Why is RTÉ clinging on to Tubs, D'Arcy, Duffy etc?

political analyst

Why the hell is RTÉ still paying huge amounts of money to Tubridy, Joe Duffy and Ray D'Arcy?

RTÉ, given its relatively small size, cannot keep paying these people six-figure sums to present radio and TV programmes that any experienced presenter could anchor.

If RTÉ wasn't paying these big names such amounts then maybe it wouldn't be in situation that it's in - the mothballing of Prime Time every August, peak-time repeats during the summer, the joke of a show that is entitled "Ireland's Fittest Family".

The consternation about the big names' salaries can be seen in the comments section of the following page:

http://www.thejournal.ie/dee-forbes-licence-fee-3491383-Jul2017/

Elmo

Have these wages not always come with consternation?

No real point defending the game indefensible.

But RTÉ will spend another 80,000 per on redC Audience research and are looking for new PR company do deal with PR.

BuilderPlumber

It baffles me too why those 3 you mention along with others like Pat Kenny are commanding or have commanded such pay now and in the past. Clearly this is why RTE is 'broke' and clearly these people (who are doing an easy job) don't deserve that kind of pay. Would the world stop turning if we had no Ryan Tubridy, Pat Kenny, Joe Duffy or whoever? Are these people doing jobs that save people's lives? No. Are they doing work that betters Irish society? The opposite actually: handpicked individuals are forced at us while people with more to offer are ignored and given no help.

Why are RTE making or have made gods of the likes of affore mentioned presenters? It has always baffled me and always will. None of them have anything special to offer, anyone can do what they do, and they work very little and what they do anyway is hardly work. Better use could be put with that money.

iseegirls

I don't agree with RTE looking for a licence fee increase, neither do I think poaching Ray D'Arcy from Today FM made any financial sense.

However, with Joe Duffy - he does command such a huge listenership. About 400,000 people listen to the show on a daily basis. Same with Ryan Tubridy - biggest talk show in Ireland commanding half a million viewers for around 38 Fridays of the year - generating a huge amount of advertising revenue. So people do like these 2 shows and are getting their value for the licence fee.

Should RTE stick with these, or should they risk going for an unknown and falling ratings/listenership? If they promoted Miriam to Late Late Show - she'll command nearly the same wage that Ryan was on.

You get what you pay for really.

BuilderPlumber

iseegirls wrote: »

I don't agree with RTE looking for a licence fee increase, neither do I think poaching Ray D'Arcy from Today FM made any financial sense.

However, with Joe Duffy - he does command such a huge listenership. About 400,000 people listen to the show on a daily basis. Same with Ryan Tubridy - biggest talk show in Ireland commanding half a million viewers for around 38 Fridays of the year - generating a huge amount of advertising revenue. So people do like these 2 shows and are getting their value for the licence fee.

Should RTE stick with these, or should they risk going for an unknown and falling ratings/listenership? If they promoted Miriam to Late Late Show - she'll command nearly the same wage that Ryan was on.

You get what you pay for really.

I agree Joe Duffy's show is popular and it at times does serve a purpose and does some good. Tubridy's show is watched by many too and while poor, it is an institution here for better or worse.

The problem I have is that these people are paid way too much and surely they could be paid less. On top of this, they could do more to help the people who have talent rather than just forcing the same individuals on us all the time. Everyone deserves a chance and the media should be open not closed to the people.

Elmo

There are two case studies for star power at RTE
The first is Ian Dempsey. From what I can see RTE at the time didn't think much of Iano. Ian was just on before Gerry Ryan in the morning. With the rebrand of Radio Ireland to Today FM they possibly thought that no Radio presenter would escape to the new service considering Marty Whelan on Century Radio. Ian made the jump as did his audience. This was also down to TodayFM making a name for themselves nationally with The Last Word something Century didn't have time to do. RTE have really only had two long running morning shows on 2FM the current Breakfast Republic and The Full Irish with Tubrity. The rest have come and gone in the last 20 years, with most failing to take on Iano.

