Cork train delayed at Limerick Junction

savagethegoat

not fast enough, I can do it quicker in the car without breaking the limit

Del.Monte

savagethegoat wrote: »

not fast enough, I can do it quicker in the car without breaking the limit

In 1999 Dublin/Cork could be done in 2 hours 17minutes - that's progress CIE style. For as long as I've been interested in railways (c.1978) CIE have been 'upgrading' the Dublin/Cork line and what's to show for it.

dowlingm

Perception of how late is acceptable does vary.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Delay_certificate

in Ireland, well...

tabbey

Del.Monte wrote: »

In 1999 Dublin/Cork could be done in 2 hours 17minutes - that's progress CIE style. For as long as I've been interested in railways (c.1978) CIE have been 'upgrading' the Dublin/Cork line and what's to show for it.

In 1968, I read in a newspaper how Continously Welded Rail then being introduced would lead to a Dublin - Cork journey time of 1 hour, 50 minutes. This was based on an average speed of 90 mph. (110 minutes / 165 miles)
The journalist had clearly assumed maximum speed to be synonymous with average speed. Nevertheless, some degree of CIE propaganda was probably a factor in this article.

trellheim

not fast enough, I can do it quicker in the car without breaking the limit

You can not do Kent-Heuston in sub 2 hours in a car legally.

It is 257 km according to Google via M7, M8 . At 120kph the whole way you will still arrive 17 km short after 2 hours. ( No allowance made for traffic , tolls, non 120kph zones etc etc etc ).

savagethegoat

trellheim wrote: »

You can not do Kent-Heuston in sub 2 hours in a car legally.

It is 257 km according to Google via M7, M8 . At 120kph the whole way you will still arrive 17 km short after 2 hours. ( No allowance made for traffic , tolls, non 120kph zones etc etc etc ).

no one does that journey....

my own particular journey would be Mallow to Heuston which means 20 mins drive to station 20 mins to park and buy ticket, wait for train, almost 2 hours on train,10 minutes walk to LUAS /taxi rank/ bus stop (x) amount of time to destination. Result: car all the way would be quicker, not to mention cheaper.

trellheim

Cork to Heuston is assumed to be Kent-Heuston. If you had meant Mallow you should have said so.

Taxi from centre of Mallow to Station : 5/6 minutes , collect online ticket 5 mins wait for train 5 mins , 1:45 on train, approx 2 hours . As someone who regularly drops and picks up people from Mallow Stn I know this is all you need to do.

It is exactly 240km from Mallow centre to Heuston Station and don't tell me you can do Mallow-Heuston in less than the 2'32'' that Google suggests without breaking the limit, the N73 between Kildorrery and Mallow is crapola, I must drive from near Heuston to near Mallow about 10 times a year and 2'45' to 3 is about right going M7 and M8, M7/M20 is slower.

Lets get some reality into the discussion.

Also I know several people who drive from Cork City to Dub centre cos they can't be arsed to prise themselves out of the motors.

Train is a bit - but not a lot - more expensive, if you don't book in advance.

IE 222

Can a new station be built at L JCT between the direct curve and waterford line and a second platform on the down cork line. A turn back could be put in the middle of the direct curve and waterford platform and im sure some points could be saved and put a direct connection onto waterford line from main cork. Make a much simpler operation as well.

Jamie2k9

IE 222 wrote: »

Can a new station be built at L JCT between the direct curve and waterford line and a second platform on the down cork line. A turn back could be put in the middle of the direct curve and waterford platform and im sure some points could be saved and put a direct connection onto waterford line from main cork. Make a much simpler operation as well.

Limerick J has lots of room but such investment wouldn't be warranted. If IE want to build platforms to cut journey times I have a list of where they can start.

man98

IE 222 wrote: »

Can a new station be built at L JCT between the direct curve and waterford line and a second platform on the down cork line. A turn back could be put in the middle of the direct curve and waterford platform and im sure some points could be saved and put a direct connection onto waterford line from main cork. Make a much simpler operation as well.

To be honest, there's land there to build a down platform for Cork as well as building a curve from the Waterford line so the train from Waterford need not waste time with the driver having to move cabs, it's disgraceful it hasn't been done already and it's reflective of IÉ's lack of concern about that line.

IE 222

Wouldn't be just cutting times it offers more free movements, better services and more safety overall. Current set up strangles connections. Would there be much demand for a clonmel - Dublin service even one that splits from a direct limerick or cork. Waterford services could run limerick shuttle as well with new layout.

On a separate note I think L JCT could offer a brilliant freight hub as well and transfer freight department from limerick to the JCT.

