Clonmel to Thurles Greenway (Lets take Tipp off track)

macjohn

Deleted User wrote: »

If it is a cycling track (and i would imagine that most users of these amenities are cyclists who want to explore the whole length) then you would need smooth hard surface.

Absolutely, probably would be a bad step to develop it and not cycle friendly but just thought the article was interesting.

As you say would need to be smooth as people are spending a lot on road bikes.

whisky_galore

Deleted User wrote: »

Farmers are in favour of projects like this. One of our own groups dad is a farmer with land near the old line and he is in favour. There is another dairy farmer down in Waterford who spoke publicly on the Deise groups behalf and he was a strong proponent of the greenway.

All farmers, or just the two you mentioned?

Well, best of luck, but people need to be realistic.
Thurles-Clonmel has been out of CIE ownership for a half century. The Waterford project is a different kettle of fish as that still is, or was, CIE property until very recently.

Del.Monte

Like the little used railway lines that people give out about - who is going to pay for the maintenance of all these Greenways?

whisky_galore

Del.Monte wrote: »

Like the little used railway lines that people give out about - who is going to pay for the maintenance of all these Greenways?

As far as I know Limerick Co Council maintain the Limerick portion of the GST and I believe Kerry C.C. now are in charge of the Fenit branch, although only a tiny portion of that has got tarmac on it.
Locals on the outskirts of Tralee blocked any further progress.

I think there is an assumption that once the tarmac is down the work is over, far from it. Surfaces break up and gates and fences need ongoing replacement.

macjohn

whisky_galore wrote: »

All farmers, or just the two you mentioned?

Well, best of luck, but people need to be realistic.
Thurles-Clonmel has been out of CIE ownership for a half century. The Waterford project is a different kettle of fish as that still is, or was, CIE property until very recently.

Thanks.

Was struggling to see why someone might be against it.


Ya loads of realism in this and the other thread to be fair.

whisky_galore wrote: »

I think there is an assumption that once the tarmac is down the work is over, far from it. Surfaces break up and gates and fences need ongoing replacement.

I dont think there is that assumption at all, far from it.

Obviously like everything maintenance will be needed.

whisky_galore

macjohn wrote: »

Thanks.

Was struggling to see why someone might be against it.

Don't worry, they came out of the woodwork when the Fenit Greenway was proposed, citing privacy issues, loss of their gardens, increases in criminality and god knows what else. The impasse at Abbeyfeale were farmers taking over the trackbed as their own.

Del.Monte

Del.Monte wrote: »

Like the little used railway lines that people give out about - who is going to pay for the maintenance of all these Greenways?

Considering that its worth a bit to the local economy id imagine it would be worthwhile the local council looking after them. The waterford one cost 15m to develop but it is estimated that 100 jobs will be created and that it will be worth over 100m to the economy over the next five years.

whisky_galore

whisky_galore wrote: »

All farmers, or just the two you mentioned?

Well, best of luck, but people need to be realistic.
Thurles-Clonmel has been out of CIE ownership for a half century. The Waterford project is a different kettle of fish as that still is, or was, CIE property until very recently.

Oh dont worry we are under no illusions. Of course we havent spoke to all farmers yet but i prefer to be positive about it rather than just sit on the fence, make assumptions and moan about it like some people would prefer me and the others to do. Id rather get up off my arse and be proactive instead of whining and being defeatist.

No greenway project was easy. There is obstacles everywhere, but if you believe in something you persevere. The positives of the Waterford Greenway can be used to promote our own campaign. The facebook page is doing very well and gaining alot of interest.

bert n ernie

Hi all, this is a general example of the processes involved in a project of this nature. Might be worth a read. http://bit.ly/2u6ebuK and http://bit.ly/2tD6N7i

Might also be worth examining the budgets of the county councils involved, specifically under planning/environment, as projects such as this can and will run into the millions. The one above was estimated at €8mill approx. for the Fingal portion.Maintenance of projects of this scale can involve a large maintenance budget on the local authorities part.

Also worth examining if there is alternate funding available from other sources, grants etc. were there any other proposals of this nature in the county that could be drawn from.

bert n ernie

bert n ernie wrote: »

Hi all, this is a general example of the processes involved in a project of this nature. Might be worth a read. http://bit.ly/2u6ebuK and http://bit.ly/2tD6N7i

Might also be worth examining the budgets of the county councils involved, specifically under planning/environment, as projects such as this can and will run into the millions. The one above was estimated at €8mill approx. for the Fingal portion.Maintenance of projects of this scale can involve a large maintenance budget on the local authorities part.

Also worth examining if there is alternate funding available from other sources, grants etc. were there any other proposals of this nature in the county that could be drawn from.

The Waterford project cost 15m but given the current activity and buzz around the county, it is estimated that it could be worth 100m to the economy over the next five years. Bed and breakfasts are booked out for fifty miles, jobs are being created and rural areas are really benefiting.

