Home heating automation

useeme

Im looking for a temperature probe to monitor, and display on an app / website my domestic hot water temperature.

I have a 3rd generation nest setup that i'm very happy with except it doesn't have this feature.

Has anyone fitted such device and if so what did you use?

deezell

useeme wrote: »

Im looking for a temperature probe to monitor, and display on an app / website my domestic hot water temperature.

I have a 3rd generation nest setup that i'm very happy with except it doesn't have this feature.

Has anyone fitted such device and if so what did you use?

Check this post
https://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=109668398&postcount=1172

2011

deezell wrote: »

Check this post https://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=109668398&postcount=1172

+1
This is exactly what I am using, they work very well.

Last night I discovered that a new version of firmware was available for my Sonoff devices, Once downloaded this gave me a new feature, inching. This gives me the option of setting up the device so that once turned on it will turn itself off once a predetermined time elapses (in 0.5 second increments up to one hour). This means that if the kids ask my GH to turn the heating on it will turn off an hour later just like a boost function.

I have also ordered one of these (it has not arrived yet):

The plan is that this will display the temperature of my domestic hot water at all times at a location outside the hot press.

deezell

Belt AND braces! Real man stuff, I love it.

john_doe.

useeme wrote: »

Im looking for a temperature probe to monitor, and display on an app / website my domestic hot water temperature.

I have a 3rd generation nest setup that i'm very happy with except it doesn't have this feature.

Has anyone fitted such device and if so what did you use?

Got the sonoff also as recommended here , flashes with Tasmota. Cheap out.

Looking to sort my heating system now:
Tado
Netamo
Drayton
Genius Hub
Ember

Which one is best out of this lot. Ember seems poorest unless integrated to Home Assistant.

How does Netamo stack up ?

Caillte

Photo:
https://v2uploads.zopim.io/3/B/g/3BgoleldjFbgFxUQ2AWnb6ehEzHp33Gj/93c2da81678bae0faebf95c8523371233fcb75e1.jpg

Anyone got any idea how to tado this EPH 3 zone controller? Tado only does two zone. I already have the tado eco system and this will be in my new house. I will replace all the thermostats with Tado versions but what controls the the motorised valves at the cylinder?

Tado recommend I leave the programmer well alone and just change the thermostats but i'd love to control the hot water remotely if needs be. Does tado extension kit show current temperature of cylinder or is it simply on off controls?

Thanks

deezell

john_doe. wrote: »

useeme wrote: »

Im looking for a temperature probe to monitor, and display on an app / website my domestic hot water temperature.

I have a 3rd generation nest setup that i'm very happy with except it doesn't have this feature.

Has anyone fitted such device and if so what did you use?

Got the sonoff also as recommended here , flashes with Tasmota. Cheap out.

Looking to sort my heating system now:
Tado
Netamo
Drayton
Genius Hub
Ember

Which one is best out of this lot. Ember seems poorest unless integrated to Home Assistant.

How does Netamo stack up ?

Netatmo has no HW options, but as you have sonoff for your HW, Netatmo will work for CH, and also has smart TRVs if required. Ember not. A smart system at all.

deezell

Caillte wrote: »

Photo:
https://v2uploads.zopim.io/3/B/g/3BgoleldjFbgFxUQ2AWnb6ehEzHp33Gj/93c2da81678bae0faebf95c8523371233fcb75e1.jpg

Anyone got any idea how to tado this EPH 3 zone controller? Tado only does two zone. I already have the tado eco system and this will be in my new house. I will replace all the thermostats with Tado versions but what controls the the motorised valves at the cylinder?

Tado recommend I leave the programmer well alone and just change the thermostats but i'd love to control the hot water remotely if needs be. Does tado extension kit show current temperature of cylinder or is it simply on off controls?

Thanks

Good advice from Tado, just add two wired Tado stats, let the EPH look after HW timing, and set the two ch zones to always on. Tado ext. kit will give you remote HW timing, that's all. If you currently have a mechanical cylinder stat you leave it to control temperature. All self installable.
Later you can get the SonOff relay and probe discussed above, and substitute them for the mechanical stat, turn EPH HW to always on also, and HW on the SonOff app.

john_doe.

deezell wrote: »

Netatmo has no HW options, but as you have sonoff for your HW, Netatmo will work for CH, and also has smart TRVs if required. Ember not. A smart system at all.

The Drayton has some limits in amount of rads p per zone it seems. Same with Netamo and to lesser extent Tado.

