How much is your home electricity bill

pwurple

bk wrote: »

Really, why would that be? Surely the insurance on a car that costs almost €6000 more, is going to cost more?

Just my own experience, even though we went to a car which had a much larger value than our old one, my insurance dropped because I was in an EV. Maybe Eco-drivers are more conscientious?

cros13

pwurple wrote: »

Just my own experience, even though we went to a car which had a much larger value than our old one, my insurance dropped because I was in an EV. Maybe Eco-drivers are more conscientious?

My insurance on a €62,000 i3 was less than on a 2012 €18,000 Avensis.

Pulsar,

22,300 XE Trim

23,595 SV

26, 395 SVE,

I think the cost of the Leaf is pretty good, + there's no gears, Remote activation of heat and AC.

+ the XE LEaf is 20,500 if you want basic EV with ultra cheap running costs.

cros13

cros13 wrote: »

My insurance on a €62,000 i3 was less than on a 2012 €18,000 Avensis.

62K ? Rex and what ?

@8

Ok, so now I can connect to the Nissan EV app,

Here is actual real life data from the last year, with the exception of last January because I got the Leaf on the 20th and took a few weeks to get car wings working.

I drive quiet hard too.

Below is my monthly data starting February, I will calculate the monthly costs + 10 % for charger inefficiency, the charger is 90% efficient.

This is based on charging at night rate @8.4 C/Kwh, not all my charging is done at night rate and a significant amount has been from the public chargers and the work charge point so the total is substantially less than the total night rate figure.

February 460 Kwh for 2,578 Kms Cost 42.50

March 502 Kwh 2,785 Kms Cost 46.37

April 461 Kwh 2,645 Kms 42.59

May 280 Kwh 1,643 Kwh 25.87

June 397 Kwh 2,415 Kms 36.67

July 347 Kwh 2,095 Kms 32.54

August 414 Kwh 2,532 Kms 38.17

Sept 448 Kwh 2,679 Kms 41.39

Oct 439 Kwh 2,362 Kms 40.55

Nov 448 Kms 2,388 Kms 41.39

Dec 439 Kwh 2,247 Kms 40.55

I can't be bothered to add the total, you get the idea, now think about all the free electricity I got from the charge points and the work charge point. Even if I didn't, that's way cheaper than Diesel, even the most efficient diesel. Even if all your driving was on day rate, it's still a lot cheaper.

You can always add Solar PV and Wind to the mix ! Remember these figures are including 10% for the charger inefficiency which is about 90% efficient !

cros13

Deleted User wrote: »

62K ? Rex and what ?

REx with every option. That's after the grant and VRT credit.

cros13

cros13 wrote: »

REx with every option. That's after the grant and VRT credit.

:eek::eek:

bk

Deleted User wrote: »

Pulsar,

22,300 XE Trim

23,595 SV

26, 395 SVE,

I think the cost of the Leaf is pretty good, + there's no gears, Remote activation of heat and AC.

+ the XE LEaf is 20,500 if you want basic EV with ultra cheap running costs.

Huh?! The XE Leaf is 21,490 per the Nissan site.

And the Pulsar XE 1.2 liter petrol starts 20,695

And you more then anyone know that the XE leaf with no options is pretty rubbish. Very limited range, really no more then a city car.

To get a decent vehicle with any real range performance you have to get the SV for the heat pump and then add the 30kWh battery, cold pack and 6kw charger.

Just so you have some sort of decent range, but still wouldn't have the range of even the XE Pulsar.

Realistically the Leaf is about 5000 to 6000 more then the equivalent petrol/diesel.

You guys talk a lot about all your great cheap and free electricity, while leaving out the reality that you paid more then 5000+ more to get that ability. And unless you drive a lot more then 20,000 km per year, it really doesn't make financial sense.

The SV Leaf compares quiet favourably to the Diesel version.

I have no idea where you're getting it costs 5-6 K more than the equivalent petrol or diesel.

And the electric drive train is vastly superior to diesels or even petrols. and I know there are people who disagree but each to their own.

Like it or not, not having a gearbox is good, having pre heating is fantastic and very hard to part with.

Fuel savings are very real also.

The Heat pump makes a difference but in reality not a huge amount, and when you pre heat you don't use the heat pump.

Once you pre heat off the mains there isn't a lot in the difference. Preheating away from the mains there is no difference.

SV Pulsar 23,595

Leaf SV 24 Kwh 23,990 more equipment. Sat Nav and remote activating of heat and AC, look up the cost of parking heaters !

I'd like to know how you came to the figure of 5-6 K more expensive than the equivalent diesel or petrol ?

