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Wrongly fined €150 for illegal dumping

  • 14-07-2017 11:17pm
    #1
    Registered Users Posts: 605 ✭✭✭ paulb06


    Hi,

    Would like some advice.

    We availed of a 'classified' ad in Northside People in April for someone to come and fix a gutter issue where birds were nesting.

    The man came out to my mother on her own while I was in work, had a look at the problem and quoted her €3.5k to sort it out. She said no way, however he went and done it anyway and demanded €2000 after the work was done. Basically a cowboy builder, anyway to cut a long story short, he ended up taking just €200 from us which already explains the type of person he was.

    The issue I have is that he emptied our attic out of the stuff that was up there (old stuff that we never threw out, black bags) - my mam didn't know all my personal stuff was there either, he put them all in his truck (after leaving and coming back with 4 other men) then he went and 'fixed' the gutter telling us the rubbish would be sent to a recycling facility - never received evidence of this and now I know why.

    Only today have I received a illegal littering fine of €150, the absolute moron dumped the rubbish and never sent it to a recycling facility, I received a photo from the council of a big pile of rubbish, all of it was not mine, with photocopies of my wage slips (shoebox of all old wage slips that I kept was taken when he took all the black bags from the attic)

    I have the classified ad still as the experience we had was disgraceful.

    What are my options regarding appealing this fine?

    I am willing to fight this all the way, my mother was intimidated by this asshole and he knew this.

    I have screenshots of conversations with friends over what happened back in April so I am hoping this will be some sort of evidence to show what went on and that it wasn't us who dumped this, furthermore if I was illegally dumping, which I NEVER would, why would I be that stupid to throw out all my wage slips and personal information with them?

    Sorry for the long post.


«1345

Comments

  • Registered Users Posts: 4,057 ✭✭✭ whomitconcerns


    What's the connection between the gutters and the attic... Sorry this didn't add up.... But you have no come back anyway as you allowed this person dump.


  • Registered Users Posts: 605 ✭✭✭ paulb06


    What's the connection between the gutters and the attic... Sorry this didn't add up.... But you have no come back anyway as you allowed this person dump.

    I allowed this person to dump? Seriously? Good man.

    To access the problem, you need access through the attic to check the extent of the problem - that is the connection.

    The attic was full of black bags stored up there over the years.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 8,600 jca


    Did you seriously think this person who already had tried to fool your mother was going to do the right thing with your black bags? He dropped his extortionate price and accepted 200 to clear off, come on you can't be that gormless. Just pay the fine and move on.


  • Registered Users Posts: 8,558 ✭✭✭ degsie


    You knew you were being conned by these 'gentlemen' and yet allowed them to take your rubbish and it all backfired?

    Lesson learned, suck it up and move on. You will know better next time. You are not the first and you wont be the last.


  • Registered Users Posts: 8,997 ✭✭✭ Senna


    You want to fight this by telling some story that makes no sense and you have evidence of text messages from your friends??
    Pay the fine and don't be so silly again.


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  • Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 6,769 Mod ✭✭✭✭ nuac


    Both the gutters con and the "I'll get rid of all that for you sir" have been well known scams for decades.

    They take a few quid to get rid of rubbish. Instead of bringing it to an approved landfill site, and paying their charges, they chuck the bags into a handy ditch. They will have first taken anything of value from the rubbish. If they have spotted anything else of value around the house they may be back

    If you can identify the guy you dealt with, make a full statement to the Council. THey might just proceed against him and leave you out of it. The Council might be anxious to stop his activities

    AGS would also be interested. Four or five strangers going into a lone woman's house is not on.
    They may already know these lads

    You would have to give evidence of the transaction. Did you get a receipt for the 200 Euro? VAT?( OK, joking ) Anything to identify him on the van? Did you take his regn number? Have you neighbourhood watch in your area?. If so, there may be some info on this lad in the local AGS station.

    Talk to your solicitor re proofs. Usually DJs expect rather more than screen-grabs of text messages to third parties.

    Get your mother a mobile thru' which she can send an alert to you or others re unwanted callers. e.g. the basic Doro phone sends out a preset emergency text message on unobtrusively pressing an alarm button.


  • Registered Users Posts: 605 ✭✭✭ paulb06


    degsie wrote: »
    You knew you were being conned by these 'gentlemen' and yet allowed them to take your rubbish and it all backfired?

    Lesson learned, suck it up and move on. You will know better next time. You are not the first and you wont be the last.