The second is Pat Kenny. Pat commanded high audiences on The Late Late Show, Tubrity retain these audiences. Pat's Frontline wasn't a major success but wasn't a major failure either, both Prime Time and Claire Byrne Live retained that audience. His move to Newstalk did nothing like Ian Dempsey's move, Ian halfed 2fm's audience, Sean O'Rourke retained almost all of PK's audience. PK's move to UTV Ireland in TV did little, the show was an attempt from him to show he wasn't just about Current Affairs, while I'd question if TV3 will keep PK Tonight.

Also Liveline isn't about Joe Duffy he wasn't the original presenter, they could easily have a new one in the morning.

RTE should take risks, it shouldn't be about the same old faces. While it is important to have the same people on the air it is also not good to become so attached to them. I see no need for RTE to spend any more than 150,000 on RTE stars, if they want more then they know where the door is.

In terms of Pay equality, I don't understand how news correspondents can be part of their top 10. Surely they should be on a payscale.

expectationlost

its about the guest and production as much as the host, if you have the content the host matter less. NO public broadcasting show should be arranged or named after the host.

the-island-man

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gu6d0ns-JJU

BuilderPlumber

the-island-man wrote: »

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gu6d0ns-JJU

These type of things were the only memorable contributions in Pat Kenny's drab chatshows of the 2000s and 2010s.

J.pilkington

I'd love to know how ye experts would value their services? Seriously are ye just just jumping on the band wagon and whinging for the sake of it or do ye have information on whether these presenters actually make RTÉ money.

I don't have any deep insight but do the consistently high late late viewership not speak for itself? It has a high paying title sponsor and regular ad breaks.

Compared to this lad who seems to do an identical job to tubridy yet his audience is only a quarter but gets paid more tubridy seems like great value.

http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-northern-ireland-40653578

RTÉ is a beast of a company and as it provides expensive content to multiple tv / radio and websites as well as public services (do ye think all the 1916 commemorations paid for themselves) it's going to be expensive to run. It's not black and white that oh yer man needs a pay cut because he earns X and then it will be grand

Elmo

J.pilkington wrote: »

I'd love to know how ye experts would value their services? Seriously are ye just just jumping on the band wagon and whinging for the sake of it or do ye have information on whether these presenters actually make RTÉ money.

I don't have any deep insight but do the consistently high late late viewership not speak for itself? It has a high paying title sponsor and regular ad breaks.

Compared to this lad who seems to do an identical job to tubridy yet his audience is only a quarter but gets paid more tubridy seems like great value.

http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-northern-ireland-40653578

RTÉ is a beast of a company and as it provides expensive content to multiple tv / radio and websites as well as public services (do ye think all the 1916 commemorations paid for themselves) it's going to be expensive to run. It's not black and white that oh yer man needs a pay cut because he earns X and then it will be grand

I have no problem in saying that BBC presenters are also pay far too much money.

Tubrity moved into Radio slots that gave him an audience. His work on 2fm did help them regain some lost ground in morning terms and did lead to him moving to RTÉ Radio 1 and getting Tubrity Tonight. However I do not beleive that the slot given to him on Radio 1 could not have been given to someone else, he didn't improve much on Murray's audiences, and he didn't work out as a replacement for Gerry Ryan on 2FM leading him to move back to the comfort of Radio 1. TV wise Tubrity had no competition and both O'Connor and D'Arcy have retain much of his audience, indeed so did Craig BBC Doyle. (Kenny Live did just as well). His move to the Late Late Show pretty much gave him an audience as it had done for Pat Kenny.

RTÉ lost 20 million last year. It produced just 2 dramas outside of Fair City and 1 comedy series. RTÉ ONE had 20% repeats in Prime Time, RTÉ2 had 45%. RTÉ2 has no adult news service. RTÉ reduce its spend on Children's TV by 25% in 2016. RTÉ spent 25m on imports. RTÉ employ 2000 people.

