Minimum alcohol pricing is nigh

Leroy42

darkpagandeath wrote: »

What companies advertising has decided what you drink and how much just curious ?

So advertising has no effect on you, but you really think that is enough to dismiss it?

Based on the amount of advertising spend across all economies logic dictates that it has some value.

Of course, maybe you were just the 1st one to work it out that its all a scam.

Jayop

darkpagandeath wrote: »

What companies advertising has decided what you drink and how much just curious ?

I'd say probably things like captain morgans, bacardi, and other spirits. Stuff I might generally have never bothered about but when you see an ad a few times it gets in your head and you might give it a go.

A pub having a poster up with a promotion on a certain type of beer could make me choose it, that's advertising. It works.

http://alcoholresearchuk.org/alcohol-insights/the-representation-and-reception-of-meaning-in-alcohol-advertising-and-young-peoples-drinking/

This is interesting. Links between advertising spend by a company and an increase in consumption of that particular brand have been proven in some studies and not in others. It's likely in my mind that spending alone doesn't equate to an increase, rather the quality of the Ad.

darkpagandeath

Leroy42 wrote: »

So advertising has no effect on you, but you really think that is enough to dismiss it?

Based on the amount of advertising spend across all economies logic dictates that it has some value.

Of course, maybe you were just the 1st one to work it out that its all a scam.

It is...

darkpagandeath

Jayop wrote: »

I'd say probably things like captain morgans, bacardi, and other spirits. Stuff I might generally have never bothered about but when you see an ad a few times it gets in your head and you might give it a go.

A pub having a poster up with a promotion on a certain type of beer could make me choose it, that's advertising. It works.

http://alcoholresearchuk.org/alcohol-insights/the-representation-and-reception-of-meaning-in-alcohol-advertising-and-young-peoples-drinking/

This is interesting. Links between advertising spend by a company and an increase in consumption of that particular brand have been proven in some studies and not in others. It's likely in my mind that spending alone doesn't equate to an increase, rather the quality of the Ad.

Usually as it will be cheaper hence the promotion.

Jayop

darkpagandeath wrote: »

Usually as it will be cheaper hence the promotion.

It's still advertising that's bringing to my attention that there's a promotion on. You asked for an example of when advertising would cause me specifically to choose one drink over another, that's an example.

I'll often also go into the off license and have no idea what I'm going to buy, in that instance POS advertising will have a big impact on what I choose.

Leroy42

Its a scam. That's a pretty big claim, any evidence to back it up?

Think of it this way, what soft drink is most associated with Christmas? That is no just luck or somebody read it. It is years or advertising and subtle references in the colours used, in movies etc.

Even the drink companies, who are loath to admit that advertising increases spending on drink, will admit that it influences brand choice.

So we have years of successful advertising campaigns, millions of euros spent each year on advertising and thousands of people actively working in the industry to point to the notion that it works.

What do you have to back up your claim?

darkpagandeath

Leroy42 wrote: »

Its a scam. That's a pretty big claim, any evidence to back it up?

Think of it this way, what soft drink is most associated with Christmas? That is no just luck or somebody read it. It is years or advertising and subtle references in the colours used, in movies etc.

Even the drink companies, who are loath to admit that advertising increases spending on drink, will admit that it influences brand choice.

So we have years of successful advertising campaigns, millions of euros spent each year on advertising and thousands of people actively working in the industry to point to the notion that it works.

What do you have to back up your claim?

I Replied to Advertising being a scam.. it is.

Jayop

darkpagandeath wrote: »

I Replied to Advertising being a scam.. it is.

It's a scam in that they give the impression that if you drink their brand of beer your social circle will be suddenly much cooler, you'll be much more attractive to potential mates and your jokes will suddenly rock. Yeah that's all bollocks and whether you drink Heinekin or Coors Light you'll remain the loser you were before hand.

It's not a scam from the POV of the vendor or the manufacturer though as it clearly works. As an ex-barman you would see an instant increase in demand for a product that was previously out of fashion if a big advertising campaign was up and running. Morgans is the best example of this.

Even parking advertising and look at product placement. I have a mate who runs a cocktail bar. Said ever since Mad Men started airing Old Fashioned has become a best seller even though no-one ever asked for it int he past. That alone is bringing more men into his bar that previously would have thought of cocktails as a woman's drink.

Leroy42

darkpagandeath wrote: »

I Replied to Advertising being a scam.. it is.

Ah, think I get you now. You mean advertising is scamming us?

darkpagandeath

Leroy42 wrote: »

Ah, think I get you now. You mean advertising is scamming us?

