MATCH PREVIEW & THREAD: B&I Lions vs NZ Provincial Baa-Baas

Braken

Braken wrote: »

Sexton was terrible today,he is tackling too high,more pulling then tackling,how he came through the rugby system without learning how to tackle technicle correct is beyond me...he hasn't a chance of making the test team..

Yeah its so weird. Te'o and Farrell were doing the same thing, I thought it was because they are trying to contain the ball in the tackle and because in mid field its not always possible to adjust in time for strike runners but obviously they have picked up some bad habits from Sexton.

coulagh2017

Sam Warburton was a mile of the pace. Perhaps he has a lot of hard training done the past 2 months while being out injured and hoping to peak in a few weeks.

I think the chances of Sexton starting are slim. It was telling in the second half half when he made the tackle that he stayed down for winded.. management had Farrell lined up immediately to come on. Yes, there is bigger games to come but the fact they gave him no time to recover shows little confidence in his abilities to survive the physical confrontations that lay in store.

ScrubsfanChris

Didn't know he was good at the aul rugby too :pac:

pickarooney

Hippo wrote: »

Abysmal. Obviously some lack of coherence to be expected, but the butchering of opportunities in the first half particularly was down to poor individual errors and some selfish decision-making. On that showing there's a genuine chance of there being no further victories.

I thought at first you were a baa baas fan

typhoony

Sexton is playing like he's one tackle away from being injured again. Lacks confidence

buck65

Sexton is finished lads. He may yet star in this series but I think he will not be playing for Ireland after this tour. He should have been left at home.

sydthebeat

buck65 wrote: »

..... but I think he will not be playing for Ireland after this tour......

what are you basing this on?

ScrubsfanChris

buck65 wrote: »

Sexton is finished lads. He may yet star in this series but I think he will not be playing for Ireland after this tour. He should have been left at home.

Hippo

Braken wrote: »

Sexton was terrible today,he is tackling too high,more pulling then tackling,how he came through the rugby system without learning how to tackle technicle correct is beyond me...he hasn't a chance of making the test team..

No argument, he was very poor today. His tackling technique is a bit like Jonny Wilkinson's, i.e. a No.10 showing that he's no pushover. He remains a world-class player, despite his recent form. Of course he has a chance of making the test team - if he improves.

Thelomen Toblackai

It's funny watching everyone (reddit, social media etc) lose their minds over one game (people were going mental after 20 minutes tbh) in which all but about 3 players had bad games. All the English and Scottish fans jumping on Henderson over a bad performance but clearly just using it as an opportunity to continue whinging about Launchbury or Gray not being selected.

The reason Sexton and Laidlaw looked so bad is because they were the center of everything that happened and more involved than anyone else. They played badly but were far from the only ones. So many players like Warburton were completely anonymous and done fcuk all while those that were trying to make headway will be hung for failing.

I mean if you have a team with Sexton, Laidlaw, Hogg, AWJ, Warburton, Joseph, Henderson and all of those played ****e is it really a problem with form ? And as bad as they were while they were on the Lions had about 5 try scoring chances. Hoggs bad pass, Warburtons penalty, held up 3 times over the line etc.

When the players everyone was calling for to be replaced were taken off and a host of fresh legs and replacements on the Lions managed one simple enough run it from a flat pass then immediately went to **** again and were pinned in their own half by a then tired semi pro team for the remainder of the game. They could have actually lost that game in the last 5 minutes without putting up much in the way of a fight.

To me it didn't look like individuals failing, it looks like a shambles of a team who were completely unused to playing with each other and no plan whatsoever to mitigate that and when they couldn't put scores up it kept them under constant pressure and everything went wrong for them.

I think people are in for a rude awakening if they think the problem is individuals and that replacing them will fix things. The next team up won't be fumbling the ball every 20 seconds to release the pressure like the Provincial Barbarians did.

buck65

ScrubsfanChris wrote: »

Honestly reserve judgment til this tour is over. This is a step too far for Sexton and he should be resting with a proper pre season. I said it before Murray and Sexton should be pulled by the IRFU.

irishbucsfan

buck65 wrote: »

Honestly reserve judgment til this tour is over. This is a step too far for Sexton and he should be resting with a proper pre season. I said it before Murray and Sexton should be pulled by the IRFU.

