane.

That's a racial slur we just don't hear enough

_Dara_

humberklog wrote: »

Chris De Burgh is Argentinian.

English and Irish parentage. He just happened to be born in Argentina because his father was a diplomat there when he was born.

_Dara_

Erik Shin wrote: »

Not you, but this is a phenomenon that is becoming more common amongst children...English and American accents from watching kids shows on television

I know, I met a cousin of my husband's recently. Mid-20s, Dublin- and Wexford-raised, has never lived outside Ireland. She spoke with a distinct American accent and used the words 'store' (instead of shop) and 'impactful'. Nooooooo!

American TV shows don't explain this phenomenon IMO, we've been getting shows from the US for 25 years or more. And actually with TV watching more fragmented now, I don't know if American imports are watched en masse the way they were twenty years ago. No half the country sitting down to watch a 'Friends' these days.

bobbyss

Deleted User wrote:

Was listening to the superb Documentary on One series on RTRadio 1 today. For the first time I couldn't, like, continue, like listening. It was, like, about, like,

What's strange is that adults also are influenced by this American influence. Listen to Miriam O' Callaghan with her upward intonation. Even more remarkable is the odd culchie TD has this. Xpose's presenters, no spring chickens, go around talking as if they were fourteen year old girls from USA.

Erik Shin

bobbyss wrote: »

What's strange is that adults also are influenced by this American influence. Listen to Miriam O' Callaghan with her upward intonation. Even more remarkable is the odd culchie TD has this. Xpose's presenters, no spring chickens, go around talking as if they were fourteen year old girls from USA.

Australian upspeak is a pet hate of mine....it sounds like they're asking a question everytime they open their mouths

Wibbs

_Dara_ wrote: »

American TV shows don't explain this phenomenon IMO, we've been getting shows from the US for 25 years or more. And actually with TV watching more fragmented now, I don't know if American imports are watched en masse the way they were twenty years ago.

Well over 25 years alright. As a kid of the 70's I was hooked on such programmes as Kojak, Starsky and Hutch, Charles Angels, Grizzly Adams, The Bionic Man, Hawaii Five O, M.A.S.H, The Rockford Files and all the rest. The airwaves were chock full of that stuff. Certainly if you were getting the "pipe TV" in Dublin and surrounds we were probably directly exposed to more US shows than British and certainly Irish, than today(more a captive audience for a start). Yet none of us picked up the accent(though did pick up loan words).

I think the difference before and certainly when I was a kid was that actual American accents were fine, but this fake "mid Atlantic" accent was seen as the preserve of bad pirate radio/local dischoo DJ's and mocked as irredeemably tacky, false and sad. If any of my peers had used "mom" or "store" in 70/80's Dublin* they would have been slagged to within an inch of their lives. In the 80's I knew a girl who had been born and raised in America and she came in for some gentle slagging about "mooooom" and "stoooore". If a "local" had aped her accent... It was much more about the accent than American English loan words. We had and have plenty of the latter.

It would be generational thing. This recent Irish mid Atlantic whiny drawl really grates on my ears and TBH and I know it to be wrong, but I find it hard to take someone seriously with such an accent and assume I have to dial back my brain in any communication with them.


*I say Dublin as apparently it was in use in Kerry/the West, though I genuinely never heard it personally until the late 90's. And I holidayed in Kerry/The West on the fairly regular.

Erik Shin

The difference between growing up in the 70's and today is television saturation.
In the 70's you had 1 TV channel..... today....kids are woken up by tv, it's their babysitter....they hear the American accent constantly...it's a different scenario completely to when we grew up

RhubarbCrumble

uch wrote: »

Do you say schhhtuff instead of stuff

Not yet . . . . .

bobbyss

I feel sorry for anyone over eighteen who speaks like Monica from Friends.