What I log about when I log about running

Murph_D

Good luck - run well.

skyblue46

Have a good run, enjoy it and leave nothing behind. Best of luck.

chickey2

Best of luck!

Huzzah!

Thanks for all the good wishes re the 10k. Much appreciated and I drew on the support when the going got tough.

I hadn’t intended on tapering much for the race on Sunday, but personal circumstances didn’t allow for running on either Wednesday or Thursday and left me too tight for time and lacking in motivation on Friday. A quick recap of the week that was:

Monday, 4 February 2019, a very slow but enjoyable runmute. 1 hour and 21 minutes @7:39/km.

Tuesday, 5 February, 2019 – Club session. A repeat of the first week’s pyramid:
|Lap|Time|
|300|72s|
|400|1:59|
|600|2:54|
|800|3:56|
|600|2:50|
|400|1:50|
|300|1:40|

Kept an eye on Strawberry Swan to pace myself better. I’m clearly holding something in reserve in the first half of sessions, so possibly something I need to improve on.

Saturday, 9 February, 2019 – very easy 30 minutes@8:03/km. Didn’t want to but felt good to get out. Contemplated adding strides but didn’t.

Enniscorthy 10k.

Not much to say apart from I messed this up for the second year running. The amount of bad race reports I have is getting embarrassing but they have their use, so deep breath and here I go. I fully thought I’d run this race in 55 or so minutes last year but I ran 57:58. 2018 Disaster

Anyway, I had no such lofty goals for this year, but thought, using Raheny as a guide, that I could run something in the region of my PB of 56:40ish. Raheny suggested 5:36/km for 10k, so I settled upon 5:40 as being the pace I would set out at. The course is hilly, so I thought I would pick it up a bit on the downhills and slow as needed on the uphills. Simple, right? It was an uphill start last year but we were straight into a downhill stretch this year. I ran the first kilometre too fast but it didn’t feel at all quick and I didn’t want to brake too much. I felt like the world and their mother were passing me but I didn’t go with them. The second kilometre was an uphill back to where we started. It was tough but I knew that the third kilometre would be downhill, so I didn’t panic. I allowed the pace to slow as required and kept my focus on the turn ahead. Back over the start and through the third kilometre. We then turned right and I was into unknown territory and, tbh, I don’t remember too much more. Four was very downhill and five was back uphill. I started to struggle in the fifth kilometre and thought of all the encouragement I’d received and was determined not to walk. But I basically ran myself to a standstill – my legs were full of lactate and everyone around me had slowed to a walk. I got back running near the crest of the hill and just put one foot in front of the other. My brain stopped working too as I kept telling myself to get to the seventh kilometre because then it would only be one parkrun to go (?!). I ran much of the race with the same people and a woman I’d passed somewhere on the fifth kilometre passed me here, apologising for doing so. I wasn’t able to go with her but I did increase my pace. I knew the last mile or so would be downhill and that was my motivation. Ever step was hurting and I was fighting the urge to stop even in the last 300metres. But at least I didn’t feel the urge to vom, despite hitting my max HR.

Back on plan now with no deviations until my goal race. And then I might take up knitting for real.

OOnegative

Hard luck, not the result you wanted again. Are you possibly putting to much pressure on yourself going into races?

Huzzah!

OOnegative wrote: »

Hard luck, not the result you wanted again. Are you possibly putting to much pressure on yourself going into races?

Fair question and I possibly did for Jingle Bells. I don't think I put too much pressure on myself on Sunday, in that I genuinely wasn't even really thinking about the race. I do seem to be trying to hit times I'm not able for, so I suppose that's a pressure. I genuinely thought I wasn't being lofty on Sunday, but I need to have an idea of what to aim for, so it's hard to know what to do.

ReeReeG

Was really disappointed for you when I saw the result on Strava. Sounds like a tough day, but you started out smart. It's hard to keep running on a hill when all around you have slowed to a walk.

I don't think the goal was too lofty, but maybe more race practice would be helpful for when the going gets tough?

Not that I'm much good for advice there

gypsylee

Sorry to hear Enniscorthy did not go as well as you had hoped. Hopefully your next race will be one you are happy with. Sounds like a tough course. Glad to hear you have stopped sulking!

