Young woman murdered in Goa, India

Witchie

http://www.rte.ie/news/2017/0315/859859-goa-india-irishwoman-death/



I am sitting approximately 1 and half miles away from the scene of the crime and am a little in shock. This paradise has been my safe haven for a few weeks now and I don't think I have even felt as safe in my hometown as here.

Initially rumours here yesterday were that she was Russian and it was her boyfriend who did it but seems it was an Irish girl on a British passport or living in Liverpool and she was murdered by an Indian guy.

Monday was the end of Holi and this place was crazier than usual. Down here on Palolem beach there were crowds of Indians going wild, getting drunk, throwing powdered paint, gangs of them in the sea playing polo and just general mayhem....a bit like a sunny version of Paddy's day.

Then Monday night the big nightclub near here, Leopard Valley, were having a massive Holi party and from what I can gather the poor victim went there and was found dead in a field near it yesterday morning.

My family and friends are all panicking a bit but to be honest, I still feel so safe here. It is a really fun place with the nicest people.

If anyone knows the family of the young woman, could they pass on my condolences and if they want to get in touch with me here, I will help them in anyway I can. I have an apartment with a double bed and a single so if they need somewhere to stay or just a friendly face to chat to, I am here.

Winterlong

God love her. Goa for me will always be associated with the Scarlett Keeling murder.
It should be a little bit of paradise on earth though.

whiskeyman

Witchie wrote: »

If anyone knows the family of the young woman, could they pass on my condolences and if they want to get in touch with me here, I will help them in anyway I can. I have an apartment with a double bed and a single so if they need somewhere to stay or just a friendly face to chat to, I am here.

Really kind gesture of you Witchie.
Super to have such lovely people like you on boards.

Witchie

All I can think of is the poor family having to make a torturous trek out here and how distraught they must be. I have had to make a trip to America not knowing if my brother was still alive or not and relied heavily on the kindness of others to sort things out over there so I have an inkling as to what they are going through and if there is any way at all that I can help, I want to pay forward the kindness I recieved.

smelly sock

Pic of the young lady up on Sky News now. Can't see a name anywhere.

May she RIP.

smelly sock

Sky have released the name as Danielle McLoughlin.

Erik Shin

Mind yourself Witchie and be safe

Witchie

From Buncrana originally.

It is just horrendous. Am really in shock here. Yesterday I was shocked but even more so now that more details emerge.

Witchie

Erik Shin wrote: »

Mind yourself Witchie and be safe

I honestly don't think I could feel any safer than here but I am minding myself. I am usually back at my apartment by 10pm and always take a tuktuk. I have a lovely Indian boyfriend who stays with me when he finishes work at 11 so I do feel very safe and looked after.

ArnoldJRimmer

Absolutely tragic news. I stayed in a hut at Palolem beach many years ago and had an amazing time, such a beautiful part of the world. Hard to imagine something so horrific happening to someone who was likely out there on the adventure of a lifetime.

Lovely gesture Witchie

failinis

Just got a phone call, used to know the girl, friend of friends, not spoken since she left for Liverpool.
Shocking news. Will let the family know Witchie that you have a room if anyone needs it.

Witchie

Thank you. There is also a hotel beside me that will be a haven for them if they need it. If they need anything at all let me know through pm and will pass on my Indian phone number so they can get in touch.

Just in the bar of the hotel here and the staff are all shook up too. They really hate stuff like this happening here as it is such a threat to their livelihoods as well as being a sad death.

Seems the guy was from Canacona village, just a few miles from the beach.

gifted

Stay safe witchie

DanielODonnell

A terrible business, I don't know what passports have got to do with anything though, UTV news said it too.

Fair play to you Witchie, a lovely gesture to make. Mind yourself x

Mint Sauce

Scumbags everywhere.

DanielODonnell wrote: »

A terrible business, I don't know what passports have got to do with anything though, UTV news said it too.

