TV License Summons - Can we pay now to avoid fine?

rawn

Hi all. My husband and I live with my dad. My dad owns and watches the TV, we pay him rent inclusive of bills. My husband got a summons today for nonpayment of TV license, we were confused at first about why it was his name on it rather than my dads, but the husband vaguely remembers giving his name to someone at the door last year who could have been a TV License inspector (he didn't let him in but he could easily have seen the TV through the window). We were unaware that the TV License hadn't been paid, we honestly never gave it a thought as my dad does usually have one.

We know of course that judges have heard it all before and we don't want to go in full of excuses, but if we pay for a license now and bring a copy on the day would we avoid a fine? There's no phone number on the summons to call and ask. Thanks

whomitconcerns

Best to get the licence asap before court. But the the judge may or may not still make a fine payable. You just can't know.

ScouseMouse

Is it correct that anyone in who answers the door can be prosecuted for the household not having a licence? Even visitors or tenants?

Fred Swanson

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rawn

Fred Swanson wrote:

If they are stupid enough to give their names and make an admission of guilt.

He was stupid to give his name but there was no admission of guilt. He was asked if he was the homeowner and he said no, he was asked his name, he told him (i don't know why!) and the man said "ok thank you" and left.

Fred Swanson

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ScouseMouse

Fred Swanson wrote: »

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That's the point I was trying to make. Would such a summons be appropriate if the person was a tenant/visitor/guest etc etc.

tracey turnblad

Is your father elderly? Would he be entitled to free to licence? Maybe they thought your father no longer lived there so sent it in your husbands name

rawn

tracey turnblad wrote:

Is your father elderly? Would he be entitled to free to licence? Maybe they thought your father no longer lived there so sent it in your husbands name

He's mid 50s. We did find it odd that it's in my husbands name cos his name isn't on any bills, all we could think of is he gave his name at the door.

I haven't told my dad about it, his health isn't great and he'd only feel guilty. We're just really hoping to avoid a fine, my husband is doing his Masters and I'm on Maternity Leave, money is tight!

dev100

rawn wrote:

Hi all. My husband and I live with my dad. My dad owns and watches the TV, we pay him rent inclusive of bills. My husband got a summons today for nonpayment of TV license, we were confused at first about why it was his name on it rather than my dads, but the husband vaguely remembers giving his name to someone at the door last year who could have been a TV License inspector (he didn't let him in but he could easily have seen the TV through the window). We were unaware that the TV License hadn't been paid, we honestly never gave it a thought as my dad does usually have one. We know of course that judges have heard it all before and we don't want to go in full of excuses, but if we pay for a license now and bring a copy on the day would we avoid a fine? There's no phone number on the summons to call and ask. Thanks

Seeing the TV bit thru the window doesn't necessarily mean it's a TV it could have been a monitor and being used for streaming from the internet. The inspector would have to inspect it to see if conforms to what they class as a TV The household must have received letters and warnings about not paying for a TV license??? usually those money grabbers generally give people an opportunity to pay it and then if you don't then you get summoned but generally they the fright of them turning up makes people run out and get a license .

Was there ever a license in the house and the father forgot to pay it ?

Tip for ya never give your name

Sleeper12

ScouseMouse wrote:

That's the point I was trying to make. Would such a summons be appropriate if the person was a tenant/visitor/guest etc etc.

They always carry ID when knocking on the door.
Yes a summons is appropriate for whoever answers the door.

It all seems strange to me. If your dad had a license at one stage then he gets reminders in the post. Licence inspector shows ID, otherwise who'd give their name to a stranger at the door.

rawn

dev100 wrote:

Seeing the TV bit thru the window doesn't necessarily mean it's a TV it could have been a monitor and being used for streaming from the internet. The inspector would have to inspect it to see if conforms to what they class as a TV The household must have received letters and warnings about not paying for a TV license??? usually those money grabbers generally give people an opportunity to pay it and then if you don't then you get summoned but generally they the fright of them turning up makes people run out and get a license .

Was there ever a license in the house and the father forgot to pay it ?


Tip for ya never give your name

Our tv is huge and can be seen through the window, it's unmistakably a tv! No warnings, none at all and especially none in my husband's name. My dad usually does have a license but his memory is dotty, he must have either forgotten or just put it on the long finger.

