Is He A Good Guy or a Bad Guy?

beks101

Things aren't really black or white in real life. I think this thought process that guys are either superheroes or villains is a bit narrow-minded and probably detrimental to your dating life in a general sense. Someone wanting casual sex doesn't make them a "bad guy", it just makes them a guy who wants casual sex.

All that aside, some guy I was dating telling me it wasn't dating and that he "wasn't the relationship type" and "wouldn't get married" and all of these negative things you heard would be an immediate indicator to me that I was barking up the wrong tree. It wouldn't make him a "challenge" or someone that I could change into wanting these things just because I liked them - those days I reserved for my youthful early-20s new-to-dating phase where the emotionally unavailable men seemed to hold some sort of an enigmatic appeal.

The fact is, for whatever reason or multitude of reasons, this lad wasn't for the taking. Not emotionally open to you and not on the same page in terms of the things he wanted/didn't want. It doesn't make him good or bad and it doesn't mean you've been deceived or wronged; it happens and that's dating. Next time try to not let your own feelings cloud your judgement, even if that person is a friend or colleague etc. Try to take a see-how-it-goes approach to dating without getting too invested and take people at their word.

njs030

You had sex multiple times over a period of months....How does that mean he dumped you when he got what he wanted? If that was the case it would have been after the first time.
He just decided he didn't want a relationship with you, that's the long and short of it.

Lisacatlover

I think you want these believe this narrative of him being 'a bad guy that played you and took what he wanted' because that's easier for you to deal with than what seems to be the case: he told from the outset he didn't want a relationship, you chased him anyway hoping he'd change his mind, but after dating you for a period of time, he still didn't want a relationship with you.

The first way it's all on him, he's a bastard and you're a victim, he'd have done the same to anyone, nothing to do with you. The second way, he just didn't like you enough to want to be your boyfriend, which hurts you more to think about.

meeeeh

Count your lucky stars, you just avoided somebody who has enough problems for both of you. He is depressed, doesn't work and he doesn't leave the house. Relying on getting some rent money to survive isn't exactly great. What happens if renter stops paying and he has trouble getting them evicted. It seems you were seeing someone who has plenty of issues and is doing very little to sort them.

You were not being played. He doesn't feel the same as you do. Weather he never felt the same is not clear but who cares, you just had a lucky escape and in a while you will appreciate that.

dellas1979

You are really picking this apart, aren't you?

Lookit, from what Ive read, there were big massive red flags from the very beginning.

You either chose to ignore them or you didn't see them. You seemed to have build up an idealistic version of this guy before you even knew him.

Rule 1: Learn to see the red flags. If it feels like a game, it usually is. Guys who are interested do not leave you guessing. Time to get out of there.
Rule 2: If a guy is not meeting your expectations of what you want/need. Time to get out of there.
Rule 3: Listen. Listen to what someone is saying. Look at their behaviour.
Rule 4: You cant change someone. Too often us ladies "try" so hard to help/change a guy, and its never going to happen.
Rule 5: Be realistic. Again, as ladies, if a guy isn't coming upto par in what we want/need, we fill in the gaps. We idealise a version of a person in our heads.
Rule 6: Have respect and courage for yourself to walk away.
Rule 7: Stop blaming yourself if things don't work out. Sometimes they just don't (different views, on different pages).

Sexual predator is beyond a strong word to call someone who just didn't see a relationship with you. And it is quite naieve.

Shocker-Ive had sex with guys Id no commitment to. Or didn't see a future with. Does that make me a sexual predator, or is it different because Im female?

Distorted

Thanks for your responses (I think!). Some very harsh views on here!

I wouldn't have had sex with him if I didn't think there was a prospect of a relationship, and despite his initial remarks, he led me to believe that we were in a relationship with a future. He actually corrected himself pretty quickly regarding his initial remarks and made comments about "our relationship" quite a lot. I thought it was going quite well and that he seemed very into me and that he was pretty keen. But as soon as I told him I was moving back to our city, he changed and then dumped me.