I can defend RTÉ as a PSB. It provide comprehenisive news (even if it goes on holidays during the summer), it has to fund the Orchestras, it funds a Children's programming, it funds an hour of TV for TG4, it funds RnaG, it funds Oireachtas TV, it has a 2 channels that don't carry adverts and so on.

Would any of these things changed if they paid Tubs etc less, absolutely not.

political analyst

J.pilkington wrote: »

I'd love to know how ye experts would value their services? Seriously are ye just just jumping on the band wagon and whinging for the sake of it or do ye have information on whether these presenters actually make RTmoney.

I don't have any deep insight but do the consistently high late late viewership not speak for itself? It has a high paying title sponsor and regular ad breaks.

Compared to this lad who seems to do an identical job to tubridy yet his audience is only a quarter but gets paid more tubridy seems like great value.

http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-northern-ireland-40653578

RTis a beast of a company and as it provides expensive content to multiple tv / radio and websites as well as public services (do ye think all the 1916 commemorations paid for themselves) it's going to be expensive to run. It's not black and white that oh yer man needs a pay cut because he earns X and then it will be grand

Stephen Nolan is a presenter on BBC Radio Five Live as well as BBC One Northern Ireland and Radio Ulster. I'm sure that Five Live has a much bigger number of listeners.

Elmo

J.pilkington wrote: »

I'd love to know how ye experts would value their services? Seriously are ye just just jumping on the band wagon and whinging for the sake of it or do ye have information on whether these presenters actually make RTÉ money.

I don't have any deep insight but do the consistently high late late viewership not speak for itself? It has a high paying title sponsor and regular ad

I love to know how a news correspondent and a current affairs presenter can claim they bring revenue or viewers to RTÉ.

BuilderPlumber

Elmo wrote: »

I have no problem in saying that BBC presenters are also pay far too much money.

Tubrity moved into Radio slots that gave him an audience. His work on 2fm did help them regain some lost ground in morning terms and did lead to him moving to RTRadio 1 and getting Tubrity Tonight. However I do not beleive that the slot given to him on Radio 1 could not have been given to someone else, he didn't improve much on Murray's audiences, and he didn't work out as a replacement for Gerry Ryan on 2FM leading him to move back to the comfort of Radio 1. TV wise Tubrity had no competition and both O'Connor and D'Arcy have retain much of his audience, indeed so did Craig BBC Doyle. (Kenny Live did just as well). His move to the Late Late Show pretty much gave him an audience as it had done for Pat Kenny.

RTlost 20 million last year. It produced just 2 dramas outside of Fair City and 1 comedy series. RTONE had 20% repeats in Prime Time, RT had 45%. RT has no adult news service. RTreduce its spend on Children's TV by 25% in 2016. RTspent 25m on imports. RTemploy 2000 people.

I can defend RTas a PSB. It provide comprehenisive news (even if it goes on holidays during the summer), it has to fund the Orchestras, it funds a Children's programming, it funds an hour of TV for TG4, it funds RnaG, it funds Oireachtas TV, it has a 2 channels that don't carry adverts and so on.

Would any of these things changed if they paid Tubs etc less, absolutely not.

For better or worse, the Late Late Show has an audience that follows it due to tradition. It goes back to when this show was genuinely popular in the Gay Byrne era. Kenny and Tubridy were handed a ready made audience when they took over.

Looking at Kenny and Tubridy and their shows gives us an insight into how poor they were and are. Kenny's Late Late Show in its final years was dire. Drab political commentary, boybands and awkward interviews was what characterised it. Controversial moments like he being attacked being called a 'piece of s***' or he tearing up the toy show tickets and joking 'there is nought as strange as folk' or something were the only memorable things.

