Is Aid for Africa Working?

JupiterKid

Like many people, I give money to charity in monthly instalments but the more I read up on charity and international aid, the less I am convinced that this is the most effective way to lift people out of abject poverty.

For instance, the West has been pouring billions in aid - either governmental or through NGO charity - to African countries over the past 60 or so years and if anything the continent is becoming poorer. Is this due to corrupt governments siphoning off the money targeted at the poor, is it due to unfair international trade practices, is it due to neo-colonial economic exploitation of poor countries by the West?

Hundreds of millions of people in Asia have been lifted out of poverty over the past 30 years (especially in China) and this has been the result of government policies promoting economic/infrastructure development and not aid.

So what is the answer?

Atlantic Dawn

Rubbers are the answer.

qo2cj1dsne8y4k

I used to donate to concern but cancelled it when they would leap out infront of me like a crouching tiger and ask me to donate, and when I would say I foster already they'd ask me to donate more. Get ta fug.
Cancelling my subscription will pay for two hours less harassment from these people

suicide_circus

keeping the black man down by keeping him dependant on handouts

VladamirP

Aid to Africa is a scam, it's being plundered by the west for it's minerals, here this article will save my fingers.

The world’s $58 billion scam of Africa
http://thisisafrica.me/world-scams-africa-unbalanced-reality-aid-africa/

wakka12

Nobody can really save a countries population but the countries own government tbh. Why should other countries care about others that arent in their best interest. Has there ever been a case where a country or group of countries lifted a country from poverty to relatively normal standard of living?

Grandeeod

Aid for Africa is working for all those CEO's of charities. They will happily accept corrupt Governments because it assists them.

b_mac2

I've spent nearly 6 months in central Africa and it's safe to say that there is no hope for the place. The only help from aid agencies I saw over there were the brand new WFP branded jeeps, which were given to the village elders.

Also it taught me that all NGO's are corrupt to the core.

Ted111

Send advice and encouragement. Maybe some inspiration gifs.
But no cash.

darkpagandeath

Them lads for the ahem famine in Ethiopia are still in the same camp using aid as currency. Also it was not a famine it was a man made event the gov wanted to kill off a group of people. Moved them to land that cannot grow crops.

Merowig

Asian countries were as well colonies - and look where Singapur, Hong-Kong, Malaysia etc are now. 2 Atomic bombs were dropped on Japan and look at the country now. Germany was bombed to bits and pieces - half of the country was a Soviet satellite for decades... and now...


Giving aid is like burning money in my opinion.

Senna

VladamirP wrote: »

Aid to Africa is a scam, it's being plundered by the west for it's minerals, here this article will save my fingers.

The world’s $58 billion scam of Africa
http://thisisafrica.me/world-scams-africa-unbalanced-reality-aid-africa/

While I kind of agree with the sentiment, that's the worst wrote, badly researched, biased and condenseding article I have ever read.
Africa is huge, the whole country does not depend on aid and you cant just take the figures that suit you, ignore African business and pull a figure out of your ass.

Hans Bricks

Botswana is apparently doing quite well for itself independently. Perhaps the rest of Africa should look to it for example ?

goose2005

The African population is predicted to grow from 1 to 4 billion by 2100, so any rise in the economy is likely to be swallowed up by the rising population

VladamirP

Senna wrote: »

While I kind of agree with the sentiment, that's the worst wrote, badly researched, biased and condenseding article I have ever read.
Africa is huge, the whole country does not depend on aid and you cant just take the figures that suit you, ignore African business and pull a figure out of your ass.

Sorry can you provide me with a better example, my point is Africa should be very rich, it has what the rest of the world need and want, but instead of paying, they take.

Africa is a continent made up of lots of countries, but it's the most plundered continent on the planet and has been for a long time, gold, diamonds, oil, uranium, to name just a few of the natural resources being stolen from under the poor's feet by western and Chinese companies with the help of western backed dictators.

I hope one of these links will be up to your standards.

Stop the Plunder of Africa
http://www.nytimes.com/2013/05/10/opinion/global/stop-the-plunder-of-africa.html

Africa loses $50bn a year in plundered resources
http://mg.co.za/article/2014-05-07-africa-loses-50bn-a-year-in-plundered-resources

Undermining Africa's wealth
http://www.osisa.org/economic-justice/blog/undermining-africas-wealth

Africa’s resources still plundered by corrupt officials
http://www.cnbcafrica.com/news/special-report/2014/05/08/africa%E2%80%99s-resources-plundered-by-corrupt-officials/


https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/originals/33/27/97/332797cb12055f3ac6a38a99c3ee0e60.jpg

https://www.courses.psu.edu/test/test100_hkr/AFIM/Jpegs/NR_W.jpg

https://afrospear.files.wordpress.com/2012/07/afi.jpg

http://userscontent2.emaze.com/images/77bcb314-8b51-4dbd-97bc-75076963f7a4/6612b0a7-25de-4b7f-8886-41c3296f92afimage8.png

Capt'n Midnight

Targeted Aid works best and Ireland is one of the best in that regards.