I didn't pick up on the red flags because I've known him for 10 years, I know his family and I didn't have any idea that he was depressed or long term unemployed. Before I moved away, I knew him as a well educated man in a good job and although I knew he'd voluntarily given it up, I just assumed it was because he was setting up his own business or something. Its been 3 years since he worked now and he doesn't want to do anything about it or about having no money. He's so different from what he used to be. If it had been someone on Tinder like that, I would have run a mile!

Also, we were part of a group of mutual friends and the women all told me to give him a chance because he was shy, while the men all tried to give me subtle warnings about him. Looking at the way he treats other people (he doesn't really have any friends left), he does just use them when it suits him and they've all got fed up with him or lost contact. Of course, being female, I assumed he was just shy and inexperienced with women. That's certainly not true.

Its true that he didn't just have sex with me once and then dump me. And he didn't expect me to pay his share either, which is not the actions of a bad guy. I did enjoy spending time with him. He's just that he's not really what I thought he was (the secret girlfriend in another city he told no-one about shocked me). If all of that makes me a bad person, then so be it. I don't think I am. I just really liked the guy and wanted to give him a chance, and now I don't like him at all.

I've said nothing bad to him and wished him well but I often wonder if people actually told him how bad his behaviour can be, it would benefit him far more than people just blanking him and cutting him off (which is what they do, he couldn't understand why and I was too kind to tell him). I don't think depression (if that's what he has) excuses treating people (not just me) badly.

I know he will try to come back at some stage, because he has flirted on and off with me for years now, and every time I show signs of getting over him, he improves his act for a bit. But dumping me has broke whatever hold he has over me.

Jimmy Bottlehead

Nobody thinks you're a bad person. If anything, you just seem naive and somewhat immature when it comes to relationships.

You dated someone who doesn't have his **** together, and you've learned a number of lessons; things like, listening to what someone is actually saying, and not hearing what you want to hear. And also that someone desiring just sex doesn't make them a bad person.

You seem to be realising a few things, but I would advise you to really try to take a lot of what's been said on board and grow from it. Best of luck.

sbsquarepants

Distorted wrote: »

Thanks for your responses (I think!). Some very harsh views on here!

.

Harsh but accurate I think (in general) and very much to your credit, you seem to be well able to listen to them. This trait is priceless and will serve you well.
What's obvious to outsiders is sometimes impossible to see up close especially when you're interested in someone - there can be a big tendency to see and hear what you want rather than what's really going on.

Don't be so harsh on yourself, or on him - you took a chance, it didn't work out, shít happens.
I don't think there is any villain in this story to be honest, just 2 people who wanted different things. Forget it and move on - there's no harm done at the end of the day and precious little to be gained from obsessing over it.

CaraMay

Op you clearly didn't give the full picture in your earlier posts and then get irritated when people reply based on the info you did get.

We can only answer based on what you tell us. In saying that, you don't seem to want to take any responsibility for this so its just easier if you blame him and think he's a bad guy. Ok so - he's a bag guy, you are a good person and did nothing wrong.

Distorted

CaraMay wrote: »

Op you clearly didn't give the full picture in your earlier posts and then get irritated when people reply based on the info you did get.

We can only answer based on what you tell us. In saying that, you don't seem to want to take any responsibility for this so its just easier if you blame him and think he's a bad guy. Ok so - he's a bag guy, you are a good person and did nothing wrong.

I'm not irritated, just a bit shocked at the tendency to lay blame on someone who only had a relationship with a guy, got hurt and is trying very hard to get over them. If I had to explain everything in the initial post, it would probably have exceeded the word limit.

I'm not a naughty schoolchild who needs to take responsibility. But maybe you should explain what "taking responsibility" means and why you think its so important and why I'm not doing it? What does it matter? I've always successfully avoided player types in the past as they're generally quite easy to spot, so its not like I need to learn some strict lesson about life in general. If I wanted to have casual sex, I'd go to some club or go on Tinder, not do it with someone I had feelings for. I told this guy right at the beginning I didn't do friends with benefits type of things and he seemed to accept that. He was saying the right things, and I wouldn't have let it continue if he hadn't been.