Del.Monte

IE 222 wrote: »

Wouldn't be just cutting times it offers more free movements, better services and more safety overall. Current set up strangles connections. Would there be much demand for a clonmel - Dublin service even one that splits from a direct limerick or cork. Waterford services could run limerick shuttle as well with new layout.

On a separate note I think L JCT could offer a brilliant freight hub as well and transfer freight department from limerick to the JCT.

CIE has zero interest in doing anything that would improve services to or from Clonmel having actively tried to close the Limerick Jn./Rosslare route for the last 40 years. I used to travel regularly between Heuston and Cahir in the late 1980s and I can remember being told by staff there (Heuston) that wasn't even a service between the two; and I would have to travel via Waterford. Even on train announcements would only mention change at Limerick Jn. for Limerick. That the staff/unions colluded in this speaks volumes about the giant social employment scheme that CIE has become. The management and workers in CIE don't give a damn what's closed as long as they get the right golden handshake/redundancy etc.

Also, what is this freight that you speak of that would use a hub at Limerick Junction?

savagethegoat

trellheim wrote: »

Cork to Heuston is assumed to be Kent-Heuston. If you had meant Mallow you should have said so.

Taxi from centre of Mallow to Station : 5/6 minutes , collect online ticket 5 mins wait for train 5 mins , 1:45 on train, approx 2 hours . As someone who regularly drops and picks up people from Mallow Stn I know this is all you need to do.

It is exactly 240km from Mallow centre to Heuston Station and don't tell me you can do Mallow-Heuston in less than the 2'32'' that Google suggests without breaking the limit, the N73 between Kildorrery and Mallow is crapola, I must drive from near Heuston to near Mallow about 10 times a year and 2'45' to 3 is about right going M7 and M8, M7/M20 is slower.

Lets get some reality into the discussion.

Also I know several people who drive from Cork City to Dub centre cos they can't be arsed to prise themselves out of the motors.

Train is a bit - but not a lot - more expensive, if you don't book in advance.

I don't live in Mallow.

What I said was, I can drive to my final destination in Dublin quicker than I can drive to Mallow, park, wait for train, travel by train, walk to LUAS/Bus/taxi, travel to final destination, The same would apply to travelling into Cork from a suburb. It's the time of the overall journey that is relevant.

The point is the train is still painfully slow and hasn't been accelerated since the 70s whereas many countries through the world have car-beating train times and in some cases have had them since the 70s.

Car is cheaper slightly for one person, bur unbeatable for two or more.

We're never going to get a decent rail service whilst people are willing to settle for what we have.

IE 222

Del.Monte wrote: »

CIE has zero interest in doing anything that would improve services to or from Clonmel having actively tried to close the Limerick Jn./Rosslare route for the last 40 years. I used to travel regularly between Heuston and Cahir in the late 1980s and I can remember being told by staff there (Heuston) that wasn't even a service between the two; and I would have to travel via Waterford. Even on train announcements would only mention change at Limerick Jn. for Limerick. That the staff/unions colluded in this speaks volumes about the giant social employment scheme that CIE has become. The management and workers in CIE don't give a damn what's closed as long as they get the right golden handshake/redundancy etc.

Also, what is this freight that you speak of that would use a hub at Limerick Junction?

I think there is a connection now but that's only down to the hourly cork timetable.

I said it WOULD make for a great hub in the sense of running feeder freights from waterford to Limerick, Galway and a Cork / Tralee of Dublin trains rather than trying to fill full length point to point trains from Dublin.

man98

IE 222 wrote: »

Wouldn't be just cutting times it offers more free movements, better services and more safety overall. Current set up strangles connections. Would there be much demand for a clonmel - Dublin service even one that splits from a direct limerick or cork. Waterford services could run limerick shuttle as well with new layout.

On a separate note I think L JCT could offer a brilliant freight hub as well and transfer freight department from limerick to the JCT.

I have heard that a Clonmel - Dublin service was proposed by IÉ's management in Waterford and was given the two fingers by head office not too long ago.

savagethegoat

IE 222 wrote: »

I think there is a connection now but that's only down to the hourly cork timetable.

I said it WOULD make for a great hub in the sense of running feeder freights from waterford to Limerick, Galway and a Cork / Tralee of Dublin trains rather than trying to fill full length point to point trains from Dublin.

I think he meant where are you going to find this freight from

trellheim

I don't live in Mallow.

What I said was, I can drive to my final destination in Dublin quicker than I can drive to Mallow, park, wait for train, travel by train, walk to LUAS/Bus/taxi, travel to final destination, The same would apply to travelling into Cork from a suburb. It's the time of the overall journey that is relevant.

