Tyranny

degrassinoel

Set in a world where the bad guy already won, this looks set to be the next best oldschool RPG

http://www.tyrannygame.com/

it's due out november 10th, anyone else getting it?

Kiith

I have a really hard time being a bad guy in games, so i don't think i'll be able to play this :P

ShiverinEskimo

Kiith wrote: »

I have a really hard time being a bad guy in games, so i don't think i'll be able to play this :P

I don't think you're necessarily the bad guy. More of a (reluctant?) member of the occupying force as such.

From some of the info it sounds like you can work toward fear or loyalty.

If it's anywhere near as good as Pillars of Eternity it'll get my hard earned.

degrassinoel

I'm hoping it has a more engrossing story than Pillows of Eternity (it made me fall asleep so often, that's no typo). But the style was great, combat was good, and all round it was very decent, just the story bored the ears off me.

Yeah from what i can tell, there's an evil overlord who's already taken over the world. And you're a judge dredd type party who's supposed to be putting down renegade groups, insurgents and rebels, ye know.. the good guys

Sounds novel anyway, i'll be picking it up myself.

Kiith

I also found the Pillars story pretty boring. Nothing about it really grabbed me, and i only managed to get to the point where you get the Stronghold. Was a shame, as i was really looking forward to it.

Had a look at a few youtube videos of this, and i'll probably pick it up as well.

ShiverinEskimo

Kiith wrote: »

I also found the Pillars story pretty boring. Nothing about it really grabbed me, and i only managed to get to the point where you get the Stronghold. Was a shame, as i was really looking forward to it.

Strangely enough it took me until the Stronghold to really get into it. After that it began clicking and the levelling got high enough to start to see real benefits and power. That coupled with companion quests beginning to open up was where it got the hooks into me.

I'd imagine Tyranny is a carbon copy of Pillars in terms of gameplay and engine with just a different slant on the background story.

degrassinoel

got a good write-up from pcgamer

ShiverinEskimo

Tyranny seems like it could be on the shorter side, as old-school RPGs go: you have eight days to fulfill an edict given to you by the overlord, and this quest hangs over your head from the very outset of the game. "Failing to resolve the terms of the Edict within the eight-day timeframe would end the game. Kyros doesn't play around when it comes to her Edicts," says Heins.

Don't like the mention of the 8 day time limit. I really hope that's not enforced in the game's day/night cycle or something.

Like playing these games at my own pace. No Iso RPG should feel rushed.

degrassinoel

I dunno, if they do it like the 150 days from fallout it could work, i guess it depends on how relative time is in the game

Kiith

Yeah, i've never liked time limits, especially in RPG's. Nothing worse than being forced through an area when you want to explore.

Zillah

ShiverinEskimo wrote: »

Don't like the mention of the 8 day time limit. I really hope that's not enforced in the game's day/night cycle or something.

Like playing these games at my own pace. No Iso RPG should feel rushed.

Sounds horrendous:
https://www.rockpapershotgun.com/2016/10/17/tyranny-preview-tiers/

Yes, it’s an actual time limit a la Fallout. Once you’ve read this edict, a counter pops up at the top of the screen informing you how many days are left until all life is extinguished. Time passes whenever you leave to go to a new area (a.k.a. when traveling), and if you don’t accomplish your goal before the eight days is up?

“The game ends,” said Heins. “If you are really good and know where to go you absolutely can do everything in that eight days, though it starts getting tight.”

“We wanted the replayability and playing different paths though, and having a time limit creates a sense of urgency that maybe you don’t want to do everything. And with Kyros and the Edicts,” he continued, “we wanted to add some visual presence. The time limit felt like a good way to show this is actually urgent.”

Artificially imposed limitations to force you to skip content. Great fcking plan, guys. What happens if you try to get everything done and you're just a little short on time to reach the final area? Is your game just completely fucked and you have to start all over again? Or start reloading older saves, from the last couple of days, trying to find one that will have enough time to reach the end?

I don't know how they've implemented it but it sounds utterly awful. What if I want to go back to an area, am I not allowed to retrace my steps without haemorrhaging precious time?

EDIT:
According to Reddit the time limit is just for the first act, which doesn't sound nearly as bad.

