Cycle Lanes in Phoenix Park

papu

Bought a new bike, went for a spin up and down chesterfield avenue today on the "Bike Lane". Pedestrians every 100m, whole families, buggies, kids. Asking them to move to the pedestrian lane I was told to "Get over myself" "f** off" etc. etc. one lady even told me to use the "bike lane!:rolleyes:".

I would have thought the signs on the bike path are fairly self explanatory, do they need to put up more explicit signage? How do other people get on? Is this what it's like every weekend??:(

ThisRegard

Yes, so just saunter around them or use the road. With the warm weather the place is crowded so easier to just expect it.

John_Rambo

It's a bit like driving in Dublin city centre on a summers Saturday evening, pedestrians all over the road. Just take it handy, no point in saying anything.

papu

ThisRegard wrote: »

Yes, so just saunter around them or use the road. With the warm weather the place is crowded so easier to just expect it.

Damn.... the road was bumper to bumper, its frustrating to slow down or go on the grass, can't be safe/ good for the slick tyres either...

papu

John_Rambo wrote: »

It's a bit like driving in Dublin city centre on a summers Saturday evening, pedestrians all over the road. Just take it handy, no point in saying anything.

Any suggestions for a decent stretch of cycle lane around / out of the city?

John_Rambo

papu wrote: »

Any suggestions for a decent stretch of cycle lane around / out of the city?

In particularly good weather they tend to be mobbed. But... there's much more knowledgeable cyclists on here, they know more than me. I'm just a commuter.

uck51js9zml2yt

Today was made worse by Africa Day in Farmleigh House.

Lots of roads were closed along with parking restrictions on those that were open. This added to the number of pedestrians.

DanDublin1982

Id personally say the park wasn't even that jammed today. Got a parking spot handy enough.

uck51js9zml2yt

DanDublin1982 wrote: »

Id personally say the park wasn't even that jammed today. Got a parking spot handy enough.

Depends on the time. At 11, I got a spot in Farmleigh.:D
Leaving at 2, I couldn't see a spot anywhere on the way back to the NCR gate.

Dave_White

It's fair weather weekend. Just like you, everybody wants to go out to those comfy parks and beaches. You might want to try to cycle along royal canal, it doesn't tend to attract too much people. The bit from Ashtown to Blanchardstown is pretty "user freindly". Also Tolka Valley Park might be good try. If I were you, I'd just wake up earlier and try exploring a bit. Nothing beats that magical light quality of rising sun.

retalivity

just cycle on the road....i never use the lanes on chesterfield ave anymore purely for that reason

Carawaystick

papu wrote: »

Any suggestions for a decent stretch of cycle lane around / out of the city?

Clontarf to Sutton with a gap in the middle
Grand canal with narrow gates at the road crossings
The cycle lanes in the PP south of Chesterfield avenue
From Cornellscourt out the n11 to the M11

Are the better ones I can think of

Lumen

Use your bell, the grass or the road. The grass is fine on slicks, particularly when it's dry.

The signs are self explanatory but not obvious or frequent enough. People aren't looking out for them on what looks like a footpath.

beauf

On a sunny day or when there's an event on forget the cycle path in the park its impassable due to all the pedestrians on it.

Use the road. Ironically the walking path is usually a lot quieter. When the cycle path is unusable.

buffalo

Do we need a Park cycle lanes megathread?

beauf

The thread is really about asking where else to cycle on a sunny day.

Fattes

I was in the park as a pedestrian yesterday, I am a fair weather road cyclist (Use it for fitness in off season).
Pedestrians everywhere in the cycle lanes yep, also made worse by people parking beside them and walking on them to get to their cars,
HOWEVER
The attitude of some cyclist using them is horrendous, yesterdays was one of those days in the park, road closures, a big event, lots of work setting up bloom, massive q for the zoo. While walking in the grass along side the cycle path, on the fence side I had a cyclist screaming at me to get out of the way. She then stopped to inform me it was a cycle path, I asked her did the cycle path extend to the grass and her answer was Yes, this is our part of the park!

irishrover99

I've probably done about 8000/9000 km around the park on my bike and always use the road unless i'm on a easy spin and then use the lanes with caution. I was in the park yesterday in the car with the kids and it was rammed. I got in just before it got busy but it took me a while to get out due to traffic.

