Howa 1500 .223 cal

Bad_alibi

Recently got a licence granted on the Howa 1500 in .223 cal. Any one out there shooting one of these. Is there any particular ammo it loves or hates.
I'm also looking for a set of mounts and rings. Is it true that the Remington 700 bases fit the Howa.

Cass

Bad_alibi wrote: »

Recently got a licence granted on the Howa 1500 in .223 cal. Any one out there shooting one of these. Is there any particular ammo it loves or hates.

Nothing over 55gr, and stay well clear of the Fiocchi 50gr HP. The BT ones are fine, but the HP are dirt. 1.5-2 inch group at 100 yards. It's hard as they are very cheap, but they really are terrible in the rifle.

Surprisingly the Hornady 40gr were like lasers in it. They have no drop/adjustment from muzzle, with 100 yard zero, out to 200 yards. However they are pricey (for the caliber) and not easily sourced.

I'm also looking for a set of mounts and rings. Is it true that the Remington 700 bases fit the Howa.

Yes & no.

Yes the Remmy two piece bases will work, but no the one piece Remmy rail will NOT work. There is not the full alignment of all the mounting points (from rail to receiver).

Besides this is only relevant if you have a spare Remmy rail sitting around. If not, then just order the Make/model specific one.

FISMA.

Bad_alibi wrote: »

Recently got a licence granted on the Howa 1500 in .223 cal.

Congratulations. Welcome to the addiction.

I had good results using Sako Speerheads, FMJ, 50gr and of course, Hornady AMAX.

Did the rifle not come with a base?

I have heard there can be some issues with cross compatibility, but have not experienced any, between the Howa and Remington bases. Online there appears to be a bit of chatter that 1-piece rails are not cross compatible.

Here's a nice base by NightForce at Optics Planet. Since 700 is not mentioned, I bet they are incompatible.

What base were you interested in: 2-piece, 1-piece, Picatinny, weaver?
Ideally, you would be looking for parts to fit the Weatherby Vanguard which is stated on the Optics Planet page. However, with the plethora of parts for the 700, I understand your interest.

I have: two piece, one piece, weaver, and picatinny rails/bases on my 700. If you have a base in mind, post it here. If I have the same setup, I will see if it works on both, or whichever.

Cass

FISMA. wrote: »

Online there appears to be a bit of chatter that 1-piece rails are not cross compatible.

I say they won't fit, because i have one piece and two pieces bases for my Remington 5R (it's a 700 SA). I tried the one piece rail (made for Remington 700 SA) when i got the Howa (1500 in 223) and it did not fit it. The two piece base did. I'll try to explain why.

The one piece has four holes for mounting as does the two piece bases (except the two piece has two holes per base). The gaps between holes are what you measure to find out the rail/bases you need. In Remington and Howa the gaps between the holes are identical in that the gap from the first to second hole, and the gap from the third to fourth hole are the same. The difference is the gap between these two sets of holes. On the Howa it's 6 mm longer than with the Remington.

So the one piece does not work because only two of the four holes will line up. The two piece bases work because the gap between the sets of holes is not set. I've outlined it in a diagram below.

A = Gap between first set of holes
B = Gap between first and second set of holes
C = Gap between second set of holes.

So on a Remington short action and Howa Short action A & C are the same. It's B that is slightly longer on the Howa and why a one piece won't work, whereas a two piece will.

Bad_alibi

Cass wrote: »

Nothing over 55gr, and stay well clear of the Fiocchi 50gr HP. The BT ones are fine, but the HP are dirt. 1.5-2 inch group at 100 yards. It's hard as they are very cheap, but they really are terrible in the rifle.

Surprisingly the Hornady 40gr were like lasers in it. They have no drop/adjustment from muzzle, with 100 yard zero, out to 200 yards. However they are pricey (for the caliber) and not easily sourced.

Yes & no.

Yes the Remmy two piece bases will work, but no the one piece Remmy rail will NOT work. There is not the full alignment of all the mounting points (from rail to receiver).

Besides this is only relevant if you have a spare Remmy rail sitting around. If not, then just order the Make/model specific one.

I have a few boxes of Remington UMC 50gr HP & a box of Hornady 55gr SP.

What's the best cheap and cheerful round till I get the initial plinking out of my system.

From researching online it does seem the single rail isn't interchangable but the two piece bases are. For handiness I'll probably go with the two piece bases to start and I'll order a single rail down the line.

Cass

I have gotten best results with ballistic tipped stuff. Hp and SP are second and third, but that is down to the bullet design over the rifle's preference to shoot them.

