Munster Team Talk Thread VI - Stander Up and Fight

Akrasia

Guess Who's Back, Back Again? JJ's Back, Tell a Friend

Awesome. really strong team for Sunday

Can't wait for it now

Buer

Psycho Killer - "Hands Away" (Prop-Prop-Prrrroppp-Prop, Prop-Prop-Prop-Prrrrrrop-Prop)

For Munster's sake, I hope their front five are all fit and firing for at least an hour.

Very strong team, very dodgy bench.

Eod100

Buer wrote: »

For Munster's sake, I hope their front five are all fit and firing for at least an hour.

Very strong team, very dodgy bench.

I wouldn't say very dodgy but still not ideal!

Buer

Psycho Killer - "Hands Away" (Prop-Prop-Prrrroppp-Prop, Prop-Prop-Prop-Prrrrrrop-Prop)

Eod100 wrote: »

I wouldn't say very dodgy but still not ideal!

Perhaps dodgy is too strong a word but certainly not a bench you'd be thrilled to see for a crunch European match. 61 appearances between them, 37 of which are attributed to KOB.

As it stands, I think that Munster starting pack is good enough to do a number on Castres in Limerick, especially with Murray bossing it. Two score win for Munster with a BP.

Poorside

Delighted to be wrong about the 2 boys, that’s a good rounded team to put out.

Sabre0001

Guess Who's Back, Back Again? JJ's Back, Tell a Friend

My nerves have settled a little...for now. They'll start ramping up again Sunday morning. Strong team, hopefully we can start strong and keep it up for 80 minutes - too many slow starts / taking the foot off the gas.

Poorside

Sabre0001 wrote: »

My nerves have settled a little...for now. They'll start ramping up again Sunday morning. Strong team, hopefully we can start strong and keep it up for 80 minutes - too many slow starts / taking the foot off the gas.

The one positive about the bench is they’ll all be eager to make an impact and put their hand up for next week, so can’t see a drop in intensity when they come on.

Eod100

Sabre0001 wrote: »

My nerves have settled a little...for now. They'll start ramping up again Sunday morning. Strong team, hopefully we can start strong and keep it up for 80 minutes - too many slow starts / taking the foot off the gas.

Yeah I think it was POM during the week saying they needed big start. The 1pm kick-offs don't help but thems the breaks..

phog

Buer wrote: »

For Munster's sake, I hope their front five are all fit and firing for at least an hour.

Very strong team, very dodgy bench.

Parker is probably the weakest of the bench and he has improved in the few games that I saw him in recently

Mickiemcfist

To be honest I'm delighted to see a relatively green bench, we don't give youth a shot half as much as Leinster do. The reserve props & Fineen particularly will be all the better for it.

Poorside

Mickiemcfist wrote: »

To be honest I'm delighted to see a relatively green bench, we don't give youth a shot half as much as Leinster do. The reserve props & Fineen particularly will be all the better for it.

And in fairness, KOB is in fine form at the minute, wouldn’t be one bit surprised if he got called in the next Camp Joe, not that he’d be threatening a squad place but he’s starting to lead the pack behind Cronin Scannell and Herring

Yeah_Right

Guess Who's Back, Back Again? JJ's Back, Tell a Friend

Buer wrote: »

Perhaps dodgy is too strong a word but certainly not a bench you'd be thrilled to see for a crunch European match. 61 appearances between them, 37 of which are attributed to KOB.

I assume that you are referring to the tight 5 replacements because there is a lot of experience between Botha, Mathewson, JJ and Arnold.

Is Marshall injured?

Buer

Psycho Killer - "Hands Away" (Prop-Prop-Prrrroppp-Prop, Prop-Prop-Prop-Prrrrrrop-Prop)

Yeah_Right wrote: »

I assume that you are referring to the tight 5 replacements because there is a lot of experience between Botha, Mathewson, JJ and Arnold.

Yes. That was a test. Well noted.

Treat yourself to a can of VB.

Yeah_Right

Guess Who's Back, Back Again? JJ's Back, Tell a Friend

Buer wrote: »

Yes. That was a test. Well noted.

Treat yourself to a can of VB.