Which is better of the two - Drayton or Tado in people's opinon ?

AstraMonti

With a Sonoff TH10 is there a way to have a schedule and turn it off automatically when the water has reached a certain temperature? From the app it seems I can do one or the other.

L1011

Finally gave in and turned off the legionella protection on the Nest. It was firing the water on at the most random times and even with a very heavily insulated modern tank we certainly weren't using it. People lived without that function forever before it existed, so... I'm now likely to be one of the few deaths a year from it in Ireland!

Krombopulos Michael

L1011 wrote: »

Finally gave in and turned off the legionella protection on the Nest. It was firing the water on at the most random times and even with a very heavily insulated modern tank we certainly weren't using it. People lived without that function forever before it existed, so... I'm now likely to be one of the few deaths a year from it in Ireland!

i turned it off after a month. If you don't run the hot water for at least 2 hours over a period of time, it runs the hot water now and then which is a pain to be honest.

mrblack

Hello, I am looking for some advice about Heating control automation.

Per the attached photo my OFCH has an APT 24hour analogue timer with two motorized valves controlled manually via switches to send hot water

to the cylinder only when both switches are off- as per photo
to the cylinder to either upstairs or downstairs or both- depending on the setting of both switches to on or off

I am wondering which control system would be advisable to fit to achieve

remote control via smartphone app
lower heating costs if possible
smarter system to learn our schedules

The Boiler is situated in the garage.

Would ember be a good solution for fitting or are there better systems for what I want to achieve?

Thanks for the advice
MrBlack

2011

Threads merged.

jonnyha

I have two Nests. The one upstairs controls the rads upstairs and I can also use it to turn on/off hot water. The Nest downstairs controls the rads downstairs.

I realise now I'd prefer to control the hot water from the Nest downstairs. Can that be done? I've looked on the Nest site and followed the instructions on how to add the hot water icon and on/off functions to the downstairs Nest. But the boiler doesn't fire when I turn the water on using the Nest downstairs. Obviously, it's not as simple as just going into settings and adding hot water controls to the display. But does anyone know if we can control the hot water from two Nests? Or if not, can I somehow get the downstairs Nest to control the hot water rather than the upstairs?

L1011

There is quite a bit more than adding the icon - its Heatlink is physically wired to the valve that controls it.

deezell

L1011 wrote: »

There is quite a bit more than adding the icon - its Heatlink is physically wired to the valve that controls it.

Correct. Having said that, it's just a case of taking the HW switched live wire ( SL) from the upstairs Nest heatlink box and connecting it to the same currently unused terminal on the downstairs Nest heatlink box. I'm hoping these boxes are both located together in the same area as the zone valves which are controlled by the heatlinks.

jonnyha

Thanks L1011 and deezell.

The upstairs Heatlink is in the hotpress and the valves for the hot water and upstairs rads are in the hotpress too. The downstairs Heatlink is nearly directly below the hotpress in the boiler house (or rather room - it's part of the house). So a wire would need to be connected from the Heatlink downstairs up to the valve in the hotpress, is that right? Would I need to get the Electric Ireland Nest man back or would an electrician do it?

And my last stupid question is - can two Heatlinks be wired to the same hot water valve so I could use either Nest to turn on hot water?

Thanks.

deezell

If you're not up to it yourself, get a sparks. He'll figure the wiring of heatlink upper to transfer to heatlink lower.
You could in all daftness cross the HW live in and SL from both heatlinks so either will open the valve, why would be the question.
Bear in mind that if you have a cylinder stat, this will be in series with the SL to the valve, generally between the heatlink and the valve but it could be the source of the live in to the HW relay in the heatlink. You must make sure that the live in the the lower HW relay is tapped from the upstairs HW relay live in, as this live may be after the cylinder stat if you have one.
Foolproof method, Whichever two wires are going to terminals 5 and 6 of upstairs box, move them to downstairs box.

jonnyha

Thanks again.

Before I go ahead and get the wiring changed, I decided to see if controlling the water from downstairs is the missing link in my search for eternal happiness. So I've just swapped the Nests. Put upstairs downstairs and downstairs upstairs. I don't use them for anything other than turning heating on or off - I disabled the learning stuff soon after I got them. And I turn the rads on by voice so it doesn't matter which Nest is where. The only time I use the dial is to switch on the water.

If I like having the on/off water function downstairs, I'll get the wiring changed but this interim solution is grand.

savemejebus

Can the drayton wiser kit 3 control the hot water from the wireless thermostats or just from the app and receiver?

deezell

savemejebus wrote: »

Can the drayton wiser kit 3 control the hot water from the wireless thermostats or just from the app and receiver?

