Heavyweight Boxing

walshb

normanoffside wrote: »

Agreed, but you have to admit that Ortiz has the air of a sturdy enough fellow about him.
Never been hurt by anyone but wilder and in this case he is gone with 1 punch.
It was something like when Hearns KO'ed Duran (Duran always having a sturdy beard)- OK i am not comparing Duran to Ortiz but you get the point.

Even Brezeale hasn't appeared to be weak chinned against anyone but Wilder. He took plenty from AJ and lasted 7 rounds.

Ortiz lasts a few rds against prime Tyson and Foreman and Lewis....

Would they dispatch him with one shot? They could well.....or several...

yourdeadwright

The Nal wrote: »

Hmm not so sure about that. Foreman threw a lot more and was inaccurate but when he landed that was usually that.

I know what your saying and don't disagree but in 13 fights Foreman failed to knock out his opponent ,
For Wilder its one and many think the ref count was slow,

walshb

yourdeadwright wrote: »

I know what your saying and don't disagree but in 13 fights Foreman failed to knock out his opponent ,
For Wilder its one and many think the ref count was slow,

Ali was one of those. So was Holyfield, and so were a fair few when George was not at prime....

And he had a load more fights than Wilder.

yourdeadwright

walshb wrote: »

Ali was one of those. So was Holyfield, and so were a fair few when George was not at prime....

And he had a load more fights than Wilder.

I know its hard to compare present with past guys , Much fairer when they are both done and dusted ,


Its just my opinion but I can never remember seeing someone with as much one shot power as Wilder, he doesn't even need to soften guys up its literally the right lands and its game over,

selectamatic

normanoffside wrote: »

Agreed, but you have to admit that Ortiz has the air of a sturdy enough fellow about him.
Never been hurt by anyone but wilder and in this case he is gone with 1 punch.
It was something like when Hearns KO'ed Duran (Duran always having a sturdy beard)- OK i am not comparing Duran to Ortiz but you get the point.

Even Brezeale hasn't appeared to be weak chinned against anyone but Wilder. He took plenty from AJ and lasted 7 rounds.

The question I'd have with Ortiz would be whether his chin has lessened in resistance with age as he's certainly getting on in years. And especially since being cracked a couple of times in their first fight.

The AJ Brezeale fight was kinda around that time most were saying AJ needs rounds. You can kinda see that mantra playing out during their fight as Joshua was very very methodical. Brezeale was very beat up by the end of it though.

Very hard judge Wilders power in terms of historic punchers but he sure is making for great viewing at the moment.

As said above it's not the fight, its the anticipation that is so intriguing.

nacho libre

walshb wrote: »

I think the 'hit harder than anyone' argument/discussion is just pointless....

Personally I think Lennox Lewis probably generated the single greatest force from any one single punch....

Of course, I cannot know this...

Lewis was also a far better overall puncher than Wilder.

Lewish had better technique and great power too, but a lot of times he needed two or three punches to finish a guy, whereas Wilder can do it regularly with one shot.
I suppose the only way we could ever know is if Wilder was to face someone, who is known to have legendary punch resistance, and knocked them out. However I can't think of anyone in the heavyweight division like that now

walshb

Watching the Ortiz KO again. It's probably the best shot in Wilder's career to illustrate his effortless power. He gently threw that shot. No back of the hall type swing. No even snappy. Just gently pushed through from short range....

squinn2912

walshb wrote: »

Watching the Ortiz KO again. It's probably the best shot in Wilder's career to illustrate his effortless power. He gently threw that shot. No back of the hall type swing. No even snappy. Just gently pushed through from short range....

Wonderfully timed and delivered in a flash as Ortiz had switched off. The jab surprised him. Similar to Rachmann. Tell Luis it was gentle some day!

Bobby Baccala

Can't call Povetkin/Parker on the Ruiz undercard, Povetkin is slowing down but still had more than enough to outbox a much younger man in Fury. Parker is also a lot smaller than Hughie but hes a far better boxer imo.

Is there any other decent fights on that card?

yourdeadwright

Bobby Baccala wrote: »

Can't call Povetkin/Parker on the Ruiz undercard, Povetkin is slowing down but still had more than enough to outbox a much younger man in Fury. Parker is also a lot smaller than Hughie but hes a far better boxer imo.

Is Povetkin not fighting Hunter ?

Bobby Baccala

yourdeadwright wrote: »

Bobby Baccala wrote: »

Can't call Povetkin/Parker on the Ruiz undercard, Povetkin is slowing down but still had more than enough to outbox a much younger man in Fury. Parker is also a lot smaller than Hughie but hes a far better boxer imo.

Is Povetkin not fighting Hunter ?

Yep mixed up Hunter and Parker

fitzparker

Dillian Whyte added to Card next week

yourdeadwright

fitzparker wrote: »

Dillian Whyte added to Card next week

What happened with his B sample,
Very strange Eddie never gave anyone the whole story on this said legally he can't , to me that scream something is wrong,

The Rivas fight was for a WBC mandatory shot, if he now goes away from WBC and sets sight on another title that tells us there must be something up ,


I reckon they found a loop hole to get him off and hence why there saying nothing , Its obvious there is something to hide here,

normanoffside

yourdeadwright wrote: »

What happened with his B sample,
Very strange Eddie never gave anyone the whole story on this said legally he can't , to me that scream something is wrong,

The Rivas fight was for a WBC mandatory shot, if he now goes away from WBC and sets sight on another title that tells us there must be something up ,


I reckon they found a loop hole to get him off and hence why there saying nothing , Its obvious there is something to hide here,

I think the UKAD finding only suspends him from fighting in the UK

Cyrus

From what Eddie was saying to Bunce and Costello on the podcast he has not been suspended by bbboc which means ukad haven’t suspended him .

