Advertisement
If you have a new account but are having problems posting or verifying your account, please email us on hello@boards.ie for help. Thanks :)
Hello all! Please ensure that you are posting a new thread or question in the appropriate forum. The Feedback forum is overwhelmed with questions that are having to be moved elsewhere. If you need help to verify your account contact hello@boards.ie

TK Whitaker - Father of Modern Ireland

Options
2»

Comments

  • Options
    #32
    mad muffin
    Registered Users Posts: 8,034 ✭✭✭mad muffin


    Is he related to Forest Whitaker?


  • Options
    #33
    judeboy101
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 3,246 ✭✭✭judeboy101


    JupiterKid wrote: »
    TK Whitaker's positive contributions massively outweigh any negatives.

    Anyhow, I'm not sure getting directly militarily involved in the NI troubles in the early 1970s would have been a good idea - it would have dragged the entire island into a new civil war and probably have destroyed the country economically. Would it have been worth it?

    I just see bitterness in your post.


    A simple incursion across the foyle into Derry, it would have taken Brits a week to mobilize a ground response, in the meantime a quick word in the US ambassadors ear that if UN do not get involved we will withdraw our troops from NI, completely shut the border and rent out cobh harbour to the USSR. Instead we listened to the civil servant who was born in the UK.


  • Options
    #34
    fiveleavesleft
    Registered Users Posts: 221 ✭✭fiveleavesleft


    Whitaker is very interesting. When you take the big names of modern Irish history, Haughey, Bertie, Gerry Adams, Paisley, Bono, Dinny etc... They all arouse strong feelings in Irish people from digs, abuse, jokes to outright hatred! Whitaker however is universally admired & respected by everyone.

    Perhaps TK was the cutest hoor we ever produced, so you may well be right he is the father of Modern Ireland!


  • Options
    #35
    marienbad
    Registered Users Posts: 9,463 ✭✭✭marienbad


    judeboy101 wrote: »
    A simple incursion across the foyle into Derry, it would have taken Brits a week to mobilize a ground response, in the meantime a quick word in the US ambassadors ear that if UN do not get involved we will withdraw our troops from NI, completely shut the border and rent out cobh harbour to the USSR. Instead we listened to the civil servant who was born in the UK.

    There is no such thing as 'as simple incursion' into a Sovereign state . Pie in the sky stuff


  • Options
    #36
    maudgonner
    Registered Users Posts: 5,455 ✭✭✭maudgonner


    judeboy101 wrote: »
    A simple incursion across the foyle into Derry, it would have taken Brits a week to mobilize a ground response, in the meantime a quick word in the US ambassadors ear that if UN do not get involved we will withdraw our troops from NI, completely shut the border and rent out cobh harbour to the USSR. Instead we listened to the civil servant who was born in the UK.

    He was born in Co Down in 1916. No matter where on this island he was born he would have been born in the UK.


  • Advertisement
  • Options
    #37
    cajonlardo
    Registered Users Posts: 1,019 ✭✭✭cajonlardo


    judeboy101 wrote: »
    A simple incursion across the foyle into Derry, it would have taken Brits a week to mobilize a ground response, in the meantime a quick word in the US ambassadors ear that if UN do not get involved we will withdraw our troops from NI, completely shut the border and rent out cobh harbour to the USSR. Instead we listened to the civil servant who was born in the UK.

    I have a feeling you are fully aware that this was examined in detail and discounted as idiocy.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Exercise_Armageddon


  • Options
    #38
    Outlaw Pete
    Registered Users Posts: 10,423 ✭✭✭✭Outlaw Pete


    Kirk Douglas turned 100 today too.


  • Options
    #39
    judeboy101
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 3,246 ✭✭✭judeboy101


    cajonlardo wrote: »
    I have a feeling you are fully aware that this was examined in detail and discounted as idiocy.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Exercise_Armageddon

    The threat to allow Russians unfettered access to the north Atlantic was not discussed. Whitaker was just one in a long list of faceless sir Humphreys, unable to find a niche in his own country, but fawned upon by the mandarins in the Irish civil service. You can see other UK rejects like him at the head of the HSE today.


  • Options
    #40
    marienbad
    Registered Users Posts: 9,463 ✭✭✭marienbad


    judeboy101 wrote: »
    The threat to allow Russians unfettered access to the north Atlantic was not discussed. Whitaker was just one in a long list of faceless sir Humphreys, unable to find a niche in his own country, but fawned upon by the mandarins in the Irish civil service. You can see other UK rejects like him at the head of the HSE today.

    How do you know ?