I heard this earlier on BBC Radio, they simply made the point she was a Dual Citizen, of both British and Irish.

pg339

RIP.

nacho libre

RIP
Lets hope her family's suffering is not compounded by the authorities there. A start would be that the accused is actually the one who carried out the crime.

Witchie

It matters on a diplomatic level. Because she entered the country on a British Passport, the British Embassy have the lead on dealing with the matter and the Irish Embassy are working with them. I think it is to the family's advantage as they will have 2 embassys working on their behalf and hopefully that will make things easier for them.

My fella is distraught. He just keeps saying "this is very bad....this is terrible." They haven't had a problem like this here in south Goa before in fact any crime is quite rare in this area so it has shocked him and his workmates to the core. They are obviously also worrying about the possible impact on their jobs if tourism drops off.

A consulate from the Irish embassy in Delhi is due here soon.

NIMAN

Shocking news, live in Inishowen myself, I hope the family can cope with this terrible news.

Mellor

Witchie wrote: »

It matters on a diplomatic level. Because she entered the country on a British Passport, the British Embassy have the lead on dealing with the matter and the Irish Embassy are working with them. I think it is to the family's advantage as they will have 2 embassys working on their behalf and hopefully that will make things easier for them.

The entry passport doesn't matter. She's a citizen of both regardless. UK would still take the lead if she entered on a Irish passport.
I have two passports and travel with both for that reason tbh.

My fella is distraught. He just keeps saying "this is very bad....this is terrible." They haven't had a problem like this here in south Goa before in fact any crime is quite rare in this area so it has shocked him and his workmates to the core. They are obviously also worrying about the possible impact on their jobs if tourism drops off.

A consulate from the Irish embassy in Delhi is due here soon.

It might feel like paradise at times.
But you can't overlook that India is usually first or second on the list in terms of total murders. And I know its a big place, and Goa might have lower crime rates in general, but it would also have higher rates of crime against foreigners.

Witchie

Just found out that it was much closer to me than I realised. She had been down at the beach huts beside where I stay and then was found about a mile away from me. Freaking me out a little.

Witchie

Witchie wrote: »

......................

My fella is distraught. He just keeps saying "this is very bad....this is terrible." They haven't had a problem like this here in south Goa before in fact any crime is quite rare in this area so it has shocked him and his workmates to the core. They are obviously also worrying about the possible impact on their jobs if tourism drops off. .....................

I hope he gets over it soon.

Mellor wrote: »

...................


It might feel like paradise at times.
But you can't overlook that India is usually first or second on the list in terms of total murders. And I know its a big place, and Goa might have lower crime rates in general, but it would also have higher rates of crime against foreigners.

Indeed, and lone women are very vulnerable in much of India.

Shurimgreat

I don't see why a western woman should feel "safe" in Goa. Even the slightest research would reveal some doubts about the place.

http://www.independent.ie/world-news/asia-pacific/dangers-for-women-travelling-to-goa-are-well-known-35536017.html

I am all for people travelling to various places around the world, but a lot of people rush off alone, without precautions and without researching where they are going.

Many of these "paradises" involve rich westerners mixing with poor locals. Of course there's going to be problems because of that.

fatknacker

Shurimgreat wrote: »

I don't see why a western woman should feel "safe" in Goa. Even the slightest research would reveal some doubts about the place.

http://www.independent.ie/world-news/asia-pacific/dangers-for-women-travelling-to-goa-are-well-known-35536017.html

I am all for people travelling to various places around the world, but a lot of people rush off alone, without precautions and without researching where they are going.

Many of these "paradises" involve rich westerners mixing with poor locals. Of course there's going to be problems because of that.

That's just scaremongering nonesense. It's quite rare and makes headlines because female travelers don't usually end up raped and murdered.

It's more likely to happen at home.

Thepoet85

Knew the girl fairly well and our whole town is in shock.

Hard to believe it's happened really

fatknacker

fatknacker wrote: »

.........

It's more likely to happen at home.