Whether anyone cares about not changing gears is up to them auto is worth up to 1,500 more but not available on the diesels.

The 30 kwh does add extra cost granted, but having that would eliminate my need to charge at home for all mu work commute.

steelboots

At the end of the day, different strokes for different folks. From my point of view the Leaf is a second car in my house. I use it to go to work which I can comfortably do with a 24kw Leaf and have 30% remaining. Once in a blue moon do I need to go bigger distances, and if I do then I have the choice of bringing the Leaf and have a few free charging points, or bring the main ICE car.

I'm getting a Leaf SVE 24kw with 6.6 charger for approx ~24K. Tell me what ICE that has Sat Nav, Bose sound system, full leather, all seats & steering wheel heated, remote connectivity to activate heating, for €40 be able to perform full diagnostics, require minimal servicing (no oil changes, timing belts DPF fluid, DPF filter etc..)

On the other hand if you doing large and unpredictable journeys then its not the car for you. To compare one against the other you have to take its purpose into consideration.

Ireland as a nation is very slow to adapt to new technology, I think there is a great opportunity to reduce the €6bn we are spending on imported on fuel and invest in renewable forms of power such as wind and solar, create more jobs and better for the environment. Its only a matter of time and the majority of cars will be electric once the range increases.

I remember I got my first mobile in '97 and I got an awful lot of slagging by my mates, saying it would never take off etc... who's laughing now. ICEs days are numbered, but you'll always have the nay sayers...........

Oh yeah I forgot about the heated front and rear seats and steering !

The 30 kwh will be handy for me, the work charge point will meet 100% of my 135 Km commute.

The faster charging ability on the fast charger will mean I can at least do the Airport run with a lot less time on the fast charger and there is another charger up near the airport or newlands or Naas. Either way it offers a lot more routes.

Maybe if I adjust my speed I can make the entire Airport tun on one charge.

cros13

bk wrote: »

Realistically the Leaf is about 5000 to 6000 more then the equivalent petrol/diesel.

The SV Leaf is higher spec than the SVE Pulsar.

The SV Leaf has the following that is either not included in the SV Pulsar or an option for extra charge:
NissanConnect 2
DAB
Rear View Camera
Auto Hill Hold
iPod connectivity
A bigger touchscreen (7" vs 5")
Privacy Glass
Front sliding armrest (paid option on the SV Pulsar included in the SVE)

KCross

bk wrote: »

Huh?! The XE Leaf is 21,490 per the Nissan site.

And the Pulsar XE 1.2 liter petrol starts 20,695

And you more then anyone know that the XE leaf with no options is pretty rubbish. Very limited range, really no more then a city car.

To get a decent vehicle with any real range performance you have to get the SV for the heat pump and then add the 30kWh battery, cold pack and 6kw charger.

Just so you have some sort of decent range, but still wouldn't have the range of even the XE Pulsar.

Realistically the Leaf is about 5000 to 6000 more then the equivalent petrol/diesel.

You guys talk a lot about all your great cheap and free electricity, while leaving out the reality that you paid more then 5000+ more to get that ability. And unless you drive a lot more then 20,000 km per year, it really doesn't make financial sense.

Im somewhat similar to you, I'm still on the fence but for different reasons. I dont agree with your logic/figures though. I think some of your assumptions are wrong.

You are adding the bigger battery and then using that as a means to say its not worth it. You only buy that bigger battery if you need it.

If a 60kwH Leaf comes out in a few years and is a few grand more again are you going to say that that extra costs is wasted money also making the Pulsar an even better option then?

The point is you pay for the larger battery on the basis that you need the range and you will be saving more fuel costs since you will be doing more driving and hence it will pay for itself.

Importantly, you are also writing off the entire €5k-€6k(which is an over inflated value to begin with) as "lost value" when it wont all be lost. That value is still in the car for resale later. The amount the car depreciates is a worry but every car depreciates so trying to figure out how much it will depreciate is just a guess. Too many factors to guess it accurately, particularly in this EV sector as it is relatively new. So, if you go EV you just have to take a gamble on depreciation unfortunately.... going the PCP route and upgrading every 3 years is a way to insulate yourself some bit from that, but PCP isnt cheap either.

I played around with a few figures to compare Pulsar 1.5d and Leaf. The XE and SV Leaf have the same 24kwH battery and much the same range. By my reckoning based on a Diesel price of 1.19c/ltr and electricity at 8.58c/kwh and driving 20k kms a year, assuming the Pulsar is doing 55mpg, the savings in running costs (tax, diesel, electricity only) are just short of €1000 a year and the XE Leaf is €905 cheaper to buy!