And oh boy, don't I know it! He must have caught him hungover :P

Should we be able to get out of the court date because we had no warnings? We'll still buy the license ofc

Fred Swanson

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rawn

Fred Swanson wrote:

You can come to an out of court settlement with An Post. Ring them up and see what they will accept to drop the charges.

Thanks I will do that.

Just spoke to my dad about it, he said he's been getting letters but hasn't opened them, he doesn't remember if he threw them out or not but I'm looking for them now, chances are there's a few warnings in there! I'm guessing when he didn't pay up they showed up and my supposedly smart husband gave his name so they probably assumed my dad moved out and are chasing him for it now. Fml. We'll call them tomorrow and see if we can just pay up and avoid the court altogether. My husband is doing a summer internship and I don't like the idea of him having to ask for a day off to go to court! Thanks everyone

coylemj

Fred Swanson wrote: »

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That's 100% wrong, you cannot negotiate your way out of a District Court summons by discussing it with the agency taking the prosecution in advance of the court hearing.

What you're suggesting is the same as asking a Garda what he will take to 'settle' a drink driving summons.

twowheelsonly

You're wasting your time talking to An Post now that a summons has been issued.

Pay the licence now (in your dads name) and get one or two stamps towards next years and bring the lot to court.

Cry the poor mouth - without appearing that you're exaggerating - and basically appear as honest as you can.

Just tell the truth pretty much as you've stated here and let them know it's your dads but that your husband answered the door.

It's up to the judge after that and depends on his mood but I'd be pretty confident of a strike out. It's never a guarantee though.

Losty Dublin

rawn wrote: »

He's mid 50s. We did find it odd that it's in my husbands name cos his name isn't on any bills, all we could think of is he gave his name at the door.

I haven't told my dad about it, his health isn't great and he'd only feel guilty. We're just really hoping to avoid a fine, my husband is doing his Masters and I'm on Maternity Leave, money is tight!

If money is tight then you should look to pay it monthly via direct debit.

dev100

rawn wrote:

Our tv is huge and can be seen through the window, it's unmistakably a tv! No warnings, none at all and especially none in my husband's name. My dad usually does have a license but his memory is dotty, he must have either forgotten or just put it on the long finger. And oh boy, don't I know it! He must have caught him hungover Should we be able to get out of the court date because we had no warnings? We'll still buy the license ofc

Tell ya that's a dear hangover he should of slammed the door in his face.

I thought I had responded . You can get massive monitors these days so an inspector has to check it. But that's a different story . Basically find an old TV license that your dad paid for before or even anything with the license number and find out when he last paid for it and go in with that detail and pay it but beware they may make you back date since it was last paid either that or put it in your name . Surely your hubby was receiving letters in his name from An post about paying it ? I'd doubt your dad was opening letters meant for the hubby ?

My advice is go and organise a solicitor . Your husband will have to go to court . If you pay the outstanding license fee I'd be emailing them and stating you aren't the license holder and that they've incriminated the wrong person but the license has been paid and up to date and maybe look to have the license transferred into your name stating that your dad has been unwell now mind you if he hasn't paid the license in the last 3 or 4 yr then that's a different story. This will at least show the judge you have paid the money scam .

When's the court date ? Keep us updated .....

gerard2210

Call an post explain the situation, its your dads house its his name that should be on the summons. Buy a license now and if an post still bring your husband to court you can explain the mix up to the judge. Unlikely an post will persue it all the way to court. Are you sure your hubby didnt receive any letters prior to summons?

Sleeper12

Tobe honest if your dad is leaving bills unopened it might be time for you to step up and take charge of the bills. Your dad got reminders to pay for the licence. Then at least one bill & possibly some reminders were sent to your husband once they had his name so your dad didn't pass these on either.
An post will have a record or all of bills sent to your dads and husband. This will be part of their case.

To claim its the first you heard of it won't wash with the judge imo. As everyone has said pay the licence ASAP

Billy Reid

Speak to an post legal dept this morning.
This can be pulled at a cost.
Been there done that.
And be apologetic have the credit card ready

Fred Swanson

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Homer

coylemj wrote: »

That's 100% wrong, you cannot negotiate your way out of a District Court summons by discussing it with the agency taking the prosecution in advance of the court hearing.