Those of us that are affected by it yes. I see plenty of adds on TV. Have no urge to by a hearing aid or that brand of car. For example.

Jayop

darkpagandeath wrote: »

Those of us that are affected by it yes. I see plenty of adds on TV. Have no urge to by a hearing aid or that brand of car. For example.

Unless you need a hearing aid then that marketing isn't targeted at you, however if it was they'd be trying to tell you that their brand is the bestest ever and you should try it.

Same, if you're in the market for a new car then you watched an ad it might make you go to the dealer to try a test drive whereas if you hadn't seen the ad you may not have bothered and they'd have had no chance to sell to you.

For young people who haven't yet drunk then constant alchohol advertising is putting the messages of it being cool, popular, normal into their heads. It may not be the deciding factor but it will help make up their minds. Also, how does a 16 or 17 year old decide what to buy for their first drink?

darkpagandeath

Jayop wrote: »

Unless you need a hearing aid then that marketing isn't targeted at you, however if it was they'd be trying to tell you that their brand is the bestest ever and you should try it.

Same, if you're in the market for a new car then you watched an ad it might make you go to the dealer to try a test drive whereas if you hadn't seen the ad you may not have bothered and they'd have had no chance to sell to you.

For young people who haven't yet drunk then constant alchohol advertising is putting the messages of it being cool, popular, normal into their heads. It may not be the deciding factor but it will help make up their minds. Also, how does a 16 or 17 year old decide what to buy for their first drink?

What ever is being passed around the party usually something someone robbed from their own house.

Jayop

darkpagandeath wrote: »

What ever is being passed around the party usually something someone robbed from their own house.

Erm, or whatever they buy in the off license or get their older friend to buy. The first time they buy alcohol they will decide what to buy, and whatever marketing they have seen be it sugary crap for girls or beer to look cool for the lads, the ads will have an impact on their decision making. Most people I know took their first drink with something they bought in an off-license.

Jayop

Look DPD, we've gone miles off topic here anyway, you don't think advertising makes a jot of difference and I do. It matters little what either of our opinions are in the grand scheme of things really.

Jayop

Deedsie wrote: »

Of course advertising and marketing has a massive influence on alcohol consumption. It romanticises drinking as harmless fun thing that everybody should do. Unfortunately, not everyone can control themselves with alcohol. It's an addictive substance. Some people can, some can't. Increasing the price probably won't help. Removing advertising will 100% reduce alcohol consumption in Ireland. Out of sight out of mind...

Anyone here who doesn't believe advertising has a massive impact on their lives is deluded.

I really think it's the one thing the government can do to improve alcohol misuse in Ireland without losing all support for their attempts at dealing with problem drinking in Ireland. Minimum unit pricing hurts responsible drinkers unfairly.

I 100% support the government in their attempt to improve the situation but I'm not sure if minimum pricing is the way to go.

Unfortunately, that link I posted on the last page shows that an advertising ban in a country like Ireland wouldn't work because you couldn't completely ban advertising on drinks. The drinks companies would simply divert their ad money to where it's no banned.

So say you ban TV and Radio advertising, ban sports sponsorships and the likes. They will then ramp up their in-store/pub advertising and POS ads are simply the most effective anyway. We are a small media market and buy most of our media from outside the country. We can't ban the UK from airing drinks ads so are we going to ban the UK channels too? What about if the Premier League becomes sponored by a drinks company, or the Heinekin Cup in Rugby? Our laws can't dictate international competitions names, or what the teams wear on their shirts, or if I'm a Celebrity is sponsored by Auntie Bessie's food or by some wine company.

darkpagandeath

Deedsie wrote: »

France have a ban on alcohol advertising in sport. It was called the H Cup in France. I am sure we could do the same here. I agree we view a lot of uk tv but I don't think the Irish government should base its health and education policy on what they allow to be shown on UK TV. Maybe if we lead the way they will follow.

Irish government can only improve things for Irish people in Ireland. I maintain that a media ban on alcohol advertising would be one way they could make improvements in our relationship with alcohol misuse.

What relationship ? Lived here a very long time. You don't drink any more than the rest of Europe. You have stupid laws dealing with drink. No interest in fining people who are publicly drunk no drunk tanks.

_Jamie_

Philip Clean Ruler wrote: »

Stopping alcohol advertising is a nonsense argument imo. Advertising has no influence on how much or what people drink.

How can you say that with such certainty? If alcohol advertising didn't work, why would the companies bother shelling out for it? Companies aren't keen on throwing away vast sums of money for no reason.

Advertising works, that's why it exists.

