JC assessment English (NEW)

MrJones1973

Can anybody explain the class room assessment and the assessment that gets sent away to Department. I understand the oral exam and I understand the exam paper but I cant make sense of exactly how the two aforementioned parts work.

Please help

thefasteriwalk

Do you have the resource booklet from Day 2 of the English inservice? Perhaps not if you're not ETB like me. I'd download it from JCT to start.

Incoming 3rd years should have started working on their collection of texts (the part that's send away) last year. For instance, mine each have a folder in my room with about 6-7 pieces in it: two analytical essays, a personal essay, a short story, etc. Each piece has 2-3 drafts. They'll continue to add to this until December 1st this year.

The CBA 2 will take place over two lesson periods from 5th-9th December. There will probably be an audio/visual that you have to show students and then they take notes and answer the questions. Their collection of texts is likely to be an integral part of this: students may have to reflect on their collection of texts and what they learned about the writing process in some of their answers. They have access to their collection of texts over the two lessons. Then the whole kit and kaboodle is shipped off. A sample CBA 2 is in that resource booklet I mentioned.

This is my understanding, at least. I'm open to correction.

I'll be starting my planning soon and I really don't know where to start for my incoming 3rd year English. Ugh!

Jamfa

The CBAs are classroom based assessments and assessed by the English & reported by the school with nothing being sent outside to SEC. Following the CBA2 in December of 3rd year the students will do the Assessment Task (10%) which takes place during class time & is then stored in the school & sent off to the SEC with the written exam (90%) in June. More info about the AT is here: https://www.curriculumonline.ie/getmedia/72cb871a-d8e5-4218-9de7-5dc634674147/Assessment-Task-example-and-guidelines.pdf

MrJones1973

Im ASTI so what are we to do? What do you think will happen?

Jamfa

Mrwhite1970 wrote: »

Im ASTI so what are we to do? What do you think will happen?

That's a question to ask the ASTI. The new course now applies to all students from 1st-3rd year & the ASTI directive says you are to follow it except for the CBA assessments. The problem next term will be the Asssessment Task & whether the students who haven't completed CBA2 can do it. Are the ASTI offering any supports or training for their English teachers?

man_no_plan

Jamfa wrote: »

That's a question to ask the ASTI. The new course now applies to all students from 1st-3rd year & the ASTI directive says you are to follow it except for the CBA assessments. The problem next term will be the Asssessment Task & whether the students who haven't completed CBA2 can do it. Are the ASTI offering any supports or training for their English teachers?

The main issue now is, as the CBA isn't optional, will students in ASTI schools be capped at 90% as they haven't submitted one assessment component?

Jamfa

man_no_plan wrote: »

The main issue now is, as the CBA isn't optional, will students in ASTI schools be capped at 90% as they haven't submitted one assessment component?

As a parent I wouldn't be happy with the DES not allowing my son complete the Assessment Task because his English teacher hadn't assessed his two pieces from his collection of texts.

man_no_plan

Jamfa wrote: »

As a parent I wouldn't be happy with the DES not allowing my son complete the Assessment Task because his English teacher hadn't assessed his two pieces from his collection of texts.

I agree alright about the SEC. If the teacher doesn't facilitate it how doescit go for you though?

Jamfa

man_no_plan wrote: »

I agree alright about the SEC. If the teacher doesn't facilitate it how doescit go for you though?

If the ASTI directs English teachers to not facilitate the Assessment Task then both the teachers & DES have a problem explaining that to parents & students.

evolving_doors

Jamfa wrote: »

As a parent I wouldn't be happy with the DES not allowing my son complete the Assessment Task because his English teacher hadn't assessed his two pieces from his collection of texts.

As a parent I'd prefer if the DES assessed everything if it's for state certification.

Jamfa

Gebgbegb wrote: »

As a parent I'd prefer if the DES assessed everything if it's for state certification.

Which is what the DES conceded when they added the Assessment Task to the SEC assessed final exam. The problem is that the non state certified classroom based assessment has to be completed in order for students to sit the Assessment Task. It does look like the stalemate between the DES & ASTI is set to continue which isn't good for all concerned.

evolving_doors

Jamfa wrote: »

Which is what the DES conceded when they added the Assessment Task to the SEC assessed final exam. The problem is that the non state certified classroom based assessment has to be completed in order for students to sit the Assessment Task. It does look like the stalemate between the DES & ASTI is set to continue which isn't good for all concerned.

It's not as if students won't be taught English to the standards that teachers always expect.

Classroom based assessments have been going on for centuries regardless, I don't think either side is suggesting that this will stop.


Out of interest, is this 10% that is sent to the SEC open to the exact same scrutinies as the 90%.
Appeals? Sampling? Storage?

feardeas

I'd imagine so. Just like the projects in LC history and Geography. However I'm ASTI so I have no definite information. I teach English and it is worrying and frustrating to have so little knowledge of agreement procedures for a class that will be starting third year in less than a month.