I don't think anyone else can know the full dynamic of what goes on between two people, but FWIW I don't think stating some get out clauses then retracting them before you have sex with someone stops you being a player. I don't think having sex with someone more than once stops someone from being a player. I don't think he was genuine, if you understand what I mean by that phrase. I had a false impression of this guy, based on knowing him for 10 years, and he's quite secretive, so I still don't really know whats going on or if I've had the full truth. That's an instinctive feeling.

osarusan

CaraMay wrote: »

Op you clearly didn't give the full picture in your earlier posts and then get irritated when people reply based on the info you did get.

+1.

The difference between how 'bad' the guy was portrayed in the OP and in later posts keeps getting bigger.

OP, you seem very keen for people to agree that he was a bad guy who treated you very badly and deceived you and consequently you are right to be angry/bitter about it.

But most people on here just don't seem to agree with you.

Jimmy Bottlehead

Distorted wrote: »

I'm not irritated, just a bit shocked at the tendency to lay blame on someone who only had a relationship with a guy, got hurt and is trying very hard to get over them. If I had to explain everything in the initial post, it would probably have exceeded the word limit.

I'm not a naughty schoolchild who needs to take responsibility. But maybe you should explain what "taking responsibility" means and why you think its so important and why I'm not doing it? What does it matter? I've always successfully avoided player types in the past as they're generally quite easy to spot, so its not like I need to learn some strict lesson about life in general. If I wanted to have casual sex, I'd go to some club or go on Tinder, not do it with someone I had feelings for. I told this guy right at the beginning I didn't do friends with benefits type of things and he seemed to accept that. He was saying the right things, and I wouldn't have let it continue if he hadn't been.

I don't think anyone else can know the full dynamic of what goes on between two people, but FWIW I don't think stating some get out clauses then retracting them before you have sex with someone stops you being a player. I don't think having sex with someone more than once stops someone from being a player. I don't think he was genuine, if you understand what I mean by that phrase. I had a false impression of this guy, based on knowing him for 10 years, and he's quite secretive, so I still don't really know whats going on or if I've had the full truth. That's an instinctive feeling.

Referring to the bolded parts... yes you did need to learn a lesson. And that lesson was you're not half as good at spotting 'players' as you thought you were.

Frankly I don't think this guy was a player. He saw you over a long period, and didn't want to pursue a relationship with you.

The part that stings (as previous posters have said) is that he has rejected you. He likely feels he can do better than you, and you can't accept that rejection. So you have to write him off as a 'player' and a 'bad guy'.

And there's the other lesson to learn. That not everybody is going to feel the same toward you as you do about them.

woodchuck

OP it sounds like the two of you were just looking for different things and now you're trying to make yourself feel better by placing the blame on him. From what you've said, nobody did anything 'wrong' here and there's nobody to blame. These things just happen and there's always something to be learned as others here have outlined. It doesn't mean you did anything wrong; we can always learn and grow from our experiences.

HiGlo

Distorted wrote: »

I don't think anyone else can know the full dynamic of what goes on between two people, but FWIW I don't think stating some get out clauses then retracting them before you have sex with someone stops you being a player. I don't think having sex with someone more than once stops someone from being a player. I don't think he was genuine, if you understand what I mean by that phrase. I had a false impression of this guy, based on knowing him for 10 years, and he's quite secretive, so I still don't really know whats going on or if I've had the full truth. That's an instinctive feeling.

I think this is the aspect that CaraMay is referring to. Your focus seems to be on the "wrong" he did to you, and not how you also didn't help yourself...

I understand that you feel fooled by him and feel like he lead you on, but by the same rationale, you opted to focus on the positives he said to you (oh I didn't mean that etc) and ignore the negatives (I'm not a relationship person, I'm only looking for sex). You need to pay attention to both - one does not cancel out the other.

