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Avatar 2



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,412 ✭✭✭ Shred

    I liked the first one, yes the story was by the numbers but the 3D was incredibly impressive, it was a stunning visual feast on the big screen. I went along with the family to see it again on re-release (in September?) as they hadn't seen it in 3d; I enjoyed it again but did feel the runtime a lot more...this one is even longer, while I'd like to see it I'm just not sure I can put myself through it. Either way it looks like it's doing really well at the box office so another 3 parts likely incoming!

  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Entertainment Moderators Posts: 30,621 CMod ✭✭✭✭ pixelburp

    Just out from a showing this morning.

    It went exactly as I suspected it would: an absolute sumptuous visual feast from someone whose grasp of action and the choreography thereof is so expert as to shame the rest of Hollywood. We have become deadened by the omnipresence of lazy, rubbery CGI we're conditioned to blame the tool, rather than the craftspeople wielding it. James Cameron is a master and every damn time, he shows the kids how it's done. The MCU in particular should take note. The fidelity was so good in places I simply stopped thinking about how it wasn't real. It's not like he's a particularly showy director either; he just knows where the pieces go.

    However, the actual story remains utter gubbins of the highest order. Basically a hasty redress of the first film's plot with the humans now even more callous and cartoonishly evil than before. And there's simply no escaping the vomitous over-sincerity of the whole "native tribes are at one with nature and a bit magic" angle that has dragged the tone downwards since the beginning.

    So while the spectacle remains awe inspiring, I'm also still a bit bummed that this is the project Cameron is tethering himself to for the final part of his career. He's 68, not exactly prolific and I'd worry all we'll see from him is Avatar sequels.

  • Registered Users Posts: 22,374 ✭✭✭✭

    Agree completely. I can't speak for others and maybe there is a horde of fans hiding in plain sight but I have never heard anyone say they couldn't wait for an Avatar sequel. Strange.

  • Registered Users Posts: 27 _H80_GHT

    Film was very predictable. I wanted to like it. There is just too little to like in the Avatar world. It's a film that regardless of all it's technical breaking of ground, left me feeling that I've seen this film a hundred times before.

  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Entertainment Moderators Posts: 30,621 CMod ✭✭✭✭ pixelburp

    I will say in follow up that in a world of utterly overblown finales where the scale goes completely insane, I really enjoyed Avatar 2s simple, focused final act.

    All set around and within the environs of a single whaling ship, and the dozen or so natives attacking it.

    James Cameron is such a master of action he made the three or so separate stories happening within it all hum and never feel incoherent or confusing.

    Post edited by pixelburp on

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  • Registered Users Posts: 13,247 ✭✭✭✭ MisterAnarchy

    Such a waste of talent.

    Since 1995 he has essentially released 3 films, Titanic, Avatar and Avatar 2.

  • Registered Users Posts: 4,357 ✭✭✭ Josey Wales

    There hasn't been too much mentioned about HFR in the last few posts.

    Is [email protected] the only cinema showing it in that format? It seems they are cutting back on it too, the next showing is Jan 4th for 3D HFR.

    I emailed both Cineworld and Odeon but got no response on whether they are showing it in that format.

  • Registered Users Posts: 11 summerhaze55

    I started watching new avatar film last week, 5/10, did not make it to the end.

  • Registered Users Posts: 22,374 ✭✭✭✭

    Meanwhile just out of the blue James Cameron in recent days is claiming a reboot of the Terminator franchise is in discussion (ugh). Cynics might say he is scoping an exit from his Avatar franchise already.

    The next Avatar is done but I'd make a pretty big bet on it being the last.

    Post edited by on

  • Registered Users Posts: 5,738 ✭✭✭ speedboatchase

    I doubt he wants to leave the Avatar world - he wrote the scripts for 4 and 5. As for Terminator, I’m sure he’ll produce a reboot but I think Avatar is all he’ll direct this decade

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  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Arts Moderators, Computer Games Moderators, Entertainment Moderators Posts: 28,005 CMod ✭✭✭✭ johnny_ultimate

    Some of four is already shot too, presumably the bits that happen before a big time jump. Given this film is already set to comfortably sail past the $1 billion box office mark by the end of the week, there’s every chance this’ll be a big enough hit to get the next two definitively greenlit. The whole four sequels thing was always a big gamble by Cameron, but so far anyway it seems to be paying off for him.

  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Entertainment Moderators Posts: 30,621 CMod ✭✭✭✭ pixelburp

    James Cameron, for better or worse, is all in on the Avatar sequels - unless the box office drives the franchise into the grave I'd be very surprised if he pivots to anything else. It's clearly the exact kind of technical playground that has enabled him to just mess with technology to his hearts content.

    Not sure how or where that Terminator rumour came from but it doesn't pass the smell test at all, not for me. The franchise and concept is beyond Dead Horse territory and couldn't see what might entice Cameron. I'd sooner believe True Lies 2 than his return to Terminator.

