Senior gardaí ‘tried to destroy’ whistleblower

My name is URL

http://www.irishexaminer.com/ireland/senior-gardai-tried-to-destroy-source-424048.html

Two senior gardaí have made statements under whistleblower legislation alleging that senior garda management conducted a major campaign to “destroy” a whistleblower within the force.

The disclosures detail a number of different strands to the campaign, which was conducted over a number of years.

These include:

• Generating hundreds of text messages which were disseminated among a large group of officers with the instructions to attack the whistleblower’s character;
• The creation of an intelligence file on the whistleblower;
• The deployment of an officer to monitor the activity of the whistleblower on Pulse, the Garda computer system;
• The briefing of elements of the media about the whistleblower, laying emphasis on entirely false allegations about the whistleblower’s character;
• The briefing of selected politicians in a similar vein.

Seems like a serious and orchestrated campaign by Garda management. I wonder if heads will roll over this. Unsurprising to see the incestuous relationship that gardai, politicians and the media have come to light.

No doubt the usual lot be along to defend or downplay the seriousness of this.

Birneybau

There was another article about the same topic I read over the weekend. The whistleblower was walking into the station and was stopped by a fellow guard. 'Ah, here, where are you going? Sure you're finished' or something to that effect.

Samaris

Poor guy (or woman, whoever it was). Over a number of -years-? It'd be driving most people out of their minds within a month.

hatrickpatrick

Nothing remotely surprising about this, unfortunately. What would be very (pleasantly) surprising would be if anybody in the senior echelons of the Gardaí, or indeed the DOJ if they were involved, actually suffers meaningful consequences.

Don't forget that it took no less than four consecutive scandals over a period of at least five - six months to claim the resignations of Martin Callinan and Alan Shatter. Unfortunately in Ireland, just like in most of the world it seems, senior people do not face accountability without a fight.

My name is URL

Birneybau wrote: »

There was another article about the same topic I read over the weekend. The whistleblower was walking into the station and was stopped by a fellow guard. 'Ah, here, where are you going? Sure you're finished' or something to that effect.

There was also that time when a whistleblower had a dead rat nailed to his front door. Ugly nasty stuff

Certain elements within the gardai simply see themselves as being above the law, and anyone wanting to see that culture ended; as an enemy.

I doubt this will cement public support for them, in their threatened strike actions.

Your Face

Unacceptable behavior if allegations are true.

jmayo

If all thigns were equal and the allegations can be proven the whistleblower should sue the ar** off the individuals, the AGS and dept of justice.

Problem with that is, the state usually threaten plaintiffs with never ending legal fees and force them to give up.
And what will be done to those who have already left the force.

I always thought it would be nice to have a little piece of legislation added in Ireland where if it is subsequently found that retirees in receipt of a state pension (and the usual lump sum) have broken the law or abused their position while in the employ of the state, they lose their pension, have to repay any pension already received and any lump sums received.

For a start something like that would have recouped millions from haughey, burke, and probably a host of others we hardly hear of.

Joshua J

lol Laws are for the plebs only. Do people actually still think otherwise?.

Ted111

jmayo wrote: »

Problem with that is, the state usually threaten plaintiffs with never ending legal fees and force them to give up.

The tactic they actually use is to contest all the way because it often takes over ten years for it to get to court. They've all retired. It's not their money that's in jeopardy it's yours and mine. They don't give a fck.

Alf Stewart.

The govt have a threat of an all out garda strike hanging over them for several days next month from the Gards.

Info like this emerges before the strike.

Conveniently.

My name is URL

Alf Stewart. wrote: »

The govt have a threat of an all out garda strike hanging over them for several days next month from the Gards.

Info like this emerges before the strike.

Conveniently.

The fact that whistleblowers were targeted and had their characters tarnished by false allegations has has been well known for 2 years or more. It's just because 2 gardai have now officially made disclosures that it's in the news again.

Nothing to do with government. In fact it could be as damaging for them and the Dept. of Justice as it is for Gardai.

Alf Stewart.

My name is URL wrote: »

The fact that whistleblowers were targeted and had their characters tarnished by false allegations has has been well known for 2 years or more. It's just because 2 gardai have now officially made disclosures that it's in the news again.

I'm just deeply cynical as to just how low this government could stoop, the last one had been engaging in divide and conquer tactics since its beginning, I expect no less from this one.

Nothing to do with government. In fact it could be as damaging for them and the Dept. of Justice as it is for Gardai.

Shatter has already been fallen on his sword, I can't see Fitzgerald taking any rap for Shatter/Callinans exploits.

As I said, I'd put nothing past them.

cursai

Whistleblowers........people are conned easily.