The cheapest and "best" (cost wise) for plinking i can think of is the American Eagle stuff. 55gr FMJ. I get it for €12 per 20 in the Midlands range. This is only slightly more expensive than the Fiocchi HP at €27-€29 per 50, but far more accurate and reliable. The Fiocchi works out at approx €0.55 per round while the AE works out at €0.65 per round.

The Remington UMC stuff was quite good in the rifle. I used the 45gr HP stuff and got fairly decent results, but i think prices per box are €18 depending on where you buy which leave it at €0.90 per round.

Lastly the Hornady steel match. They are 55gr hp, come in boxes of 50 like the Fiocchi, but are much better in terms of performance and consistency. Problem is they don't last long when dealers get them in so keeping a steady supply is difficult. Price per box (50) is average of €29 making it the same as Fiocchi, €0.57 per round.

I tried some heavier stuff in the Howa such as 62gr, and 75 gr just for curiosity sake. They were dreadful. I mean truly dreadful. The 62gr stuff as fairly well spread out and group sizes were terrible, but the 75 gr stuff was brutal. I even got a key holed round at 100 yards (fairly sure it was anyway as the hole was misshapen.

Bad_alibi

FISMA. wrote: »

Congratulations. Welcome to the addiction.

I had good results using Sako Speerheads, FMJ, 50gr and of course, Hornady AMAX.

Did the rifle not come with a base?

I have heard there can be some issues with cross compatibility, but have not experienced any, between the Howa and Remington bases. Online there appears to be a bit of chatter that 1-piece rails are not cross compatible.

Here's a nice base by. Since 700 is not mentioned, I bet they are incompatible.

What base were you interested in: 2-piece, 1-piece, Picatinny, weaver?
Ideally, you would be looking for parts to fit the Weatherby Vanguard which is stated on the Optics Planet page. However, with the plethora of parts for the 700, I understand your interest.

I have: two piece, one piece, weaver, and picatinny rails/bases on my 700. If you have a base in mind, post it here. If I have the same setup, I will see if it works on both, or whichever.

Thanks fisma, been looking for a .223 for a while now. Glad I went with the Howa. Does the one piece rail make it awkward loading the rifle.
Would you recommend the weaver or picatinny. I've a bushbell banner trophy scope at the min and I'll stick that one for the time been.

I've seen the drop in magazine replacement for the rifle. Is it worth doing ??

Cass

Bad_alibi wrote: »

Does the one piece rail make it awkward loading the rifle.

As in cycling the bolt? Not at all. If you mean loading, then not at all again.

I've seen the drop in magazine replacement for the rifle. Is it worth doing ??

Absolutely. I done it with the Remington and the Howa came with one in it (done a swap with another Boards.ie). Much easier to load, and simply more convenient to have the mag.

Here it is:

Bad_alibi

Cass wrote: »

As in cycling the bolt? Not at all. If you mean loading, then not at all again.

Absolutely. I done it with the Remington and the Howa came with one in it (done a swap with another Boards.ie). Much easier to load, and simply more convenient to have the mag.




I meant loading the rounds.

Where would you recommend for sourcing the mag replacement, I've seen two versions online are they both Interchangable with each other's magazines.

That's a sweet setup you have there Cass. I love the thumb hole stock.

Bad_alibi

Need to get the rifle threaded for a mod any recommendations for someone in Leinster.
And while we're at it I'll take recommendations for a mod as well

Cass

Bad_alibi wrote: »

I meant loading the rounds.

Doesn't cause any problems at all lad.

Where would you recommend for sourcing the mag replacement, I've seen two versions online are they both Interchangable with each other's magazines.

You can pick them up fairly easily in most online shops. America is cheap but, and i found this out within the last month, more and more places point blank refuse to ship mags, etc. to Ireland. Something to do with a tightening up on Federal law. One woman even said she'd rather ship me a handgun than a magazine (she was joking by the way). It's gone seriously tight, plus with the Dollar so strong against the Euro, and once you factor in shipping, duty, tax, etc. it can as cheap and definitely easier to buy from home.

Check the lads in the North. Two or three of them are suppliers of Brownells UK stuff.

My system is an ATI. It's not very interchangeable with other systems, but some systems can be. Make sure you check out the interchangeability of mags from different suppliers before buying if this is important to you.

That's a sweet setup you have there Cass. I love the thumb hole stock.