Maybe the strike days they're planning will sort it out!!!! God help us.

Jamfa

Gebgbegb wrote: »

It's not as if students won't be taught English to the standards that teachers always expect.

Classroom based assessments have been going on for centuries regardless, I don't think either side is suggesting that this will stop.


Out of interest, is this 10% that is sent to the SEC open to the exact same scrutinies as the 90%.
Appeals? Sampling? Storage?

Yeah the Assessment Task is part of the SEC grade and students will receive a single grade for it & the final exam. The SEC procedures for appeals, sampling & storage will apply. The new grading system will apply so no more As, Bs etc.

MrJones1973

I teach a mixed ability group which is another load of bollix from those in charge. I have kids who can barely write a sentence and those who can write loads. They dont study. It would be hard to get a completely new course finished without this issue unresolved.
I find the lack of inaction from both DES and ASTI frustrating. My main beef with new JC is that
1) No extra cash for the extra productivity
2) No posts to co-ordinate the realms of paperwork
3) The dumbing down which is evident to anybody who looks at a sample paper.

If both parties were really concerned they would be meeting now.

chases0102

Did I hear correctly during the last school year, that there were to be two more (revised) sample exam papers to be released in September?

Personally, if true, I hope any new samples are heavily revised....

Jamfa

As far as I know there are no further sample papers & the exam is based on 23 of the learning outcomes & will be completed in 2 hours at both levels in an answer booklet.

maude6868

Is everyone doing house exams for 2nd yr after their recent English CBA. Is there any union directive on it?

mtoutlemonde

maude6868 wrote: »

Is everyone doing house exams for 2nd yr after their recent English CBA. Is there any union directive on it?

I can't find ASTI link but this is from the TUI which states that CBAs should replace summer house exams. We will have to stand strong about this or we will end up doing both. As far as I know, this is the Department stance as well. However, I have heard of schools doing the CBA and two 40 mins written exams. I would stand strong (as a department) and tell the principal that you will not be doing both!! Let the parents give out - they will know what we ASTI members fought to avoid doing. If parents complain the JCT people will have to think again!!

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=1&ved=0ahUKEwigv8GxjaHbAhVTQMAKHT31DxsQFggnMAA&url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.tui.ie%2F_fileupload%2FJC%2520Reform%2520Clarification%2520-%2520Letter%2520to%2520Members%2520-%252021%2520Nov%252016%2520(002).pdf&usg=AOvVaw1W4qOQkXHWyNzrRrazLN7G

solerina

mtoutlemonde wrote: »

I can't find ASTI link but this is from the TUI which states that CBAs should replace summer house exams. We will have to stand strong about this or we will end up doing both. As far as I know, this is the Department stance as well. However, I have heard of schools doing the CBA and two 40 mins written exams. I would stand strong (as a department) and tell the principal that you will not be doing both!! Let the parents give out - they will know what we ASTI members fought to avoid doing. If parents complain the JCT people will have to think again!!

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=1&ved=0ahUKEwigv8GxjaHbAhVTQMAKHT31DxsQFggnMAA&url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.tui.ie%2F_fileupload%2FJC%2520Reform%2520Clarification%2520-%2520Letter%2520to%2520Members%2520-%252021%2520Nov%252016%2520(002).pdf&usg=AOvVaw1W4qOQkXHWyNzrRrazLN7G

It probably depends on each individual department but we are giving a summer test, we felt that the Science CBA would not give an accurate idea of what the students know after second year.

mtoutlemonde

solerina wrote: »

It probably depends on each individual department but we are giving a summer test, we felt that the Science CBA would not give an accurate idea of what the students know after second year.

Yes I do agree that the CBA is only a snapshot but think of the work you and you're department are after doing in order to complete that CBA and now you have to set and correct a class set or more. It also sets a precedent for the other departments - are the English and Business departments also giving exams??

maude6868

Thanks for the link. We have been told we have to do a house exam, management decision.

mtoutlemonde

maude6868 wrote: »

Thanks for the link. We have been told we have to do a house exam, management decision.

Bring it to the attention of your shop steward. Was at a union meeting recently and the union will be enforcing this strongly. It is in a circular -

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=1&ved=0ahUKEwiGm7-pwaHbAhUnCcAKHRyDDKkQFggnMAA&url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.education.ie%2Fen%2FCirculars-and-Forms%2FActive-Circulars%2Fcl0015_2017.pdf&usg=AOvVaw15xhPGEooGg2h3kho0kkfh


Section 2.12. Classroom Based Assessments


There is a need to avoid ‘over-assessment’ and to minimise the cumulative burden on students and teachers of multiple assessments across the full range of subjects. In this context, the Classroom-Based Assessments will substitute other assessments currently undertaken in the school such as in-house examinations (Christmas/end of term), as appropriate.



You're making a rod for your own back. I'm not doing CBAs until next year but will not be setting exams for summer but would prefer to do a summer test than these stupid CBAs.