Take for example, the now defunct Arthur's Day. OK, so in the long-run, it didn't catch on. However, many people did get sucked in by it. Not quite enough for them to keep going with it but there was certainly some interest. That's alcohol advertising at work, right there. Anyone who participated in Arthur's Day did so because of it was marketed to them successfully. And a lot of alcohol advertising is a lot more insidious than that.

darkpagandeath

_Jamie_ wrote: »

How can you say that with such certainty? If alcohol advertising didn't work, why would the companies bother shelling out for it? Companies aren't keen on throwing away vast sums of money for no reason.

Advertising works, that's why it exists.

It's becoming less and less effective we are getting numb to it. Now it's all about creating fake stories for outrage to get views on the product.

_Jamie_

Leroy42 wrote: »

So advertising has no effect on you, but you really think that is enough to dismiss it?

Based on the amount of advertising spend across all economies logic dictates that it has some value.

Of course, maybe you were just the 1st one to work it out that its all a scam.

Gotta love the 'Advertising isn't the boss of ME' viewpoint, eh? Yes, dear, you're speshul, impenetrable to advertising whilst the rest of us plebs remain rapt. I mean, sure, we can all point to an ad that we hated so much that it turned us off the product. But what about all the other millions of ads out there?

andekwarhola

Anyway, about the imminent arrival of minimum pricing...

osarusan

The imminent arrival of rich creamery butter?

_Jamie_

Jayop wrote: »

It's not a scam from the POV of the vendor or the manufacturer though as it clearly works. As an ex-barman you would see an instant increase in demand for a product that was previously out of fashion if a big advertising campaign was up and running. Morgans is the best example of this.

Absolutely. I worked as a demand analyst for a soft drink company a few years back. You could actually track the rise in sales of soft drinks in response to new, aggressive advertising campaigns. There would be an immediate spike, always. Advertising works.

darkpagandeath wrote: »

Those of us that are affected by it yes.

:D:D

darkpagandeath

_Jamie_ wrote: »

Gotta love the 'Advertising isn't the boss of ME' viewpoint, eh? Yes, dear, you're speshul, impenetrable to advertising whilst the rest of us plebs remain rapt. I mean, sure, we can all point to an ad that we hated so much that it turned us off the product. But what about all the other millions of ads out there?

_Jamie_

andekwarhola wrote: »

Anyway, about the imminent arrival of minimum pricing...

Yes, that's barely been discussed, only 590+ posts. Can't let the conversation veer off-track a little when the original topic has barely had a look in!

Jayop

It is nice to be able to have a discussion here with someone of a different viewpoint with it descending into a slinging match.

darkpagandeath

Jayop wrote: »

It is nice to be able to have a discussion here with someone of a different viewpoint with it descending into a slinging match.

You cant have a proper discussion about Drink in Ireland. You get the were drinking ourselves to death shrieks. I'm not Irish but have lived here long enough to see it's nothing to do with consumption here that is the issue. It's simply ridiculous laws crated to drive you into the pub. Lack of education Lack of laws tackling actual public drunkenness. The price of drink has created the problem in binge drinking. Pre drinking now due to the price in the pub. The problem is you get vague hand waving about consumption and oh below cost selling with very little to back stuff up. I remember Leo banging on about being able to buy booze within a mile of the Dail for below cost on RTE. This is a law akin to using a shotgun when doing brain surgery.

Jimmy Garlic

1L spirits 48 quid? haha. If that happens the aul black market will step in and kick it in the balls for sure. An old tradition in this country will be revived.

darkpagandeath

Jimmy Garlic wrote: »

1L spirits 48 quid? haha. If that happens the aul black market will step in and kick it in the balls for sure. An old tradition in this country will be revived.

It's Gas I would probably drink more than Irish people I know. Seen it since I moved here going down and down the consumption. Unless they are drinking loads at home. I have noticed that a lot cant handle their drink though. but that could be due to the getting the scoops in fast in the pub before it closes.

Jimmy Garlic

darkpagandeath wrote: »

It's Gas I would probably drink more than Irish people I know. Seen it since I moved here going down and down the consumption. Unless they are drinking loads at home. I have noticed that a lot cant handle their drink though. but that could be due to the getting the scoops in fast in the pub before it closes.

Most of generation snowflake couldn't drink a seven stone Japanese teenager under the table.

darkpagandeath

Jimmy Garlic wrote: »

Most of generation snowflake couldn't drink a seven stone Japanese teenager under the table.

Well Maybe it's because I don't mix drinks. I stick to beer. Some I know you give them a few beers they start turning green. No pun intended they tend to like sweet stuff and strong.