Why do the Gardaí not use eirecode ?

BaronVon

Firearms applications now have an Eircode space, so maybe there'll be brought in slowly:rolleyes:

Water John

As someone said yesterday, eircode only relates to a post box/house. Half of Gardai business, disturbance of the peace etc, is in the public domain. So we will have them using one system for houses and another for the road accident.
That's the nonsense of eircode, along with its randomness.

TheChizler

Water John wrote: »

As someone said yesterday, eircode only relates to a post box/house. Half of Gardai business, disturbance of the peace etc, is in the public domain. So we will have them using one system for houses and another for the road accident.
That's the nonsense of eircode, along with its randomness.

And in the public domain you'd still need a computer to generate a code for that location. Might as well use e112 for that as it's coming in anyway .

Water John

What's e112 in this context?

TheChizler

Water John wrote: »

What's e112 in this context?

Location enhanced version of 112/999. Operator transmits the info they have about your location to the emergency call operator. Not as accurate as GNSS yet but it's heading that way.

GoProGaming

TheChizler wrote: »

Water John wrote: »

As someone said yesterday, eircode only relates to a post box/house. Half of Gardai business, disturbance of the peace etc, is in the public domain. So we will have them using one system for houses and another for the road accident.
That's the nonsense of eircode, along with its randomness.

And in the public domain you'd still need a computer to generate a code for that location. Might as well use e112 for that as it's coming in anyway .

Will only show what cell mast your pinging off, not very accurate in ireland as they are so far apart. As it stands we can tell if your ringing from clare and you tell the operator you require help in limerick for example

TheChizler

I did say that it was coming in future, not that the accuracy was already here.

Water John

Plenty options out there. The Irish National Grid was set up by Ordinance Survey I presume?

Graces7

beveragelady wrote: »

Living in the countryside does not mean that 'gangs of raiders' will be hammering on your door every night. When you hear people talking about rural crime they are usually referring to statistics that include theft of farm machinery and animals. Violent crime is rare.
The way you write about your sister and your insistence on being the boss in this situation (seriously, you're making phonecalls on her behalf?) is the problem here, not a perceived threat of Mad Max lawlessness.
Do you by any chance disapprove of some element of her chosen lifestyle, is that why you're so keen to create a problem?

Edit... And another thing: The notion that if somebody is alone they are automatically in danger is almost superstitious. Give the lady a bit of credit, and for heaven's sake give her some independence.

Ah be fair, please! I live in a very remote house, so much so that when I needed an ambulance before eirecode, they got lost on the top road.. When I called 999 last week, they asked for my eireocode which I could not find.

One of the first sensible things you need to do when moving to a remote house is to make sure that at need you CAN get emergency help.

I am moving soon to another remote area and will do so immediately simply for consideration for the emergency services.

As someone has said the 999 operator will ask for it and will direct to the address. It was a terrible thing this last week to be trying to explain where I was to someone in Dublin.

Little CuChulainn

Graces7 wrote: »

Ah be fair, please! I live in a very remote house, so much so that when I needed an ambulance before eirecode, they got lost on the top road.. When I called 999 last week, they asked for my eireocode which I could not find.

One of the first sensible things you need to do when moving to a remote house is to make sure that at need you CAN get emergency help.

I am moving soon to another remote area and will do so immediately simply for consideration for the emergency services.

As someone has said the 999 operator will ask for it and will direct to the address. It was a terrible thing this last week to be trying to explain where I was to someone in Dublin.

It never ceased to amaze me how many people in rural areas could not give simple accurate directions to their own house. Some form of location system is definitely needed across the emergency services.

Reati

bravestar wrote: »

Provide Gardai on the ground with the relevant technology to enable it's use and I'm sure they would use it if it made houses easier to find.

Seem plenty of Gardai with their iphones out in town. Guess Google Maps is an ask to much on them in a real emergency.

Little CuChulainn

Reati wrote: »

Seem plenty of Gardai with their iphones out in town. Guess Google Maps is an ask to much on them in a real emergency.

It is. But that doesn't stop us from using them when we can. Should we bring our own sticks instead of batons? Maybe drive our own cars around with some blue lights stuck on.

Tell me, what happens when the Google Maps location doesn't line up with the eircode location or when we get closer to the location and lose service? There's a reason proper standardised equipment should be provided.

Reati

Reati wrote: »

Seem plenty of Gardai with their iphones out in town. Guess Google Maps is an ask to much on them in a real emergency.

As already stated we do use or own PERSONAL phones to assist us in doing the job, be it looking for a location of a call or for finding info for somebody. We don't get any allowance for paying our bills or topping up so why should we be obliged to use them?