Kenny went on then to do The Frontline, another drab political/economic based chatshow that was appalling and equally controversial. Moments like Kenny losing it after his house was called a trophy house or an angry mentally ill man roaring at him from the audience about his salary once more provided the only memorable moments. This boring chatshow was too concerned about just one topic: the then banking crisis. You get the feeling with these programmes that the presenter more than the audience is accommodated. It gave Kenny room to pontificate without having to do much research. It gave the audience a borefest.

Tubridy is no better and his Late Late Show just continued Kenny's and his own Tubridy Tonight. The same old guests were retained. Controversy was taken off the menu but boybands, handpicked individuals and the RTE 'canteen' was retained. An obsession with ex boyband members singing what is supposed to be 'country music' but is most certainly not was something Tubridy added.

RTE's dramas have returned to the restrained, tame format. While the likes of Clean Break, Striking Out and Rebellion were watchable, they were missing a vital spark and would not be something one would purchase on a DVD. RTE forked out a fortune on these type of programmes that no one wanted and all were ultimately a disappointment. They were middling fare that was not cheap to make either.

expectationlost

liveline is one thing, but the drivel done other shows in the afternoon is bizarre reading out little stupid things that some PR company has sent them, I don't know how the presenters can bare it.

Sam Russell

If they saved an average of €100,000 of their top 50 earners, it would save them €5 million - they lost €72 million last year. They would have to do a lot more.

If TV3 and TG4 paid their share of Saorview by going HD, they would save at least €2 million.

If RTE NN were allowed to carry adverts, they would pay for a viable news service. If RTE 2 was freed from the children's programmes and was a bit more along the lines that the viewers liked, it could turn a profit.

If they dropped the DAB nonsense, that would cut some of the losses.

Get more people to pay their TV licence fee.

Are we up to €5 million savings yet? Add the savings on top salaries and we might be into the black.

Elmo

Sam Russell wrote: »

If they saved an average of €100,000 of their top 50 earners, it would save them €5 million - they lost €72 million last year. They would have to do a lot more.

If TV3 and TG4 paid their share of Saorview by going HD, they would save at least €2 million.

If RTE NN were allowed to carry adverts, they would pay for a viable news service. If RTE 2 was freed from the children's programmes and was a bit more along the lines that the viewers liked, it could turn a profit.

If they dropped the DAB nonsense, that would cut some of the losses.

Get more people to pay their TV licence fee.

Are we up to €5 million savings yet? Add the savings on top salaries and we might be into the black.

I am not actually looking at it from a cost savings perspective. I have no issue with RTor any company paying staff well. RTs losses and loans are an issue hence the sale of land and redunances and even their call for a 15 euro increase in the licence fee.

I want to see RTproduce quality programming. This may help RTincrease audiences (traditional audiences, sales of programmes and online audiences).

The wages paid to the top presenters and executives are over the top, and while cutting may only save 5million, I like to see that 5 million invested into Drama/Comedy.

RTand Political Parties seem to be under the impression that increases to licence fee and cuts will hope to deliver the current content provided by RT the problem is that audiences aren't happy with their content and are become resentful of having to pay out for this content.

I have no problem with the idea of Quality of Quanity but I haven't seen this in the last 10 years, and if RTs only aim is to retain their current levels they will just continue down the same road as before.

As you can see E fada does not work on boards.ie from the desktop site.

Sam Russell

Elmo wrote: »

I am not actually looking at it from a cost savings perspective. I have no issue with RTor any company paying staff well. RTs losses and loans are an issue hence the sale of land and redunances and even their call for a 15 euro increase in the licence fee.

I want to see RTproduce quality programming. This may help RTincrease audiences (traditional audiences, sales of programmes and online audiences).

The wages paid to the top presenters and executives are over the top, and while cutting may only save 5million, I like to see that 5 million invested into Drama/Comedy.