I dont include the cost of PCP or maintenance costs because they should be much the same for 2 new cars under warranty. Obviously for 2nd hand owners the maintenance costs will be a bigger factor and will lean more in favor of the Leaf.

Now, your example, you compared the SV's with 30kwH battery (€3k) and 6.6kw charger(€900). That's fine if you need the longer range. Most people wont if its used as a runaround type car... relatively short commute to work, school runs etc. But just to run the numbers on that.... since you have the larger battery the assumption would be you are doing more driving so it costs €4295 more to buy that SV Leaf than the SV Pulsar but the fuel savings are going to be twice that of the 20k kms example so you will save close to €2k a year and thats all home charging.

If you have an understanding employer who gives you free elec you will save more. So, the extra €3900(rather than your €6k) will be paid for within 2 years and ongoing yearly savings of €2k beyond that. If you keep the car long term you then have to factor the saving the Leaf will have over the Pulsar on maintenance.

The guys that have the Leaf on here have spoken about a few other extras the Leaf has over the Pulsar as well so you need to factor that in and also the greener environment element.

In another few years there will likely be multiple battery sizes/options to choose from and the bigger the battery the more it costs to buy but the main point is that you only buy the battery size you need for the commute you have. If you are not doing the mileage to justify it you have wasted your money, unless its just for piece of mind which is a personal thing.

I think the numbers do stack up for EV based on my research. So why dont I have one you ask!

I'm close to jumping. The depreciation was/is a worry. I also wanted to get some feedback from the folks on here first that have bought the 30kwH to see what that is like. And I need to sit with a dealer and trash out figures after that on my ICE trade-in... my first approach hasnt been favorable for my ICE!

I may buy in the next couple of months.

Im happy to share my calculations if you feel I've misrepresented your figures/reasoning.

Ah come on lads, this thread is about electricity bills.

This EV never makes sense topic has been bet to death on boards.

By all means create another thread to go over it all again and again.

Deleted User

Deleted User wrote: »

Ok, so now I can connect to the Nissan EV app,

Here is actual real life data from the last year, with the exception of last January because I got the Leaf on the 20th and took a few weeks to get car wings working.

I drive quiet hard too.

Below is my monthly data starting February, I will calculate the monthly costs + 10 % for charger inefficiency, the charger is 90% efficient.

This is based on charging at night rate @8.4 C/Kwh, not all my charging is done at night rate and a significant amount has been from the public chargers and the work charge point so the total is substantially less than the total night rate figure.

February 460 Kwh for 2,578 Kms Cost 42.50

March 502 Kwh 2,785 Kms Cost 46.37

April 461 Kwh 2,645 Kms 42.59

May 280 Kwh 1,643 Kwh 25.87

June 397 Kwh 2,415 Kms 36.67

July 347 Kwh 2,095 Kms 32.54

August 414 Kwh 2,532 Kms 38.17

Sept 448 Kwh 2,679 Kms 41.39

Oct 439 Kwh 2,362 Kms 40.55

Nov 448 Kms 2,388 Kms 41.39

Dec 439 Kwh 2,247 Kms 40.55

I can't be bothered to add the total, you get the idea, now think about all the free electricity I got from the charge points and the work charge point. Even if I didn't, that's way cheaper than Diesel, even the most efficient diesel. Even if all your driving was on day rate, it's still a lot cheaper.

You can always add Solar PV and Wind to the mix ! Remember these figures are including 10% for the charger inefficiency which is about 90% efficient !

Back on topic, in case someone missed it.

KCross

Deleted User wrote: »

Ah come on lads, this thread is about electricity bills.

This EV never makes sense topic has been bet to death on boards.

By all means create another thread to go over it all again and again.

@Mad_Lad, I thought bk was the moderator!... Alas I digress again!

KCross

KCross wrote: »

@Mad_Lad, I thought bk was the moderator!... Alas I digress again!

But I'm the Mad_Lad ! :pac:

DrPhilG

My electric bill has usually been around €220 for 2 months. Sometimes as low as €190, occasionally as high as €240.

Bill issued 2 days ago was €255 which is an all time high, but it does cover the Christmas period with lots of lights, the wife beating the hell out of the electric heater beside the bed, and 3 Christmas trees.

The amount added by the Leaf is pretty small in general. I charge maybe 3 times per week, average maybe 70% each time.

When I switched from diesel 6 months ago I started a savings account and set up a regular payment equivalent to what I'm saving on diesel, minus what I'm spending extra on electricity.

6 paydays later and that account has £960 sterling in it.

'the wife beating the hell out of the electric heater beside the bed."

I know what I'd do !!!