  • Registered Users Posts: 7 Lara Ashton

    I'm eager to watch it finally

  • Registered Users Posts: 18,942 ✭✭✭✭ Drumpot

    Aliens is probably my favourite movie of all time. It has absolutely everything you could want in an drama, action, sci fi flick. Story is savage and the main characters motivations and story arcs are handled beautifully.

    And the movie holds up well after 36 years, particularly for a sci fi, that’s remarkable.

    Cameron has done more celebrated stuff but Aliens stands out for me. Regardless of what people think of his movies, He is indeed a special director

  • Registered Users Posts: 3,940 ✭✭✭ SuperBowserWorld

    Yep, Aliens is supreme, and T2 comes very close as the best action movies of all time for me.

    The bike/truck chase scene near the start of T2 is a towering piece of action cinema. And the CGI special effect does not appear until this sequence is over, where the T1000 appears from the flames. And it's a "this movie is just getting started" moment. Brilliant.

  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Entertainment Moderators Posts: 30,621 CMod ✭✭✭✭ pixelburp

    Theres probably a very short list of movies where the original and sequel can legitimately Duke it out over which one is the better, a hair's breadth between. While both also existing as proper Best In Class of cinema in the first instance.

    The thing you can say without reservation - bar the self surgery scene maybe in t1, some of the finale FX in True Lies - is that Cameron's work holds up. There's barely a scene in Aliens that still doesn't convince. And as you say the script and components therein are near flawless.

  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Entertainment Moderators Posts: 30,621 CMod ✭✭✭✭ pixelburp

    Re. the box office: despite America currently engaging in a real-life recreation of 2004s The Day After Tomorrow, Avatar 2 still managed $64 million across the holiday weekend over there. $90 million if you include the long weekend. So as of typing it's at $889 million worldwide; will be fascinating to watch how much legs this thing has. It'll break $1 billion handily I'd say ... where to after that?

  • Registered Users Posts: 11,652 ✭✭✭✭ titan18

    I think it'll have some legs as there's not much else big box office wise until Ant Man, and for all its flaws as a film, I'd still probably see it again in the cinema. It's the sort of film thats only really worth watching in the cinema.

  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Entertainment Moderators Posts: 30,621 CMod ✭✭✭✭ pixelburp

    What will help is like Top Gun Maverick, the word of mouth clearly says "if you see it, you have to see it in the cinema!" which will get more bums on seats. As opposed to something like the MCU where I'd say there are folks like myself, who now just wait the few months before the new film appears ok Disney+.

    I see Black Panther 2 hasn't broken the $1 billion ceiling, which is interesting; you'd wonder how much of the interest is down to that factor (again, it's why I didn't bother going to the cinema).

  • Registered Users Posts: 17,127 ✭✭✭✭ silverharp

    Avatar 2 has now passed every MCU film this year. Funnily enough one or 2 of the MCU films opened stronger than Avatar but they fall off a cliff in the second week so word of mouth must be poor. Avatar 2 is a good family oriented film so you have a huge audience there that will get around to seeing it.

    A belief in gender identity involves a level of faith as there is nothing tangible to prove its existence which, as something divorced from the physical body, is similar to the idea of a soul. - Colette Colfer

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  • Registered Users Posts: 3,940 ✭✭✭ SuperBowserWorld

    The MCU has become Coronation Street. Regular, repetitive, on TV, has a die hard fan base. Simple, ongoing plots, but miss an episode and you drop off. Or it makes it hard to join with all the backstory for new consumers.

    People want to see something different and see it in the Cinema.

    People are sick of being stuck at home.

    Also it's holiday time and there is no other competition at the moment.

    Also, Cameron has arranged that China drop it's covid restrictions just in time for this movie.

    It's going to be huge.


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,233 ✭✭✭ MayoForSam

    Went to see it last night and the plot is very basic and formulaic, even more so than the first one. However, the 3D action sequences, especially the last hour of the movie, does make it entertaining and worthwhile of a cinema visit. The extremely comfortable seats in the Galway Salthill Omniplex also helped. The extra charge and queue for the 3D glasses was annoying and I missed the first 10 minutes.

    My missus thoroughly enjoyed it and that's all that counts.

  • Registered Users Posts: 23 sherrupyew

    Watched this a couple of nights ago in Cineworld, IMAX 3D. I don't think it was screening in HFR as I didn't notice any frame rate switching or unsual motion smoothing. Either way, if looked absolutely incredible.

    The film itself is a huge technical achievement and I'm amazed at how loudly dismissive a few critics have been (like Kermode). It's a long film, but I don't think that's an issue if you're mentally prepared for that. I think it's a richer, more accomplished film than the first.