RTand Political Parties seem to be under the impression that increases to licence fee and cuts will hope to deliver the current content provided by RT the problem is that audiences aren't happy with their content and are become resentful of having to pay out for this content.

I have no problem with the idea of Quality of Quanity but I haven't seen this in the last 10 years, and if RTs only aim is to retain their current levels they will just continue down the same road as before.

As you can see E fada does not work on boards.ie from the desktop site.

You are right.

Selling the family silver only works once. Selling the land to cover losses is not wise.

RTE are a public service broadcaster (some of the time) but they are also a commercial broadcaster and need to turn a profit. I would not like them to descend to the poor standards of TV3 but they do need to up their game.

Currently, if you watch RTE TV this week, you have seen it before or you are on holiday from somewhere else. That is also true of BBC.

mikeybrennan

Wasn't Vincent Browne on a fraction of the money at Tv3

I believe he said 55,000

Elmo

mikeybrennan wrote: »

Wasn't Vincent Browne on a fraction of the money at Tv3

I believe he said 55,000

I believe another report stated 400,000 PA. Though I think that was a 3 year deal which would put him on over 100,000 per year.

mikeybrennan

Kenny is worth good money,top broadcaster

Darcy and tubbs are worth buttons

I'd love to see what would happen if they moved Joe Duffy and liveline to another slot and see how the numbers matched up. I suspect, most people listen to Joe Duffy at 1.45 because its straight after the news which most people tune in for, and leave the radio on afterwards.

If Joe Duffy earns 300k for his listenership, but the listenership doesn't follow him if he moves to a different slot, then I think you need to ask the question, does he really deserve that salary?

Elmo

Sam Russell wrote: »

Currently, if you watch RTE TV this week, you have seen it before or you are on holiday from somewhere else. That is also true of BBC.

It is wrong to suggest that BBC have as many Repeats as RTÉ. RTÉ ONE has 20% repeats, BBC ONE has 4%, RTÉ 2 has 45%, BBC 2 has 20%, while Channel 4 has 12%. In peak viewing times.

RTÉ have an excessive amount of repeats coupled with the start of holidays beginning in May and eventually ending in September.

Atlantic Dawn

Deleted User wrote: »

I'd love to see what would happen if they moved Joe Duffy and liveline to another slot and see how the numbers matched up. I suspect, most people listen to Joe Duffy at 1.45 because its straight after the news which most people tune in for, and leave the radio on afterwards.

If Joe Duffy earns 300k for his listenership, but the listenership doesn't follow him if he moves to a different slot, then I think you need to ask the question, does he really deserve that salary?

His fees were €416k back in 2-14, more likely on more today.

http://www.irishexaminer.com/ireland/rte-cant-be-forced-to-reveal-top-salaries-455534.html

political analyst

Sam Russell wrote: »

If they saved an average of €100,000 of their top 50 earners, it would save them €5 million - they lost €72 million last year. They would have to do a lot more.

If TV3 and TG4 paid their share of Saorview by going HD, they would save at least €2 million.

If RTE NN were allowed to carry adverts, they would pay for a viable news service. If RTE 2 was freed from the children's programmes and was a bit more along the lines that the viewers liked, it could turn a profit.

If they dropped the DAB nonsense, that would cut some of the losses.

Get more people to pay their TV licence fee.

Are we up to €5 million savings yet? Add the savings on top salaries and we might be into the black.

The problem is that letting 2 drop children's programmes and News Now have ads would hit TV3 Television Network Ltd's income.

Bear in mind that TV3 Ltd cannot make it's owner, Liberty Global, put more money into it.

As for DAB, it's doing well in the UK. The Republic would look very stupid if it decided to just stick with analogue radio, which won't be around forever.

Sam Russell

political analyst wrote: »

The problem is that letting 2 drop children's programmes and News Now have ads would hit TV3 Television Network Ltd's income.

Bear in mind that TV3 Ltd cannot make it's owner, Liberty Global, put more money into it.