Good question. From reading the installation guides it's app only. It's only timing, there's no temperature control, this is done with a manual stat on the cylinder. There is a boost button on the receiver itself for the HW channel.

loyatemu

savemejebus wrote: »

Can the drayton wiser kit 3 control the hot water from the wireless thermostats or just from the app and receiver?

As you say, just from the app and the controller. The stats only control the zone they're assigned to.

When I installed the Wiser kit I set the HW to stay on for most of the day as we have a well insulated cylinder, I've rarely had to boost it at all.

deezell

jonnyha wrote: »

Thanks again.

Before I go ahead and get the wiring changed, I decided to see if controlling the water from downstairs is the missing link in my search for eternal happiness. So I've just swapped the Nests. Put upstairs downstairs and downstairs upstairs. I don't use them for anything other than turning heating on or off - I disabled the learning stuff soon after I got them. And I turn the rads on by voice so it doesn't matter which Nest is where. The only time I use the dial is to switch on the water.

If I like having the on/off water function downstairs, I'll get the wiring changed but this interim solution is grand.

The Nests have to be where the rads they control are located, in order to measure the zone temperature and cut off the zone when it reaches target. Swapping them will mean the stat downstairs will send heat to the upstairs rads when on, but won't turn off based on temperature reached as its measuring a different area, and vice versa for upstairs. You say you turn the rads on by voice, do you mean voice control to the Nest or have your smart radiator valves also? Regardless, by swapping you are now using the Nests as on off switches, no meaningful temperature control.

jonnyha

Good point, Deezell. I'll swap them back in a few days when winter kicks in!

You know the smart immersion control Electric Ireland offers? I didn't take up that offer when getting the Nests. I've since asked them can I get one as part of an extra subscription but they've said no, they only install them when they install the Nests. Do you know can the same smart immersion control be bought elsewhere?

deezell

The image on their site is indeterminate. No make or model, but it might be just a 16 amp relay, designed to up the capacity of the nest HW relay to switch power to an immersion element as against the low current requirement of opening a valve. It could also be a smart relay with 8ts own timer app, like the Sonoff relays, which can handle immersion currents, just, but have question marks over their safety.
If you want app control of your HW from an immersion element as distinct from your boiler, you are perfectly set up, as you have two Nest, with two HW timers. Just get a sparks to install a 16a mains relay or din rail contactor to the immersion, and control it with the spare Nest HW terminals.

Essien

I've recently signed up to Electric Ireland and I was planning on having the discounted Nest installed.

Since the house has 3 zones (upstairs/downstairs rads & water) and Nest can only manage 2, the guy said I would need an additional Nest to control all 3. Alternatively I could merge my upstairs and downstairs rads or just install a Climote which he says manages 3 zones.

Any thoughts on what the best option might be here? I have no experience of either Nest or Climote, though I've read some pretty bad feedback about Climote. Though the second Nest is 270 from EI.

If I just went with one Nest initially would it be a big job to add a second one later if I could pick one up online a little cheaper?

deezell

Essien wrote: »

I've recently signed up to Electric Ireland and I was planning on having the discounted Nest installed.

Since the house has 3 zones (upstairs/downstairs rads & water) and Nest can only manage 2, the guy said I would need an additional Nest to control all 3. Alternatively I could merge my upstairs and downstairs rads or just install a Climote which he says manages 3 zones.

Any thoughts on what the best option might be here? I have no experience of either Nest or Climote, though I've read some pretty bad feedback about Climote. Though the second Nest is 270 from EI.

If I just went with one Nest initially would it be a big job to add a second one later if I could pick one up online a little cheaper?

For 270 installed for the second nest go for it. You won't do better, and a second hand one, maybe €180, doesn't come with installation.

deezell

deezell wrote: »

For 270 installed for the second nest go for it. You won't do better, and a second hand one, maybe €180, doesn't come with installation.

Or get a boiler service and nest for €209

john_doe.

Quick question, I have a fairly large hot water cylinder.

There are 3 temp probes on it .

#1 up near the top of tank
#2 close to the bottom
#3 just above #2

The solar display connected displays the temperature of the hot water . It is connected to probe 1&2 and seems to use the difference to calculate the water temperature.

I have a Sonoff TH connected to #3.

There is a difference between the Sonoff and the solar however.

I was wondering typically where do people measure the water temperature of the tank?