Is it fnck

Shurimgreat

fatknacker wrote: »

That's just scaremongering nonesense. It's quite rare and makes headlines because female travelers don't usually end up raped and murdered.

It's more likely to happen at home.

I'd imagine the chances of it happening are about equal everywhere. As we all know a number of women disappeared in Ireland roughly 20 years ago.

That said, western women should take precautions when travelling to the third world, particularly women travelling alone. The idea that the third world is perfectly safe for lone western women is nonsense, that's the point I am trying to make. Take precautions, such as knowing where you are going, knowing where the no-go areas are, always staying in a well lit place, etc etc and everything should be fine. This is the sort of common sense that many westerners lack unfortunately.

Witchie

Augeo wrote: »

I hope he gets over it soon.

He is obviously upset about the murder too, it is just a worry that this will impact on them as they need these jobs to stay alive and to help keep his family in Calcutta alive. You forget that this country is poverty stricken so if tourism is lost here it will cause greater reprecussions than it would elsewhere. So less of the smartarseness. You are not here seeing the impact it is having on everyone.

Shurimgreat wrote: »

I don't see why a western woman should feel "safe" in Goa. Even the slightest research would reveal some doubts about the place.

http://www.independent.ie/world-news/asia-pacific/dangers-for-women-travelling-to-goa-are-well-known-35536017.html

I am all for people travelling to various places around the world, but a lot of people rush off alone, without precautions and without researching where they are going.

Many of these "paradises" involve rich westerners mixing with poor locals. Of course there's going to be problems because of that.

Well that article is a bit piece of crap to start....they keep referring to Goa as a city. Idiot.

I did research and it is scary alright but it is still a beautiful place and is relatively safe when you consider the number of people who visit here and come to no harm each year. I have met people who are coming here for years and they never have an issue.

Witchie

Witchie wrote: »

He is obviously upset about the murder too, it is just a worry that this will impact on them as they need these jobs to stay alive and to help keep his family in Calcutta alive. You forget that this country is poverty stricken so if tourism is lost here it will cause greater reprecussions than it would elsewhere. So less of the smartarseness. You are not here seeing the impact it is having on everyone. .................

No, I don't forget that.

Witchie wrote: »

..............

I did research and it is scary alright but it is still a beautiful place and is relatively safe when you consider the number of people who visit here and come to no harm each year. I have met people who are coming here for years and they never have an issue.

At least you seem somewhat informed as to the dangers there.

fatknacker

No ones saying not to take precautions, of course you do that anywhere. But the idea that women shouldnt travel alone because they are likely to have terrible things happen is pure scaremongering.
Like I said, it makes headlines because it's generally rare. That's not to take away from people being sensible about what they do with themselves. But sometimes **** things happen and they can happen in your local just as easily.

mahamageehad

fatknacker wrote: »

No ones saying not to take precautions, of course you do that anywhere. But the idea that women shouldnt travel alone because they are likely to have terrible things happen is pure scaremongering.
Like I said, it makes headlines because it's generally rare. That's not to take away from people being sensible about what they do with themselves. But sometimes **** things happen and they can happen in your local just as easily.

I dunno, there's a handful of places that I wouldn't go to as a woman alone. Goa may not be one of them (haven't done research on it) but I do think in some countries or cities it's not safe for a woman to travel alone. The vast majority of the world is fine though as long as you take precautions. Research is key.

Also RIP, horrible story.

fatknacker

mahamageehad wrote: »

I dunno, there's a handful of places that I wouldn't go to as a woman alone. Goa may not be one of them (haven't done research on it) but I do think in some countries or cities it's not safe for a woman to travel alone. The vast majority of the world is fine though as long as you take precautions. Research is key.

Also RIP, horrible story.

Yeah for sure there are places in the world that you just don't go to. Even as a guy. That article was just pure ****e though. "Dangers for women travelling to Goa are well known" and goes on to talk about another girl attacked 9 years ago.

Sure aren't more backpackers attacked in Australia yet there's no "DANGER" articles looming about each time something happens there.