Ill have to agree with anyone saying yesterday was not the day to be having a go at pedestrians. There is not much they could have done. The police only closed roads and done no other traffic management and the place was a mess. Anyone cycling should have seen this and just went somewhere else. At least that's what i would have done.

ted1

Fattes wrote: »

I was in the park as a pedestrian yesterday, I am a fair weather road cyclist (Use it for fitness in off season).
Pedestrians everywhere in the cycle lanes yep, also made worse by people parking beside them and walking on them to get to their cars,
HOWEVER
The attitude of some cyclist using them is horrendous, yesterdays was one of those days in the park, road closures, a big event, lots of work setting up bloom, massive q for the zoo. While walking in the grass along side the cycle path, on the fence side I had a cyclist screaming at me to get out of the way. She then stopped to inform me it was a cycle path, I asked her did the cycle path extend to the grass and her answer was Yes, this is our part of the park!

If she was in a car she'd be beeping her horn. Would she have an equally bad attitude, beat in mind a cyclist was killed recently in the park CBeebies side of a collision with a pedestrian in a cycle lane

beauf

That's why you should avoid the paths.

Not have arguments.

DanDublin1982

ted1 wrote: »

If she was in a car she'd be beeping her horn. Would she have an equally bad attitude, beat in mind a cyclist was killed recently in the park CBeebies side of a collision with a pedestrian in a cycle lane

Doubt she'd have been on the grass in her car...

Fattes

ted1 wrote: »

If she was in a car she'd be beeping her horn. Would she have an equally bad attitude, beat in mind a cyclist was killed recently in the park CBeebies side of a collision with a pedestrian in a cycle lane

Well aware of the recent tragedy in the park, she was cycling quickly and aggressively on a very busy park, and had an attitude about it and was not the only one yesterday.

average_runner

Fattes wrote: »

I was in the park as a pedestrian yesterday, I am a fair weather road cyclist (Use it for fitness in off season).
Pedestrians everywhere in the cycle lanes yep, also made worse by people parking beside them and walking on them to get to their cars,
HOWEVER
The attitude of some cyclist using them is horrendous, yesterdays was one of those days in the park, road closures, a big event, lots of work setting up bloom, massive q for the zoo. While walking in the grass along side the cycle path, on the fence side I had a cyclist screaming at me to get out of the way. She then stopped to inform me it was a cycle path, I asked her did the cycle path extend to the grass and her answer was Yes, this is our part of the park!

Its pretty impossible not to walk on the cycle lanes in the Phoenix park to get to your car, because some idiot put the cycle lanes in the wrong place. Its a nightmare park when trying to get kids out of the car and onto the correct walkway with people going way to fast on the cycle lanes in that environment.

People shouldn't be walking up and down the lanes but the cyclist need to slow down there also

TheExile1878

average_runner wrote: »

People shouldn't be walking up and down the lanes but the cyclist need to slow down there also

Never going to happen, not when they routinely ride on pavements and pedestrianised areas. Knocked into again this morning off Dame Street.

Fattes

average_runner wrote: »

Its pretty impossible not to walk on the cycle lanes in the Phoenix park to get to your car, because some idiot put the cycle lanes in the wrong place. Its a nightmare park when trying to get kids out of the car and onto the correct walkway with people going way to fast on the cycle lanes in that environment.

People shouldn't be walking up and down the lanes but the cyclist need to slow down there also

Could never figure out why they are not inside the fence like the footpath, only reason was not to alter the original fence.

average_runner

Fattes wrote: »

Could never figure out why they are not inside the fence like the footpath, only reason was not to alter the original fence.

It floods alot in there and if the cycle lane was in there if would be quiet slippy at times, so not safe!

Bloggsie

retalivity wrote: »

just cycle on the road....i never use the lanes on chesterfield ave anymore purely for that reason

+1 for that, too many bodies on it & some that cross over it dont even look before hand.

beauf

Its ok in the morning, if you are commuting. Less so in the evening now the weather is a bit better.