Seems odd

There’s a suggestion Eddie has added him to the card to prompt them to come out and make an announcement

normanoffside

Cyrus wrote: »

From what Eddie was saying to Bunce and Costello on the podcast he has not been suspended by bbboc which means ukad haven’t suspended him .

Seems odd

There’s a suggestion Eddie has added him to the card to prompt them to come out and make an announcement

Investigations are still ongoing. It will only be announced when it's done, but the point I am making is that a UKAD suspension will only affect fighting in the UK, not Saudi Arabia

yourdeadwright

Cyrus wrote: »

From what Eddie was saying to Bunce and Costello on the podcast he has not been suspended by bbboc which means ukad haven’t suspended him .

Seems odd

There’s a suggestion Eddie has added him to the card to prompt them to come out and make an announcement

I seen Ryan Martin just got a 4 year ban from UKAD a year after his test ,
Could Eddie be just throwing Dillian Another pay day before he actually gets suspended for real ? Looking at the fight itself it makes little sense ,

Wasn't the Rivas fight for the mandatory positon ?

yourdeadwright

normanoffside wrote: »

Investigations are still ongoing. It will only be announced when it's done, but the point I am making is that a UKAD suspension will only affect fighting in the UK, not Saudi Arabia

I don't think so as I read he actually isn't suspended at all by UKAD ( until the finish there investigation ) , Even the WBC changed there stance and he isn't suspended bythem currently ,

Cyrus

normanoffside wrote: »

Investigations are still ongoing. It will only be announced when it's done, but the point I am making is that a UKAD suspension will only affect fighting in the UK, not Saudi Arabia

Either he is a drugs cheat or not how long can it take ?

And he isn’t suspended in the uk

normanoffside

Cyrus wrote: »

Either he is a drugs cheat or not how long can it take ?

And he isn’t suspended in the uk

I can’t be 100% sure but I get the feeling that, although not (yet) banned he won’t get a fight sanctioned in the UK until after the UKAD investigation is finalised (assuming he is found not guilty).
If found guilty his suspension will be backdated.

Same thing happened Fury except nothing came out until a few years after at which pint he had already served his suspension.
Fury fought Klitschko after he had been popped by UKAD but we didn’t know at the time.

Cyrus

normanoffside wrote: »

I can’t be 100% sure but I get the feeling that, although not (yet) banned he won’t get a fight sanctioned in the UK until after the UKAD investigation is finalised (assuming he is found not guilty).
If found guilty his suspension will be backdated.

Same thing happened Fury except nothing came out until a few years after at which pint he had already served his suspension.
Fury fought Klitschko after he had been popped by UKAD but we didn’t know at the time.

The Rivas fight went ahead ?

normanoffside

Cyrus wrote: »

The Rivas fight went ahead ?

That’s true but the B sample hadn’t been tested and they got the lawyers involved to argue that point. It will have been tested by now. His lawyers will be arguing ‘tainted supplements’ in the background.

normanoffside

normanoffside wrote: »

Investigations are still ongoing. It will only be announced when it's done, but the point I am making is that a UKAD suspension will only affect fighting in the UK, not Saudi Arabia

This is confirmed by the fact Eric Molina is on the Saudi Card is just finishing a 2 year UKAD ban but has been fighting away outside the UK in the meantime.

Mantis Toboggan

It's no wonder the top lads are all juicing when the sanctions are so weak.

walshb

Mantis Toboggan wrote: »

It's no wonder the top lads are all juicing when the sanctions are so weak.

No, they're not all juicing......unless you know something I don't?

yourdeadwright

walshb wrote: »

No, they're not all juicing......unless you know something I don't?

It wouldn't surprise me if they where ,


Look at all the top heavy weights who have been caught,
You have the stories around AJ for years plus he is the only top heavy weight not signed to VADA all year testing


Wilder's brother who has the same team and same camp as him got caught in the summer, Nothing would surprise me at this stage

walshb

yourdeadwright wrote: »

It wouldn't surprise me if they where ,


Look at all the top heavy weights who have been caught,
You have the stories around AJ for years plus he is the only top heavy weight not signed to VADA all year testing


Wilder's brother who has the same team and same camp as him got caught in the summer, Nothing would surprise me at this stage

Well, for now in the heavies all we know is that Povetkin and Fury and Whyte and Millar are,or were juicers...I would say these are "top" lads...

Ruiz and AJ and Wilder are clean as far as we know.

yourdeadwright

walshb wrote: »

Well, for now in the heavies all we know is that Povetkin and Fury and Whyte and Millar are,or were juicers...I would say these are "top" lads...

Ruiz and AJ and Wilder are clean as far as we know.

Would it surprise you if any of the three popped ?
Wouldn't surprise me at all but I guess innocent till proven other wise,

walshb

yourdeadwright wrote: »

Would it surprise you if any of the three popped ?
Wouldn't surprise me at all but I guess innocent till proven other wise,

Of course it wouldn't surprise me....same with many other examples across other sports.

But that's neither here nor there...

squinn2912

Here’s one. If you found out that they were all on helpers would you continue to watch? I don’t see it ever being fixed