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Property Market 2016

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    #242
    SarahMollie
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,843 ✭✭✭SarahMollie


    Bob24 wrote: »
    Surveyor suspected a possible issue with fire safety regulations both within the apartment and in the common areas; and recommended not to go ahead without obtaining recent fire safety certificates. Certificates were requested via our solicitor but never came.

    It was an apartment in Longboat Quay a few months before it was all over the media. I can't thank the surveyor enough - I suspect they will sort the situation eventually but as of today the apartments there are probably impossible to sell (solicitor said the block has been blacklisted by several mortgage providers).

    Wow, talk about money well spent! That would have been a nightmare scenario. Feel bad for the owners though, Longboat Quay will always be known for this.


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    #243
    Bob24
    Registered Users Posts: 10,905 ✭✭✭✭Bob24


    SarahMollie wrote: »
    Feel bad for the owners though, Longboat Quay will always be known for this.

    Yes indeed, and to be honest from what I know about it (I have been renting there for some time), the media reports about the issues seem quite overblown and a bit dramatic. But no matter what the reality is once the bad public perception is there and googling the name of the place brings up that many worrying results, it will definitely impact the selling potential and value of the properties - so yes glad we escaped the drama.


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    #244
    gaius c
    Registered Users Posts: 3,528 ✭✭✭gaius c


    Michael D Not Higgins wrote: »
    Yeah this does matter, undisturbed asbestos won't cause a problem. The big issue is the EA not telling the following bidders, which will cost them a survey to find out.
    Boiler shed roof. Poor condition.
    Vendor is obviously chancing their arm hoping the next prospective buyer will miss it. You'd be surprised how many people skimp on the survey or don't do one at all.

    I don't get upset about EA's lying because I assume it's their default position anyway. Getting upset about them or trying to play games with them is a fools errand.
    I prefer the system here in Scotland where the vendor must pay for a Home Report, which includes a survey, and give this to bidders.
    He who pays the piper calls the tune. I wouldn't trust any survey that I didn't pay for.


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    #245
    Michael D Not Higgins
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 7,223 Mod ✭✭✭✭Michael D Not Higgins


    gaius c wrote: »
    He who pays the piper calls the tune. I wouldn't trust any survey that I didn't pay for.

    It's a regulated system though, you have to get it through a chartered surveyor. I've read about some problems with the survey insofar as they sometimes don't go into enough detail, but that's a judgment call for a buyer if they suspect an issue to get a more in-depth one carried out at their own cost. You couldn't hide asbestos on this survey though.

    Edit: just checked and there's actually a direct question about asbestos in the Home Report.


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    #246
    SarahMollie
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,843 ✭✭✭SarahMollie


    Michael D Not Higgins wrote: »
    It's a regulated system though, you have to get it through a chartered surveyor. I've read about some problems with the survey insofar as they sometimes don't go into enough detail, but that's a judgment call for a buyer if they suspect an issue to get a more in-depth one carried out at their own cost. You couldn't hide asbestos on this survey though.

    Edit: just checked and there's actually a direct question about asbestos in the Home Report.

    Is there come back for the buyer if something is missed by the survey under the Scottish system?


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    #247
    Shedite27
    Registered Users Posts: 9,389 ✭✭✭Shedite27


    For all those that said interest rates can't go any lower, here's the proof that yes they can go into negative figures


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    #248
    Bob24
    Registered Users Posts: 10,905 ✭✭✭✭Bob24


    Shedite27 wrote: »
    For all those that said interest rates can't go any lower, here's the proof that yes they can go into negative figures

    Yes, central bank rates have a tiny margin to temporarily go down (negative rates can only last for a limited period and are never significantly below 0), and infinite margin to go up.

    Rates could go down a few basis points for a period, but a long term downwards trend is technically impossible. The trend can be a flat one or an increase. And while rate can remain flat or a while (which will probably be the case for a few years), it is reasonable to think it will not last forever and they will have to go up at some point.


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    #249
    gaius c
    Registered Users Posts: 3,528 ✭✭✭gaius c


    Michael D Not Higgins wrote: »
    It's a regulated system though, you have to get it through a chartered surveyor. I've read about some problems with the survey insofar as they sometimes don't go into enough detail, but that's a judgment call for a buyer if they suspect an issue to get a more in-depth one carried out at their own cost. You couldn't hide asbestos on this survey though.

    Edit: just checked and there's actually a direct question about asbestos in the Home Report.

    We also have a regulated building system that should prevent new builds being fire hazards from the day they are built...

    I'm not a very trusting soul and when it comes to Irish property/accommodation, I have found that it is the safest approach.


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    #250
    SarahMollie
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,843 ✭✭✭SarahMollie


    gaius c wrote: »
    We also have a regulated building system that should prevent new builds being fire hazards from the day they are built...