Even if that didn't break the laws of the sport, there's not a hope in hell Murray or Sexton would agree to that.

HankScorpio102

Don't know how laidlaw got on the tour even after youngs pulled out. Would have Gareth Davies, Danny care even Kieran marmion ahead of him. Honestly think it was just to up the Scottish numbers in the squad after all the fuss of 2 being named originally. He's possibly the slowest scrumhalf I've ever seen. The only thing he offers is place kicking which won't be needed with Farrell, sexton, halfpenny etc. And clermont have signed him for next season! What are they thinking?

laurie88

Johnny had a bad start. From what the commentators said that he demanded the kicking responsibilities suggest him thinking he under estimated the NZ Baba's.
This whole lions team that fronted up, on paper, in any other country, would have torn shreds off of any other team.
They had the best forwards combo that they could have available, the back combo, I honestly think Farrell was the first choice above Johnny anyway, but the whole Lions game lacked skill speed and execution.
They are professionals and I reckon they should have prepped better. 3 days short of arriving, that's a long flight etc
The starting 23 should've been wrapped up in cotton wool on the way over
The Baba's had a few things on there side
Home advantage
NZ coached skill set and fitness levels
NZ mentality towards winning at all costs

No real continuity of pressure was applied at length to them, The Lions did cut them a few times but not enough to wound them. They let them fight back.
Farrell made the difference in the second half.

This was a 90% full strength Lions side and they nearly came undone.
If NZ travelled anywhere and had the same result against not a second tier but 3rd tier ranked team (personally I would say 4th as I think the Maori AB's will pose a bigger threat)
They would be expected to win and win well even if they just got off the plane an hour before or lewts say, 3 days before.

bilston

laurie88 wrote: »

Johnny had a bad start. From what the commentators said that he demanded the kicking responsibilities suggest him thinking he under estimated the NZ Baba's.
This whole lions team that fronted up, on paper, in any other country, would have torn shreds off of any other team.
They had the best forwards combo that they could have available, the back combo, I honestly think Farrell was the first choice above Johnny anyway, but the whole Lions game lacked skill speed and execution.
They are professionals and I reckon they should have prepped better. 3 days short of arriving, that's a long flight etc
The starting 23 should've been wrapped up in cotton wool on the way over
The Baba's had a few things on there side
Home advantage
NZ coached skill set and fitness levels
NZ mentality towards winning at all costs

No real continuity of pressure was applied at length to them, The Lions did cut them a few times but not enough to wound them. They let them fight back.
Farrell made the difference in the second half.

This was a 90% full strength Lions side and they nearly came undone.
If NZ travelled anywhere and had the same result against not a second tier but 3rd tier ranked team (personally I would say 4th as I think the Maori AB's will pose a bigger threat)
They would be expected to win and win well even if they just got off the plane an hour before or lewts say, 3 days before.

90% full strength?

That's hard to measure at this stage but taking today into consideration I will have another stab at the test team

1 McGrath
2 Best
3 Furlong
4 Kruis
5 Itoje
6 Stander
7 Warburton
8 Faletau
9 Murray
10 Farrell
11 North
12 Henshaw (p
13 Davies
14 Watson
15 Halfpenny

Everyone will have their own opinions, but we were a long way off 90% of that side today.

laurie88

true, but with the reserves and all
That, on paper is a monster team, had they played anywhere else!!!??

I would've started the whole front row replacements
Itoje would've got 1st choice as well as Connor and the rest of the backline is on point.
However, the do or die attitude that nz have for the game is not in the Lions, and this was the difference today
hit everything at pace as if it is the last minute that you will spend on the paddock playing the great Lions legacy
That's what this Baba's team had today
and that what every team, that the Lions will play that is not called the All Blacks will have
They will have "fcuk me!!! I'm going to play the Lions!" and will give the attitude of life to win it

irishbucsfan

The players who didn't start were almost all invoolved in knockout rugby domestically.

There were very few selection decisions to be made if you're leaving those guys out to get recovered.