Graces7

Little CuChulainn wrote: »

It never ceased to amaze me how many people in rural areas could not give simple accurate directions to their own house. Some form of location system is definitely needed across the emergency services.

Oh I can and do give very accurate directions to here! But google and other maps that the services use misinterpet eg field access dirt tracks as lanes.. so they are talking about the third lane when there is really only one.

With the ambulance two years ago they were on the right road but panicked as it was "in the forestry" and turned back.. I had to redirect them to a local tavern them start again..

Directions are in the ear of the listener..

ED E

GoProGaming wrote: »

Will only show what cell mast your pinging off, not very accurate in ireland as they are so far apart. As it stands we can tell if your ringing from clare and you tell the operator you require help in limerick for example

Nope.

E112 or its real name, AML, is deployed as part of Google Play Services (part of the OS) and can boot up all aspects of the location service. That means its cells + wifi hits + GPS/GLONASS/Baidu + AGPS. On a newer phone they'll have you down to a confident 1-3m radius by the end of a 60 second call.

ED E

ED E wrote: »

Nope.

E112 or its real name, AML, is deployed as part of Google Play Services (part of the OS) and can boot up all aspects of the location service. That means its cells + wifi hits + GPS/GLONASS/Baidu + AGPS. On a newer phone they'll have you down to a confident 1-3m radius by the end of a 60 second call.

If that were the case we'd be prosecuting a lot more people for bogey calls.

GreenFolder2

GoProGaming wrote: »

Will only show what cell mast your pinging off, not very accurate in ireland as they are so far apart. As it stands we can tell if your ringing from clare and you tell the operator you require help in limerick for example

Not very accurate outside urban areas anywhere actually.

Kevin3

No, AML (advanced mobile location) is technology which not used in Ireland yet but will hopefully be in the future. It's only being used in the UK and Estonia at the moment.

barrymanilow

beveragelady wrote: »

Living in the countryside does not mean that 'gangs of raiders' will be hammering on your door every night. When you hear people talking about rural crime they are usually referring to statistics that include theft of farm machinery and animals. Violent crime is rare.
The way you write about your sister and your insistence on being the boss in this situation (seriously, you're making phonecalls on her behalf?) is the problem here, not a perceived threat of Mad Max lawlessness.
Do you by any chance disapprove of some element of her chosen lifestyle, is that why you're so keen to create a problem?

http://www.independent.ie/irish-news/news/priest-tied-up-and-locked-in-room-as-raiders-ransacked-his-home-35418372.html

"Deputy Collins said: "The community is in shock over this. What it shows is that while crime stats go up and down, crime never goes away. It also reminds us about the vulnerability of people living alone.""

Indricotherium

barrymanilow wrote: »

http://www.independent.ie/irish-news/news/priest-tied-up-and-locked-in-room-as-raiders-ransacked-his-home-35418372.html

"Deputy Collins said: "The community is in shock over this. What it shows is that while crime stats go up and down, crime never goes away. It also reminds us about the vulnerability of people living alone.""

How would an eircode have helped in this situation?

flutered

Red Kev wrote: »

Yep. And there's no point giving them a smartphone to google it or use the Eircode website as they possibly won't get reception when they need it most.

They need something else. Totally infuriating that the new system is used by next to nobody.

it was brought in so as to enable the revenue idintify each house in the country, so as to enable the entire collection of the lpt, plus iw was also to use it, nothing else plain and simple, as there was a system already in place, used by the distpatch freight and curiour companys, the wording of the law ensured that they could not compete, so mr j tierney him of poolbeg eyer square and iw fame and minister alex white got the gig to set it up

flutered

why not provide the lass in question with two good dogs, also if the op is still concerned he could get a tazer from our travelling cousins, they seem to be able to supply everything and anything to anyone

Thoie

Little CuChulainn wrote: »

It never ceased to amaze me how many people in rural areas could not give simple accurate directions to their own house. Some form of location system is definitely needed across the emergency services.

Simple directions to a particular place from easy to find spot x: Turn right at the crossroads. No, the actual crossroads marked with a crossroads road sign, not the place where two houses with long driveways are across from each other. Oh, the sign is missing, and the right turn looks like a driveway? Yeah, there. Now, keep driving straight ahead for precisely 2.8km. About 1 and three quarter miles, yeah, a bit less. Slow down once you stop going uphill. Do you see the crooked telegraph pole on your right? You can't see the turn, but immediately before that there's a sharp turn back on itself that's invisible from the side you're coming from. Oh, you've passed it? Well, you'll have to reverse back up the road, there's no room to turn around. There's a tractor behind you? What colour is it? If it's a green tractor, then go down to the 3rd gate where there's room to turn. If it's blue, he'll be going in the 3rd gate, so you'll need to go to the 5th gate and turn there instead. Now, remember to turn left just after the crooked telegraph pole. At the end of that lane it splits, you want to keep to the left after the green house.

