Anyone else fed up of the Gardai whinging about pay?

F1fan

Anyone else fed up of the Gardai whinging about pay?


No

dwayneshintzy

TheDavester wrote: »

Im more sick of teachers whinging about pay

Why, what do you think a newly qualified primary or secondary school teacher should be paid?

worded

I heard a funny one

I'd you want to contact all the landlords in Ireland just put an ad in the monthly Garda gazette mag

Atari Jaguar

doc11 wrote: »

yeah yeah yeah, what about the gardai who sit safely in their stations all day doing crosswords. The majority are desk based. Risk of Death? you do like the drama. 63k for an average guard plus pension after 30 years is amazing. How much do you think a guard should be paid?

:rolleyes: yeah Gardai don't risk death going out and dealing with the worst scum Ireland has to offer. Get a grip. They don't even have bulletproof vests.

diomed

bubblypop wrote: »

You hardly think a Garda gets all these allowances

I think adults reading the list will realise it is a list of allowances.
If I posted a list of everything in a supermarket people would know that it is what the shopping population buys, not something that one person buys.

TheDoc

12 guards recently turned up at a neighbouring house, to execute something to do with a traffic violation. 12 guards....12

When asked why there was 12 Guards at the house (owner known as a friendly, community oriented gentleman) the response was " Christmas overtime sure". No arrest that anyone could see, pretty much just a service of a ticket or something. Me and other neighbours were in absolute shock, and some of us made it clear what we thought about the total waste of resources.

I've a certain aspect of that I sick of the moaning. Their gravy train is coming to an end, like so many of the public sector now that there is the realisation most public sector areas are ran so criminally they need tightening up and efficiency drives.

I havn't been directly involved with a Guard in terms of an incident in over 15 years, but have from time to time in the last 4 years being witness to some stuff. Of course I'd never tarnish everyone with the same brush, but there feels to me like a shift in the general attitude of younger guards coming out of templemore. Witnessed some absolutely horrific brutality this year that was just toally out of order. I would be one that would actually applaud someone getting knocked around when they are out of order, and think there is too many shams on then go these days, but some of the stuff I saw this year was incredible. Total escalation of a situation that you would assume training would outline how to diffuse.

I wonder if the water protest stuff has changed the dynamic and the thought process in the general rank and file when it comes to the wider public, especially in certain "areas" where maybe some water protest stuff went on.

Anyway, know enough Guards who are in the mid stage of their career, and to me it sounds just like so many of public sector workers. Trying to corner off the gravy train that is coming to an end, as governments or departments realise there is pure waste going on and there is ways to trim the fat and be more efficent.

Don't have much sympathy for new recruits, as you should have your eyes open when going in. It's like junior doctors annoyed or "distraught" at the long working hours. Like you didn't know this before you decided on the career. And like Doctors, Guardaí have some pretty nice stuff to look forward to as they progress in their career. Allowances, more allowances and then a pension that most private sector workers would love.

So you go through some tough times starting off? Sorry but tough ****, welcome to life and the real world, where you need to grind your way and graft your way through it if you want to be succesfull or provide. Too many people nowadays with expectations of things being handed to them as "entitlement"

ceegee

LexieOnRale wrote: »

They were walking around the carpark today in blanch shopping centre checking windows, now - I've no issue with them having checkpoints or catching people on the road that shouldn't be on the roads, but you'd think they'd have more to be worrying about than walking around a carpark collecting revenue given the state of the country at the minute with people being shot at, mugged, and burgled

There are loads of reports every year in the run up to Christmas of peoples shopping being robbed from cars in big shopping centres. I'd imagine they were as much there for crime prevention reasons as they were checking tax/insurance

worded

ceegee wrote: »

There are loads of reports every year in the run up to Christmas of peoples shopping being robbed from cars in big shopping centres. I'd imagine they were as much there for crime prevention reasons as they were checking tax/insurance

If the figures for car tax fines are up Im sure its used as a bargaining chip / justification with the govt to raise pay.

If this type of fish in a barrel tax fines activity in Shopping centres carparks has never been seen before, why are we seeing it now?

ActingDanClark

ceegee wrote: »

There are loads of reports every year in the run up to Christmas of peoples shopping being robbed from cars in big shopping centres. I'd imagine they were as much there for crime prevention reasons as they were checking tax/insurance

Guards don't give tickets in shopping centre carparks

super_furry

Gardai are already well paid. They're the best paid workers in the public service and their average pays is 50% higher than other public workers.