Yeah_Right

Thelomen Toblackai wrote: »

The next team up won't be fumbling the ball every 20 seconds to release the pressure like the Provincial Barbarians did.

You do realise the next team up is the Blues? Even though I'm a Blues fan, I'm pretty sure they'll turn the ball over a lot. The difference is they will offer a lot more on attack when they do keep hold of the ball (I hope).

irishbucsfan

Yeah_Right wrote: »

You do realise the next team up is the Blues? Even though I'm a Blues fan, I'm pretty sure they'll turn the ball over a lot. The difference is they will offer a lot more on attack when they do keep hold of the ball (I hope).

They'll offer more on attack but they also have tape to study. Today's scratch team were effectively impossible to prepare for specifically. So it'll go both ways.

I expect Farrell to get the defence playing a lot more aggressively for then.

shuffol

I think if the last few weeks have shown us anything it's that margins are tight in rugby and if one side is off their game by a few per cent and the other side is treating it like a cup final anything can happen.

Today will have no bearing on the test matches. If the Lions are to take a test off New Zealand it'll be through a monumental forward effort with Murray and Farrell/Sexton putting them in the right areas of the field. They have the pack to do that but It won't be the type of performance they can trot out every week though.

Interested Observer

Anyone else notice the ref standing in the channel outside the SH on more than one occasion during the game? Whatever about making decisions, standing in the wrong spot and influencing play is fairly poor.

Tim Robbins

Braken wrote: »

Sexton was terrible today,he is tackling too high,more pulling then tackling,how he came through the rugby system without learning how to tackle technicle correct is beyond me...he hasn't a chance of making the test team..

He is trying to wrap the man and ball. Super hard tackle to make.

However, you drive a player right back with a decent tackle on the hips, so wonder should he mix he up?

Tim Robbins

Erik Shin wrote: »

I'd have to agree, thought Best was one of the better performers this morning won a beaut of a turnover too

I'd liked the one where he was on the tail of the lineout, read the next play, gone it quickly and got a nice jackal in.

Kanrith

I thought Sexton's defence was one of the few aspects that worked well today for him. He had a few good hits in my recollection.

laurie88

irishbucsfan wrote: »

The players who didn't start were almost all invoolved in knockout rugby domestically.

There were very few selection decisions to be made if you're leaving those guys out to get recovered.

yup ok, we'll take that point.
Here's another; This is THE LIONS
whatever degree of talent that performed on the pitch, they are the creme talent pool of the North that no matter who is chosen, should've wiped the floor with ease,
which played non pro players that had more heart.
Ireland beat the AB's black and blue then the following week AB side were back to doing what they do, win games.

I hope for the sake of the game that the Lions reciprocate.

GrainneArd

I do think Sexton and Murray are our best 10 and 9. But every time I watch Sexton he is so slow getting up from the hits. Every time I watch him I wonder is this the last time. Is he physically too old now. I don't think that is the reason but he is on his knees on a regular basis these days. Is he being hit so hard so regularly that he is no longer capable of taking a hit.

Buer

laurie88 wrote:

which played non pro players

Eh, what?

Brutal result and performance. The opposition were all professional rugby players though.

swiwi_

Buer wrote: »

Eh, what?

Brutal result and performance. The opposition were all professional rugby players though.

The devil is in the detail Buer. Im disappointed you couldn't recognise the devil as usually it takes one to know one...

(One of the Baa-baas plays in the Heartland Championship for Wanganui which is non-pro).

Buer

swiwi_ wrote:

The devil is in the detail Buer. Im disappointed you couldn't recognise the devil as usually it takes one to know one...

Well that's annoying. But a replacement second row on the field for 19 minutes does not make it an amateur side.

Regardless, it shouldn't distract from the performance or result. I have money on the NZ SR sides to all beat their handicaps and I haven't changed that opinion at all.

I'm probably more confident if anything.

It's going to be a long month for the Lions.

It was a disappointing win but at the end of the day it was a warm up game which was clearly badly needed.

There was a total lack of intensity though and while there might be valid reasons for this, it was the one aspect of the performance I found troubling.