Trade would be better but too many one-sided treaties for that.


Zambia would be doing a lot better if all it's copper exports weren't routed through a small village in Switzerland to avoid giving them a share of the profits.

Overall the cash flow is out from Africa and that's one reason why we have so many economic migrants heading our way.

the_pen_turner

i never give to any of those charities. all the money is wasted.
they send all this money to fund stupid things like schools (they are nowhere near ready for schools), computers, fancy cloths,

they need to reduce the numbers in these areas to levels that the land can support. do this with contractption and castration.
then help them farm the land so that they can support themselvs

then when there is a decent foundation built you can start raising the level of acidemic education.

VladamirP

the_pen_turner wrote: »

i never give to any of those charities. all the money is wasted.
they send all this money to fund stupid things like schools (they are nowhere near ready for schools), computers, fancy cloths,

they need to reduce the numbers in these areas to levels that the land can support. do this with contractption and castration.
then help them farm the land so that they can support themselvs

then when there is a decent foundation built you can start raising the level of acidemic education.

But they can't be empowered or shown how to be self sufficient, that would eventually lead to bigger thoughts and aspirations, God forbid they might even start thinking of kicking the multinationals out.

Donald Trump

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6szE_qmzavQ

VladamirP

Donald Trump wrote: »

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6szE_qmzavQ

Aid not AIDS, tut tut.

Junkyard Tom

I bless the rains down in Africa

LeinsterDub

Africa is a very big place lots of it doing quite well

Skommando

How many people do we have to move from Africa to Europe before Europe works out that's not a solution ?

JupiterKid

LeinsterDub wrote: »

Africa is a very big place lots of it doing quite well

Some as in a few, African countries are doing ok. But most clearly aren't. Deeply corrupt governments interested only in feathering their own nests, corrupt wealthy elites, the kleptocracy and a hugely impoverished populace.

Wars, famines, rampant disease, poor or no infrastructure, superstition, FGM, child soldiers, refugees, overpopulation.

Utter dysfunctionalism.

Good article on why aid to Africa is not alleviating poverty:
http://www.spectator.co.uk/2014/01/why-aid-fails/

JupiterKid

If the level of aid to Africa since the 1950s hadn't been forthcoming, would things have been different?

VladamirP

JupiterKid wrote: »

If the level of aid to Africa since the 1950s hadn't been forthcoming, would things have been different?

If the amount stolen from Africa since 1700, hadn't been invaded and colonized wasn't nearly as high then yes Africa would be a totally different place.

Dick phelan

The problem is corruption and populations being too big, There is wealth in Africa the problem is it's all controlled by very corrupt governments who give nothing to help their people, a lot of the money we send ends up going to either the CEO's of the charity or warlords, corrupt governments ect. The harsh truth is it is better for us if plenty of poor countries still exist, imagine how expensive goods would be if we actually had to pay handsomely for the raw materials, How much would clothes cost if their were no sweatshops?

If we really wanted to help Africa we could but the reality is deep down we like things to remain as they are, people throw a few quid in the trocaire box or whatever to make themselves feel good and to feel like they are doing something to help, reality is all that stuff is a waste of money. What Africa needs is stable government and fair trade deals but that's not to our benefit so it won't happen.

pwurple

Aid won't counteract us drying up a continent by ignoring climate change.

You can have all the diamonds in the world, but if your crops fail, you either fight with your neighbours for their stuff, or flee north (hello calais).

People are so surprised by everyone flooding out of africa. As if we'd stay there while it's being scorched by the west.

VladamirP

pwurple wrote: »

Aid won't counteract us drying up a continent by ignoring climate change.

You can have all the diamonds in the world, but if your crops fail, you either fight with your neighbours for their stuff, or flee north (hello calais).

People are so surprised by everyone flooding out of africa. As if we'd stay there while it's being scorched by the west.

You can't eat gold or diamonds.

Merowig

Africa is not colonized any longer - you can't blame the West for its problems. Saudi Arabia, Kuwait etc also sold with success their ressources.


Vladimir That you posted that link http://www.cnbcafrica.com/news/special-report/2014/05/08/africa%E2%80%99s-resources-plundered-by-corrupt-officials/ and that one http://www.nytimes.com/2013/05/10/opinion/global/stop-the-plunder-of-africa.html is more than ironic - as Koffi Annan himself was involved in corruption!

Africa is responsible for itself.
China and Western companies pay for the ressources - they don't occupy and take as you claim.

VladamirP

Merowig wrote: »

Africa is not colonized any longer - you can't blame the West for its problems. Saudi Arabia, Kuwait etc also sold with success their ressources.


Vladimir That you posted that link http://www.cnbcafrica.com/news/special-report/2014/05/08/africa%E2%80%99s-resources-plundered-by-corrupt-officials/ and that one http://www.nytimes.com/2013/05/10/opinion/global/stop-the-plunder-of-africa.html is more than ironic - as Koffi Annan himself was involved in corruption!