I suppose the long distance thing you two had going on suited him cause it was meet up, sex, then you're gone again... You moving back and possibly needing more from him made him back off and make it clear that that isn't what he wanted.

I feel bad for you cause it's not nice to be feeling like you do now at the moment, but I agree with some of the others, you need to keep both eyes open when stepping into things with a guy who started the conversation with "I'm only looking for sex".....

Distorted

Jimmy Bottlehead wrote: »

The part that stings (as previous posters have said) is that he has rejected you. He likely feels he can do better than you, and you can't accept that rejection. So you have to write him off as a 'player' and a 'bad guy'.

Cheers for that comment. Don't sugar coat the pill or anything. Hey, one good thing about the guy I was seeing, he didn't come out with deliberately mean or nasty statements. I'm sure we all have our points of criticism, but if I'm lucky, I'll never turn into a person who utters a phrase like that.

If you do want to talk in terms like that, we were equally good looking, I don't have to pursue guys at all, and even though he was unemployed and depressed, I'd never say that about him.

Its almost like on here, you look on any woman who has sex as wicked and deserving of any fate that befalls her unless she looks upon every sexual encounter with rose tinted glasses and counts herself lucky for a man showing a little attention in her. Its pretty old fashioned and a bit odd.

Penny Tration

Distorted wrote: »

Cheers for that comment. Don't sugar coat the pill or anything. Hey, one good thing about the guy I was seeing, he didn't come out with deliberately mean or nasty statements. I'm sure we all have our points of criticism, but if I'm lucky, I'll never turn into a person who utters a phrase like that.

He hasn't said anything bad. He's said what everyone thinks when they dump someone - the dumpee is no longer what they want, and not enough. You simply weren't enough, in his eyes.

If you do want to talk in terms like that, we were equally good looking, I don't have to pursue guys at all, and even though he was unemployed and depressed, I'd never say that about him.

It's nothing to do with looks. He decided, for whatever reason, that you weren't what he wanted. That's it.

Its almost like on here, you look on any woman who has sex as wicked and deserving of any fate that befalls her unless she looks upon every sexual encounter with rose tinted glasses and counts herself lucky for a man showing a little attention in her. Its pretty old fashioned and a bit odd.

Nobody has done that at all. actually, the only judgemental attitude towards women having sex in this thread is your own insistence that you don't do casual sex, and calling him a 'sexual predator' because he does!

Look, the guy told you you weren't dating. He took that back, and you chose not to acknowledge that massive, glaring red flag.

He did nothing wrong. He dated you for a period of time, realised it wasn't what he wanted, so ended it.

Have you ever dumped someone before? Does it make you a sexual predator if you do? All he did was date you, realise you weren't what he wanted, and had the decency to end it rather than string you along.

But you don't want to hear that. you're looking for every excuse in the book to make yourself out to be some poor, taken advantage of lady, and he a big bad sexual predator bastard. He's not, and you're not.

You dated, it didn't work out. You still chose to have sex with him, so stop blaming him for sleeping with you.

CaraMay

Distorted wrote: »

Cheers for that comment. Don't sugar coat the pill or anything. Hey, one good thing about the guy I was seeing, he didn't come out with deliberately mean or nasty statements. I'm sure we all have our points of criticism, but if I'm lucky, I'll never turn into a person who utters a phrase like that.

If you do want to talk in terms like that, we were equally good looking, I don't have to pursue guys at all, and even though he was unemployed and depressed, I'd never say that about him.

Its almost like on here, you look on any woman who has sex as wicked and deserving of any fate that befalls her unless she looks upon every sexual encounter with rose tinted glasses and counts herself lucky for a man showing a little attention in her. Its pretty old fashioned and a bit odd.

Now you are gone off on a total tangent. People are taking time out of their days to give you their unbiased opinions. Looks like you 'can't handle the truth' from him or us.

Distorted

HiGlo wrote: »

I think this is the aspect that CaraMay is referring to. Your focus seems to be on the "wrong" he did to you, and not how you also didn't help yourself...