    Read the post, I was in work, my mother was on her own. He took the rubbish before I even got home - she's not the type to put up a fight, she didn't 'know' she was being conned.

    And no I will not suck it up and move on, I will appeal if I can and will see where that gets me.


  • Registered Users Posts: 605 ✭✭✭ paulb06


    Senna wrote: »
    You want to fight this by telling some story that makes no sense and you have evidence of text messages from your friends??
    Pay the fine and don't be so silly again.


    Senna, again can I also ask you to read the original post? Can you do that and come back to me before posting such a pointless post?

    Please explain to me now what doesn't make sense about this story and I will answer any queries you have.

    I have evidence of what happened at the time, telling friends and family of the time line of events.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 18,277 ✭✭✭✭ Callie Damp Geek


    Your op says you were aware he took it. You could have said no and give it back to me...you didn't.
    Sorry, your responsibility!


  • Registered Users Posts: 605 ✭✭✭ paulb06


    nuac wrote: »
    Both the gutters con and the "I'll get rid of all that for you sir" have been well known scams for decades.

    They take a few quid to get rid of rubbish. Instead of bringing it to an approved landfill site, and paying their charges, they chuck the bags into a handy ditch.

    If you can identify the guy you dealt with, make a full statement to the Council. THey might just proceed against him and leave you out of it. The Council might be anxious to stop his activities

    You would have to give evidence of the transaction.

    Ensure your mother does not deal with casual callers, and in particular does not let them into the house

    Thank you, yes don't worry I have told her this already and won't be availing of people like this again. Yes she said she can clearly identify him. I will look to get a full statement provided to them.

    Look to be honest, €150 is not the issue here it's the experience we went though in the first place, then to have this come through the letterbox is very frustrating and I want this prick stopped because it's clear he is doing this all the time.

    Am I able to post a photo of the ad?


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  • Registered Users Posts: 605 ✭✭✭ paulb06


    Your op says you were aware he took it. You could have said no and give it back to me...you didn't.
    Sorry, your responsibility!

    My mother called me after he had left, crying down the phone that she has to go down to the bank and withdraw €2,000, that he will be back at 2pm to collect the money. (he being the man who arrived on his own before getting the other 4)

    The bags were gone at the stage when she called.

    She was intimidated, frightened and wanted them out of the house - there was no telling them to leave the bags there.

    5 men versus my 65 year old mother. What would you do?


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 8,556 ✭✭✭ Roger Hassenforder


    its worth a shot, you've nothing to lose.
    have you a waste collection service? i.e. you have your waste disposed of properly.
    if you're willing to testify (might not even come to it) this was your material removed from your attic without your permission.
    submit the flyer and shop the bollix, Councils regularly carry out stings on these cnuts

    get cracking, you've 21 days


  • Registered Users Posts: 605 ✭✭✭ paulb06


    its worth a shot, you've nothing to lose.
    have you a waste collection service? i.e. you have your waste disposed of properly.
    if you're willing to testify (might not even come to it) this was your material removed from your attic without your permission.
    submit the flyer and shop the bollix, Councils regularly carry out stings on these cnuts

    get cracking, you've 21 days

    Exactly I'm happy to take this as far as possible if it means getting this idiot shut down or caught.

    Yes we have a waste collection service.


  • Registered Users Posts: 51 ✭✭✭ Dr Ben


    paulb06 wrote: »
    Hi,

    Would like some advice.

    We availed of a 'classified' ad in Northside People in April for someone to come and fix a gutter issue where birds were nesting.

    The man came out to my mother on her own while I was in work, had a look at the problem and quoted her €3.5k to sort it out. She said no way, however he went and done it anyway and demanded €2000 after the work was done. Basically a cowboy builder, anyway to cut a long story short, he ended up taking just €200 from us which already explains the type of person he was.

    The issue I have is that he emptied our attic out of the stuff that was up there (old stuff that we never threw out, black bags) - my mam didn't know all my personal stuff was there either, he put them all in his truck (after leaving and coming back with 4 other men) then he went and 'fixed' the gutter telling us the rubbish would be sent to a recycling facility - never received evidence of this and now I know why.

    Only today have I received a illegal littering fine of €150, the absolute moron dumped the rubbish and never sent it to a recycling facility, I received a photo from the council of a big pile of rubbish, all of it was not mine, with photocopies of my wage slips (shoebox of all old wage slips that I kept was taken when he took all the black bags from the attic)

    I have the classified ad still as the experience we had was disgraceful.

    What are my options regarding appealing this fine?

    I am willing to fight this all the way, my mother was intimidated by this asshole and he knew this.