What you're suggesting is the same as asking a Garda what he will take to 'settle' a drink driving summons.

That's actually not true. And it's nowhere near the same as trying to negotiate your way out of a drink driving summons. Stupid statement to make. I received a summons for non payment of a TV licence recently enough. I purchased a TV licence and contacted An Post and explained it was an oversight on my part. They could see I had purchased a licence recently, and they simply asked me to make a postal order out for the amount that equated to the difference in time between the inspector calling and the date I purchased the new licence! They would then not make any representation in court in relation to the summons and it would be struck out.

jimmycrackcorm

Homer wrote:

That's actually not true. And it's nowhere near the same as trying to negotiate your way out of a drink driving summons. Stupid statement to make. I received a summons for non payment of a TV licence recently enough. I purchased a TV licence and contacted An Post and explained it was an oversight on my part. They could see I had purchased a licence recently, and they simply asked me to make a postal order out for the amount that equated to the difference in time between the inspector calling and the date I purchased the new licence! They would then not make any representation in court in relation to the summons and it would be struck out.

Same happened to us.

rawn

Thanks for all of the replies, i don't have time to read them properly atm but I just want to point out that this is the first my husband had heard from them, there's been nothing else sent to him regarding payment due etc. Definitely not.

My dad is fully clued in now about the situation, and he's admitted he hasn't paid it in years. He had told me in the past that he had one. I think he was just embarrassed that he couldn't afford it, and didn't want us to have to pay for it, which we would have. FML. We can't afford to pay a fine, my hubby is on BTEA and I'm on maternity benefit, we have no credit cards. F**k

rawn

Ok! Update.

Hubby called them there. They said they sent out 2 letters solely in his name. He definitely didn't get them, but it's very likely now that I have the truth from my dad, that my dad just saw the An Post logo and threw it away without looking at the name. But we were told if we bought a license in my husband's name and paid 100e arrears by postal order at least 10 days before the court date (30th June) it will be struck out. Genuinely the best outcome we could have gotten imo. Time to give the Provident man a call!

Thanks everyone for the advice

I love Sean nos

dev100 wrote: »

pay it but beware they may make you back date since it was last paid either that or put it in your name.

They do backdate it. I looked it up before and it says something like if there was a licence at the address in the past six months, they backdate it. The name on the previous licence doesn't matter.

I've tested this. I have a TV licence. Buy it every year. But I never buy it on time. Last year I received a total of 8 reminders before I said **** it and paid up. One previous year I used the wife's name and it backdated regardless.

This raises a question for me. If for example, the OP's TV licence expired in March 2017 and the inspector called in May 2017. OP buys a licence now and it's backdated to start from March 2017. Surely now he has a robust defence in that he had a valid licence at the time the inspector called. It says so right on the front of the licence.

Fred Swanson

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I love Sean nos

Fred Swanson wrote: »

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I've never bought a TV licence over the counter, always online. Always backdated.

Fred Swanson

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snowflaker

If its not backdated to the time of the offence, the offence would still stand.

Fred Swanson

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snowflaker

Fred Swanson wrote: »

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If you are buying for the first time in your name, it has no specific start date, except the day they recorded you without having a licence

uck51js9zml2yt

It gets backdated to the beginning of the current month.
Had to buy one recently after my mother died(she had it free).
Why can't you just buy it in your fathers name and show in court that a TV license was bought by the owner of the house. You neither own the house or TV.

dbagman

So in effect what iv taken from this thread is all you have to do is not give your name to the licence inspector and there's jack they can do to you regarding not having a licence.

snowflaker

Joey Delicious Sprinter wrote: »

It gets backdated to the beginning of the current month.
Had to buy one recently after my mother died(she had it free).
Why can't you just buy it in your fathers name and show in court that a TV license was bought by the owner of the house. You neither own the house or TV.

If it was in his dad's name, they may be liable back to when he last had a tv licence!

snowflaker

dbagman wrote: »

So in effect what iv taken from this thread is all you have to do is not give your name to the licence inspector and there's jack they can do to you regarding not having a licence.

they can get your name

dbagman

snowflaker wrote:

they can get your name

How?

questionmark?

