Are water meters still being installed?

Redbishop

gladrags wrote: »

"Are water meters still being installed?

That question is more relevant now than a week or two ago.

The most logical course of action at this point,is not to install or replace any meters.

They are simply not fit for purpose,at this point.

Why?

FTA69

I'd imagine Irish Water will keep installing meters as it's a vehicle by which they can continue to extract money from the public purse, now that there's an uncertainty about the future of charges I'd imagine they'll even speed up installation so as to gouge as much coin as possible before it gets wound up.

Make no mistake though, the charges have been stopped and are unlikely to come back in due to a fantastic grassroots initiative rejecting them.

blackcard

FTA69 wrote: »

I'd imagine Irish Water will keep installing meters as it's a vehicle by which they can continue to extract money from the public purse, now that there's an uncertainty about the future of charges I'd imagine they'll even speed up installation so as to gouge as much coin as possible before it gets wound up.

Make no mistake though, the charges have been stopped and are unlikely to come back in due to a fantastic grassroots initiative rejecting them.

You are probably right about water charges coming in, the rest of your post doesn't make sense

gladrags

blackcard wrote: »

The meters are useful irrespective of whether water charges are in place or not. They provide information on the amount of water usage on the private side thus helping to assist in leak identification on the public side

I was specifically referring to their main purpose in relation to charges.

The problem with leakage is mainly on the main piping systems,household leakage is minimum when compared to same.

A good plumber would resolve leakage from the householders perspective.

blackcard

gladrags wrote: »

I was specifically referring to their main purpose in relation to charges.

The problem with leakage is mainly on the main piping systems,household leakage is minimum when compared to same.

A good plumber would resolve leakage from the householders perspective.

But how would a person know that there was leakage on their premises without a meter unless there was visible evidence which in most cases there is not?

Redbishop

gladrags wrote: »

I was specifically referring to their main purpose in relation to charges.

The problem with leakage is mainly on the main piping systems,household leakage is minimum when compared to same.

A good plumber would resolve leakage from the householders perspective.

http://www.water.ie/news/irish-water-launches-inte/

Spanish Eyes

I have a meter.

There were no protests against them here.

I wonder if those without meters will EVER get them now?

So how will that work going forward like, will households like mine have to pay by consumption, (because it can be tracked), but those without meters pay a flat charge and power wash their drives, and wash their cars, and have twenty power showers a day or what!

I am a bit worried, but I was on holliers when the meters were installed. So I couldn't even say to the installers that I didn't want one. Not that they listened anyway, they were on a contract and only doing their jobs in fairness.

What an absolute clusterf, really.

Redbishop

Spanish Eyes wrote: »

I have a meter.

There were no protests against them here.

I wonder if those without meters will EVER get them now?

So how will that work going forward like, will households like mine have to pay by consumption, (because it can be tracked), but those without meters pay a flat charge and power wash their drives, and wash their cars, and have twenty power showers a day or what!

I am a bit worried, but I was on holliers when the meters were installed. So I couldn't even say to the installers that I didn't want one. Not that they listened anyway, they were on a contract and only doing their jobs in fairness.

What an absolute clusterf, really.

Absolutely.
I paid my charges and have defended their introduction, now I hear they are suspended and although they promise to follow non payers for arrears I cant see them getting anywhere with it.
Now if they re introduce them later I think I ll take a year out of paying the next time to get me back even.
Clusterf is right.

gladrags

Redbishop wrote: »

http://www.water.ie/news/irish-water-launches-inte/

Blackser is referring to the wise ones who decided not to have a meter installed.

Come to think of it,how would we know if the leak was fixed,if as blackser says,there is no sign of a leak above ground.

Anyway I would not trust a water meter that was supplied by the owner of the Sindo.

Off to watch the Reds.

Redbishop

gladrags wrote: »

Blackser is referring to the wise ones who decided not to have a meter installed.

Come to think of it,how would we know if the leak was fixed,if as blackser says,there is no sign of a leak above ground.

Anyway I would not trust a water meter that was supplied by the owner of the Sindo.

Off to watch the Reds.

Yea me too. See you on PC wen we get it back.

Spanish Eyes

Redbishop wrote: »

Absolutely.
I paid my charges and have defended their introduction, now I hear they are suspended and although they promise to follow non payers for arrears I cant see them getting anywhere with it.
Now if they re introduce them later I think I ll take a year out of paying the next time to get me back even.
Clusterf is right.

I paid them myself, didn't mind the meter being installed really, as it was a flat charge anyway, so all were treated equally AT THAT POINT!

I'm not so certain about things in the future.

But I can assure you, even though I am a little mouse sometimes, I will roar like a lion if metered and non metered customers are treated differently.

Apparently in the UK you can opt for metered or non metered charges. That is the way to go, IF the charges are reintroduced.