ThisRegard

average_runner wrote: »

Its pretty impossible not to walk on the cycle lanes in the Phoenix park to get to your car, because some idiot put the cycle lanes in the wrong place. Its a nightmare park when trying to get kids out of the car and onto the correct walkway with people going way to fast on the cycle lanes in that environment.

Yip, this always come up when on this topic, and there's always people who still have issue with you when you raise it, telling you you shouldn't be there anyway, we don't care if you have kids. It was suggested recently that a woman with a young baby should have no problems lifting the buggy, with a kid and all the paraphernalia, over the fence, to get to the footpath quicker.

average_runner

ThisRegard wrote: »

Yip, this always come up when on this topic, and there's always people who still have issue with you when you raise it, telling you you shouldn't be there anyway, we don't care if you have kids. It was suggested recently that a woman with a young baby should have no problems lifting the buggy, with a kid and all the paraphernalia, over the fence, to get to the footpath quicker.

It was more than likely said by someone that's not a parent or had a little kid over 10 years ago!

beauf

Doesn't really matter the reasons. Its is how it is.

On a busy day I often go around by the zoo or the magazine in order to have a nice cycle and avoid the walkers.

CramCycle

TheExile1878 wrote: »

Never going to happen, not when they routinely ride on pavements and pedestrianised areas. Knocked into again this morning off Dame Street.

You seem to get it worse than anyone. Are you sure you were not walking on the road?

TheExile1878

Going for "you're" were you ??

CramCycle

TheExile1878 wrote: »

Going for "you're" were you ??

Thank you for pointing that out, and glad you could translate it for anyone who may have not understood what I was asking.

So back to the question. Are you incredibly unlucky or are you standing on the roadway, or maybe your exaggerating what has happened ever so slightly?

Roadhawk

If its not illegal to walk in a cycle track then people are going to do it. Regardless of how inconvenient it is for a cyclist its going to happen.

poochiem

Cycled each way through the park yesterday, didn't know there was an event on but that explains the number using the cycle lanes. I got a couple of frights with kids wandering onto the lane in front of me while they're mammies were distracted so I moved onto the road - naturally I was almost doored ten seconds later only for letting an enormous roar.

Anyway, it's a place that'll be busy, make allowances and 'mind that child'!

ThisRegard

Knowing kids you should expect then to run in front of you if they're anywhere near the cycle lane. Rather than get a fright when they do so, be pleasantly surprised if they don't.

Bloggsie

as previously posted, the PP is not to bad in the mornings, in the evenings the park is much busier, I just use the road, keep 1 foot unclipped in case of emergency and move into the hard shoulder to allow cars pass when their is nothing parked in it.

Bloom starts this week so the park will be even busier!

2RockMountain

Roadhawk wrote: »

If its not illegal to walk in a cycle track then people are going to do it. Regardless of how inconvenient it is for a cyclist its going to happen.

Don't think legality or otherwise have much to do with it, tbh. People ignore all aspects of the law all the time, speed limits, red lights, phoning etc.

average_runner wrote: »

Its pretty impossible not to walk on the cycle lanes in the Phoenix park to get to your car, because some idiot put the cycle lanes in the wrong place. Its a nightmare park when trying to get kids out of the car and onto the correct walkway with people going way to fast on the cycle lanes in that environment.

People shouldn't be walking up and down the lanes but the cyclist need to slow down there also

It's pretty impossible not to cross the cycle lanes, but it is very, very possible not to walk on the lanes.

beauf

You can forget using them in the evening, completely when Bloom is on. Just go a different way.

Roadhawk

2RockMountain wrote: »

Don't think legality or otherwise have much to do with it, tbh. People ignore all aspects of the law all the time, speed limits, red lights, phoning etc.


It's pretty impossible not to cross the cycle lanes, but it is very, very possible not to walk on the lanes.

Well if its legal i presume people would be more inclined to do it. Im sure you are right that some pedestrians would still use the cycle track if it was legal or not but i suppose they are entitled to use it at the moment?

papu

Roadhawk wrote: »

Well if its legal i presume people would be more inclined to do it. Im sure you are right that some pedestrians would still use the cycle track if it was legal or not but i suppose they are entitled to use it at the moment?