A bit like saying hurling matches cost money to stage in Thurles without considering that they reap a hell of alot too. But from the point of view that it is harder to get authorities to see the bigger picture then i get what your saying. Support is growing for this and we are collecting signatures wherever we go.

bert n ernie

Deleted User wrote: »

The Waterford project cost 15m but given the current activity and buzz around the county, it is estimated that it could be worth 100m to the economy over the next five years. Bed and breakfasts are booked out for fifty miles, jobs are being created and rural areas are really benefiting.

A bit like saying hurling matches cost money to stage in Thurles without considering that they reap a hell of alot too. But from the point of view that it is harder to get authorities to see the bigger picture then i get what your saying. Support is growing for this and we are collecting signatures wherever we go.

Just to be clear, I'm in favour of this idea. What I'm saying is that the councillors local representatives need to see the bigger picture here.At the end of the day for spend on a project such as this money needs to be drawn from the existing pot, at least in the initial stages, and it's worth asking the question about joint funding. They will have to approve funding and budgetary changes and have a majority support from their elected colleagues to do so.

Failte Ireland are spending massive amounts of money advertising overseas with "themed" packages - castles, rivers, Irelands Ancient East, Wild Atlantic way etc. Quite a lot of the marketing is focusing on overseas markets, would be worth examining the stakeholders and target audience in a few of these projects and seeing if there's an angle that could be promoted.

bert n ernie

bert n ernie wrote: »

Just to be clear, I'm in favour of this idea. What I'm saying is that the councillors local representatives need to see the bigger picture here.At the end of the day for spend on a project such as this money needs to be drawn from the existing pot, at least in the initial stages, and it's worth asking the question about joint funding. They will have to approve funding and budgetary changes and have a majority support from their elected colleagues to do so.

Failte Ireland are spending massive amounts of money advertising overseas with "themed" packages - castles, rivers, Irelands Ancient East, Wild Atlantic way etc. Quite a lot of the marketing is focusing on overseas markets, would be worth examining the stakeholders and target audience in a few of these projects and seeing if there's an angle that could be promoted.

Im informed that the motion is going in front of the meeting of Tipperary County council tomorrow night in Nenagh for a feasibility study to be conducted into the possibility. I know of at least 5 councillors behind the motion. I think it will pass and if not then the campaign is not over.

It would be interesting certainly to find out whether more tourists would come from mainland europe if we created more cycle routes.

Del.Monte

Deleted User wrote: »

The Waterford project cost 15m but given the current activity and buzz around the county, it is estimated that it could be worth 100m to the economy over the next five years. Bed and breakfasts are booked out for fifty miles, jobs are being created and rural areas are really benefiting.

A bit like saying hurling matches cost money to stage in Thurles without considering that they reap a hell of alot too. But from the point of view that it is harder to get authorities to see the bigger picture then i get what your saying. Support is growing for this and we are collecting signatures wherever we go.

Hyperbole - much!

Del.Monte

Del.Monte wrote: »

Hyperbole - much!

Er no not really?

I was informed by a member of the Deise Greenway group that visitors that using the Waterford greenway are staying in accommodation in neighbouring counties as far as Cork and Tipperary within a 50 mile radius. I can assume they have done their research on the local accommodation facilities. Kilmac in particular is really reaping the benefit.

I was down in Waterford myself the other day and there was a constant flow of people going onto the greenway and coming off it at the WIT campus.

Del.Monte

Deleted User wrote: »

Er no not really?

I was informed by a member of the Deise Greenway group that visitors that using the Waterford greenway are staying in accommodation in neighbouring counties as far as Cork and Tipperary within a 50 mile radius. I can assume they have done their research on the local accommodation facilities. Kilmac in particular is really reaping the benefit.

I was down in Waterford myself the other day and there was a constant flow of people going onto the greenway and coming off it at the WIT campus.

But that's not what you said, and you implied that every B+B within 50 miles of the greenway was booked out. It used to be that every town had to have an advanced factory, a bypass and now the latest panacea for all rural Ireland's ills is to have a greenway.

Del.Monte

Del.Monte wrote: »

But that's not what you said, and you implied that every B+B within 50 miles of the greenway was booked out. It used to be that every town had to have an advanced factory, a bypass and now the latest panacea for all rural Ireland's ills is to have a greenway.

yes that is what i was informed that there is huge demand for accomodation within a 50mile radius for those who are using the greenway. ??


What is your beef with this concept? Can you honestly not see the benefit? what is your genuine argument against it besides this nonsense you are spouting?

Its a place to get exercise in a safe environment and will have huge economic and tourism benefits for the area. Many from the local areas are behind it and one of our campaigners who is an avid cyclist, everyone he speaks to is fully behind it.

Del.Monte

Del.Monte wrote: »

But that's not what you said, and you implied that every B+B within 50 miles of the greenway was booked out. It used to be that every town had to have an advanced factory, a bypass and now the latest panacea for all rural Ireland's ills is to have a greenway.

:rolleyes:

Good grief what a condescending arrogant tone your post has and without any real basis of counter argument. You said the other day 'who is going to pay for these greenways?'. Who pays for the upkeep of the rock of cashel or any of the other sites? And why do they do it?

