The 2017 In Between Grand Slam Thread

NoviGlitzko

dominatinMC wrote: »

Your anti-Nadal bias coming to the fore once more. The sense of disappointment at Nadal getting the No.1 is almost palpable.

You quite clearly have strong Nadal bias in your post.

IMO, Nadal has had a great year on the Hard Courts - winning the USO is proof of this. Yes, the field was diminished, but Nadal got through it whereas Fed didn't.

Both Federer and Del Potro weren't fit at the USO and playing at about 60% each. Even tennis analysts admit this. Fair play to Nadal for taking it but when your biggest test is Kevin Anderson I'm afraid the tournament was just bad. I'd place it as the worst GS since I've started watching tennis.

At least Nadal had the courage to play the full season and not cherry-pick events like Fed. Nadal has had a horrible time at SW19 recently but still entered, even at the risk of getting embarrassed by an early exit (which didn't quite transpire this time). Fed, however, skipped the entire clay season. Now I know, Fed is the GOAT, but is that really the sort of message one should be sending out to players? If someone doesn't like a particular surface, they should just skip it? I like both players but it is clear that Nadal is deserving of No.1.

Nadal is 31 and Federer is 36. The majority of tennis players have retired at his age. What he's doing is nothing short of remarkable and why should he bother risking his body on the sports most demanding surface and his least successful? I'm sure if Nadal plays for another five years he'll have time to 'cherry pick' himself.

Christy42

Can we agree they both had exceptional seasons?

Nadal wad the best over all courts though and deserves number 1 spot.

If Fed wanted to compete for it he would have competed on clay. He prioritised trophies and it paid off.

Fed had an incredible season and I wish him well. He made the right choices. I don't feel like you should be considered for number 1 in the rankings if you skip a surface though and I don't Fed minds too much.

jr86

Sorry maybe I didn’t make myself clear, but I have no problem at all with Nadal being ranked number 1.
At the end of the day Federer skipped 5 out of 9 Masters Events and a whole surface.

No-one else comes close in terms of consistency all year. You could argue similarly that Murray took advantage of a lot of scenarios last year too, with Djokovic’s form falling off a cliff and year-end events being far easier to pick up points, with players tanking, burnt out etc. but the stats don’t lie as they say

Overall I don’t pay a whole lot of attention to rankings though if I’m completely honest.
My post is more directed at the current state of the Men’s game more than anything. I don’t think Nadal’s hard-court form has had to be much more than passable by his standards, yet he can canter away with the year-end number 1 title

Has he had an “exceptional” year? Outside of clay I don’t necessarily agree, but his clay form has been memorable for sure

If Djokovic, Murray and wawrinka come back to form, Federer continues this level, and Raonic/Nishikori/Del Potro etc. can stay fit consistently, I don’t see Nadal winning another non-clay slam again

But credit where it's due for taking advantage this year

lostcat

jr86 wrote: »

My post is more directed at the current state of the Men’s game more than anything. I don’t think Nadal’s hard-court form has had to be much more than passable by his standards, yet he can canter away with the year-end number 1 title

I agree with this part, this year was basically a total washout, with a lot of players not good enough to make the final push, a lot more not maturing fast enough (if they ever will) and the worlds two best players of the past couple of years both stuttering

Nothing against either of the current top two (two of the finest of all time without doubt) but I have had enough of Federer v Nadal in GS finals. We been there done that for 6 or 7 years when they were both better players than they are now.
The fact that they are still miles ahead of whom ever else was playing consistently this years is really rather depressing.

And we are basically waiting for 2 x 30 year olds and a 32/3 year old to return fit in January to make things interesting? what gives?

mickmackey1

lostcat wrote: »

I have had enough of Federer v Nadal in GS finals. We been there done that for 6 or 7 years when they were both better players than they are now.

Well just one more year so Fed can balance the books

Seriously the biggest single factor in Fed's dominance is that he somehow at 35/36 conjured up a dominant, reliable backhand which he simply didn't have in his twenties. That alone has made for a memorable season.

lostcat

mickmackey1 wrote: »

Well just one more year so Fed can balance the books

Seriously the biggest single factor in Fed's dominance is that he somehow at 35/36 conjured up a dominant, reliable backhand which he simply didn't have in his twenties. That alone has made for a memorable season.

I think the single biggest factor in Federers dominance is that no one else is up to very much (bar Nadal on Clay, which Federer didnt manage to play this year)

fair play to him on the backhand upgrade, however my question (asked before on boards) is why couldn't he conjure up a reliable backhand several years ago when it was evident that Nadal was always going to beat him by simply balloning balls to Feds backhand until it broke down? ego/stubborness/whatever?

I do acknowledge that Fed (and Nadal to a lesser extent) have improved aspects of their games in the past year or so, but the competition is so bad they could still be beating everyone else without the retooling

none of this is Federers or Nadals fault, of course

mickmackey1

Nadal out of Paris masters with a knee injury. A bit annoying that he squeezed out those last few points for YE No 1...

jr86

He really shouldn’t bother with the WTF knock-about either at this stage. Call it a year altogether, number 1 is sewn up

It was probably his best chance to ever win Paris this year though, so can’t imagine he took this decision lightly

He had a bye in the quarters too, pretty much

NoviGlitzko

Definitely must be a legit injury from Nadal.