HensVassal

My name is URL wrote: »

http://www.irishexaminer.com/ireland/senior-gardai-tried-to-destroy-source-424048.html



Seems like a serious and orchestrated campaign by Garda management. I wonder if heads will roll over this. Unsurprising to see the incestuous relationship that gardai, politicians and the media have come to light.

No doubt the usual lot be along to defend or downplay the seriousness of this.

Just like US cops are putting their lives on the line each day to keep people safe (nevermind that you have a better chance of dying on the job as a construction worker or farmer) and should be allowed to shoot dead anyone they want, Gardai have to deal with "scumbags" everyday so should be given a pass when it comes to wrecking the life of someone who might expose corruption and malfeasance.

SEPT 23 1989

for their own good they need the RUC treatment

My name is URL

My name is URL wrote: »

I wonder if heads will roll over this.

This is where several gifs of hysterical laughter should be put.

Mr. Incognito

http://www.broadsheet.ie/2016/05/26/maurice-mccabe-and-the-plastic-rat/

biko

Bastards management guards for orchestrating this.
And bastard low-level regular guards for joining in. Cowards.

Fair play to the two guards that came forward and exposed the whole thing, well done!

steddyeddy

Low lives.

jmayo

The thing is this doesn't just lie with Callinan.
Who was one of his chief subordinates, but none other than the now Commissioner.

They should have gone for an outside person, but no this is Ireland where one of the insiders has to get it.
See how that worked out for the Central Bank and for indeed our entire banking system.

_Kaiser_

I've said it before, but we need a complete clear-out and dismantling/rebuilding of the Gardai from the ground up.. the rot is too deep and widespread for the organisation to be saved. This is only the latest in a series of similar scandals that goes back decades.

We don't have a professional police force in this country. We have a keystone cops brigade where good people (on both sides) are victimised so the status quo can be maintained.

mynamejeff

HensVassal wrote: »

Just like US cops are putting their lives on the line each day to keep people safe (nevermind that you have a better chance of dying on the job as a construction worker or farmer) and should be allowed to shoot dead anyone they want, Gardai have to deal with "scumbags" everyday so should be given a pass when it comes to wrecking the life of someone who might expose corruption and malfeasance.

how many scumbags do you think senior garda management deal with every day ?

this isnt a story about the man or woman on the beat. this is a story about management of the ranks above superintendent which are politically appointed thus tend towards corruption.

for my money a uk style police management by qualified civilian staff would be a good step

also Michael Clifford has a consistently anti garda agenda which is often ill informed inaccurate and needlessly provocative.

m5ex9oqjawdg2i

HensVassal wrote: »

Just like US cops are putting their lives on the line each day to keep people safe (nevermind that you have a better chance of dying on the job as a construction worker or farmer) and should be allowed to shoot dead anyone they want, Gardai have to deal with "scumbags" everyday so should be given a pass when it comes to wrecking the life of someone who might expose corruption and malfeasance.

You have just suggested lawlessness. Not sure if you are narrating the OP or if this is your opinion. If it's the later, never hold a position of power....

seamus

This is great. This is an illustration that a real desire for change is starting to get a foothold within the force. The hardest part of attacking corruption and the "old boys club" of any organisation is breaking the unspoken and institutional processes that tend to poison the minds of new members.

New members are never going to go against the flow, and once they've been "educated" on "how things are", they become complicit in these nefarious activities and start defending them.

That two senior Gardai are now coming out in defence of another whistleblower, who I'll presume is probably Maurice McCabe, shows that this attitude is beginning to break down; that more and more Gardai want to route out this corruption and more and more are willing to come forward.

Whether there are any actual repercussions is somewhat a side-issue here; the more decent Gardai who are willing to stand up and blow that whistle, the fewer bad apples there will be who are willing to be blatant about what they're doing.

All forces have corruption; the aim should be to retreat this corruption into quiet corners and catch it when it happens; not to promote it and allow it to be endorsed from the top.

Water John

Mick Clifford is a top class journalist. The Examiner would not run his reportage unless they were absolutely sure of him.
Attacking Mick is pathetic and has form on previous threads.
The culture within the Gardai has to be deconstructed and rebuilt, similar to what was done with the PSNI.
This has been obvious since the Donegal fiasco. What's that 10/15 years ago.

Has any Govn't the liathriodi to do it?

martingriff

Whole wide change is needed in the guards is needed now the name itself is ruined which is sad for the honest working cops out there. I was not 1 bit surprised (appalled yes) when i saw this. What ever job you are if you are seen as a whistleblower your more than likely will leave the job your in.

I remember watch an episode of aircraft investigation and a crash had happened due to repairs not been done and falsifying records. A guy came out as a whistleblower was put on administrative leave by company. Eventually won a case on harrassment but never worked in the industry itself.