Is that your only argument btw? ''oh its a new craze amongst rural Irelands ills'' I have to wonder about some of the people in this country at times and their lack of foresight

Del.Monte

Deleted User wrote: »

:rolleyes:

Good grief what a condescending arrogant tone your post has and without any real basis of counter argument. You said the other day 'who is going to pay for these greenways?'. Who pays for the upkeep of the rock of cashel or any of the other sites? And why do they do it?

Is that your only argument btw? ''oh its a new craze amongst rural Irelands ills'' I have to wonder about some of the people in this country at times and their lack of foresight

I have plenty of foresight thank you and have seen enough bs in rural Ireland (especially Co.Tipperary) to last me several lifetimes. Why don't you get your wonderful local TD Michael Lowry on the case or Tipperary Enterprise? :pac:

Del.Monte

Del.Monte wrote: »

I have plenty of foresight thank you and have seen enough bs in rural Ireland (especially Co.Tipperary) to last me several lifetimes. Why don't you get your wonderful local TD Michael Lowry on the case or Tipperary Enterprise? :pac:

Ah here your credibility is just gone with this nonsense. Every initiative in rural ireland is bs? FFS grow up.

Some brush your tarring us all with. :rolleyes:
And yet you have failed to mount any solid argument against it apart from some bizarre agenda you seem to have against rural life, its people, its politicians? Scutter talk.

Vizzy

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/newreply.php?do=newreply&p=103984087

This is a post I put on the Waterford Greenway thread last week. Doesn't prove that B&B's are booked for "50 miles" but it gives a flavour of the benefits of the Greenway to the area.

By the way, there are two motions on the Council agenda tomorrow asking that a feasibility study on the Clonmel Thurles Greenway be carried out.

Vizzy

Vizzy wrote: »

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/newreply.php?do=newreply&p=103984087

This is a post I put on the Waterford Greenway thread last week. Doesn't prove that B&B's are booked for "50 miles" but it gives a flavour of the benefits of the Greenway to the area.

By the way, there are two motions on the Council agenda tomorrow asking that a feasibility study on the Clonmel Thurles Greenway be carried out.

Thanks Vizzy. I was speaking to the two councillors in question from each side of the track that are proposing the motion and they are backed by a couple of other councillors. Meanwhile myself and a couple of others are going to collect signatures and are looking into other ways of funding the campaign

I rung a member of the Waterford Greenway group looking for information recently on how they went about campaigning and he informed me that there is demand on accommodation within a 50 mile vicinity in Cork, Kilkenny, Tipperary and other neighbouring areas. I cant vouch for the validity of this information and also the greenway in Waterford is newly opened lets be fair and its possible that there may have been a spike of demand in the early stages.

the_pen_turner

I cannot fathom how anyone could think this is a bad idea .
anything that brings people into the area has to be good

marvin80

Deleted User wrote: »

Thanks Vizzy. I was speaking to the two councillors in question from each side of the track that are proposing the motion and they are backed by a couple of other councillors. Meanwhile myself and a couple of others are going to collect signatures and are looking into other ways of funding the campaign

Any update on how the proposed motion went last night?

marvin80

marvin80 wrote: »

Any update on how the proposed motion went last night?

The two motions were declined before going on the floor unfortunately. its a setback but other campaigns have experienced similar setbacks. Thats just the way. I felt it was a bit shortsighted not too even discuss this based on the fact a previous motion by Pat English didnt get off the ground two years ago. People are more educated to the benefits of these amenities since with the population of the Waterford greenways and other greenways in the west.

Nevertheless we are currently collecting loads of petition signatures and interest is really growing. We will continue to fight for what we believe is a worthy cause that will bring huge tourism and lifestyle benefits.

marvin80

Very shortsighted alright - it's definitely worth doing a feasibility study at least.

It would appear to be a non runner due mainly to the lack of finances. A lot of money has been put into the track from Clonmel to Carrick and they obviously feel that is enough for now.

Del.Monte

What do walkers make of the 'concrete' Greenway?

What's wrong with so called 'hardpack' as used in the Isle of Man where walkers, horses, and the occasional cyclist are all catered for?

Deleted User

Deleted User wrote: »

It would appear to be a non runner due mainly to the lack of finances. A lot of money has been put into the track from Clonmel to Carrick and they obviously feel that is enough for now.

I believe though there will be state funding available down the line so it might be another route to goal so to speak. The minister, Shane Ross was looking for submissions of interest which were due during the week. I submitted one on behalf of our group.

Del.Monte

Del.Monte wrote: »

What do walkers make of the 'concrete' Greenway?

What's wrong with so called 'hardpack' as used in the Isle of Man where walkers, horses, and the occasional cyclist are all catered for?

A couple of things have to be considered with surface. Now im no expert on the different properties of surface but id imagine for cycle/walk track that is used throughout the year are required to be somewhat frost resistant while at the same time keeping in mind that bicycle wheels need a smooth terrain.

Is hardpack a sort of sandy looking colour?

Paddico

Del.Monte wrote: »

What do walkers make of the 'concrete' Greenway?

What's wrong with so called 'hardpack' as used in the Isle of Man where walkers, horses, and the occasional cyclist are all catered for?

Cant horses go of concrete too?
Not been smart with that one by the way