The average take-home pay for Gardai across the force last year was €63,450, and now after their strike vote, they're going to get another massive bump.

PANDDDKP

I know a good few guards, some whinge and some don't... I accept it's a hard job at times, and the hours are ****ty..

But their wage is good!! I've yet to meet a guard who isn't married, has his/her own house, good cars at the door, holidays every year, has the best of stuff and they still save money...

They get days off no problem, always someone else to cover for them, they'll still get paid.. If they take sick - no problem- they get paid... They get paid every week on the button, and they'll get a handsome pension when they retire. They have it handy and they should just accept they do..

super_furry

If you factor in their hugely generous pension - they can retire aged 55 with their full pension after 30 years service - the value of payments to the average guard last year was in excess of €100,000.

Calhoun

super_furry wrote: »

Gardai are already well paid. They're the best paid workers in the public service and their average pays is 50% higher than other public workers.

The average take-home pay for Gardai across the force last year was €63,450, and now after their strike vote, they're going to get another massive bump.

Let's not talk to reports of recent days which speak to that average pay or with pension entitlements they are actually on over 100.

The poor little lambs their job is obviously to serve the pocket first before the community. Maybe a harsh opinion but the whole illegal proposed strikes really and carry on of their trade union really has soured my view of them. I always knew they served themselves but gave them benefit of the doubt as it's always though job.

wingbacknr5

And every media report on their pay states that "Garda morale is said to be at an all time low".

I have never heard it said that Garda morale is on the increase.

Who is measuring this, have they a morale-ometer or something.

Grayson

dwayneshintzy wrote: »

Why, what do you think a newly qualified primary or secondary school teacher should be paid?

Personally I think 25-30k. That should be fine for a new graduate who's 23 years old. Put in decent yearly increases so after 5 years they can have another 10k.

I'd say the same for gardai but also put in a bonus if they have undergraduate degrees that are relevant qualifications.

The problem isn't how much they're paid but rather the fact that in certain parts of the country it's so expensive to rent. That affects everyone, not just civil servants, So the three solutions are
1) Increase civil servant pay for everyone.
2) Increase it for people living in Dublin.
3) solve the rent crises.

I'd be in favour of the last option. Without that it may be necessary to give people living in cities rent supplements.

Ted111

wingbacknr5 wrote: »

And every media report on their pay states that "Garda morale is said to be at an all time low".

Similar to a&es and/or nursing staff in a&es who are perpetually at "Breaking Point"!
Although it never actually breaks?
Just hovers at breaking point.
What actually happens when it breaks?

Slydice

Slydice wrote: »

Not really...

****ing rents these days are mad. Average rent in Dublin is almost a grand a month.

What do Gardai earn startin?
http://www.garda.ie/Controller.aspx?Page=12252

Let's skip to the year 1: €25,727
after basic tax..
http://taxcalc.ie/
that's €21,618

So like.. what's that less a grand a month. It's 21,618-12000 = 9,618

so each week that's: 184.......................

Can't young AGS in their first year working house share like most other young professionals?

Apprentice accountants in the big4 manage away on sh1t money

Atari Jaguar

Augeo wrote: »

Can't young AGS in their first year working house share like most other young professionals?

Apprentice accountants in the big4 manage away on sh1t money

Implying house shares in Dublin aren't crazy money also.
And I'm sure that their housemates would be delighted with them walking in from work at god knows what hour of the morning if they end up doing night shifts.

Water John

Is it now an imposition to house share with somebody on shift work?
That must really qualify as a first world problem.

Atari Jaguar

Atari Jaguar wrote: »

Implying house shares in Dublin aren't crazy money also.
And I'm sure that their housemates would be delighted with them walking in from work at god knows what hour of the morning if they end up doing night shifts.

I did shift work myself, my housemates weren't bothered. One is mindful when coming in late.

Calhoun

Grayson wrote: »

Personally I think 25-30k. That should be fine for a new graduate who's 23 years old. Put in decent yearly increases so after 5 years they can have another 10k.

I'd say the same for gardai but also put in a bonus if they have undergraduate degrees that are relevant qualifications.

The problem isn't how much they're paid but rather the fact that in certain parts of the country it's so expensive to rent. That affects everyone, not just civil servants, So the three solutions are
1) Increase civil servant pay for everyone.
2) Increase it for people living in Dublin.
3) solve the rent crises.