You can shove your VB up your ..... I'm all about the Fosters.

case885

John Hayes Ligind

Will be interesting if JVG drops JJ for carbery if he's fit this weekend, I'd like to see JJ back up that performance but he's frustratingly inconsistent.

Tomtom364

Psycho Killer - "Hands Away" (Prop-Prop-Prrrroppp-Prop, Prop-Prop-Prop-Prrrrrrop-Prop)

case885 wrote: »

Will be interesting if JVG drops JJ for carbery if he's fit this weekend, I'd like to see JJ back up that performance but he's frustratingly inconsistent.

100% carbery in if fit.

I feel for JJ in the situation like but carbery is just too far above him in class to not go back in if available. A win in castre woild be very valuable before the game in kingsholm

Mr Tickle

Return of the JJ

case885 wrote: »

Will be interesting if JVG drops JJ for carbery if he's fit this weekend, I'd like to see JJ back up that performance but he's frustratingly inconsistent.

It's a tired line about the guy but it's still true so i'll repeat it; JJ has never been given a good run of games to show how consistent he can be as a starting 10. It was looking like this would be his season since he overtook Keatley at the end of last year. Then along comes Joey.

Former Former

John Hayes Ligind

Mr Tickle wrote: »

It's a tired line about the guy but it's still true so i'll repeat it; JJ has never been given a good run of games to show how consistent he can be as a starting 10. It was looking like this would be his season since he overtook Keatley at the end of last year. Then along comes Joey.

You should never be 'given' a run to prove anything. You earn it.

Every young player coming through is the same. You pick up games here and there when the existing guy is injured, rested or away on internationals. You work your ass off in training. You take the chances that come your way and you force the coach to pick you.

Hanrahan just hasn't done it. Why should he be given anything and not Johnston? Why not give Bleyendaal a run?

Mr Tickle

Return of the JJ

Former Former wrote: »

You should never be 'given' a run to prove anything. You earn it.

Every young player coming through is the same. You pick up games here and there when the existing guy is injured, rested or away on internationals. You work your ass off in training. You take the chances that come your way and you force the coach to pick you.

Hanrahan just hasn't done it. Why should he be given anything and not Johnston? Why not give Bleyendaal a run?

You're right. But I think he did earn it last season. He overtook the two who were there. Then a new guy dropped in front of him.

And i'm not saying this from a "justice for JJ" point of view. Just that we don't know as much as people think we do.

case885

John Hayes Ligind

Former Former wrote:

You should never be 'given' a run to prove anything. You earn it.

Former Former wrote:

Every young player coming through is the same. You pick up games here and there when the existing guy is injured, rested or away on internationals. You work your ass off in training. You take the chances that come your way and you force the coach to pick you.

Former Former wrote:

Hanrahan just hasn't done it. Why should he be given anything and not Johnston? Why not give Bleyendaal a run?

Well JJ put a motm performance in at the weekend, Johnston hasn't hasn't stood out at pro 14 level and Bleyendaal is seen more as a 12 now.

Caranica

case885 wrote: »

Well JJ put a motm performance in at the weekend, Johnston hasn't hasn't stood out at pro 14 level and Bleyendaal is seen more as a 12 now.

Johnston has had very very little time at pro14 level. Almost all his rugby so far this season was with the A team where he played a blinder.

Former Former

John Hayes Ligind

case885 wrote: »

Well JJ put a motm performance in at the weekend, Johnston hasn't hasn't stood out at pro 14 level and Bleyendaal is seen more as a 12 now.

You could alternatively argue that a performance against a weakened Castres side who generally don't bother their arses away from home isn't much indication of anything.

I've nothing against JJ but he's had plenty of chances, the guy is 26 now.

Shefwedfan

Former Former wrote: »

You could alternatively argue that a performance against a weakened Castres side who generally don't bother their arses away from home isn't much indication of anything.

I've nothing against JJ but he's had plenty of chances, the guy is 26 now.

Ahh yeah, throw him onto the scrap heap....sure he is f**king useless


He could play for another 10 years of rugby at the highest level, you do realize that?


So once you dump JJ, what the plan? bring in Johnson, wait for him to make a mistake. Call him s**t, drive him out of the club and then move onto the next guy.....