    I have screenshots of conversations with friends over what happened back in April so I am hoping this will be some sort of evidence to show what went on and that it wasn't us who dumped this, furthermore if I was illegally dumping, which I NEVER would, why would I be that stupid to throw out all my wage slips and personal information with them?

    Sorry for the long post.


    By any chance was this guy a member of the travelling community who also does gardening work ?


  • Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 117 ✭✭ alig123aileen


    Hi there what a terrible experience for your mum and you I hope you ar both recovering. If the fine is from your local council write to the freedom of information officer - the email address is usually on their website and get a copy of your file which should show documentary evidence of why they decided to fine you. Did you report the incident to the police can you verify it in that way. I have always thought those fines cannot be upheld because finding a letter with your name on it does not mean you dumped it. Engage your local councillor too! In reading through some of the replies to your post I despair as there seem to be some posters who lack any emotional intelligence or empathy and instead attack people like moral police. It's so sad this stuff permeates online especially when someone had had a tough experience and asks for advice. Those who posted personal attacks must never have made an error of judgement in their lives:) I wish you and your mum well and I hope you get it sorted.


  • Registered Users Posts: 37,525 ✭✭✭✭ the_syco


    paulb06 wrote: »
    The issue I have is that he emptied our attic out of the stuff that was up there (old stuff that we never threw out, black bags) - my mam didn't know all my personal stuff was there either, he put them all in his truck (after leaving and coming back with 4 other men) then he went and 'fixed' the gutter telling us the rubbish would be sent to a recycling facility - never received evidence of this and now I know why.
    Personally, I'd pay the €150 and ask if you could have the black bags back. Explain what happened, and you may get your stuff back.

    Don't chase the scumbag, as there's nothing stopping him coming back whilst you're at work to terrorize your mum. Nothing. And if he's part of a certain protected minority, he won't care about the law.

    And if you testify against him, there's 4 others that know where you live. For the €150, it's not worth it in the long run.


  • Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 6,769 Mod ✭✭✭✭ nuac


    paulb06 wrote: »
    Thank you, yes don't worry I have told her this already and won't be availing of people like this again. Yes she said she can clearly identify him. I will look to get a full statement provided to them.

    Look to be honest, €150 is not the issue here it's the experience we went though in the first place, then to have this come through the letterbox is very frustrating and I want this prick stopped because it's clear he is doing this all the time.

    Am I able to post a photo of the ad?

    No point in posting copy of ad here.

    Include it in your statement to the council.

    I see a mention in another post here that your mother was put under some pressure to go to her bank. AGS should have been called at that,

    Reviewing this thread, I am wondering if there is something more you should share with us here?
    E.g.You seem rather relaxed about these lads' efforts to get a large amount of money from your mother. Most people would have called AGS and their solicitor at that stage.

    One wonders........................


  • Registered Users Posts: 705 ✭✭✭ tigerboon


    Ah janey, your poor mum, what a pack of scumbags. That is all they are. I have no advice on any issues, bar the fact that you ignore the idiots who are somehow trying to blame you. I have elderly parents living in a rural area which has seen loads of break-in's lately. We all know who is at it. Take all the good advice others gave you and do try and bring this forward, you have so much evidence there, surely the guards can get these feckers when they are in the system. Good luck.


  • Registered Users Posts: 8,558 ✭✭✭ degsie


    Whatever about the circumstances regarding the removal of material, the council have to be praised for following up on illegal dumping.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,831 ✭✭✭ heldel00


    I totally agree degsie but I'd rather see a heftier fine than €150 being dished out.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 1,202 ✭✭✭ Mrs Shuttleworth


    paulb06 wrote: »
    My mother called me after he had left, crying down the phone that she has to go down to the bank and withdraw €2,000, that he will be back at 2pm to collect the money. (he being the man who arrived on his own before getting the other 4)

    The bags were gone at the stage when she called.

    She was intimidated, frightened and wanted them out of the house - there was no telling them to leave the bags there.

    5 men versus my 65 year old mother. What would you do?

    Call AGS.

    I'm reading your posts and timeline and I'm sorry but I'm not following it.


  • Registered Users Posts: 9,178 ✭✭✭ lucernarian


    I don't think it's all that hard to follow, certainly the Gardaí should be getting involved and there is a far bigger issue than the fine itself here.

    I would assume the fine can be contested in court (at risk of a bigger fine I assume, if things don't go through OP's way).