I'd be in favour of the last option. Without that it may be necessary to give people living in cities rent supplements.

I can tell you this most Guards i know dont live uncomfortably and up until recent years were always guaranteed a nice old loan from the credit union or from the banks as they were in a very secure job with decent wage.

The factors which have changed are exactly as you have called out above and dont just impact young gaurds but everyone in society. The difference is not everyone can retire at 50 with the type of pension they get, which they do deserve but they need to stop the poor mouth crap.

jetsonx

Calhoun wrote: »

The factors which have changed are exactly as you have called out above and dont just impact young gaurds but everyone in society. The difference is not everyone can retire at 50 with the type of pension they get, which they do deserve but they need to stop the poor mouth crap.

Well said.

With their poor service, poor mouth and amazing arrogance in dealing with the citizens about this country I am not surprised public sentiment is largely against them.

Maybe we could set-up a second police force in this country, AGS could do the all the easy stuff like parking fines, drug patrols at rock concerts, shopping centre patrols and a proper force could actually do the hard strategic crime fighting stuff?

TheDoc

TheDoc wrote: »

12 guards recently turned up at a neighbouring house, to execute something to do with a traffic violation. 12 guards....12

When asked why there was 12 Guards at the house (owner known as a friendly, community oriented gentleman) the response was " Christmas overtime sure". No arrest that anyone could see, pretty much just a service of a ticket or something. Me and other neighbours were in absolute shock, and some of us made it clear what we thought about the total waste of resources.

I've a certain aspect of that I sick of the moaning. Their gravy train is coming to an end, like so many of the public sector now that there is the realisation most public sector areas are ran so criminally they need tightening up and efficiency drives.

I havn't been directly involved with a Guard in terms of an incident in over 15 years, but have from time to time in the last 4 years being witness to some stuff. Of course I'd never tarnish everyone with the same brush, but there feels to me like a shift in the general attitude of younger guards coming out of templemore. Witnessed some absolutely horrific brutality this year that was just toally out of order. I would be one that would actually applaud someone getting knocked around when they are out of order, and think there is too many shams on then go these days, but some of the stuff I saw this year was incredible. Total escalation of a situation that you would assume training would outline how to diffuse.

I wonder if the water protest stuff has changed the dynamic and the thought process in the general rank and file when it comes to the wider public, especially in certain "areas" where maybe some water protest stuff went on.

Anyway, know enough Guards who are in the mid stage of their career, and to me it sounds just like so many of public sector workers. Trying to corner off the gravy train that is coming to an end, as governments or departments realise there is pure waste going on and there is ways to trim the fat and be more efficent.

Don't have much sympathy for new recruits, as you should have your eyes open when going in. It's like junior doctors annoyed or "distraught" at the long working hours. Like you didn't know this before you decided on the career. And like Doctors, Guardaí have some pretty nice stuff to look forward to as they progress in their career. Allowances, more allowances and then a pension that most private sector workers would love.

So you go through some tough times starting off? Sorry but tough ****, welcome to life and the real world, where you need to grind your way and graft your way through it if you want to be succesfull or provide. Too many people nowadays with expectations of things being handed to them as "entitlement"

Tbf, your upstanding community activists neighbour isn't going to tell you that he is wanted for something is he?
Or that one of his family is wanted for some serious offence...

Sam Kade

ohnonotgmail wrote: »

I'm fed up reading threads about people whinging about other people whinging. Is that close enough?

But you are whinging about people whinging about people whinging, which makes you no better than them

Calhoun

Sam Kade wrote: »

But you are whinging about people whinging about people whinging, which makes you no better than them

As far as we know he isn't costing the tax payer 100k a year and delivering a piss poor service in return but also acting like spoilt little security gaurds as opposed to a professional police force.

Dr. Kenneth Noisewater

Calhoun wrote: »

I can tell you this most Guards i know dont live uncomfortably and up until recent years were always guaranteed a nice old loan from the credit union or from the banks as they were in a very secure job with decent wage.

What good is a loan if you're on rubbish money to pay it back?

I dunno lads, I've dealt with a few arseholes of Gardaí, but there's always a few no matter where you go. The bottom line is that these people are paid poorly for doing a job I know I certainly wouldn't do, taking abuse from scumbags and drunk, arrogant fools who think they know more about the law than the cops themselves, working long shifts, weekends, over Christmas, telling distraught families their loved one is dead, being assaulted, spat at, dealing with the scene of accident and countless other horrible duties. All for a wage most people would snot at.