    I'm not a very trusting soul and when it comes to Irish property/accommodation, I have found that it is the safest approach.

    Well during the time that the well known fire hazzards were built, we had a system of regulation that was based on self regulation.

    Absolute nonsense.


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    #251
    Michael D Not Higgins
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 7,223 Mod ✭✭✭✭Michael D Not Higgins


    SarahMollie wrote: »
    Is there come back for the buyer if something is missed by the survey under the Scottish system?

    I'm not entirely sure. I think the idea behind the Home Report is to give an overview of the condition of the property and if any potential issues are highlighted then it's up to the buyer to do their own due diligence.

    Nonetheless, it would stop dodgy EAs like above claiming the previous buyer's finance fell through rather than hiding something wrong with the property.


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    #252
    Bob24
    Registered Users Posts: 10,905 ✭✭✭✭Bob24


    Dublin city centre has no new houses or flats for sale

    "Just eight of the 56 developments have apartments for sale and, of these, only two are in the [Dublin] city council area.

    All are significantly above the affordability threshold and outside the city centre. "


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    #253
    Michael D Not Higgins
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 7,223 Mod ✭✭✭✭Michael D Not Higgins


    gaius c wrote: »
    We also have a regulated building system that should prevent new builds being fire hazards from the day they are built...

    I'm not a very trusting soul and when it comes to Irish property/accommodation, I have found that it is the safest approach.

    True, but similar to what Sarah says above, that regulation was the same as the banking regulation in the 2000s, completely laissez-faire and self governed. If I recall correctly, Longboat Quay was signed off with a note from the fire engineer that he hadn't seen the building in construction, which was completely allowable under the system in force at the time.

    I did find this which seems to indicate that the Home Report looks for surface problems and a full structural survey may still be needed but at least there's a legal liability on the surveyor for something they should have spotted. http://scotland.shelter.org.uk/get_advice/advice_topics/finding_a_place_to_live/buying_a_home/valuations_and_surveys
    It at least ensures the impartiality of the surveyor as they have a duty to all parties.


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    #254
    SarahMollie
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,843 ✭✭✭SarahMollie


    Bob24 wrote: »
    Dublin city centre has no new houses or flats for sale

    "Just eight of the 56 developments have apartments for sale and, of these, only two are in the [Dublin] city council area.

    All are significantly above the affordability threshold and outside the city centre. "

    This is all just really disappointing. There are half finished developments around the 3Arena for example that surely would be wroth while to finish off. Its high time developers were forced to "use it or lose it" when it comes to sitting on assets like this which are vital to the developme.nt of the city


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    #255
    yqtwqxqm
    Registered Users Posts: 422 ✭✭yqtwqxqm


    Bob24 wrote: »
    Dublin city centre has no new houses or flats for sale

    "Just eight of the 56 developments have apartments for sale and, of these, only two are in the [Dublin] city council area.

    All are significantly above the affordability threshold and outside the city centre. "

    It wont be long until you cant get any apartment for under €250 all the was out to Balbriggan at this rate.


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    #256
    yqtwqxqm
    Registered Users Posts: 422 ✭✭yqtwqxqm


    Bob24 wrote: »
    Dublin city centre has no new houses or flats for sale

    "Just eight of the 56 developments have apartments for sale and, of these, only two are in the [Dublin] city council area.

    All are significantly above the affordability threshold and outside the city centre. "

    It wont be long until you cant get any apartment for under €250k all the was out to Balbriggan at this rate.


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    #257
    Michael D Not Higgins
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 7,223 Mod ✭✭✭✭Michael D Not Higgins


    Bob24 wrote: »
    Dublin city centre has no new houses or flats for sale

    "Just eight of the 56 developments have apartments for sale and, of these, only two are in the [Dublin] city council area.

    All are significantly above the affordability threshold and outside the city centre. "

    It's as bad as we all knew, but it's good to have the figures to back it up.


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    #258
    Bob24
    Registered Users Posts: 10,905 ✭✭✭✭Bob24


    SarahMollie wrote: »
    This is all just really disappointing. There are half finished developments around the 3Arena for example that surely would be wroth while to finish off. Its high time developers were forced to "use it or lose it" when it comes to sitting on assets like this which are vital to the developme.nt of the city

    Yes - time to understand what is preventing ANY new builds from reaching the market at a price a decent number of people can afford and to address it whatever it is (tax, regulations, zoning, speculators sitting on land, I don't care ... but the solution is NOT to relax lending rules for people to start contracting unsustainable mortgages again so that we have another banking crisis and wreck the economy one more time).

    When a country is not able to build homes at a price average employed people can afford without contracting unsustainable debt, something has to be wrong.