Munster have no long term plan, doesn't seem like the supporter do either.



Let looks at last few years in one position
Keatley - too old, move him on
JJ v1 - too young don't play him, he moves
Bleyendaal - injury prone, get some games and looks decent, now he is a 12????
JJ v2 - too old don't play him

Carberry - currently the savior but who knows next week
Johnson - too young don't play him.....

Mr Tickle

Return of the JJ

Former Former wrote: »

You could alternatively argue that a performance against a weakened Castres side who generally don't bother their arses away from home isn't much indication of anything.

I've nothing against JJ but he's had plenty of chances, the guy is 26 now.

This is what i was getting at. I think he's had surprisingly few chances.
Also 26 is hardly curtains. In a position where decision making and experience are so important he has plenty of time yet.

Even if he never breaks the irish team he's far too good to be thinking about getting rid of.

Former Former

John Hayes Ligind

Shefwedfan wrote: »

Ahh yeah, throw him onto the scrap heap....sure he is f**king useless


He could play for another 10 years of rugby at the highest level, you do realize that?


So once you dump JJ, what the plan? bring in Johnson, wait for him to make a mistake. Call him s**t, drive him out of the club and then move onto the next guy.....


Munster have no long term plan, doesn't seem like the supporter do either.

What the?! Is all this directed at me? Are you for real with this tone??

I don't see where I've called JJ sh*t or said he should be dumped. All I've said is that if he wants an extended run in the team, he should earn it and not be given it.

Tomtom364

Psycho Killer - "Hands Away" (Prop-Prop-Prrrroppp-Prop, Prop-Prop-Prop-Prrrrrrop-Prop)

JJ is already signed for next year.
He isn't being thrown on the scrap heap, and I doubt many people would be calling for that.

However people have decided that in their opinion, he is a solid squad option and decent back up, but carbery is so far showing to be a far superior player and the team's first choice outhalf. So if he's fit. He starts.

JJ will get plenty of game time over the next year and I for one hope he can make it all click and give carbery some strong competition for the spot.
But for now he hasn't done that yet and a crucial European away game against a french side is not the kind of game you take those chances in.

Buer

Psycho Killer - "Hands Away" (Prop-Prop-Prrrroppp-Prop, Prop-Prop-Prop-Prrrrrrop-Prop)

JJH is a good squad player. Definitely worth hanging onto. He's talented, covers multiple positions and can kick. But he's not going to be a strong option at outhalf in the long term. We've all seen enough at this point. He has had about 30 starts at outhalf for Munster and plenty more appearances from the bench. If he hasn't been able to consistently show he's the man for the job in that time, he's not going to now. He has progressed very little as a player in the past 5 years.

With Carbery now in the hot seat, he's not going to get any significant run of games at 10 either for the foreseeable future.

Shefwedfan

Former Former wrote: »

What the?! Is all this directed at me? Are you for real with this tone??

I don't see where I've called JJ sh*t or said he should be dumped. All I've said is that if he wants an extended run in the team, he should earn it and not be given it.

What tone? the tone with the emoji on it?



He just got man of the match at weekend, would you not count getting MOM as earning it? after all it was a top European game against the French Champions.....



You mentioned his age, I just pointed out at 26 he has potentially another 10 years of top rugby. Something wrong with that? was the tone wrong on that?

phog

FF complaining about a tone :pac: :pac: :pac:

thomond2006

A new born king to see POM POM POM POM POM

Buer wrote: »

JJH is a good squad player. Definitely worth hanging onto. He's talented, covers multiple positions and can kick. But he's not going to be a strong option at outhalf in the long term. We've all seen enough at this point. He has had about 30 starts at outhalf for Munster and plenty more appearances from the bench. If he hasn't been able to consistently show he's the man for the job in that time, he's not going to now. He has progressed very little as a player in the past 5 years.

With Carbery now in the hot seat, he's not going to get any significant run of games at 10 either for the foreseeable future.

This.

JJH is not going to be a long term starter and if Carbery and/or Johnston work out he doesn't need to be.

I agree that he's probably reached his ceiling. He didn't work out to the level his initial appearances may have promised but he's a valuable piece to hold onto.