  • Subscribers Posts: 35,684 ✭✭✭✭ sydthebeat


    Who advertises in a newspaper for gutter cleaning? Did you put your address in the ad?


    A quick Google throws up about 7 or 8 options for North Side Dublin... And that took about 10 seconds.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,147 ✭✭✭ Comerman


    It's a horrible thing to do to ordinary decent folk but that's the type of fcuker you are dealing with and in my honest opinion if you follow up on all this (which I would feel like doing too if it was my Mam) you could be opening a whole can of worms, you work and your mam is at home and this cnut knows that. It's a long shot but if there was a large ammount of rubbish dumped maybe the council have cameras there? If the scum has dumped there and got away with it he'll be back again with his next victims stuff. There's a card you can get your Mam from the gardai that basically says "stick your details down here and I'll give you a call" and get her the free neighbourhood watch sticker for the door too.


  • Registered Users Posts: 605 ✭✭✭ paulb06


    Dr Ben wrote: »
    By any chance was this guy a member of the travelling community who also does gardening work ?

    No he wasn't a member of the traveling community, his company if you want to call it that was to to with gardening work yes.


  • Registered Users Posts: 605 ✭✭✭ paulb06


    In reading through some of the replies to your post I despair as there seem to be some posters who lack any emotional intelligence or empathy and instead attack people like moral police. It's so sad this stuff permeates online especially when someone had had a tough experience and asks for advice. Those who posted personal attacks must never have made an error of judgement in their lives:) I wish you and your mum well and I hope you get it sorted.

    Thank you! Yes it boils my blood reading replies like that but it's expected I suppose! No we never got the gardai involved as we were just happy they went and happy that was the end of it. My mother was so scared that had she not have called us she was getting the next bus down to the bank to make the withdrawal.


  • Registered Users Posts: 605 ✭✭✭ paulb06


    the_syco wrote: »
    Personally, I'd pay the €150 and ask if you could have the black bags back. Explain what happened, and you may get your stuff back.

    Don't chase the scumbag, as there's nothing stopping him coming back whilst you're at work to terrorize your mum. Nothing. And if he's part of a certain protected minority, he won't care about the law.

    And if you testify against him, there's 4 others that know where you live. For the €150, it's not worth it in the long run.

    Yeah I know what you mean, and I was so close of naming and shaming the company through different avenues of social media, but thought against it for that exact reason.


  • Registered Users Posts: 605 ✭✭✭ paulb06


    nuac wrote: »
    No point in posting copy of ad here.

    Include it in your statement to the council.

    I see a mention in another post here that your mother was put under some pressure to go to her bank. AGS should have been called at that,

    Reviewing this thread, I am wondering if there is something more you should share with us here?
    E.g.You seem rather relaxed about these lads' efforts to get a large amount of money from your mother. Most people would have called AGS and their solicitor at that stage.

    One wonders........................

    Sorry I have no idea who AGS are. We were far from relaxed about it, when he came back the price was negotiated with us being present with my mam, the cheek of him actually coming back to take money in the first place as he knew exactly what he was doing, I suggested that we call the gardai before he arrived but we never did and totally regret it now after what's happened - we were advised to call gardai after but didn't because again, we were just happy it was finished. He was happy to take whenever he could and left in a heartbeat. He told us the rubbish was gone to a recycling plant.

    There's nothing more to tell, this is something that's never happened before and what should've been done(or more so what wasn't done) in the first place is great in hindsight.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,428 ✭✭✭ Needs Must


    I don't hold out much hope for you having this resolved to your satisfaction. Unless your mother got a receipt for the work done and it included removal of black bags. Otherwise he will deny it and it's your mother's word against his.
    The evidence against your mother is greater than him if no receipt exists. I think it's an expensive lesson learned and move on.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 605 ✭✭✭ paulb06


    Needs Must wrote: »
    I don't hold out much hope for you having this resolved to your satisfaction. Unless your mother got a receipt for the work done and it included removal of black bags. Otherwise he will deny it and it's your mother's word against his.
    The evidence against your mother is greater than him if no receipt exists. I think it's an expensive lesson learned and move on.


    Yes I agree, I will appeal it anyway and see how it goes. I'm sure I'm not the only victim to this clown either. While I can't ultimately prove it wasn't us that dumped it, I have relevant dated evidence to state what happened that day the evidence states that he "took all the stuff from the attic and put it in his truck" So I'll put this forward see what they say.

    I'll have no issue with paying the €150 if the appeal is unsuccessful but I'm not just giving in and paying up straight away, that's for people who are actually guilty of illegal dumping.


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