Farm science.

Upstream

Quote: 148multi
Can you explain the s***e bit.

Gawddawggonnit wrote: »

That information is as old as Methuselah with research that has been independently trialed and indeed proven in commercial use.
Reminds me of the Dáil printer...for €100k an hour I could (and thousands more) give better insight into multi-species benefits in pasture swards. No mention was made of the newer fesque and cocksfoot varities etc?
Nice work if you can find it, and closer to home than NZ. One can see how close the Swiss land and climate is to the massif of Kilkenny or the high alps of east Cork...
Teagasc would be better employed paying for new research and not rehashing something that’s researched to death...

I just watched Dr Helen Sheridan interviewed on EcoEye on the Regenerative Agriculture episode. In fairness to her, she said exactly what you said Gawddawggonnit, "it's not new".
At the same time - to a lot of her peers in mainstream agriculture, this is radical, almost heresy, completely different to what they were educated to.

The wheels of change move more slowly in academia and corporate circles, having a proper piece of well researched academic study might be enough to inform decision makers and change the direction of agricultural policy.

While progressive farmers like yourself might be ahead of the curve there are a lot of followers that might be able to change direction by following her example.

yosemitesam1

Upstream wrote: »

Quote: 148multi
Can you explain the s***e bit.


I just watched Dr Helen Sheridan interviewed on EcoEye on the Regenerative Agriculture episode. In fairness to her, she said exactly what you said Gawddawggonnit, "it's not new".
At the same time - to a lot of her peers in mainstream agriculture, this is radical, almost heresy, completely different to what they were educated to.

The wheels of change move more slowly in academia and corporate circles, having a proper piece of well researched academic study might be enough to inform decision makers and change the direction of agricultural policy.

While progressive farmers like yourself might be ahead of the curve there are a lot of followers that might be able to change direction by following her example.

If you get the chance read the clifton park system and An account of the work of the Cockle Park Experimental Station from 1896 to 1956. That's the point where todays grassland management evolved from. Clifton park made use of what was there with multi species swards and cockle park went down the route of buying in slag and lime, simplified sward composition over the years and introduced nitrogen later.

Water John

Dr. Sheridan and UCD experimentation whilst good was viewed as being well behind the curve by the audience at the Biological Conf last Nov.
Now John McHugh and his farming methods would be a real challenge for most.
The Ecoeye programme was good.

yosemitesam1

https://www.iflscience.com/health-and-medicine/one-most-common-ingredients-western-diet-found-alter-genes-brain/amp.html?__twitter_impression=true

Ruminants filter all this sh1t out. Inflammation causing polyunsaturated fats are changed to saturated fats in the rumen and other undesirable chemicals are also destroyed in the rumen

ganmo

yosemitesam1 wrote: »

https://www.iflscience.com/health-and-medicine/one-most-common-ingredients-western-diet-found-alter-genes-brain/amp.html?__twitter_impression=true

Ruminants filter all this sh1t out. Inflammation causing polyunsaturated fats are changed to saturated fats in the rumen and other undesirable chemicals are also destroyed in the rumen

the rumen saturates fats as part of its function, this results in beef and lamb having relatively large quantities of saturated fats.
unfortunately saturated fats are considered less healthy especially for those with heart conditions.

yosemitesam1

ganmo wrote: »

the rumen saturates fats as part of its function, this results in beef and lamb having relatively large quantities of saturated fats.
unfortunately saturated fats are considered less healthy especially for those with heart conditions.