ShadowHearth

Looks interesting and like the idea....
Wait what? Time limit aka fallout? **** that, I am out.

thegame983

I'm sure it will be fine and the 8 days will be more than enough time to do everything you need to do. A time limit is more realistic anyway. It's a bit dumb where is a game where you have to save the world (or whatever) you then spend hours on end rooting through every drawer in some NPC's house

degrassinoel

Well, the first act is basically just setting the pace for the game. So yeah, the limit restricts how you start your game but may not be restricted beyond that act. That's the impression i got anyway.
It also allows for some replayability given that you're on a timer for the moral choices you've to make and the ramifications of those choices in later acts.

I think it's a good idea if they've done it like that.

Lone Stone

This is out tomorrow i think, anyone getting it ? Might grab it if i see it going cheap anywhere. i was watching a dev video and they said its not going to insanely long winded like pillars of eternity which is good to me because i got burned out trying to finish that game.

Grassey

Preloaded it last night. So hopefully get into it on Friday.

Actually revisted PoE recently to finish it off. A year long gap was just what it needed!

degrassinoel

Lone Stone wrote: »

This is out tomorrow i think, anyone getting it ? Might grab it if i see it going cheap anywhere. i was watching a dev video and they said its not going to insanely long winded like pillars of eternity which is good to me because i got burned out trying to finish that game.

tossup between this and space hulk deathwing

YouSavedMyLife

Ill be picking this up tomorrow. I hope max party size is smaller this time around. The one thing i disliked about PoE was micromanaging spells from 4 different spellcasters :mad: Don't know how many times i read and re-read over Wizard and Priest spells to find out what they do only to forget and have to read again during the next fight i get in. Having a tonne of spells is cool and all, but man can it be overwhelming at times...

Lone Stone

ugh i caved and got it, i just hope i dont get another huge vet bill >_< What class type are you peeps thinking of going with ?

ShiverinEskimo

YouSavedMyLife wrote: »

Don't know how many times i read and re-read over Wizard and Priest spells to find out what they do only to forget and have to read again during the next fight i get in. Having a tonne of spells is cool and all, but man can it be overwhelming at times...

This. Ended up sticking to a reliable few that I know did damage or buffed to suit nearly all situations. Probably missed out on a ton of effective spells better suited to certain enemies but I had neither the knowledge nor the patience to micro-manage them all across 4 characters.

Save

Zillah

ShiverinEskimo wrote: »

This. Ended up sticking to a reliable few that I know did damage or buffed to suit nearly all situations. Probably missed out on a ton of effective spells better suited to certain enemies but I had neither the knowledge nor the patience to micro-manage them all across 4 characters.

Save

You're in direct control of four characters? I suppose, given that BG2 had you in control of the entire party that makes sense; just seems odd and very micro-managy for a modern game.

Lone Stone

Zillah wrote: »

You're in direct control of four characters? I suppose, given that BG2 had you in control of the entire party that makes sense; just seems odd and very micro-managy for a modern game.

Well bg1 & 2 had party ai you could turn on, i think they added that to pillars in a patch at some stage i might be wrong tho. Looking forward to this game though i dont usually go the bad guy route my morals are just to dam do goodery but il try kill some babies if i have to.

Kiith

Yeah, Pillars added party AI a few patches ago, though i've not tried it myself. For some reason i never had any issue micro-managing 6 characters in BG2, but found it much more frustrating in Pillars.

It may be nostalgia speaking though...since BG2 was the best isometric RPG ever (even ahead of Planescape for me)

Lone Stone

Kiith wrote: »

Yeah, Pillars added party AI a few patches ago, though i've not tried it myself. For some reason i never had any issue micro-managing 6 characters in BG2, but found it much more frustrating in Pillars.

It may be nostalgia speaking though...since BG2 was the best isometric RPG ever (even ahead of Planescape for me)

i loved bg2 but just haven't ever played a isometric game that grabbed me as much as fallout 2 i replayed that game like 20 time's there was so many different ways to go about things in it, I tried Planescape with mods to get it working but it just crashed far to often for me to stick with it but definitly looking forward the sequel coming up. Anywho the game is live now woop gonna give it a bash.