The point is the train is still painfully slow and hasn't been accelerated since the 70s whereas many countries through the world have car-beating train times and in some cases have had them since the 70s.

Car is cheaper slightly for one person, bur unbeatable for two or more.

We're never going to get a decent rail service whilst people are willing to settle for what we have.

I've now quoted two of your own examples and shown rail to be the faster option. With the current M50 congestion and Dunkettle interchange congestion car is absolutely mank in driving to Dublin or Cork why would you not !

end of the road

man98 wrote: »

I have heard that a Clonmel - Dublin service was proposed by IÉ's management in Waterford and was given the two fingers by head office not too long ago.

this doesn't surprise me in the least. CIE/IE management up in dublin have their pets and anything outside those can go to hell. always been the way, always will be the way.

savagethegoat

trellheim wrote: »

I've now quoted two of your own examples and shown rail to be the faster option. With the current M50 congestion and Dunkettle interchange congestion car is absolutely mank in driving to Dublin or Cork why would you not !

I don't use the M50 going to Dublin. Dunkettle is only congested in rush hour, it's no problem almost all of the day. (not that I go there either), Congestion at Dunkettle or on the M50 would also hit some people heading for the train of course.

Rail is a lot slower as I have explained twice. Journeys go from door to door , not Heuston to Kent.

IE 222

man98 wrote: »

I have heard that a Clonmel - Dublin service was proposed by IÉ's management in Waterford and was given the two fingers by head office not too long ago.

I can kind of agree with them to be honest with the current Limerick JCT layout it would be a headache running these.

IE 222

savagethegoat wrote: »

I think he meant where are you going to find this freight from

The freight is there it's just about finding a way to get it of the trucks. The Jct hub would remove the idea of full train load point to point movements albeit it would require an unloading area and forklift at each city, not a Hugh cost to be fair.

A Dublin - Cork / Tralee stopping in Limerick Jct for tranfer loading / unloading and another service possibly a rerouting of Ballina to Waterford via WRC turning at Athlone also stopping at Limerick Jct for transfers as well.

Thats Cork, Tralee, Mallow, Ballina, Limerick, Galway (Athenry) and Waterford all served with freight to and from each other and Dublin by only using 2 trains.

Del.Monte

IE 222 wrote: »

The freight is there it's just about finding a way to get it of the trucks. The Jct hub would remove the idea of full train load point to point movements albeit it would require an unloading area and forklift at each city, not a Hugh cost to be fair.

A Dublin - Cork / Tralee stopping in Limerick Jct for tranfer loading / unloading and another service possibly a rerouting of Ballina to Waterford via WRC turning at Athlone also stopping at Limerick Jct for transfers as well.

Thats Cork, Tralee, Mallow, Ballina, Limerick, Galway (Athenry) and Waterford all served with freight to and from each other and Dublin by only using 2 trains.

Forget it.

savagethegoat

Del.Monte wrote: »

Forget it.

yep, the truck the stuff started out on would be at the destination by the time you did all that connecting stuff.

end of the road

savagethegoat wrote: »

yep, the truck the stuff started out on would be at the destination by the time you did all that connecting stuff.

not if done properly. but yeah, if his suggestion was ever implemented, the screams of a certain group would be heard in southern yemen.

IE 222

savagethegoat wrote: »

yep, the truck the stuff started out on would be at the destination by the time you did all that connecting stuff.

Rail freight is not for next day delivery fast services. Road transport is becoming a lot more expensive in Ireland and only seems to be going up in price. If IE extend train lengths and can bring prices down I can see a shift been made, not a massive one but enough to see current loads double or treble.

savagethegoat

whilst you are in crystal ball mode, what do you see them carrying then?

trellheim

If IE extend train lengths

Didn't they run the longest freight ever there not so long ago

IE 222

trellheim wrote: »

Didn't they run the longest freight ever there not so long ago

Yes and done weight trials as well but think that was the first step to running the longer trains. Open to correction on that. I would be surprised to see new flows be developed soon.

Does anyone know what the IWT pr event was about the other day.

Carawaystick

savagethegoat wrote: »

I don't use the M50 going to Dublin. Dunkettle is only congested in rush hour, it's no problem almost all of the day. (not that I go there either), Congestion at Dunkettle or on the M50 would also hit some people heading for the train of course.

Rail is a lot slower as I have explained twice. Journeys go from door to door , not Heuston to Kent.

The M50 is only congested at rush hour too.