There's an ever growing amount of people questioning that long held "fact". Inflammation and diets rich in refined carbohydrates are more likely the cause

Buford T. Justice XIX

A link to a short paper on N routes after application. It seems shallow drainage like mole and gravel mole ploughing speeds up N outflows from most soils. Early days yet but it may inform policy decisions in the future.
https://twitter.com/TeagascEnviron/status/1220274258703724545?s=19

Buford T. Justice XIX

Some interesting regional variations on yield responses to increasing C levels of soils.
https://twitter.com/pepcanadell/status/1224963367733006336?s=19

Buford T. Justice XIX

Food production projections 2050.

https://academic.oup.com/bioscience/article/67/4/386/3016049

Buford T. Justice XIX

With interest in MSS growing, this below link looks at the best ways of adding lucerne to swards.
https://www.nzgajournal.org.nz/index.php/JoNZG/article/view/406

whelan2

Have had 3 lads on to me yesterday looking for calves. Might work out better with marts closed

Buford T. Justice XIX

https://twitter.com/agronomistag/status/1256292646919667713?s=19

yosemitesam1

Buford T. Justice VI wrote: »

https://twitter.com/agronomistag/status/1256292646919667713?s=19

He shares a lot of info like that, that is based on trials that are far too short for the benefits of more sustainable farming to start to show. It's a big ask for soil biology to go from 0 to 60 in two years, generally 5 years is more realistic for differences to start to emerge

Buford T. Justice XIX

There's a lot of interesting debate atm about carbon sequestration and the link in the tweet below goes into some of the debate.
https://twitter.com/xAlan_Matthews/status/1272110908505042944?s=19

Say my name

We should be looking to the past about how farmers centuries ago built carbon rich stable soils.

https://youtu.be/PLWwMC3kVOE

He doesn't mention it here but in other accounts they mention that the fire waste from homes and industry was also included as fertilizer along with the animal manure.
You'll see it here in this country that the animal manure on it's own doesn't build the soil and carbon stocks on it's own but gets burnt out and used by microbes. It does have an effect but there's something else needed too.
Maybe the peat had an effect like charcoal too in being somewhat stable carbon but charcoal is definitely mentioned elsewhere in accounts of Anthrosol formation.

Mattdhg

Say my name wrote: »

We should be looking to the past about how farmers centuries ago built carbon rich stable soils.

https://youtu.be/PLWwMC3kVOE

He doesn't mention it here but in other accounts they mention that the fire waste from homes and industry was also included as fertilizer along with the animal manure.
You'll see it here in this country that the animal manure on it's own doesn't build the soil and carbon stocks on it's own but gets burnt out and used by microbes. It does have an effect but there's something else needed too.
Maybe the peat had an effect like charcoal too in being somewhat stable carbon but charcoal is definitely mentioned elsewhere in accounts of Anthrosol formation.

I read an article somewhere that said "renewable" forestry isn't truly renewable because the ash is not being returned to the plantations so you'll eventually have a nutrient deficit there, so youre definitely onto something. it came with the big caveat though that coal soot/ashes are potentially toxic and will lead to an accumulation of metals in the soil and make it unsuitable for growth. have anecdotally seen this too,I used to throw ashes from the fire into the corner of a hen run so they could dustbathe in it - that patch has become a pure wasteland

Say my name

Mattdhg wrote: »

I read an article somewhere that said "renewable" forestry isn't truly renewable because the ash is not being returned to the plantations so you'll eventually have a nutrient deficit there, so youre definitely onto something. it came with the big caveat though that coal soot/ashes are potentially toxic and will lead to an accumulation of metals in the soil and make it unsuitable for growth. have anecdotally seen this too,I used to throw ashes from the fire into the corner of a hen run so they could dustbathe in it - that patch has become a pure wasteland

You'll see hardwood forests and they drop the leaves back down and feed themselves that way. Actually the same with pine trees only they like poor soil with no competition and the needles acidify the soil.
What you'd have to remember though is with ash. Is that all those nutrients (bar nitrogen and phosphorus?) that were in that big tree are now concentrated so tightly in that small bit of ash. They don't burn off (well not really, nitrogen burns off in an instant in smoke and i think phosphorus does too?) But i think the rest stays.
So it's the same with any nutrient. Too much and the plant won't grow.
And then there's the pH of ash. Ash would be up around 13. Most plants just like either side of or on neutral which is 7.
Grass likes it 6.2, 6.3 but even at 7 it not the end of the world.
But at a soil pH of 13. Nope. Nope.