The paths specifically have a no walking sign on them. So they are very much not entitled to use it.

Fireball XL5

The issue of entitlement or otherwise is not determined solely by the signs on the path. Any question relating to the position concerning the cycle paths depends on what is contained in the bye laws of the Park. Unfortunately all I can find on the web is an abbreviated version of the bye laws which makes no specific reference to the cycle paths. A copy of the bye laws are posted at the entrance to the Park. Might be worth a read the next time someone on this forum is passing.

papu

Fireball XL5 wrote: »

The issue of entitlement or otherwise is not determined solely by the signs on the path. Any question relating to the position concerning the cycle paths depends on what is contained in the bye laws of the Park. Unfortunately all I can find on the web is an abbreviated version of the bye laws which makes no specific reference to the cycle paths. A copy of the bye laws are posted at the entrance to the Park. Might be worth a read the next time someone on this forum is passing.

(7) No bicycle, tricycle, or other vehicle shall be ridden or driven at any time on or across any footpath in the Park.
http://www.irishstatutebook.ie/eli/1926/sro/6/made/en/print

(14) No person shall molest, annoy, or otherwise interfere with any other person using or enjoying the Park in a lawful manner.

So really the only place is the road or the designated bike path...

If you tried walking on a designated bike path in any other European city you'd be done for.

beauf

I never seen it enforced in any serious way in the park. Or anywhere in Dublin for that matter.

Fattes

papu wrote: »

(7) No bicycle, tricycle, or other vehicle shall be ridden or driven at any time on or across any footpath in the Park.
http://www.irishstatutebook.ie/eli/1926/sro/6/made/en/print

(14) No person shall molest, annoy, or otherwise interfere with any other person using or enjoying the Park in a lawful manner.

So really the only place is the road or the designated bike path...

If you tried walking on a designated bike path in any other European city you'd be done for.

How do you suggest people get to their cars? Genuine question, the location of the cycle path is a big issue.

cython

Fattes wrote: »

How do you suggest people get to their cars? Genuine question, the location of the cycle path is a big issue.

There is a significant difference between crossing a path with due care and attention for access, and travelling along it. For example, cars drive across footpaths to access driveways, etc. all the time. However driving along said path, or parking on it, is rightly illegal.

To be straight, I don't think anyone has suggested an issue with people crossing the cycle path (I'm not re-reading every post to confirm, mind!), but there is definitely a problem with people meandering along it and creating obstructions and hazards for cyclists. And I include cyclists travelling against the normal flow of traffic in that too (i.e. I would reasonably expect cyclists on each side to be travelling in the same direction as the traffic nearest them, in line with the orientation of the majority of the painted signs on the road - all of them excluding yields at roadways, AFAIK)

Bristolscale7

The paths in Phoenix park and multi-use paths in general (the Phoenix Park ones perhaps were not conceived as such) are not safe. Avoid them. Use the road.

Fattes

Cython, people will walk along them even for short distances, while returning to their cars on Chesterfield avenue, due to their location and the proximity to available parking in the park.

GasBrakeHonk

The lanes are poorly designed - thats a given. Rather then look at how we could restrict the movements of cyclists and pedestrians we need to look at how the park treats cars. If the purpose of the park is for leisure usage then the car should be accommodated but not prioritized. I do remember a proposal from the OPW to close the park to through traffic back in the late 90’s which was vigorously opposed by the local TDs. I don’t think that we need to go that far but we could

Make the speed limit in the park 20 kph for all traffic including bikes and strictly enforce it - including the use of average speed camera’s across the junctions.

Extend the hours where the main avenue to closed to traffic between Mountjoy / Phoenix roundabouts. Diverting the traffic via the North road.

Break out the tins of pain. Make the main avenue the bike lane that cars can “share” . Its common enough in Baltimore to see the bike lane markings on the center section of the road

It’ll never happen of course….

buffalo

GasBrakeHonk wrote: »

Make the speed limit in the park 20 kph for all traffic including bikes

How do you expect people on bikes to be able to tell when they're speeding?