I know its America but i am sure its the same in most countries. Unless the whistleblower remains not known it will happen

cursai

these people do not seem to be legitimate whistleblowers. None of the allegations they have made have proved real. The penalty points one was known by everyone. THey seem to me to be disgruntled employees and itd be interesting to know about their work histories. i bet they have very dodgy records themselves.
Although i do agree the force needs to modernised and outside agencies managing it. For modernising reasons not for the reasons the anti-authority, angry attentioin seeking brigade are giving.

Floppybits

It takes an awful lot of courage by these Garda whistleblowers to do what they have done. To go against the entire force knowing what is going to happen to them.
I reckon the 2 officers that have come forward are more about protecting their own arses now that they have seen the way the wind is blowing.
The only solution is a clear out of the top brass and for people from the outside with no ties to anyone in the country be put in place.
On another note as a country we do need stronger legislation where wrong doing or negligence in a role has taken place. This should that person loose all entitlements that they have received in that role. I bet that would make some of the people in those roles concentrate better.

expectationlost

could these two be the gardai who were on tape trying and are trying to save their own necks now?

Floppybits

expectationlost wrote: »

could these two be the gardai who were on tape trying and are trying to save their own necks now?

that's what I think they are doing. This is not done out of some sense of justice, this is just a save our arses measure.

Your Face

expectationlost wrote: »

could these two be the gardai who were on tape trying and are trying to save their own necks now?

That was my first thought.
Could be rats leaving a sinking ship.

Ted111

cursai wrote: »

these people do not seem to be legitimate whistleblowers.

If they had nothing to say then their bosses wouldn't have made them intelligence targets. That by the way could mean anything up to and including monitoring internet and phone calls, gps tracking movements, watching them at home and other settings.

Your making the assumption that it is mccabe and wilson. There were and are a number of others.

Regardless of any revelations in and of themselves the sanctioning and actioning of illegal surveillance of these employees should get these people sacked and before the criminal courts.

toptom

An Garda Síochána are a credit to this country, Our bravest and our best so this nonsense about them being corrupt is just that, Nonsense. Every workplace has a few bad apples people who step out of line etc The guards are no different.

Your Face

toptom wrote: »

An Garda S och na are a credit to this country, Our bravest and our best so this nonsense about them being corrupt is just that, Nonsense. Every workplace has a few bad apples people who step out of line etc The guards are no different.

Sorry Garda

Water John

Don't know, but they seem to be at reasonably high level.
One accepts though disapproves that informal downing of someone not marching to the one beat of all organisations, workplaces etc.
Here it is the systematic nature of it that is very troubling.
This is the equivalent of bullying being not only condoned but being encouraged.

This is not about looking for a head again, in the great words of Ruari Quinn.
Radical overhaul for the good of the police force and ourselves.

Hopefully, Tomtom has his/her tongue in their cheek.

Floppybits

toptom wrote: »

An Garda S och na are a credit to this country, Our bravest and our best so this nonsense about them being corrupt is just that, Nonsense. Every workplace has a few bad apples people who step out of line etc The guards are no different.

[font=Georgia, Arial, Verdana, sans-serif]Noiron is that you? [/font]

Water John

Ask Denis Bradley to come up with a whole renewal programme for the Gardai.

toptom

Floppybits wrote: »

[font=Georgia, Arial, Verdana, sans-serif]Noiron is that you? [/font]

No Im just a person sick of seeing the gardaí being treated as wrongdoers.

golfball37

The commissioner who should have never been appointed in the first place simply has to go now. She was well aware of this carry on and along with the findings in Fennelly about her knowledge of other things, she hasn't a leg to stand on anymore.

if the govt don't back calls for her to go then we confirm Ireland as nothing more than an old boys club.

Ted111

golfball37 wrote: »

The commissioner who should have never been appointed in the first place simply has to go now. She was well aware of this carry on and along with the findings in Fennelly about her knowledge of other things, she hasn't a leg to stand on anymore.

if the govt don't back calls for her to go then we confirm Ireland as nothing more than an old boys club.

Noirin and Frances. Peas in a pod. And the supposedly independent Inspectorate.
After initially deciding to question her about promoting her husband they then rolled over and accepted it placidly. They're part of the same cosy cartel.

Water John

The Gardai operate on behalf of the people. They also operate with the consent and goodwill of the same people. This is being discarded and good Gardai on the ground are the ones that will suffer that loss.

Muahahaha

Water John wrote: »

Mick Clifford is a top class journalist. The Examiner would not run his reportage unless they were absolutely sure of him.
Attacking Mick is pathetic and has form on previous threads.
The culture within the Gardai has to be deconstructed and rebuilt, similar to what was done with the PSNI.
This has been obvious since the Donegal fiasco. What's that 10/15 years ago.

Has any Govn't the liathriodi to do it?