As for DAB, it's doing well in the UK. The Republic would look very stupid if it decided to just stick with analogue radio, which won't be around forever.

So RTE have to hobbled so that TV3 can make a few bob out of poor content, and extensive ad breaks. Meanwhile those who pay the licence fee are robbed of a decent news channel.

DAB is looking good in the UK because most radios sold in the UK can receive DAB, but how many are actually tuned into DAB? Are there any reliable figures for actual listenership of DAB?

Here we can be certain that many people in Ireland do not listen to it because they live outside the range of the three transmitters that broadcast it. Commercial stations are not rushing to sign up for DAB licences.

RTE should not be made pay for the poor financial setup of TV3. Do not forget, we own RTE and we will pay for the losses they build up. (Mind you, did we not bail out TV3 before to the tune of €80 million?).

Elmo

political analyst wrote: »

The problem is that letting 2 drop children's programmes and News Now have ads would hit TV3 Television Network Ltd's income.

Bear in mind that TV3 Ltd cannot make it's owner, Liberty Global, put more money into it.

This is untrue. RTwould probably regain revenue currently lost to English Opt-Outs. TV3 wouldn't complain this time as they now have a 17% share, the reason they lobbied the Dept was the fact that they were entering competition with UTV Ireland which cost them and UTV over 30million in losses. They lobbied the gov to prevent UTV Ireland appearing on Saorview.

Elmo

Something strange with the É, seems it disappears on edit.

political analyst

Sam Russell wrote: »

So RTE have to hobbled so that TV3 can make a few bob out of poor content, and extensive ad breaks. Meanwhile those who pay the licence fee are robbed of a decent news channel.

DAB is looking good in the UK because most radios sold in the UK can receive DAB, but how many are actually tuned into DAB? Are there any reliable figures for actual listenership of DAB?

Here we can be certain that many people in Ireland do not listen to it because they live outside the range of the three transmitters that broadcast it. Commercial stations are not rushing to sign up for DAB licences.

RTE should not be made pay for the poor financial setup of TV3. Do not forget, we own RTE and we will pay for the losses they build up. (Mind you, did we not bail out TV3 before to the tune of €80 million?).

TV3 was just one of many corporate debtors who had at least some of their debts written off. TV3's dealings with NAMA are separate from TV3's function as a broadcaster.

By the way, RTE radio is available on Saorview. Therefore, you don't need to be in a DAB reception area to listen to RTE digital-only radio stations.

Elmo

political analyst wrote: »

TV3 was just one of many corporate debtors who had at least some of their debts written off. TV3's dealings with NAMA are separate from TV3's function as a broadcaster.

By the way, RTE radio is available on Saorview. Therefore, you don't need to be in a DAB reception area to listen to RTE digital-only radio stations.

TV3 was brought into the evergreen set of companies on the behest of the Government as it did not want to take control of the only independent broadcaster. TV3 is a broadcaster it was in trouble because the arse went out of the market, IRBC as the lender of course has a view of its function as a broadcaster.

What about car radios?

Sam Russell

political analyst wrote: »

TV3 was just one of many corporate debtors who had at least some of their debts written off. TV3's dealings with NAMA are separate from TV3's function as a broadcaster.

TV3 never stopped banging on about their lack of funding from the TV licence fee but never once mentioned the few bob that was written off for them.

By the way, RTE radio is available on Saorview. Therefore, you don't need to be in a DAB reception area to listen to RTE digital-only radio stations.

If you listen to DAB broadcasts, you are listening to DAB. If you listen to Saorview, you are listening to Saorview. If you listen to RTE of the web, you are listening to a web broadcast. The programme you are listening to is content. RTE radio is also available on satellite as well.

DAB is an inferior broadcasting system to FM and should be dropped. RTE have shelved the expansion of DAB and the commercial broadcasters have shown no interest in using it. It should be dropped.