Del Potro is in real trouble of going out here and missing his spot in the WTF.

mickmackey1

Delpo might still qualify if Nadal withdraws. Fed would prefer to face the World No 1 I'd imagine.

CassieManson

mickmackey1 wrote: »

Delpo might still qualify if Nadal withdraws. Fed would prefer to face the World No 1 I'd imagine.

Sock qualifies for London!

Interesting that after years of nearly always the same 8 players only two players who were in London last year will appear this year - Cilic and Thiem. 4 first time qualifiers - Sock, Zverev, Dimitrov and Goffin.

TICKLE_ME_ELMO

ATP making some very questionable choices in the organisation of their "Next Gen" tournament this week. The draw for groups had the players choose models who had the different groups on them and they paraded up and down with the players. Some of them actually had the group letters hidden on parts of them and revealed them removing clothing. Pretty tone deaf given what's been making the headlines these past few weeks.

https://twitter.com/Renestance/status/927291739190300672

yerwanthere123

Disappointing, but not entirely surprising given that Stakhovsky is annually re-elected to their players council.

jr86

Sock winning a Masters is bizarre but that's what you get when most players are mentally on holidays.

2017 in Mens Tennis, folks

Silver linings and all that, it spares us of the farcical scenario of carreno-Busta actually making a Tour Finals

Floppybits

Great seeing videos of Wawrinka back practicing and Murray playing in Glasgow. Can't wait for 2018 when everyone is back.

yerwanthere123

I wonder if we'll see Azarenka back in January. Doesn't look like this ugly custody battle is going to be sorted out soon.

RosyLily

yerwanthere123 wrote: »

I wonder if we'll see Azarenka back in January. Doesn't look like this ugly custody battle is going to be sorted out soon.

A real pity! She'll be missing Belarus' Fed Cup final as well. I'm sure she would have loved to have played in that but family comes first!

World Tour Finals kick off tomorrow. Afternoon session: Kontinen/Peers vs. Harrison/Venus up first followed by Federer vs. Sock.

mickmackey1

RosyLily wrote: »

World Tour Finals kick off tomorrow. Afternoon session: Kontinen/Peers vs. Harrison/Venus up first followed by Federer vs. Sock.

Federer tix: 80 euro. Nadal tix: 30 euro. Everyone else: 25 euro.

NoviGlitzko

Unless Roger picks up an injury or is fatigued he should have the WTF in the bag. Indoor hard suits his game better than grass and that's saying something.

jr86

NoviGlitzko wrote: »

Unless Roger picks up an injury or is fatigued he should have the WTF in the bag. Indoor hard suits his game better than grass and that's saying something.

Quicker courts aswell this year and last year

Think he'll win it at a canter, which is no more than he'd deserve really

Floppybits

Goffin can't finish off a one legged Nadal.

jr86

If there's one thing federer always beats nadal on its scheduling! I'm gobsmacked a clearly hindered nadal even turned up to this event

jr86

Floppybits wrote: »

Goffin can't finish off a one legged Nadal.

He's somehow broken him back again in the 3rd.

Got to be a worry for nadal he's infamously had lots of knee troubles. In either case I can't see him completing the tournament

paulie21

Nadal has subsequently withdrawn

Floppybits

Doesnt say much for goffins mentality when he couldn't put an injured Nadal away. 4 match points in the second set and he couldnt take one of them.

mickmackey1

Nadal was swinging away freely to shorten the points though, top players can be very dangerous in that mode. Three of the match points were saved with winners.

Disappointing that Fed won't get the opportunity to close the H2H further!

MrKingsley

mickmackey1 wrote: »

Nadal was swinging away freely to shorten the points though, top players can be very dangerous in that mode. Three of the match points were saved with winners.

Disappointing that Fed won't get the opportunity to close the H2H further!

Nadal played the match points well but at 15-40 goffin had him on the ropes, got a short ball to his forehand and put a nothing shot back in play that Nadal punished.

That to me was a perfect example as to why we havent seen 1/2 of the 'younger' players win a GS or get to the top of the rankings. For the most part they wait for a mistake from the other side and dont take the initiative when the opportunity is there

mickmackey1

MrKingsley wrote: »

That to me was a perfect example as to why we havent seen 1/2 of the 'younger' players win a GS or get to the top of the rankings. For the most part they wait for a mistake from the other side and dont take the initiative when the opportunity is there

I don't think Goffin is the best example though. He has a lot of ability but is so mentally weak it's untrue.

MrKingsley

mickmackey1 wrote: »

I don't think Goffin is the best example though. He has a lot of ability but is so mentally weak it's untrue.

Yeah he’s not the strongest but it is in points like that last night that he could’ve improved his mental strength by taking the shot on and winning the point.

That would’ve given him more belief next time he is in that spot I think. But instead he’ll most likely play defensively again next time

walshb

Federer goes a calendar year with only wins against Nadal. Without checking I think that's the only year where he was a 100 percent winner vs. Nadal....

Edit: 2015 Fed was 1-0 vs Nadal...