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    #259
    Shedite27
    Registered Users Posts: 9,389 ✭✭✭Shedite27


    Bob24 wrote: »
    Dublin city centre has no new houses or flats for sale

    "Just eight of the 56 developments have apartments for sale and, of these, only two are in the [Dublin] city council area.
    Doesn't sentence 1 (no new developments of flats for sale in DCC) contradict sentence 2 (2 new developments of flat for sale in DCC)? :confused:


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    #260
    Michael D Not Higgins
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 7,223 Mod ✭✭✭✭Michael D Not Higgins


    Shedite27 wrote: »
    Doesn't sentence 1 (no new developments of flats for sale in DCC) contradict sentence 2 (2 new developments of flat for sale in DCC)? :confused:

    They're within the city council area but outside the city centre.


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    #261
    quadrifoglio verde
    Registered Users Posts: 3,670 ✭✭✭quadrifoglio verde


    Bob24 wrote: »
    Yes - time to understand what is preventing ANY new builds to reach the market at a price a decent number of people can afford and to address it whatever it is (tax, regulations, zoning, speculators sitting on land, I don't care ... but the solution is NOT to relax lending rules so that people start contracting unsustainable mortgages again so that we have another banking crisis and wreck the economy one more time).

    When a country is not able to produce homes at a price average employed people can afford without contracting unsustainable debt, something has to be wrong.

    This is so vital and is why I'm glad the lending rules came in.
    Most people want to buy and as we know from before if they can borrow more, they will


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    #262
    Barely Hedged
    Closed Accounts Posts: 992 ✭✭✭Barely Hedged


    Bob24 wrote: »
    Dublin city centre has no new houses or flats for sale

    "Just eight of the 56 developments have apartments for sale and, of these, only two are in the [Dublin] city council area.

    All are significantly above the affordability threshold and outside the city centre. "

    450 non new units >= 2 bed for sale in the postcodes 1-10 for <= 300k. What's the problem?


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    #263
    Bob24
    Registered Users Posts: 10,905 ✭✭✭✭Bob24


    Barely Hedged wrote: »
    450 non new units >= 2 bed for sale in the postcodes 1-10 for <= 300k. What's the problem?

    Different topic.
    Original article and discussion are about the lack of availability of new builds at affordable prices.


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    #264
    SarahMollie
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,843 ✭✭✭SarahMollie


    Bob24 wrote: »
    Different topic.
    Original article and discussion are about the lack of availability of new builds at affordable prices.

    Agree - the real issue is lack of supply and growing demand. Without new units this is never going to get better so the article highlights a very real problem.


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    #265
    yqtwqxqm
    Registered Users Posts: 422 ✭✭yqtwqxqm


    I doubt the city center will ever have new builds at affordable prices though.


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    #266
    SarahMollie
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,843 ✭✭✭SarahMollie


    yqtwqxqm wrote: »
    I doubt the city center will ever have new builds at affordable prices though.

    True, and its not even really the prices that bother me that much, I think the Central Bank Rules seem to be stopping prices racing ahead. There needs to be more building activity going on though.


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    #267
    Bob24
    Registered Users Posts: 10,905 ✭✭✭✭Bob24


    yqtwqxqm wrote: »
    I doubt the city center will ever have new builds at affordable prices though.

    Yes - but what the report is saying is that the city centre has no new builds whatsoever though, regardless of the price (as mentioned by SarahMollie earlier there is definitely land available, and there have been reports confirming this recently: "More than 61 hectares of vacant or derelict land, spread over 282 sites in central Dublin, could be developed for homes or commercial buildings, according to Dublin City Council").

    When they are talking about the lack affordable options they are talking about Dublin city as a whole (which I think is an issue).


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    #268
    Barely Hedged
    Closed Accounts Posts: 992 ✭✭✭Barely Hedged


    Bob24 wrote: »
    Different topic.
    Original article and discussion are about the lack of availability of new builds at affordable prices.

    Hardly a mutually exclusive topic


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    #269
    Sleepy
    Registered Users Posts: 24,196 ✭✭✭✭Sleepy


    Are there that many that want to live in the city centre? It's a bit of a social housing ghetto tbh.


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    #270
    SarahMollie
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,843 ✭✭✭SarahMollie


    Sleepy wrote: »
    Are there that many that want to live in the city centre? It's a bit of a social housing ghetto tbh.

    Thats hardly true. Plenty of people would love to be more central, especially young people. The docklands are part of the city center in my opinion and they're the most in demand location in the country.


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    #271
    Barely Hedged
    Closed Accounts Posts: 992 ✭✭✭Barely Hedged


    Sleepy wrote: »
    Are there that many that want to live in the city centre? It's a bit of a social housing ghetto tbh.

    Replace social housing ghetto with centre of employment and innovation


This discussion has been closed.
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