    Even though it would have been madness , we were trying to join the EEC and entice US companies to Ireland , why would we apply such a self inflicted wound ?


  • Options
    #41
    judeboy101
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 3,246 ✭✭✭judeboy101


    marienbad wrote: »
    How do you know ?

    Even though it would have been madness , we were trying to join the EEC and entice US companies to Ireland , why would we apply such a self inflicted wound ?
    Entice US companies in 1960's ? A come on. You'd be a fool to think that Irish policy towards the north wasn't run through Whitehall and Mi6. The betrayal of lynch's government of the people of ulster was a stain on his career and the fact Whitaker, a UK citizen with strong ties to his native country had such influence in him, is no happy accident. As for the Russians, of course it would be insane, but the Americans would do anything to avoid another Cuba, and getting UN boots on the ground would be a small price to pay. As for the EEC, sure they had no problem with countries joining who had active communist parties.


  • Advertisement
  • Options
    #42
    Galwayguy35
    Registered Users Posts: 16,369 ✭✭✭✭Galwayguy35


    Outlaw Pete wrote: »
    Kirk Douglas turned 100 today too.

    Aye but he doesn't seem to be in as good a shape as this oul boy.


  • Options
    #43
    BadBannana
    Registered Users Posts: 355 ✭✭BadBannana


    judeboy101 wrote: »
    Am I the only one who remembers that this is the man who convinced Jack Lynch to stand by and watch the slaughter of Irish men and women by the Brits in the north?

    Are you suggesting an invasion or just baiting us?


  • Options
    #44
    marienbad
    Registered Users Posts: 9,463 ✭✭✭marienbad


    judeboy101 wrote: »
    Entice US companies in 1960's ? A come on. You'd be a fool to think that Irish policy towards the north wasn't run through Whitehall and Mi6. The betrayal of lynch's government of the people of ulster was a stain on his career and the fact Whitaker, a UK citizen with strong ties to his native country had such influence in him, is no happy accident. As for the Russians, of course it would be insane, but the Americans would do anything to avoid another Cuba, and getting UN boots on the ground would be a small price to pay. As for the EEC, sure they had no problem with countries joining who had active communist parties.

    Have you sources for anything you have posted above ?

    Such a pity when people don't even know their own history , particularly when it is so easily available

    ''Shannon Free Zone is Ireland's largest cluster of North American investments. Since its establishment in 1959, more than 110 overseas companies have chosen to open subsidiaries in Shannon''

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shannon,_County_Clare


  • Options
    #45
    judeboy101
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 3,246 ✭✭✭judeboy101


    marienbad wrote: »
    Have you sources for anything you have posted above ?

    Such a pity when people don't even know their own history , particularly when it is so easily available

    ''Shannon Free Zone is Ireland's largest cluster of North American investments. Since its establishment in 1959, more than 110 overseas companies have chosen to open subsidiaries in Shannon''

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shannon,_County_Clare
    He was born in the UK ergo his allegiance would naturally be with his saxe Coburg overlords.


  • Options
    #46
    Water John
    Registered Users Posts: 21,169 ✭✭✭✭Water John


    So was James Connolly. Nonsense post.


  • Options
    #47
    marienbad
    Registered Users Posts: 9,463 ✭✭✭marienbad


    judeboy101 wrote: »
    He was born in the UK ergo his allegiance would naturally be with his saxe Coburg overlords.




    In 1970 everyone born in Ireland before the early 1920's was born in the UK !

    So have you given up on your 'Enticing US companies in the 1960's ' argument


  • Options
    #48
    osarusan
    Registered Users Posts: 16,576 ✭✭✭✭osarusan


    judeboy101 wrote: »
    He was born in the UK ergo his allegiance would naturally be with his saxe Coburg overlords.
    Do you have any idea how much shyte you're talking?


  • Options
    #49
    judeboy101
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 3,246 ✭✭✭judeboy101


    Water John wrote: »
    So was James Connolly. Nonsense post.

    And Connolly led men to their death in 1916. Seems to me that these uk Irish have a habit of doing this.


  • Options
    #50
    padd b1975
    Registered Users Posts: 10,713 ✭✭✭✭padd b1975


    marienbad wrote: »
    what was the alternative ?

    Our army wiped out, then the British forces have their lunch.


  • Options
    #51
    judeboy101
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 3,246 ✭✭✭judeboy101


    padd b1975 wrote: »
    Our army wiped out, then the British forces have their lunch.