    There are certain refrains that keep popping up regarding Avatar movies..."Dances with Smurfs", "Blue Pocahontas", "No Plot", "Style Over Substance". I think these criticisms are unfair and don't acknowledge the serious skill involved. When it comes to action blockbuster filmmaking, Cameron is in a league of his own.

    Cameron has been fairly consistent throughout his career. His films push technological boundaries, have impeccable visual composition and focus on simple, sincere emotional truths built on clearly defined themes. He treats plot as a delivery mechanism for a visceral emotional experience. The "simplicity" is a feature, not a bug.

    The only significant criticism I have about Avatar 2 is that there is a pivotal moment involving two characters and a knife towards the end of the film. The impact of this action isn't addressed at all after it occurs. I presume this will be an issue in the next film, but is was strange not to acknowledge the tension this introduced before the film closed.

    Beautiful film that will make obscene amounts of money. Cameron is a box office god.

  • Registered Users Posts: 5,738 ✭✭✭ speedboatchase

    Completely agree. Just back from the cinema and it blew my socks off. Effortlessly created a new band of characters for audiences to care about and achieved a new level of immersion.

  • Registered Users Posts: 4,357 ✭✭✭ Josey Wales

    I'd love confirmation that the film is not in HFR in the Cineworld IMAX screen. The 3D scenes are crystal clear in comparison to any other 3D film I've seen. I was thinking while watching it that maybe these action scenes were in HFR but maybe I was imagining it.

  • Registered Users Posts: 23 sherrupyew

    I consider myself somebody who is quite sensitive to audio-visual standards, so I was a bit concerned about the HFR trick.

    But I honestly could not tell whether the IMAX 3D screening at Cineworld was HFR or not. It all looked fairly flawless, so whatever format it was in, I recommend it.

    I'm inclined to think it was actually 24fps, as I never detected any transition or "soap opera" effect. I could be wrong though...if that was HFR, then I'm all for it! The action was extremely clear and I rarely noticed any judder.

    It honestly would not surprise me if there are several versions running different frame rates out there. It's all very experimental.

  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Arts Moderators, Computer Games Moderators, Entertainment Moderators Posts: 28,005 CMod ✭✭✭✭ johnny_ultimate

    If you didn’t notice it, odds are high it wasn’t HFR. It overtly changes frame rate from shot to shot so if you’re in any way sensitive to frame rates you can’t help but notice it. I didn’t know what version I was watching other than it was 3D, and when there was a shift to 48 FPS during a flying scene near the start it couldn’t have been more obvious that it was HFR - if anything, that it’s variable makes it even more noticeable as it’s constantly switching back and forth!

  • Registered Users Posts: 23 sherrupyew

    I agree, it must have been 24fps. I also tried to get clarity on that from Cineworld and I couldn't get an answer. Whatever the framerate was for the Parnell IMAX 3D, it did seem consistent. No discernable changes.

    It sounds like HFR is a failed experiment (again) and I'm glad I wasn't subjected to it (I think). The film looked magnificent and retained a cinematic feel.

    If HFR draws attention to the edit and takes people out of the movie, it ain't worth it.

  • Registered Users Posts: 476 ✭✭ Apothic_Red

    Daughters school were all brought to see this Christmas week so she was out.

    Our 15 year old hadn't bother to watch Avatar 1 so he had no interest.

    10 year old has the movie attention of a goldfish so he was out.

    Wife was delighted cause none of them wanted to see it.

    I waited until I found a good version on the high seas appeared & have indulged over the past 2 nights.

    I wanted more Sigourney Weaver, I can see where they are going with the kid angle for the future.

    Much of the kids bullying/bonding scenes could have been cut out.

    Surely at this stage the windscreens of those helicopter things could be arrow proof.

    Why was the last hour just the Titanic movie again ?

    Great special effects though, will watch number 3

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  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Arts Moderators, Computer Games Moderators, Entertainment Moderators Posts: 28,005 CMod ✭✭✭✭ johnny_ultimate

    I almost certainly would have agreed, even during the first hour of the film! I hated HFR in The Hobbit, and was dubious when it was jumping back and forth constantly during the first act here. But the underwater scenes and second-half action sequences were so striking and effective in HFR they won me over totally. Yes, it’s certainly distracting when it still occasionally drops back to 24 for a shot or two, but otherwise I was a total skeptic that was happily convinced otherwise here. There are quite a few films that effectively utilise noticeable aspect ratio changes to the film’s ultimate benefit - I think this manages that in HFR. It’s impressive enough that I’m still weighing up seeing it again if I can get a definite HFR screening in Dublin City somewhere.

    That said, I maybe think it could’ve been even more effective had Cameron held back on HFR right until the first dive sequence. That would have been quite the trick to pull, to suddenly hit the viewer with the ultra clarity of HFR during a moment of revelation and new experience for the characters. I can understand why that didn’t happen (to ease viewers in, and to smooth out the 3D movement earlier on), but definitely would’ve been a pretty effective gambit IMO :)