There was a good point made on VinB last night that successive Ministers of Justice have known well about the problems at the top level of the Gardai for decades now but not one has had the balls to grab the nettle and truly reform it. Indeed Alan Shatter fell on his sword for the very reason that he did nothing until his position became untenable. The point that was being made is that senior management in the Gardai are much like the permanent govt in that they know Ministers of Justice come and go while they stay in their positions and the rotten culture that has bedded in continues ad infintum.

But even when Ministers for Justice do have the opportunity to reform they cock that up too. Fitzgerald had the chance to bypass Noirin OSullivan and appoint an outsider as Commissioner, someone with international experience at police force reform. But instead she chose the insider who is now just carrying on the rotten culture at the top that she inherited from Callinan. Then on top of that we have no less that three oversight bodies for the Gardai and yet none of them have been given enough legislative powers to actually regulate them properly.

seamus

golfball37 wrote: »

The commissioner who should have never been appointed in the first place simply has to go now. She was well aware of this carry on and along with the findings in Fennelly about her knowledge of other things, she hasn't a leg to stand on anymore.

How do you know she was well aware of it?

Hilarious in Irish politics. You get appointed last week and then get blamed for something which happened 3 years ago and people call for you to resign because of it.

I do understand people raising eyebrows about the commissioner, considering she would have been senior when this was going on.

But Clare Daly calling for the justice minister to stand down? These people are fncking idiots.

Water John

Responsibility rests with those in authority at any given time.
Sacking the next round won't achieve much or just about the same as the last time.
Complete revamp of its culture is what is required. Not a cosmetic solution.

Ted111

seamus wrote: »

How do you know she was well aware of it?

If she wasn't aware then that would suggest that she was not in control of her police force i.e incompetent. She is usually out with her big smiley face telling everyone that whistle blowers are valued and encouraged. Is she making those remarks based on fact or is she blind and ignorant hidden in an office not knowing what's going on but dreaming up wishful thinking.
This was a national issue and a priority one issue in her remit this year.
So she is either complicit or incompetent.
In any event certainly a resignation matter.
Also a matter for the DPP. The surveillance carried out by these senior officers on their own employees sounds criminal.

seamus

Ted111 wrote: »

If she wasn't aware then that would suggest that she was not in control of her police force i.e incompetent.

Not necessarily. She was only appointed in November 2014 and the allegations go back "a number of years". So they might well have been happening 5 or 6 years before she even got a sniff of the commissioner's position.

And when appointed, the perpetrators are hardly going to go and tell her all about what they're doing.

This is why jumping to conclusions and immediately calling for heads on spikes is ridiculous. For all we know, the next person who'd be appointed Commissioner is the ringleader of this alleged activity and they're being handed the top spot on a plate.

_Kaiser_

seamus wrote: »

Not necessarily. She was only appointed in November 2014 and the allegations go back "a number of years". So they might well have been happening 5 or 6 years before she even got a sniff of the commissioner's position.

And when appointed, the perpetrators are hardly going to go and tell her all about what they're doing.

This is why jumping to conclusions and immediately calling for heads on spikes is ridiculous. For all we know, the next person who'd be appointed Commissioner is the ringleader of this alleged activity and they're being handed the top spot on a plate.

Didn't O'Sullivan come from a HR background within AGS? Pretty poor reflection on her ability in that role as well then.

But it's no surprise that this behaviour has apparently continued under her watch. After all, she sat by her former boss while he called whistleblowers "disgusting" and was appointed by a Minister who herself was appointed (besides for being a Kenny loyalist) to settle things down within AGS after the Callinan/Shatter mess

Hibrasil

Muahahaha wrote: »

But even when Ministers for Justice do have the opportunity to reform they cock that up too. Fitzgerald had the chance to bypass Noirin OSullivan and appoint an outsider as Commissioner, someone with international experience at police force reform. But instead she chose the insider who is now just carrying on the rotten culture at the top that she inherited from Callinan..

Sorry to say but what do you expect from a Dublin 4 (Dublin South East) electoral "reject" who was parachuted into Dublin Mid-West and uses a D22 (Clondalkin) address on the ballot paper while living in Dublin 15 (Castleknock).
And brings Kenneth Egan on board to play a suporting role.

The gender factor was probably a factor in the decision making process.

Water John

Ah, she's tipped for next Taoiseach.

mynamejeff

im sure the people Francis worked for in social care have glowing reports :-)

Floppybits

toptom wrote: »

Floppybits wrote: »

[font=Georgia, Arial, Verdana, sans-serif]Noiron is that you? [/font]

No Im just a person sick of seeing the garda being treated as wrongdoers.

You are either having a laugh or are trying to be a WUM.
You maybe sick of Gardai being treated as wrong doers but their carry on in Donegal, their treatment of the whistle blowers and now with these current revelations about how senior Gardai behaved has hardly done their reputation any favours, now has it?