    One Irish battalion embedded in Derry would take weeks to clear unless the British army wanted to carpet bomb their own people. Within hrs of the incursion jack lynch brings the British and America ambassadors into an office and shows them a communique from their Russian counterpart indicating Russian interest on a 50 year lease of cobh harbour and use of Shannon airport for refueling and repair. Lynch gives them 24hrs to convene the UN security council to pass a resolution establishing a peacekeeping force up north. French and Americans wont want to look over their shoulders towards Ireland so put the pressure on UK.


  • Advertisement
  • Options
    #52
    padd b1975
    Registered Users Posts: 10,713 ✭✭✭✭padd b1975


    judeboy101 wrote: »
    One Irish battalion embedded in Derry would take weeks to clear unless the British army wanted to carpet bomb their own people. Within hrs of the incursion jack lynch brings the British and America ambassadors into an office and shows them a communique from their Russian counterpart indicating Russian interest on a 50 year lease of cobh harbour and use of Shannon airport for refueling and repair. Lynch gives them 24hrs to convene the UN security council to pass a resolution establishing a peacekeeping force up north. French and Americans wont want to look over their shoulders towards Ireland so put the pressure on UK.

    America, France and the UK would end up isolating us like Cuba when they flirted with the Soviets.

    We'd have ended up back in the dark ages along with the dead bodies.


  • Options
    #53
    marienbad
    Registered Users Posts: 9,463 ✭✭✭marienbad


    judeboy101 wrote: »
    One Irish battalion embedded in Derry would take weeks to clear unless the British army wanted to carpet bomb their own people. Within hrs of the incursion jack lynch brings the British and America ambassadors into an office and shows them a communique from their Russian counterpart indicating Russian interest on a 50 year lease of cobh harbour and use of Shannon airport for refueling and repair. Lynch gives them 24hrs to convene the UN security council to pass a resolution establishing a peacekeeping force up north. French and Americans wont want to look over their shoulders towards Ireland so put the pressure on UK.

    Do you really believe this stuff ??

    If you really want an idea what would have happened have a read up on the Falklands War.

    And to show you where true US allegiance lies have a look at the award made to Casper Weinberger by the UK even though Argentina was also a US ally .

    You couldn't make this guff up , Oh I forgot you can


  • Options
    #54
    judeboy101
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 3,246 ✭✭✭judeboy101


    padd b1975 wrote: »
    America, France and the UK would end up isolating us like Cuba when they flirted with the Soviets.

    We'd have ended up back in the dark ages along with the dead bodies.

    You know how awkward it is to fly transatlantic without going through Irish airspace? Cuba did pretty well as a country with access to Russian technology.the reality is the strategy was determined by Whitaker and he would have made sure any study into an incursion would back up his agenda.


  • Options
    #55
    Water John
    Registered Users Posts: 21,169 ✭✭✭✭Water John


    Daft stuff.
    This is your suggestion, in the middle of the Vietnam war. Threaten to side with Russia is your bargaining tool. Don't think you have the years on the clock to have lived through that time.
    As the rump in FF of the time found out, very little public appetite for anything approaching your suggested option.


  • Options
    #56
    Grandeeod
    Registered Users Posts: 12,111 ✭✭✭✭Grandeeod


    judeboy101 wrote: »
    One Irish battalion embedded in Derry would take weeks to clear unless the British army wanted to carpet bomb their own people. Within hrs of the incursion jack lynch brings the British and America ambassadors into an office and shows them a communique from their Russian counterpart indicating Russian interest on a 50 year lease of cobh harbour and use of Shannon airport for refueling and repair. Lynch gives them 24hrs to convene the UN security council to pass a resolution establishing a peacekeeping force up north. French and Americans wont want to look over their shoulders towards Ireland so put the pressure on UK.

    Write a film script. Most are fantasy anyway. Just like your post.


  • Options
    #57
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    judeboy101 wrote: »
    One Irish battalion embedded in Derry would take weeks to clear unless the British army wanted to carpet bomb their own people. Within hrs of the incursion jack lynch brings the British and America ambassadors into an office and shows them a communique from their Russian counterpart indicating Russian interest on a 50 year lease of cobh harbour and use of Shannon airport for refueling and repair. Lynch gives them 24hrs to convene the UN security council to pass a resolution establishing a peacekeeping force up north. French and Americans wont want to look over their shoulders towards Ireland so put the pressure on UK.

    The office would be under a volcanic island, reached only by submarine.

    Lynch could be cackling and stroking a cat.


  • Options
    #58
    Arghus
    Registered Users Posts: 14,373 ✭✭✭✭Arghus


    I was wondering why the thread was running and running. Are people really that into T.K. Whittaker?

    Turns out to be the same reason as always: some guy spouting crap!


Advertisement