Shurimgreat

Everywhere is safe if you take precautions and have a bit of forewarning. There are parts of Dublin I generally try to avoid, particularly late at night. There are also parts of Paris, Barcelona, Glasgow and so on that should be avoided when alone at night.

It may be wrong to put out the message that parts of India are a no go area for westerners, but its equally wrong to state that parts of India or the third wold in general are perfectly safe paradises where you'd be safer than in Ireland. Its not true. Know the risks, know the crime stats, who you can and cannot trust. These places may seem quiet and peaceful on the face of it, but often have a seedy undercurrent.

fatknacker

Yeah but I never said anywhere is perfectly safe. Because nowhere is perfectly safe.
Some places are safer than others of course. But articles like that one posted are a load of bollocks imo. Women who travel alone are very much aware of their vulnerability. It's patronizing tbh

Shurimgreat

I came across this on Tripadvisor, from someone who presumably knows the area well.

PRECAUTIONS, ESPECIALLY FOR GOA.


1. Unless on the beaches of Goa, it's best to dress conservatively. No shorts, short skirs, or shirts displaying too much cleavage. You will have to endure uncomfortable stares, and sometimes comments and even "accidental" touching. (Capris and t-shrits are fine.).


2. If someone does touch you or becomes aggressive, yell LOUDLY. They will likely run away and you will attract the attention of others who will come to your rescue.


3. Avoid walking in deserted areas at night or odd hours.


4. Avoid drinking alcohol in excess.


5. Carry tissue/toilet paper. You never know when you'll need it.


6. Where available, use women's only areas/compartments on public transportation. Never ride in the general men's compartment.


7. If you do go out to clubs/bars, never leave your drink unattended and always make sure you have transportation back to your hotel pre-arranged.


8. Never accept a ride if there's someone accompanying the driver in a taxi or rickshaw.


9. Chain-lock your door when inside your hotel room.


10. If you happen to come across a street party or a festive procession, it is best not to take part. Crowds such as those will likely have agressive and/or drunk men. You can watch from a distance and move on when it has passed you.

https://www.tripadvisor.ie/ShowTopic-g297604-i6045-k10308018-Women_Safety_in_Goa-Goa.html

I don't want to overplay the risks, but anyone travelling there should know these things.

Its not the perfectly safe, peaceful paradise that some would have us believe.

fatknacker

Shurimgreat wrote: »

I came across this on Tripadvisor, from someone who presumably knows the area well.




https://www.tripadvisor.ie/ShowTopic-g297604-i6045-k10308018-Women_Safety_in_Goa-Goa.html

I don't want to overplay the risks, but anyone travelling there should know these things.

Its not the perfectly safe, peaceful paradise that some would have us believe.

Should, but I also see these types of safety precautions listed on the backs of toilet doors in Dublin too.

Hell, there's even a "safe word" you can give to bar staff if you think you're on a dodgy date and need an exit strategy.

Shurimgreat

fatknacker wrote: »

Should, but I also see these types of safety precautions listed on the backs of toilet doors in Dublin too.

Hell, there's even a "safe word" you can give to bar staff if you think you're on a dodgy date and need an exit strategy.

So women should only use female only compartments on the luas/train/dart?

Get real.

You cannot compare the two countries in terms of the treatment of women. Read the points the tripadvisor poster made again. Women, particularly western women, are a target of local men in Goa. The danger is there, to ignore or dismiss it nonchalantly serves no-one.

I will put it simply, this place is dangerous for western women.

fatknacker

Wtf?? I never said that.

Yeah I've said my bit. It was mostly about scaremongering indo articles.

I'm not going around in circles all day and barking at shadows.

I'm done.

pappyodaniel

<mod snip> nobody needs/wants to see that </mod snip>
I came across this vile Facebook page when looking for news on the story.

PowerToWait

I thought it was common knowledge that India was a fairly dodgy destination for women travelling solo. There have been many notorious incidences of gang rape and murder of Indian women and tourists in recent times.