Bluesquare

Sorry to hear it didn’t go well.

Race practice sounds like a good idea or longer tempos intervals to practice pain ( that’s the advice I’m giving myself anyway) . Sometimes I think though runners go through bad patches for no reason and then snap back to normal . My non scientific theory is that sometimes we are carrying mini viruses for a while!

eyrie

Honestly the course sounds fairly brutal, and it was a very windy day too. I wonder if you might actually be well able for the target time you got from Raheny, on a fairer course? You've been training well and deserved a better day than this, but I just wonder if in this instance maybe there actually isn't much more to it than crappy conditions and it not being the day for it? Maybe I'm explaining this poorly... What I mean is I don't think you should be hard on yourself and I'd say if you were running a different 10k soon it could be a very different story.

I also think (personal prejudice, totally) that the 10k is maybe the hardest distance to get right. Quick enough that it hurts a lot, but it keeps going for too long!

skyblue46

Sorry to hear it didn't go well. A couple of poor results back to back can certainly be demoralising. Remember though that the Wednesday sessions (or is it Tuesday?) you are doing at the club will be adding to the tiredness in your legs. They will be beneficial in the long term but could be leaving you flat right now.

I think you are right to concentrate on the MSB race for now. You have had a couple of training blocks that have been very high on the time you spend running and very low on any level of speed work. A change of emphasis will be good.

juke

Sounds like a tough day, H. Well done for not giving up.

I've no useful advice.

I thinks it's perfectly normal to mix up miles and kilometres at that point in a race - especially when I bet you were trying to count out your possible finishing time simultaneously.

Baby75

OH, that sounds like a really tough race well done for sticking it out you are stronger for it now! ho were the quads after it, downhill running can really smash your quads.

Mr. Guappa

Like ReeReeG, I was gutted for you on Sunday when I saw on Strava that it hadn't gone as you'd hoped. I've nothing particularly useful to say either, just to keep at it and hopefully the improvements will follow.

ariana`

Huzzah it sucks when races don't go well. I don't think i can add much in the way of practical advice. I will say one thing that has helped me at times and it's from something Swashbuckler said last year is that the training is banked whether or not the target race went to plan or not. A bad race doesn't take from the training you've done, it just means you had a crappy day probably for a variety of reasons, but all those miles are still logged in your legs and lungs and eventually it will all click in a race scenario. I know it's very demoralising as S said but try not to let it get you down, the reward will be even sweeter when it comes and i hope that is sooner rather than later for you. Recover well now x

Sunny Dayz

Sorry to hear it didn't go as you would have liked. It sounds like you started off sensible and conservative enough and didn't lose the run of yourself at the start, it would have been easy (and stupid) to pick up the pace to faster than you know you should have just to keep up with those around you, that shows mental strength. But that sounds like an absolute leg drainer of a course.

Kellygirl

I’ve only just caught up here and Strava and really sorry to hear that you’d a tough day out. So frustrating. Sounds like a tough course and not ideal weather either. Keep up the solid training and it will definitely pay off.

Huzzah!

Tuesday, 12 February, 1 hr very easy@7:51/pm 144avg HR
Wednesday, 13 February, 20 minutes very easy@7:17/pm 139avg HR
Thursday, 14 February, 1 hr very easy@7:43/pm 142avg HR
Friday, 15 February, session: 4, 3, 2,1 Threshold, CV, AP, VO2 w/equal recoveries
Saturday, 16 February, 1.45 easy@7.18/km

An easy, no-pressure week of running. I ran when I felt like it. I did the session on the treadmill as I was under time pressure, so no point in recording the splits. I re-calculated appropriate HR levels and happy that the paces and effort are matching up.

Strawberry Swan

Jeez, you've had a log for 2 years and I only find out about it now! I would have had great reading during the marathon training as I remember we were quite close in times and I was keeping an eye on your reports on the main thread. For sure I would have benefitted hugely from reading your detailed reports on times and pacing, which I've still a lot to learn about. And from the little I've read so far, some really well written race reports too. Looking forward to keeping up with your progress.

Huzzah!