Icsics

No summer test in Eng for our 2nd yrs either, same with Science & Business. It was left up to each Dept. This is the system lads, let’s embrace it! We spent long enough (& lost enough pay) fighting it, new JCT is in, this is it.

maude6868

Hope the Union enforce it, the words 'as appropriate' are what's causing trouble.

mtoutlemonde

maude6868 wrote: »

Hope the Union enforce it, the words 'as appropriate' are what's causing trouble.

Teachers have to enforce it by saying no and if principal is not happy then call in union. Teachers have to get a backbone. No jibe at you Maude. Teachers keep accepting everything that's thrown at them and now more. If we don't say enough soon - we'll be writing lesson plans and reflections for every class. The government/DOE want to bring in the failed English system and we are facilitating it.

km79

https://www.jct.ie/science/subject_learning_and_assessment_review

From the Jct themselves last week - FAQ on SLAR
See number 13 - over assessing

Sometimes teachers are their own worst enemies !

r93kaey5p2izun

Many would feel that replacing written exams with CBAs is doing more to facilitate the introduction of the failed English system than anything else. Whilst I agree with the union position in terms of managing teacher workload and also not trying to cover for the crap that is the new Junior Cycle, teachers are understandably finding it difficult to dump the formal tests when they feel it's going to be seriously detrimental to their students' progress. Science teachers abandoning two sets of formal written tests when terminal exam is now worth 90% instead of 65% is a difficult one to swallow.

Moody_mona

maude6868 wrote: »

Hope the Union enforce it, the words 'as appropriate' are what's causing trouble.

I think the as appropriate refers to Christmas vs summer tests, just depending on which CBA.

I have given my second year science class a one hour test. I cannot justify removing exam practice from them, when they've moved from a 65% terminal exam to a 90% terminal exam. If the CBAs fully replaced house exams they would go from Christmas of second year to February of third year without a formal summative exam and I just don't think that's fair.

mtoutlemonde

Moody_mona wrote: »

I think the as appropriate refers to Christmas vs summer tests, just depending on which CBA.

I have given my second year science class a one hour test. I cannot justify removing exam practice from them, when they've moved from a 65% terminal exam to a 90% terminal exam. If the CBAs fully replaced house exams they would go from Christmas of second year to February of third year without a formal summative exam and I just don't think that's fair.

I completely agree that students need exam practice but the geniuses that came up with JCT wanted to remove 'pressure' from students and not let a one/two hour exam determine their result. We should let the system fail. I know I would feel extremely sorry for my students but someone has to think of the students coming afterwards and what will be expected of us. As I said previously, I would prefer to set an exam. I would have a class set (or most) corrected during them stupid SLAR meetings which were only designed to keep us in school. There is no thought of the loss of tuition time either.

Moody_mona

mtoutlemonde wrote: »

There is no thought of the loss of tuition time either.

This has been a killer, I didn't anticipate how much time would be spent on cba related activities, it ended up being far more than three weeks.

solerina

mtoutlemonde wrote: »

Yes I do agree that the CBA is only a snapshot but think of the work you and you're department are after doing in order to complete that CBA and now you have to set and correct a class set or more. It also sets a precedent for the other departments - are the English and Business departments also giving exams??

Yes, we all decided to give exams, I know it’s extra work but we all felt that the CBA wasn’t an accurate way to evaluate what the students know. Can see what people think in relation to not doing tests but feel the benefit to the students outweighs this.

mtoutlemonde

Moody_mona wrote: »

This has been a killer, I didn't anticipate how much time would be spent on cba related activities, it ended up being far more than three weeks.

And the stress!!!!

r93kaey5p2izun

Yes, the stress of the students has been a big issue. I hope as these CBAs becomes more commonplace that the drama attached to them settles down. Otherwise it's impossible to imagine students coping with these assessments across all subjects - many did not cope with three sets in 2nd Year this year. And many parents have been a nightmare over these CBAs so that will need to be addressed.

The loss of tuition time is a big problem. I don't know how Maths teachers will be expected to deal with this given that even the NCCA accepts the course is too long to realistically cover as it is. It's unthinkable that CBAs will be added on top of this.

mtoutlemonde

Lilliana Broad Grid wrote: »

Yes, the stress of the students has been a big issue. I hope as these CBAs becomes more commonplace that the drama attached to them settles down. Otherwise it's impossible to imagine students coping with these assessments across all subjects - many did not cope with three sets in 2nd Year this year. And many parents have been a nightmare over these CBAs so that will need to be addressed.

The loss of tuition time is a big problem. I don't know how Maths teachers will be expected to deal with this given that even the NCCA accepts the course is too long to realistically cover as it is. It's unthinkable that CBAs will be added on top of this.

Wait until every subject has a CBA and schools have decided to have exams as well - poor second year students don't deserve that much pressure. Nor do we. The quicker this JCT gets binned the better!!!