YouSavedMyLife

Just started up the game and i'm currently in the conquest section of the game. Its a really nice feature that lets you almost create the world state leading up to the start of the game! It really helps with the world building compared to PoE where you are thrown in at the deep end and have gods, cultures, races and places thrown at you from all angles.

I made a Throwing Weapons / Atrophy character. Surprised there was no Fire Magic school and the lack of a Dagger rogue archetype was absent..

Lone Stone

I started with a fist's unarmed kinda guy but he did terrible dmg then i made a two handed guy and the dmg was crazy, Just made someone plead fielty to me that was an unexpected outcome but cool

Grassey

Just finished first act. The level of zoom in is annoying, as is the size of some of the game maps.

Enjoying it other than that. Seem to be pissing off everyone!

Zillah

I played a couple of hours last night; I'm quite enjoying it. Character generation was pretty great, I have never seen anything like the Conquering segment - it's so simple and clever, could have been done in BG1.

At first I was very disappointed by the combat; it seems very bland and formulaic, but once I started designing my own spells it got much more interesting. It stills feels oddly robotic compared to the old infinity games' frantic one-hit gibbs, but it's growing on me. Magic crafting system is cool. It's no where near as open and dynamic as, say, Morrowind - you're more unlocking all the variations of a catalogue of spells than anything - but it is nice being able to customise.

Writing is really good in a way Pillars lacked. It feels more confident, more balanced, better planned; it gels a lot more. You can tell they weren't adding chunks to the game depending on how well a Kickstarter campaign was going. They went to a lot of effort giving you special dialogue based on your character background, the decisions you make during the Conquer phase, and your character traits. Plenty of opportunities to lie or intimidate, and everyone isn't a whiny little bitch if you say something slightly confrontational. Time will tell how well they handle your character and their relationship to the evil empire they work for; so far it's been a little shallow - I haven't had any opportunity to explore my loyalties or what motivates me.

I like the idea of combos but their style doesn't really make sense. I'm playing someone with lots of points in lightning magic and not much else, yet my combo with the first partymember is for her to knock them onto the ground and my feeble wizard character to smash them in the face for huge crushing damage while they're down. Eh, ok. It's useful but seems wildly out of character.

Not a huge fan of fantasy worlds that don't make any strong distinction between people who use magic and those who can't; it all seems to be based on Lore skill, so anyone can do a bit of magic if they want. I much prefer when magic is something discreet and special, but it's not a big deal.

One of my favourite things about Planescape was the emphasis on the value of Intelligence and Wisdom - in this all of the main attributes seem to be combat related, so you can't make a character with an emphasis on intuition and brilliance. You ability to interact with people like that is dependent on Athletics (usually intimidation), Lore, and Subterfuge - which constantly increase as you play. Somehow it feels a lot less like something inherent to your character.

The voice acting is a little rough. Like, they sound genuine, but it's all very 1980's Conan sort of stuff. Which is very reminiscent of the sort of cheese you'd have seen in BG1 and Icewind Dale and the like, but I feel that is one aspect of modern gaming that should be adopted: characters with decent, non-cheesy voices.

Early days; its flaws might grow exponentially

Zillah

Update:
I am enjoying combat a lot more as the magic system differentiates spells from regular attacks more and more. At the start they just felt like flashy attacks that did nothing more than normal attacks, but now that I've access to stuff that has an area effect, can stun or paralyse etc, it feels a lot more like wizardry.

Issues around the role of the player character are becoming more prominent. There still haven't been any opportunities to explore your attitude to the Overlord and the empire; no way to discuss your motivations: am I an evil and ambitious man? Am I too afraid to defy or fail Kyros and her minions? Am I a fanatic of the cult of Kyros? Who knows, so far it doesn't seem to matter.

Overall story remains quite interesting; good pacing, decent player agency. I have one huge pet peeve, where a big decision of A or B comes up, and if you dare to even suggest there could be a compromise between A and B (I have the diplomat background, it sounds reasonable) the game slaps you in the face, calls you an idiot and forces you to choose. Especially annoying given that there was almost exactly this same situation in the Conquer backstory where I successfully compromised between A and B.