I love Sean nos wrote: »

dev100 wrote: »

pay it but beware they may make you back date since it was last paid either that or put it in your name.

They do backdate it. I looked it up before and it says something like if there was a licence at the address in the past six months, they backdate it. The name on the previous licence doesn't matter.

I've tested this. I have a TV licence. Buy it every year. But I never buy it on time. Last year I received a total of 8 reminders before I said **** it and paid up. One previous year I used the wife's name and it backdated regardless.

This raises a question for me. If for example, the OP's TV licence expired in March 2017 and the inspector called in May 2017. OP buys a licence now and it's backdated to start from March 2017. Surely now he has a robust defence in that he had a valid licence at the time the inspector called. It says so right on the front of the licence.

Hold on that doesn't make sense if it's a new name.
What if you just moved into a rented apartment and the last tenant had not renewed the licence so your expected to cover the time for someone else?
What if you had a licence but the TV broke but only got a new TV five months later so buy a licence. Again your paying for a time you were not required to hold a licence?

Fred Swanson

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gerard2210

snowflaker wrote:

they can get your name

dbagman wrote:

How?

Ask a neighbour, label on your bin.

Fred Swanson

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Yourself isit

dbagman wrote: »

So in effect what iv taken from this thread is all you have to do is not give your name to the licence inspector and there's jack they can do to you regarding not having a licence.

They would have just summoned the father.

Fred Swanson

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I love Sean nos

Fred Swanson wrote: »

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Yes. I've never received a "corrected" one as you described. But again, I've always renewed online, never at a post counter.

So if it's backdated to before the inspector visited, then there's no case to answer in court I would have thought and no arrears to pay.

dbagman

gerard2210 wrote:

Ask a neighbour, label on your bin.

Fred Swanson wrote:

Ask the postman, lookup the electoral register, check the bins. Very easy for them to get a name.

Iv always lived in shared rental accommodation. There's always at least 1 out of the 3 or 4 in the house that won't pay it hence I end up going without as I refuse to be the one that pays for it. Bills are all in different names. Post is all in different names. Pretty sure there's no name on the bins. Iv never really known neighbours on a first and second name basis. In all the years and different addresses iv had it's never once been an issue. Just curious how they do catch people without them actually being told a name.

Really Interested

rawn wrote: »

Thanks I will do that.

Just spoke to my dad about it, he said he's been getting letters but hasn't opened them, he doesn't remember if he threw them out or not but I'm looking for them now, chances are there's a few warnings in there! I'm guessing when he didn't pay up they showed up and my supposedly smart husband gave his name so they probably assumed my dad moved out and are chasing him for it now. Fml. We'll call them tomorrow and see if we can just pay up and avoid the court altogether. My husband is doing a summer internship and I don't like the idea of him having to ask for a day off to go to court! Thanks everyone

What age is dad?

brian_t

Really Interested wrote: »

What age is dad?

rawn wrote: »

He's mid 50s.!

.

Peregrinus

dbagman wrote: »

Iv always lived in shared rental accommodation. There's always at least 1 out of the 3 or 4 in the house that won't pay it hence I end up going without as I refuse to be the one that pays for it. Bills are all in different names. Post is all in different names. Pretty sure there's no name on the bins. Iv never really known neighbours on a first and second name basis. In all the years and different addresses iv had it's never once been an issue. Just curious how they do catch people without them actually being told a name.

They're the post office. They deliver the post. They know who lives there.

endacl

coylemj wrote: »

That's 100% wrong, you cannot negotiate your way out of a District Court summons by discussing it with the agency taking the prosecution in advance of the court hearing.

What you're suggesting is the same as asking a Garda what he will take to 'settle' a drink driving summons.

You can indeed. I'm aware of two individual instances where an 'oh my god I cant believe I've been so stupid' phone call and the purchase of a license resulted in the action being dropped.

dbagman

Peregrinus wrote:

They're the post office. They deliver the post. They know who lives there.

Hardly when as iv said there's multiple names getting letters delivered. Past and present tenants. They could have their pick of 8 or so names.