Africa is responsible for iself.
China and Western companies pay for the ressources - they don't occupy and take as you claim.

Ohh shut up.

Of course Koffi is corrupt, they all are, all elites are corrupt, in every country.


And yes they do, you get a list of foreign companies in Africa, taking their goods, and I'll get a list of national companies putting it back into said country, guess who'll have the longer task, not me.

Merowig

No - not all elites are corrupt.

As said companies / China pay for the resources - like companies pay for Oil from Saudi Arabia, Kuwait, UAE etc.
But even the Arabs have better politicians than Africa...

And several former colonies with no ressources at all in Asia are doing much better than African countries.

Dr Crayfish

Africa is a massive continent and sub Saharan Africa never had any history of any types of civilisations. Then whitey came along and enslaved them or ruled them with an iron fist. Then we broke the place up into countries and f**ked off. Dictators and mayhem became the norm.
Democracy and civilisation developed organically in Europe and Asia, in sub Saharan Africa they were millennia behind, still in the hunter gatherer stage.
Saying that they should have sorted themselves out by now is an ignorant comment in my opinion, they mostly had their current situations forced upon them with no experience in government and tribes at war etc.
I wish I knew a solution for them.

Merowig

Dr Crayfish wrote: »

Africa is a massive continent and sub Saharan Africa never had any history of any types of civilisations. Then whitey came along and enslaved them or ruled them with an iron fist. Then we broke the place up into countries and f**ked off. Dictators and mayhem became the norm.
Democracy and civilisation developed organically in Europe and Asia, in sub Saharan Africa they were millennia behind, still in the hunter gatherer stage.
Saying that they should have sorted themselves out by now is an ignorant comment in my opinion, they mostly had their current situations forced upon them with no experience in government and tribes at war etc.
I wish I knew a solution for them.

Not all of Africa was hunter - gatherer societies
Great Zimbabwe had a great civilization - so has Aethiopia!

Kongo had a Kingdom with nobility, a feudal state and trade.
Benin - was a well organised empire - and an African state which traded in Slaves
Mali was a local empire as well
You had the Zulu Kingdom etc etc


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/African_empires
http://observationdeck.kinja.com/5-awesome-african-civilizations-that-arent-egypt-1688047907
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Benin_Empire
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_kingdoms_in_pre-colonial_Africa

Either you are the ignorant here or you are "racist"...

midnight city

The population of Ethiopia has doubled since 1984

Dr Jakub

goose2005 wrote: »

The African population is predicted to grow from 1 to 4 billion by 2100, so any rise in the economy is likely to be swallowed up by the rising population

Jesus Christ it will be Camp of the Saints.

At least I'll be dead before it gets really bad.

VladamirP

Merowig wrote: »

Not all of Africa was hunter - gatherer societies
Great Zimbabwe had a great civilization - so has Aethiopia!

Kongo had a Kingdom with nobility, a feudal state and trade.
Benin - was a well organised empire - and an African state which traded in Slaves
Mali was a local empire as well
You had the Zulu Kingdom etc etc


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/African_empires
http://observationdeck.kinja.com/5-awesome-african-civilizations-that-arent-egypt-1688047907
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Benin_Empire
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_kingdoms_in_pre-colonial_Africa

Either you are the ignorant here or you are "racist"...

I'm really not racist, but where are you from?

323

Does seem to be working very well for Toyota and Land Rover.:D

Skommando

Dr Crayfish wrote: »

Africa is a massive continent and sub Saharan Africa never had any history of any types of civilisations. Then whitey came along and enslaved them or ruled them with an iron fist. Then we broke the place up into countries and f**ked off. Dictators and mayhem became the norm.
Democracy and civilisation developed organically in Europe and Asia, in sub Saharan Africa they were millennia behind, still in the hunter gatherer stage.
Saying that they should have sorted themselves out by now is an ignorant comment in my opinion, they mostly had their current situations forced upon them with no experience in government and tribes at war etc.
I wish I knew a solution for them.

self hating white people don't help either, don't kid yourself, black people can be just s evil as any evil white.
skin colour has nothing do to with how good or bad a person or group of people are.

the solution to Aftica's problems is not to move everyone from Africa to europe

midnight city

I they could stop the corruption they may have a chance.

darkpagandeath

midnight city wrote: »

I they could stop the corruption they may have a chance.

Yeah removing religious order preaching no contraception to.

Skommando

midnight city wrote: »

I they could stop the corruption they may have a chance.

maybe when we do something about it here we can start preaching to the africans

midnight city

Skommando wrote: »

maybe when we do something about it here we can start preaching to the africans

This is a thread about Africa and aid we are perfectly entitled to discuss why they may need aid. Their inability to deal with corruption contributes to their needs for aid. Whether we have corruption here really doesn't matter in that context. Ireland is not being discussed here.