Lone Stone

just completed the first spire part, around the start of the game. That some freaking awesome evil guy stuff i could do really enjoying it so far. Better than pillars so far for me. Mostly because its less drawn out very nicely paced.

degrassinoel

Yeah, agreed with that, the story is actually very engaging - completed the first act last night.

It's only similar to Pillars in overall style.

The spells and how they work actually make me want to roll a magic user, as my rogue archer has been upping her lore skills to use some of the early game heals and bolt spells - love that ye can rename them to mad stuff too, though i'm stuck in WoW frame of mind with names.

YouSavedMyLife

Anyone know how to remove spells and abilities from the action bar? Its driving me nuts, i want to be neat!

degrassinoel

i'd like to know that too, it's all a massive cluster of stuff i don't want on there at all

YouSavedMyLife

degrassinoel wrote: »

i'd like to know that too, it's all a massive cluster of stuff i don't want on there at all

I figured a clever way to clear the slots. Put an item in a quick slot in the inventory menu, then from the gameplay HUD click the quick item button and assign said quick item to all slots. It will replace and remove the skill and then you have a clean action bar ready to customize!

On another note i just cleared the first act. Game is really good, enjoying it alot more than PoE. The story and world feels much more contained as well as the combat and the 4 man party system.

Kiith

Is it as short as some people were worried it would be? Tempted to pick it up this week, as i'm starved of a good RPG.

Grassey

Some review I read had the main story arc at 30 hours.

I'm about 10 hours in and still feel like I'm scratching the surface. Probably the only game in a long time where I'm looking forward to replaying straight after finishing to make different choices.

ShiverinEskimo

Rock, Paper, Shotgun early review said the time limit on the start of the game didn't effect him having a slow playthrough and that so he reckons the 25 hour campaign is only for those that fly through the main quest - that there's enough for a lot more time.

https://www.rockpapershotgun.com/2016/11/10/tyranny-review-in-progress/

There’s a counter at the top of the screen, and it gently pulses to remind you of the urgency. In Hayden’s preview last month, he was told how it was tough to get everything done in that time, and that the game would simply end if you ran out. I finished every bit of it, every side quest too, with six days left on the clock. It didn’t work at all.

Which brings me back to how I play these things. I can’t leave anything unturned. If I had a lick of sense I’d have burned through the main quest to reach the end, and written this review after that. But I can’t. I can’t leave conversations unspoken, side-quests unfulfilled, details not understood. And so the hours clock up and up, which is great for the game, rubbish for getting a review finished on time. (I’m going to keep playing, and write a follow-up piece.) Given that the time limits don’t threaten even when playing like that, it’s clear that something hasn’t quite worked.

degrassinoel

Kiith wrote: »

Is it as short as some people were worried it would be? Tempted to pick it up this week, as i'm starved of a good RPG.

depends on how much you read, if you're just skimming the dialogues, i'd say it's a lot shorter. The dialogues are really good though, i'm barely past act 1 and i've racked up 25 hours since launch (also rerolled once)

Zillah

Kiith wrote: »

Is it as short as some people were worried it would be? Tempted to pick it up this week, as i'm starved of a good RPG.

I'm taking my time - though I'm not being exhaustive I just discovered from talking to a friend last night and hearing all the stuff I missed - and I am 28 hours in and just near the end of Act 2. I wouldn't put any stock in people saying the campaign is short. If they wanted to zoom through it ASAP I don't know why they're even playing a game like this.

It lacks a bit of a sense of scale compared to some isometric games. You don't go to other dimensions, there's no underdark; as far as I've seen there's nothing outside of the main play area, so it can lead to a bit of a sense that the world isn't all that big. I think that's also compounded by the fact that the map is so, I dunno, minimalistic? You don't see trees and forests the way you did on the map in BG2, say, so you don't get much of a sense of it being a big area - though you take days to get around so it's not small in that sense.

YouSavedMyLife

14 hours in near the start of Act 2 and im doing all side quests available to me. Reading all dialogue and "lore links" of people and places mentioned in conversation. I'm using slow mode in combat 100% of the time but i don't know if that would effect overall game time.

In most game's im compelled to follow my own morals and act how i would if i was faced with the same decision, but this game has taken a hold over me and im roleplaying it like a ruthless badass. In most games generally people want to recruit all companions so they can experience all the content but I murdered a possible companion because they crossed me and i don't feel like im missing anything by not having them around. It feels.........good...