Strawberry Swan wrote: »

Jeez, you've had a log for 2 years and I only find out about it now! I would have had great reading during the marathon training as I remember we were quite close in times and I was keeping an eye on your reports on the main thread. For sure I would have benefitted hugely from reading your detailed reports on times and pacing, which I've still a lot to learn about. And from the little I've read so far, some really well written race reports too. Looking forward to keeping up with your progress.

Ah, this is a lovely comment, thanks! We ran pretty similar times, though, so I think you're doing just fine as you are. I'm a stickler for the rules, so I tend to follow plans and pacing guidelines pretty closely. Your approach has been working for you, too, though. Maybe I just need to loosen up!

You should consider starting a log. I know I'd find it useful.

Strawberry Swan

Heh, yeah my log would be a disaster. Still haven't completed base plan yet :-P And as for paces, it's almost entirely subjective and feelings based. Don't wear a watch, just my phone. There would be a tonne of sleeping in it and rest days too :-) But I need to increase my volume a lot, keep up with consistency and run at correct paces.

Huzzah!

Huzzah! wrote: »

Tuesday, 12 February, 1 hr very easy@7:51/pm 144avg HR
Wednesday, 13 February, 20 minutes very easy@7:17/pm 139avg HR
Thursday, 14 February, 1 hr very easy@7:43/pm 142avg HR
Friday, 15 February, session: 4, 3, 2,1 Threshold, CV, AP, VO2 w/equal recoveries
Saturday, 16 February, 1.45 easy@7.18/km

An easy, no-pressure week of running. I ran when I felt like it. I did the session on the treadmill as I was under time pressure, so no point in recording the splits. I re-calculated appropriate HR levels and happy that the paces and effort are matching up.

Lol - I just realised I was super speedy last week. I'd be doing well to run one mile at 7:17. Obviously, the above paces should be /km and not /m (in case there was any doubt!)

ariana`

Huzzah! wrote: »

Tuesday, 12 February, 1 hr very easy@7:51/pm 144avg HR
Wednesday, 13 February, 20 minutes very easy@7:17/pm 139avg HR
Thursday, 14 February, 1 hr very easy@7:43/pm 142avg HR
Friday, 15 February, session: 4, 3, 2,1 Threshold, CV, AP, VO2 w/equal recoveries
Saturday, 16 February, 1.45 easy@7.18/km

An easy, no-pressure week of running. I ran when I felt like it. I did the session on the treadmill as I was under time pressure, so no point in recording the splits. I re-calculated appropriate HR levels and happy that the paces and effort are matching up.

Hi E. You mind if i ask what mean by the line in bold above, recalculate the appropriate HR levels - do you do a Max HR test or how do you base the HR levels?

I hope you're feeling better after this week, i like the idea of a no pressure week of running and running for the love of it - it's just a hobby after all and important we all remind ourselves why we do it occasionally

Huzzah!

ariana` wrote: »

Hi E. You mind if i ask what mean by the line in bold above, recalculate the appropriate HR levels - do you do a Max HR test or how do you base the HR levels?

I hope you're feeling better after this week, i like the idea of a no pressure week of running and running for the love of it - it's just a hobby after all and important we all remind ourselves why we do it occasionally

Sure, I always have a firm eye on HR because I'm not very honest with myself otherwise. I've been known to chat during tempo runs, so that's not a useful test for me, either.

I used to do most of my training by HR using the Pfitzinger ranges and I still use them even where I'm doing pace-based plans. But I recently hit a new max HR and have hit it more than once since, so it's not an anomaly. I went from 190 to 196, so, after a discussion on how difficult we were finding it to stay in the very easy range, out of interest, I looked up the percentages again. I'd been thinking recovery should be less than 148 and that turned out to be bang on. It's helped me be more disciplined in hitting the very easy paces even if the results are woefully slow runs

As an aside, Jack Daniels suggest a HR of less than 127! I would literally have to walk :rolleyes:

ReeReeG

Huzzah! wrote: »

Sure, I always have a firm eye on HR because I'm not very honest with myself otherwise.

Do you use a chest strap or just whatever the watch is capable of?


I glance at my HR now and again but have never really focussed on where it is / should be...

Huzzah!

ReeReeG wrote: »

Do you use a chest strap or just whatever the watch is capable of?


I glance at my HR now and again but have never really focussed on where it is / should be...

Chest strap. I don't have optical HR on my watch.