Directions are complicated by people driving a little too fast (not speeding, just a little too fast to spot turns that are frequently hidden), and it sometimes being extremely difficult to tell the difference between "public road" and "private lane", as the two often look identical. The simple directions that I always start with are "turn right at the crossroads, turn right again after 2.8km, keep left where the boreen splits". No-one can ever follow those directions.

If I was a member of the AGS, while I'd find it disgraceful that I'd be expected to provide and use my own equipment, I'd also download "my" area maps for offline use and directions, to help avoid getting lost in areas with no signal.

Indricotherium

Thoie wrote: »

Simple directions to a particular place from easy to find spot x: Turn right at the crossroads. No, the actual crossroads marked with a crossroads road sign, not the place where two houses with long driveways are across from each other. Oh, the sign is missing, and the right turn looks like a driveway? Yeah, there. Now, keep driving straight ahead for precisely 2.8km. About 1 and three quarter miles, yeah, a bit less. Slow down once you stop going uphill. Do you see the crooked telegraph pole on your right? You can't see the turn, but immediately before that there's a sharp turn back on itself that's invisible from the side you're coming from. Oh, you've passed it? Well, you'll have to reverse back up the road, there's no room to turn around. There's a tractor behind you? What colour is it? If it's a green tractor, then go down to the 3rd gate where there's room to turn. If it's blue, he'll be going in the 3rd gate, so you'll need to go to the 5th gate and turn there instead. Now, remember to turn left just after the crooked telegraph pole. At the end of that lane it splits, you want to keep to the left after the green house.

Directions are complicated by people driving a little too fast (not speeding, just a little too fast to spot turns that are frequently hidden), and it sometimes being extremely difficult to tell the difference between "public road" and "private lane", as the two often look identical. The simple directions that I always start with are "turn right at the crossroads, turn right again after 2.8km, keep left where the boreen splits". No-one can ever follow those directions.

.

Those are terrible directions.

You should get someone else to write out intelligible directions that you could read over the phone to emergency services should the need arise.

Thoie

Indricotherium wrote: »

Those are terrible directions.

You should get someone else to write out intelligible directions that you could read over the phone to emergency services should the need arise.

Yes, and as I said, they're terrible because people miss turns, etc. The simple, easy directions are as posted: "turn right at the crossroads, turn right again after 2.8km, keep left where the boreen splits". If you follow those, you'll get to the right place.

The problem arises because in rural settings there are few landmarks, and hedgerows are often overgrown, blocking visibility of turnings and the few road signs. There's no point saying "take the 3rd turn after the white house", because all the houses are white, and people have different ideas of what constitutes a "turn" - some will count every turning (into a driveway or a field), while others will only count a turn that is an actual road. And often it's difficult to distinguish between the two. Locals will know that right turn is actually a driveway down to a hidden house, but strangers won't.

RiderOnTheStorm

I remember in the old days that we had learned many many phone numbers off by heart, in days before contact lists & smart phones. How hard is it now to learn a 7 digit reference that might save your life? Get in the habit of putting it on return address of every letter and you soon will know it by heart.

Thoie

RiderOnTheStorm wrote: »

I remember in the old days that we had learned many many phone numbers off by heart, in days before contact lists & smart phones. How hard is it now to learn a 7 digit reference that might save your life? Get in the habit of putting it on return address of every letter and you soon will know it by heart.

The whole thread is about the fact that giving your eircode to gardaí isn't terribly useful, because gardaí are not provided by their employer with equipment that can use it.

Some gardaí have personal items (like smartphones) that can get directions using the eircode, but there's no guarantee they'll have a signal during an emergency, or that they will have a charged smartphone with them, as these are personal items.

Indricotherium

RiderOnTheStorm wrote: »

I remember in the old days that we had learned many many phone numbers off by heart, in days before contact lists & smart phones. How hard is it now to learn a 7 digit reference that might save your life? Get in the habit of putting it on return address of every letter and you soon will know it by heart.

The issue is that eircodes are meaningless strings of random letters that mean nothing to anybody.

An eircodes, without a computer and license to use the database, gives you less information than a townland or road number.