Act 1

I also tucked a message into a persons gauntlet and kicked them off the spire because i wanted to deliver a message to the people below. Feels so good

degrassinoel

pro tip : don't slap beastwomen, that is all.

Zillah

YouSavedMyLife wrote: »

Act 1

I also tucked a message into a persons gauntlet and kicked them off the spire because i wanted to deliver a message to the people below. Feels so good

By far my favourite moment in the game so far. I could not resist, despite having not been playing it all that viciously up to that point.

Grassey

degrassinoel wrote:

pro tip : don't slap beastwomen, that is all.

Or ask her to wash herself

YouSavedMyLife

degrassinoel wrote: »

pro tip : don't slap beastwomen, that is all.

I also slapped her then refused her aid. Was disappointed i hadn't have the option to finish her there and then, maybe she plays a part later in the story

degrassinoel

YouSavedMyLife wrote: »

I also slapped her then refused her aid. Was disappointed i hadn't have the option to finish her there and then, maybe she plays a part later in the story

The one in the blade grave

?


Haven't had this much fun in an rpg in ages, the choices are brilliant and ye can be as evil as anything killing npc's left right and centre

Lone Stone

Bit disappointed in what you actually do with the towers so far also it keeps telling me i dont have enough forge apprentices in one of them =/ Apart from that really enjoying it so far, 3 spires down.

Kiith

Bought it last night after you were all so positive about it, and really enjoying it. Only played a few hours, and got to where I

issued the edict to the two Archon's, and the 8 day timer has started. Hopefully it won't rush me that much, as i've never been great with hurrying through RPG's like this.

The Conquest intro is excellent. Can't wait to play some more tonight.

Zillah

Kiith wrote: »

issued the edict to the two Archon's, and the 8 day timer has started. Hopefully it won't rush me that much, as i've never been great with hurrying through RPG's like this.

It can be done in a day or two; I wasn't rushing at all. If you keep taking wounds and keep having to sleep to heal them that might eventually push the timer.

Finished it last night. Boy is Act 3 short compared to the others. Like, in terms of time, I'd say maybe 2 hours? And it took me 30 to go through the other two. I'd guess 10-20-2 is the hourly breakdown for my game, roughly.

Slightly dubious about the ending; not sure everything quite lined up. Like,

Tunon bent the knee rather abruptly; not sure I even had a chance to demand it

. I was really happy that I was able to

make Ashe submit, because it made a huge amount of sense given how close I was to the Disfavored; I really didn't want to have to kill him

.

Magic ends up outlandishly overpowered by the end of the game. Nothing was a threat any more. There are accents that let you fire two projectiles instead of one, and each one has the full effect of, say, bouncing between four targets, and it creates an area explosion with every impact. So you fire off one Rimespike spell and you get eight explosions. At least that what it seems like, it's hard to keep track amongst all the chaos. I definitely saw a similarly designed force spell bounce back and forth between two remaining targets until it was exhausted. T'was hilarious.

I'm starting a new game with an unarmed ninja monk-wizard and playing on Hard; see if that makes a difference.

Dave_The_Sheep

Started this last night. Really impressed with the Conquest intro section, I really liked how that was done. Went for a pit fighter turned war advisor with the Scarlet Chorus myself, tried to end the war without that many casualties on my own side, but keeping true to the Overlord's Laws.

I really like it in that it's given me a definite idea of who my character is and what she'll do / say during the game, and it seems that there's no real downside to being a bit of a prick if that's what's called for. There are very few games where being the evil character actually gets rewards, and your companions stick around.

I'm curious as to how much the game changes depending on your choices during conquest ... yes, I can see my self starting again once I'm done just to see how things are the same/different.

Really enjoying it so far.

Side note, the little explanations of concepts and places and people in the dialogue options is an exceptionally good quality of life improvement. So simple, we wonder why it was never done before.

Lone Stone

Just finished it, That was a great game have to say. Loved the old school style to the ending. Has me eager to start a new game.

degrassinoel

Just finished it myself there now too, went disfavored all the way - Act 3 was good, and that's definitely getting a sequel! DLC Expansion or Sequel anyway