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Air Corp Pilot Refused to Fly Minister in 2015

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    #62
    Stovepipe
    Registered Users Posts: 2,979 ✭✭✭Stovepipe


    Cork's weather conditions often have a mind of their own. Coveney, as a local, should have known that, and as a sailor himself, he should be well aware of the vagaries of the weather. I'd back the pilot 100%, no question. Calling the pilot directly or even calling his boss was unprofessional and disrespectful. Cork airport can often be closed in when even the city has clear weather and that's speaking as a local and a CPL holder. I worked on the King Air, back in the day, when it was doing VIP work and the pilot's decision was final and the DFA and the Office of the Taoiseach knew and understood that. Another point; if he had gone on the flight and had to divert, then Coveney would have ended up in Waterford or Farranfore or even back in Baldonnel and his nose would have been even further out of joint.


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    #63
    EchoIndia
    Registered Users Posts: 2,830 ✭✭✭EchoIndia


    Has anyone clarified what type of aircraft was to be used on the mission in question?


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    #64
    AGC
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,648 ✭✭✭AGC


    EchoIndia wrote: »
    Has anyone clarified what type of aircraft was to be used on the mission in question?

    We only have the Gulf Stream


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    #65
    The Cush
    Registered Users Posts: 15,503 ✭✭✭✭The Cush


    AGC wrote: »
    We only have the Gulf Stream

    http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2057405795

    https://www.flightradar24.com/data/aircraft/n297pj


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    #66
    AGC
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,648 ✭✭✭AGC


    The Cush wrote: »
    http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2057405795

    https://www.flightradar24.com/data/aircraft/n297pj

    Apologies meant Lear


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    #67
    uck51js9zml2yt
    Closed Accounts Posts: 18,268 ✭✭✭✭uck51js9zml2yt


    ELM327 wrote: »
    Fair play to the pilot for standing his ground.
    I heard this on Newstalk this morning, what a ridiculous sense of self entitlement our political classes have.

    You don't know the half of it ;)


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    #68
    Pat Dunne
    Registered Users Posts: 3,001 ✭✭✭Pat Dunne


    Scarlette Raspy Salad wrote: »
    You don't know the half of it ;)

    Well tell us the half of it :confused:


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    #69
    The Rape of Lucretia
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7,440 ✭✭✭The Rape of Lucretia


    Scarlette Raspy Salad wrote: »
    You don't know the half of it ;)

    That there is more to this story, not in the public domain, and the simple fog-pilots-decision-not-to-fly, that is public, is only one side of a more complicated scenario, and that the Minister may in fact have reasonable grounds for his complaint ?


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    #70
    ger664
    Registered Users Posts: 2,400 ✭✭✭ger664


    jimmycrackcorm wrote: »

    But Coveney as MoD should at least have known about the chain of command and not overridden it.

    As MoD he would be the very top of that chain.

    Technically the pilot (who is correct in this instance) has disobeyed a direct order from a superior officer.


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    #71
    durandal01
    Registered Users Posts: 147 ✭✭durandal01


    Stovepipe wrote: »
    Cork's weather conditions often have a mind of their own. Coveney, as a local, should have known that, and as a sailor himself, he should be well aware of the vagaries of the weather. I'd back the pilot 100%, no question. Calling the pilot directly or even calling his boss was unprofessional and disrespectful. Cork airport can often be closed in when even the city has clear weather and that's speaking as a local and a CPL holder. I worked on the King Air, back in the day, when it was doing VIP work and the pilot's decision was final and the DFA and the Office of the Taoiseach knew and understood that. Another point; if he had gone on the flight and had to divert, then Coveney would have ended up in Waterford or Farranfore or even back in Baldonnel and his nose would have been even further out of joint.

    Not just a local lad, I think he hails from the area on the coast south of EICK, right under the approach to RWY35 if my sources are correct .
    Maybe he thought he knew better.


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    #72
    Gaoth Laidir
    Registered Users Posts: 8,219 ✭✭✭Gaoth Laidir


    ger664 wrote: »
    As MoD he would be the very top of that chain.

    Technically the pilot (who is correct in this instance) has disobeyed a direct order from a superior officer.

    As captain of the flight, he IS the most superior officer. He has to answer to no one.


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    #73
    Psychlops
    Registered Users Posts: 1,109 ✭✭✭Psychlops


    EchoIndia wrote: »
    Has anyone clarified what type of aircraft was to be used on the mission in question?

    Helicopter pilot they are saying, so the use of an AW139 there...


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    #74
    Bazzy
    Registered Users Posts: 1,484 ✭✭✭Bazzy


    JCX BXC wrote: »
    Would first class on Iarnrod Eireann cut it? Or would you still be mixed in with too many working class for the liking of politicans? Remember that one time Shane Ross took the bus?

    He tweeted the bus was great flew into work and that was at half 10 when the rest of the unwashed were already at their desks


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    #75
    evolving_doors
    Closed Accounts Posts: 11,812 ✭✭✭✭evolving_doors


    Politicians and personal govt. Taxis are nothing new
    http://www.irishexaminer.com/ireland/the-mystery-of-the-ministers-broken-down-car-355973.html

    .Which politician got his ministerialife car to drop him to a helicopter to fly him home... and ministerial car to follow on and pick him up to complete the journey?

    Leo and Simon are silver spoon boys so I suppose they're entitled to it all.


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    #76
    Stovepipe
    Registered Users Posts: 2,979 ✭✭✭Stovepipe


    This echoes what I said earlier....it was common practise for the/a Ministerial car to be at the airport at journey's end for the ministerial arse to be carried home, so it involved two cars; one to get to the Don, one to get home and vice versa. God forbid he would have to use his actual, personal car. The car he or she nominally pays for is still a Govt car, when all is said and done, driven by a Garda or, as was often the case, a local political apparatchik .......I was once present when a Minister's child was flown from Baldonnel to the home airport, having been flown back from Europe, because said child was bored when Daddy was off politicking in Europe. Child had no business being there in the first place. Both empty aircraft then returned to their start points......it's all very well the pilot standing up to the Minister, for good reason. It's what happens later that matters.


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