And pension entitlements me arse, we haven't a clue what's coming down the line in this country in that regard......

Calhoun

Dr. Kenneth Noisewater wrote: »

What good is a loan if you're on rubbish money to pay it back?

I dunno lads, I've dealt with a few arseholes of Gardaí, but there's always a few no matter where you go. The bottom line is that these people are paid poorly for doing a job I know I certainly wouldn't do, taking abuse from scumbags and drunk, arrogant fools who think they know more about the law than the cops themselves, working long shifts, weekends, over Christmas, telling distraught families their loved one is dead, being assaulted, spat at, dealing with the scene of accident and countless other horrible duties. All for a wage most people would snot at.

And pension entitlements me arse, we haven't a clue what's coming down the line in this country in that regard......

Who said they are on poor money? the details in the thread would counter this but lets go along with your way of thinking if they were getting a loan on a small wage which is more than most of the general public would get they were getting it from their own credit union so they had to have reasonable rates to pay it back.

Sure its a though job which is why we pay them on average 65K a year or 100K if you include the pensions which is the point. That's the point of this thread, you dont just get a blank cheque or are not open to critism because things might be a little bit hard in your role. Putting them on a pedestal is the wrong thing to do in this country, they should be treated with respect but its a two way street and actions like last month shouldnt have happened considering their pay.

As for the pension i agree with you things look bleak in the future but its not gone yet and we still pay it. I can also guarantee it wont go without a fight and services for the general public will be hindered in order to push it down the road as long as possible.

Mountainsandh

Dr. Kenneth Noisewater wrote: »

What good is a loan if you're on rubbish money to pay it back?

I dunno lads, I've dealt with a few arseholes of Gardaí, but there's always a few no matter where you go. The bottom line is that these people are paid poorly for doing a job I know I certainly wouldn't do, taking abuse from scumbags and drunk, arrogant fools who think they know more about the law than the cops themselves, working long shifts, weekends, over Christmas, telling distraught families their loved one is dead, being assaulted, spat at, dealing with the scene of accident and countless other horrible duties. All for a wage most people would snot at.

And pension entitlements me arse, we haven't a clue what's coming down the line in this country in that regard......

+ 1
And for those asking what happens after nurses or guards reach "breaking point", or when the morale is low, well... look around you : at hospitals, where nurses work their backsides off to keep the show on the road with less resources, and more and more patients on trolleys ; at the amount of road deaths this year, and the levels of crime. What happens when services are at breaking point is that people suffer.
Both service providers, and people on the receiving end.

I get as pIssed off as anyone at speed checks locations, and even worse at tax checks that seem to serve no purpose other than collecting revenue but ... I don't believe it's the young guy who just joined the guards who decides what calls he goes out on. I'm guessing they just do as they're told, and the decision makers are not the ones on the lower salary scales.

I'm only guessing, so if someone knows for a fact that each individual guard chooses freely what he's going to do that week, check tax, work at the desk, or prevent crime in the street, set me right.

I think across the board services are suffering from the (at times deliberate) ignorance of decision makers.

Grayson

Mountainsandh wrote: »

+ 1
And for those asking what happens after nurses or guards reach "breaking point", or when the morale is low, well... look around you : at hospitals, where nurses work their backsides off to keep the show on the road with less resources, and more and more patients on trolleys ; at the amount of road deaths this year, and the levels of crime. What happens when services are at breaking point is that people suffer.
Both service providers, and people on the receiving end.

I get as pIssed off as anyone at speed checks locations, and even worse at tax checks that seem to serve no purpose other than collecting revenue but ... I don't believe it's the young guy who just joined the guards who decides what calls he goes out on. I'm guessing they just do as they're told, and the decision makers are not the ones on the lower salary scales.

I'm only guessing, so if someone knows for a fact that each individual guard chooses freely what he's going to do that week, check tax, work at the desk, or prevent crime in the street, set me right.

I think across the board services are suffering from the (at times deliberate) ignorance of decision makers.

The solution to that isn't to throw money at the staff. That would work in the short term but in the end it'll make no difference. Yes, they should be paid fairly but increasing pay is no substitute for creating better conditions or a more effective structure.


btw, I think he means the new guy doesn't decide what he does but he does decide to be a prick when doing it.

Skommando

Guards is shyte job, running around after skangers all day