Another fact that could have been useful in the lockdown is that soap was made from wood ash and animal fat.
The wood ash being alkaline. Any dairy farmer with detergent knows all about that and the slippery feeling on the skin.
And the animal fat made the whole thing set and neutralized it a bit.

Buford T. Justice XIX

Another piece of the GHG emissions puzzle coming out in favour of ruminants.
https://twitter.com/fleroy1974/status/1275499332318486530?s=19

Buford T. Justice XIX

A different perspective on soil carbon and where the focus on it's presence may best placed.

https://twitter.com/agronomistag/status/1280986680741126145?s=19

ganmo

https://www.nature.com/articles/s41598-020-62314-2
Other Tb testing

Say my name

It reads like science fiction but this is science fact.

https://www.wired.com/story/a-crispr-calf-is-born-its-definitely-a-boy/

Researchers and Gene editors in California have created a calf by a process called CRISPR gene editing. The purpose was to create a guarranteed bull calf even if the calf had female genes.
Then they inserted a glow in the dark gene with the crispr genes to enable them to see how the genes developed.
There's a whole lot more and they had to induce the cow to calve as cows don't seemingly recognize calves inside them from gene editing and when to calve.

When are they going to develop a calf with wings is what I want to know.?

Buford T. Justice XIX

Soil carbon level increases are positively correlated to increased stocking rates.
https://twitter.com/SUMjournal/status/1289111053222187008?s=19

Buford T. Justice XIX

Painting eyes on cows backsides leads to hugely reduced losses from lion attacks.

https://arstechnica.com/science/2020/08/study-confirms-that-painting-eyes-on-cow-butts-helps-ward-off-predators/

I wonder if it would work on lambs?

Water John

I see somewhere a few days ago that a mixed pattern confuses horse flies, less bites.

Birdnuts

Buford T. Justice XIX wrote: »

Painting eyes on cows backsides leads to hugely reduced losses from lion attacks.

https://arstechnica.com/science/2020/08/study-confirms-that-painting-eyes-on-cow-butts-helps-ward-off-predators/

I wonder if it would work on lambs?

Interesting - I spent a wonderfull few weeks about 10 years ago on the Oj Pejeta ranch in central Kenya which is famous both for its "Big 5" safari experience and its award winning 5k beef herd. I asked the stock man how they managed both, and he simply said we just put the herd in makeshift bomas over night with a couple of watchmen and no trouble is had from the Lions, Hyenas etc. cos they only hunt at night. Its a great model really as it sees a much higher return per Ha compared to conventional herding in that part of the world.

Buford T. Justice XIX

A bit of an overview of pasture beef production in the NE USA with beef grown and finished on grass.
https://twitter.com/drsplace/status/1313589864525332483?s=19

SouthWesterly

Buford T. Justice XIX wrote: »

Painting eyes on cows backsides leads to hugely reduced losses from lion attacks.

https://arstechnica.com/science/2020/08/study-confirms-that-painting-eyes-on-cow-butts-helps-ward-off-predators/

I wonder if it would work on lambs?

I'll watch out below for lambs with 4 eyes you've nothing to loose.

Buford T. Justice XIX

Not sure if it's any 20 articles free or 20 specific ones but it'll pass away a rainy day for someone, I hope.

https://twitter.com/ejsoilscience/status/1323191007777882112?s=19

gozunda

Buford T. Justice XIX wrote: »

Painting eyes on cows backsides leads to hugely reduced losses from lion attacks.

https://arstechnica.com/science/2020/08/study-confirms-that-painting-eyes-on-cow-butts-helps-ward-off-predators/

I wonder if it would work on lambs?

Jeez lambs attacking cows now! Who'd have thunk it eh? :pac:

yosemitesam1

http://www.dungbeetlesforfarmers.co.uk/

Interesting website