I understand that you feel fooled by him and feel like he lead you on, but by the same rationale, you opted to focus on the positives he said to you (oh I didn't mean that etc) and ignore the negatives (I'm not a relationship person, I'm only looking for sex). You need to pay attention to both - one does not cancel out the other.

I suppose the long distance thing you two had going on suited him cause it was meet up, sex, then you're gone again... You moving back and possibly needing more from him made him back off and make it clear that that isn't what he wanted.

I feel bad for you cause it's not nice to be feeling like you do now at the moment, but I agree with some of the others, you need to keep both eyes open when stepping into things with a guy who started the conversation with "I'm only looking for sex".....

No, he never said that. I said thats what I thought he was looking for, once he dumped me. I'd never have kept seeing him if he'd said something like that. He'd actually made out to me that he didn't believe in cheating, or messing people around, that he was a really decent guy, better than other men in many ways, and I thought that meant because he did pursue a relationship (of sorts) with me, he was serious. He really does like to portray himself as a Nice Guy. He even said he was looking forward to me moving back as he didn't like long distance relationships. And then suddenly he flips and tells me he's an awful person, not worth bothering with, and dumps me and goes cold. Probably as you say he was holding out as it suited him to keep me going for the sex, without having to do any of the boyfriend stuff in between.

What I did find out from him (and he was very reluctant to reveal it) is that he had another long distance relationship going on while he was flirting with me. I got varied answers from him as to how long it went on for, and he just clammed up but said he had dumped her because they had nothing in common. I don't still think he is seeing her, mainly because no-one in their right mind would put up with that treatment. I only got a hint of this in the first place because he revealed it to a friend in a fit of temper and said he would bring her to their party when he saw me with another man a couple of years back.

In general, I hope the experience doesn't make me overly judgemental of men. It would be easy to assume they are all like that, and it would be better not to get involved with anyone other than the perfect man. Also, casual sex is definately not for me.

Distorted

CaraMay wrote: »

Now you are gone off on a total tangent. People are taking time out of their days to give you their unbiased opinions. Looks like you 'can't handle the truth' from him or us.

No, I'm not. That was a vile comment. No need for it and no need to try and make someone who is hurting feel even worse about themselves. Jaysus, you could say that to anyone who has got dumped. Most people have more tact.

batmanrobin

OP, I don't think it's a case that he ended it because he thought he could do better. He sounds depressed. You being at a distance kept things safe for him. When he thought you might be moving closer and he'd actually have to engage properly with you, was obviously more than he could handle. He doesn't sound like he's in the head space for anything.

Try not to overanalyse this. It happened. Take what you can from it and try to move past it.

Rekop dog

I reckon he led you on a little, more so to get a personal confidence boost than anything else. Some people just need to be liked, and if that means continuing something that they're not even interested in they'll do it for that validation.

He 100% wasn't into you in reality though by everything you've mentioned, just seen you as easy sex. There's a strong level of denial in a lot of your posts and seem to be clinging to his mental health issues as a explanation rather than the blatantly obvious.

Distorted

Rekop dog wrote: »

I reckon he led you on a little, more so to get a personal confidence boost than anything else. Some people just need to be liked, and if that means continuing something that they're not even interested in they'll do it for that validation.

He 100% wasn't into you in reality though by everything you've mentioned, just seen you as easy sex. There's a strong level of denial in a lot of your posts and seem to be clinging to his mental health issues as a explanation rather than the blatantly obvious.

If theres a strong level of denial, its because I'm completely confused. He would say one thing and then do another which seemed to cancel it out.

I wasn't aware that he had mental health issues until this started, and I have no idea whether they would make someone behave like this or not.

The whole thing was completely confusing. Every time I've pulled back from him in the past, he's reeled me back in.

Distorted

Jaysus, I feel so down now I'm going to make sure I keep my head down and not look anyone in the eye, because obviously they'll be able to do better than me.