Comparing it to Dublin is simply ridiculous.

A female friend of mine travelled there alone around 15 years back and reckons it was basically one sexual assault after another in some parts when crowded and until she figured out wtf was going on.

Jurgen Klopp

PowerToWait wrote: »

I thought it was common knowledge that India was a fairly dodgy destination for women travelling solo. There have been many notorious incidences of gang rape and murder of Indian women and tourists in recent times.

Comparing it to Dublin is simply ridiculous.

A female friend of mine travelled there alone around 15 years back and reckons it was basically one sexual assault after another in some parts when crowded and until she figured out wtf was going on.

This is boards, everyone and everywhere in the world is safe and tolerant. A woman would have no problem walking through Aleppo and anyone that says different is just scaremongering

fatknacker

I'm not talking about all of India where there's 1billion people. I'm talking about Goa, the article is about Goa and the article lists 2 western women over the space of 9 years who were attacked. Hardly disproportionate.

Ah bollocks I'm not going through this again if people can't read and make **** up in their heads as they go along.

Joey Jo-Jo Junior

sugarman wrote: »

fatknacker wrote: »

Wtf?? I never said that.

Yeah I've said my bit. It was mostly about scaremongering indo articles.

I'm not going around in circles all day and barking at shadows.

I'm done.

What are you talking about??? Its widely reported across the world, even in India itself.

I seriously suggest you look at some statistics of of violence, rape and murder against women in India, particularity incidents against backpackers and their attitudes towards them.

It's remarkable how easy you find it to to treat 15% of the human population as if they were all the same.

Nobody is denying the statistics for India but how much of that is applicable to Goa?

GOA. Have you heard of it before? Or did you just hear 'India' and jump in with your generalisations?

fatknacker

sugarman wrote: »

You still havent a clue.

Theres 1.5m people in the Goa region.. while crime against women is lower than other areas of India its still astonishingly high by western standards. There were over 3,200 reportedcases in Goa in 2015 against women alone.

Its not scare mongering, its hard facts.

And was that agains western women traveling alone, like the article suggests? Or women in general? Were they all murdered too? And how does that figure compare with crimes against women in Dublin?

May that young woman rest in peace.

retro:electro

Very sad. I would never travel alone myself for safety reasons but I think as a society we have a tendency to "other" these problems. Take Manchester for example, nobody would bat an eyelid if you told them you were going there for a weekend away but statistics show that there were over 1,200 reported rapes in the city during 2016.
I've no doubt that some parts of the world are very dangerous, especially when travelling alone, and even more so if you're a woman travelling alone, but similarly something like this could happen anywhere.

fatknacker

sugarman wrote: »

Heres a report from Indian media on Goa in 2014.

Goa actually topped the list in 2014 for crimes committed against foreigners in India.

And by foreigners...also there are higher amounts of foreigners in Goa so that's a no brainier.

That article says 73 crimes for mostly theft.

How many for rape and murder?

panda100

Wow, just wow, to this thread. A women has been murdered and within the second post she is being victim blamed for her own death. After Hours never ceases to disgust in its attitide towards women.

My heart goes out to this poor womens friends and family at such a tragic time.

Close friend of mine, a woman, was there 2 years ago. Did say parts of India felt unsafe, but North Goa was fine.

Either way, kinda agree with panda100's post. Not sure about the "well she should have known not to travel to India" stuff.,,

PowerToWait

Deleted User wrote: »

Close friend of mine, a woman, was there 2 years ago. Did say parts of India felt unsafe, but North Goa was fine.

Either way, kinda agree with panda100's post. Not sure about the "well she should have known not to travel to India" stuff.,,

Fwiw I'm not saying 'she should've known better' at all. I am saying it's a bit mad of other posters to deny there are serious problems in India. It's a very far way from the paradise people paint it as.

Leaving all the crime against women aside, there's the horrendous inequality and poverty.