I'll settle back for a bit anyway and see how it all pans out.

Ally Dick

They're actually installing them since last week in Rosehill estate Wicklow. There was a picket on the estate by protestors last year and they kept them out. Now I think they have given up

Going Forward

blackcard wrote: »

The meters are useful irrespective of whether water charges are in place or not. They provide information on the amount of water usage on the private side thus helping to assist in leak identification on the public side

How does a domestic meter help to identify a leak on the network?

It only registers water flowing one way through it, at the point of no return where the network terminates and private piping starts.

blackcard

Going Forward wrote: »

How does a domestic meter help to identify a leak on the network?

It only registers water flowing one way through it, at the point of no return where the network terminates and private piping starts.

If you have say 1000 cubic metres of water passing a meter at point A on the public waterman and 800 cubic metres passing point B, you check all the domestic meters in between. If the sum of the domestic meters was 200 cubic metres, you know that there is no leak on the public main. If the sum of the domestic meters was 10 cubic metres, you know that that there is a leak of 190 cubic metres per day between point A and point B. Without the knowledge from the domestic meters, you don't know how much is being lost on the public side

clairek6

No sign of them in my home town in galway

Spanish Eyes

Well they should just install meters with the objective of detecting leaks and not charging by consumption so.

But that will never wash will it in the long run?

tomwaterford

Spanish Eyes wrote: »

Well they should just install meters with the objective of detecting leaks and not charging by consumption so.

But that will never wash will it in the long run?

What if it's leaking between the meters as out my way it could be a couple of hundred metres between houses??

MilesMorales1

They've spent the past 2 weeks installing them on my estate.

blackcard

tomwaterford wrote: »

What if it's leaking between the meters as out my way it could be a couple of hundred metres between houses??

If you know it is on the public mains, you can use sonar equipment to try and detect where the leaks are. Easier to find larger leaks.

Going Forward

blackcard wrote: »

If you have say 1000 cubic metres of water passing a meter at point A on the public waterman and 800 cubic metres passing point B, you check all the domestic meters in between. If the sum of the domestic meters was 200 cubic metres, you know that there is no leak on the public main. If the sum of the domestic meters was 10 cubic metres, you know that that there is a leak of 190 cubic metres per day between point A and point B. Without the knowledge from the domestic meters, you don't know how much is being lost on the public side

I appreciate that answer because it's the most comprehensive one I've read yet, they can give additional confirmation that high pressure leakages are occurring elsewhere.

Shouldn't district meters also be able to give this information?

Yet all that is currently being mentioned by IW are the leaks that are being identified domestic property.

We have never heard anything about successful interim targets for fixing mains leaks or even how they propose to meet them.

With them setting aside a budget of just €150m annually for leak reduction it's easy to see why it'll be 2040 before they're half what they are now. 1% per year.

That's much the same figure as was set in recent years by the DOE prior to IW for mains rehabilitation.

http://www.per.gov.ie/wp-content/uploads/Topical-Issues-41.-Irish-Water.pdf

The Sidewards Man

Are water meters calibrated?

Lavinia

Ah now the leaks are the reason for installing meters and not the billing?

Going Forward

The Sidewards Man wrote: »

Are water meters calibrated?

Phil's answer evades answering that question:

https://www.kildarestreet.com/wrans/?id=2013-04-16a.1735

As does Alan's:

https://www.kildarestreet.com/wrans/?id=2014-07-15a.1094

my3cents

We were told a month ago that we would have a meter installed last week, not sign of any work being done or of IW contractors in the area?

Water John

Yes, meters are calibrated and should be redone about every 8 years.


Bulk metering will identify 75 to 80 % of water leakage.
1 in 20 houses have a leak, between meter point and kitchen tap.
Only 20 to 25% of leakage is on the customer side.

Usage in Ireland is low about 80 to 110 litrs per person per day.

This may mean leakage is actually higher than originally projected.

Repairing mains leaks, increases water pressure, resulting in a second round of leaks. There is a well used international methodology of doing this. do the two rounds of repairs. Also identify particular stretches that are repeat offenders and replace.

With the majority metered they should finish out the process at this stage.

Read once or twice a year to check for leakage.

Establish a clear process to remove lead piping and dose with orthophosphates in the meantime.

http://www.irishexaminer.com/ireland/chemical-added-to-water-to-combat-lead-pipes-347879.html

Why we need to do a pilot study on international practice beats me.

12Phase

If the government has any PR sense they would have combined water meter and fibre to home installation.

You could have had a neutral, state owned gigabit fibre network going to every premises, then just select a provider.

Instead, all stick, no carrot (unless they also hit you with the carrot).

Water John

Water meter reading is quite low tech.
Could the installation of smart meters with electricity over the next few years, be an opportunity?