Ah, it's by no means a foolproof method, I just find it helps me with discipline. I also found it useful for adjusting to hills - I was able to do LT runs as part of the runmute, but obviously, couldn't hit the paces, but once the HR was in the appropriate zone, though, I was happy I was getting the appropriate response.

ariana`

Thanks Huzzah. I ask because i'm finding myself increasingly interested in my HR readings recently. In the absence of anything else to measure progress by it's reassuring to track the drop in my HR drop on like-for-like runs.

Ideally I'd like to my HR zones prescribed through LT testing done in a lab scenario though if i was to go down the route of committing to training by HR, which i'm seriously considering. It's seems obvious that in the absence of having the confidence & experience to run by one's own perceived effort, surely HR has to be more reliable as an indication of effort than pace alone derived from a text book with no account for environmental factors :cool:

127 though LOL - i'd have to be walking too :pac:

eyrie

Huzzah! wrote: »

As an aside, Jack Daniels suggest a HR of less than 127! I would literally have to walk :rolleyes:

Not a hope for me either. I'm always envious of people who can maintain really low hearts while running, mine's always high!

ariana` wrote: »

Thanks Huzzah. I ask because i'm finding myself increasingly interested in my HR readings recently. In the absence of anything else to measure progress by it's reassuring to track the drop in my HR drop on like-for-like runs.

Ideally I'd like to my HR zones prescribed through LT testing done in a lab scenario though if i was to go down the route of committing to training by HR, which i'm seriously considering. It's seems obvious that in the absence of having the confidence & experience to run by one's own perceived effort, surely HR has to be more reliable as an indication of effort than pace alone derived from a text book with no account for environmental factors :cool:

I think it's an excellent way to train ariana, at least for a period of time. You learn a massive amount about how your body responds and what effort you're really putting in. I also suspect it's particularly useful for women, since I find HR/actual effort varies significantly throughout the month and you wouldn't necessarily notice or know why otherwise, but it helps you hit the right effort if not the same pace. I also think you can probably do it well enough by working off a max HR reading from a 5k race or similar.

Huzzah!

ariana` wrote: »

Thanks Huzzah. I ask because i'm finding myself increasingly interested in my HR readings recently. In the absence of anything else to measure progress by it's reassuring to track the drop in my HR drop on like-for-like runs.

Ideally I'd like to my HR zones prescribed through LT testing done in a lab scenario though if i was to go down the route of committing to training by HR, which i'm seriously considering. It's seems obvious that in the absence of having the confidence & experience to run by one's own perceived effort, surely HR has to be more reliable as an indication of effort than pace alone derived from a text book with no account for environmental factors :cool:

127 though LOL - i'd have to be walking too :pac:

I think Murph_D had his LT tested. It sounds wicked hard, though, so I've been too afraid to get it done.

eyrie wrote: »

I think it's an excellent way to train ariana, at least for a period of time. You learn a massive amount about how your body responds and what effort you're really putting in. I also suspect it's particularly useful for women, since I find HR/actual effort varies significantly throughout the month and you wouldn't necessarily notice or know why otherwise, but it helps you hit the right effort if not the same pace. I also think you can probably do it well enough by working off a max HR reading from a 5k race or similar.

Yeah, I think it's just a really good sense check. Like, I'm way slower now and it would be easy to suggest that the paces prescribed are incorrect but the HR just confirms to me that the paces are actually spot on. I'm just running slower for the same HR for whatever reason but running quicker isn't going to fix it.

Also, am I the only one who finds that moderate paced runs nearly always feel "easier" than super easy runs? I'm convinced it's because I pick my feet up more and there's a bit more of a rush from the tougher effort, so I feel great whereas on the easier runs, sometimes they're a bit of a trudge. I think it would be easy to convince myself that these are "easy" when they take a bigger toll on the body.

Kellygirl

I totally agree on the moderate paced runs being easier - I much prefer them here as I find the super easy a bit boring sometimes. I do try the not break a swea on the super easy ones and that feels like the only target I have to keep me amused!

I only got my HR chest monito in December and think I’ve broken it already. Seems to record for the start of the run and not recording properly after a bit for some reason. I was using Bodyglide as it chaffed me the first few times so don’t know if I’ve damaged it. Have you ever had any issues with yours?