Jimmy Bottlehead

Distorted wrote: »

Cheers for that comment. Don't sugar coat the pill or anything. Hey, one good thing about the guy I was seeing, he didn't come out with deliberately mean or nasty statements. I'm sure we all have our points of criticism, but if I'm lucky, I'll never turn into a person who utters a phrase like that.

If you do want to talk in terms like that, we were equally good looking, I don't have to pursue guys at all, and even though he was unemployed and depressed, I'd never say that about him.

Its almost like on here, you look on any woman who has sex as wicked and deserving of any fate that befalls her unless she looks upon every sexual encounter with rose tinted glasses and counts herself lucky for a man showing a little attention in her. Its pretty old fashioned and a bit odd.

If you want a sugar-coated pill, then don't ask for honest advice and opinions in a public forum. Pretty much everyone has given a uniform answer here, including me. You just don't want to hear the truth.

I wasn't mean; as Penny Tration said, I was pointing out the obvious for anyone ending a relationship/fling with another person.
As for not being overly judgemental of 'men' - if you're willing to let the actions of one man colour your view of the other 3 billion of us, then maybe dating isn't for you. We're all different, just as all women are different.

And as for your last paragraph, Penny covered it better than I can.

Distorted wrote: »

Jaysus, I feel so down now I'm going to make sure I keep my head down and not look anyone in the eye, because obviously they'll be able to do better than me.

I'm not even going to comment on this. I recommend you re-read it to yourself though and try to look at it ias an unbiased mature adult would.

Penny Tration

Distorted wrote: »

Jaysus, I feel so down now I'm going to make sure I keep my head down and not look anyone in the eye, because obviously they'll be able to do better than me.

Honestly, I don't know if this is intended as a snarky response to people's posts that you didn't agree with, but I'm gonna assume it's genuine -

It's nothing to do with someone doing better or worse than you. I'm sure your looks are fine. I'm sure you're a good person. Not being right for one particular person doesn't mean you won't be right for the next.

I dated this guy. Mad about him, close with his mam while we were together, the works. However, I found out he was cheating on me with multiple people for the best part of a year.

Yes, I felt awful. I wasn't good enough, I wasn't enough by myself, I must be ugly, it's because I'm fat, whatever.

However, I copped on. How someone treats me, or someone deciding I'm not enough, is no reflection on me! That's their perception and they're entitled to it. it doesn't change who I am, and I've gone on to have a wonderful relationship with someone I love.

It's his perception, that's all. He didn't like you enough to want to continue, that's his choice. It's not a reflection on you.

sbsquarepants

CaraMay wrote: »

Now you are gone off on a total tangent. People are taking time out of their days to give you their unbiased opinions. Looks like you 'can't handle the truth' from him or us.

I think you're being a bit harsh on poor old distorted. She did come here after all asking the question "is he a good guy, or a bad guy?" not just slating him.
She seems to be taking what people are saying on board - opinions and attitudes take time to come round. How you feel changes a lot more slowly than the time taken to read an internet message board.

DeltaWhite

TBH OP, you are obviously very hurt, confused and dare I say - bitter about what happened with this guy.

That's fine, you're allowed to feel what you do, I don't agree with calling him a sexual predator, but that's been covered already in this thread. The only thing I will say, take time for yourself and stop analyzing this situation. Try and free your brain of thoughts about him. You will only drive yourself mad going over and over this. It's just one of those things that didn't work out, I personally don't think anyone is to blame here. I definitely think you should never go near him again either. He is not for you.

Taltos

Mod Note
OK as it's clear that the advice is starting to have a negative effect on the OP we're closing this thread.

OP, we do ask our posters to keep their posts constructive and civil. That does mean that sometimes they can be blunt, where intentionally done to hurt we jump in, but where heartfelt advice is offered all be it without the sugar coating then that advice is still valid.

Where you don't agree with such advice the best thing to do is ignore it, or report it if you believe they are being intentionally hurtful. However if some of the comments have affected you as much as they appear to we do apologise and suggest that maybe it would be more beneficial talking to someone about everything that's going on including your reactions here to help you through this rough patch.