Thanks very much, but I cannot take credit for that. The previous owner done the work, but had he not i would have went that way as it's the best method to get the most from the rifle. It's why i done the deal with him. Anyone that takes care of their stuff and does this kind of work is someone you can trust. IMO.

She has the thumbhole stock, is glass/pillar bedded, has a Timney trigger, and is threaded for a suppressor.

Bad_alibi wrote: »

Need to get the rifle threaded for a mod any recommendations for someone in Leinster.

The two guys i'd recommend would be Enda Walsh or Dominic Byrne. Top craftsmen and do an invisible thread cap for the barrel.

And while we're at it I'll take recommendations for a mod as well

Wow. How long is a piece of string. You'll get as many recommendations for Mods as you would for ammo, guns, etc. It's a personal choice. Here is a review i've done on some of the ones i've owned. The one i currently have on the Howa is a T4 AR. It's compact, light, and very effective.

• Ase Utra S5/Jet-Z = €380
• T8 = €270
• Wildcat Predator = €295
• ATec Maxim = €300

I have/had all four of them. I've given some observations based on usage and the rifles they were used on below.



An Ase Utra S5 on a .308 & .243

• Great mod, great results with little to no difference in POI out to 300yds with it on or off.
• Easy enough to clean.
• Best sound reduction.
• Heavy on the end of the barrel.
• More expensive than most other mods.
• Tough wearing and will last as long as the owner if treated right.

T8 on 30-06 and .243

• Good on the .243 and 30-06, but difference in POI with mod on was 7" at 200yds.
• Prone to rusting.
• No more difficult to clean than an Ase, etc.
• Screws down over barrel so reducing excess weight on the end of the rifle.
• Has a resonance when fired.
• Cheapest of the current available stock of mods.
• Lighter than the Ase.

T4 AR on .223

• Difference in POI with mod on or off at 100yds.
• Prone to rusting. Needs regular maintenance
• No more difficult to clean than an Ase, etc.
• Screws down over barrel so reducing excess weight on the end of the rifle.
• Cheapest of the current available stock of mods.
• Lighter than some.

Wildcat on .223

• Great mod, and very little in difference in POI with in on or off.
• Lighter than the Ase and ( i think) the T8.
• Screw down over the barrel for reduced weight.
• Completely comes apart for easy cleaning.
• Baffles can be changed allowing the mod to be used on a .223 up to .30cal wth new inners.
• Polymer housing gives no resonance.
• Cheaper than Ase, but a little more expensive than T8.

A-Tec Maxim on .243

• Lightweight
• Good sound suppression
• Reflex
• Cheaper than most other makes at around €300
• Comes apart for easy cleaning
• Small change in POI with mod on to off.

FISMA.

Bad_alibi wrote: »

Thanks fisma, been looking for a .223 for a while now. Glad I went with the Howa.

You're very welcome. I too am Glad to have a Howa in the safe.

You'll find a lot of knowledgeable lads here, overall sound bunch. Which you have probably already figured out from Cass' replies, of which I am usually in agreement.

Bad_alibi wrote: »

Does the one piece rail make it awkward loading the rifle.

Not in the least. Nor when it comes to ejecting spent rounds.

Bad_alibi wrote: »

Would you recommend the weaver or picatinny.

I will have to check, but I think I like the weaver bases because I was able to get the scope lower and closer to the bore of the barrel. I use both one and two pieces on my hunting rifles and a one piece on my 1000ya rifle. I think if you are going to get some moa on a rail, you have to go one piece.

Bad_alibi wrote: »

I've a bushbell banner trophy scope at the min and I'll stick that one for the time been.

What size bell have you on the banner? Nothing bad to say about Bushnell.

Bad_alibi wrote: »

I've seen the drop in magazine replacement for the rifle. Is it worth doing ??

It is a handy option and nice to have, however, expensive. I looked in to changing over a 700 once. After pricing a new stock and bottom metal, I was not far off of a new rifle.

Have you bases at the moment?

Have you a discipline in mind: hunting, lamping, target, or general merriment?

I think you are set for now. Buy a few boxes of ammo and get out and shoot.

Heavy handed

I've a set of millet bases and rings here that I had on my howa m1500 223. There for a 25mm diameter scope tube. I've sence sold the gun but kept the rings. My friend that I sold it to took the thumbhole stock off it which I had bedded. He might sell that if your interested in it. Drop me a pm if your interested in the rings.

Bad_alibi

FISMA. wrote: »

You're very welcome. I too am Glad to have a Howa in the safe.

You'll find a lot of knowledgeable lads here, overall sound bunch. Which you have probably already figured out from Cass' replies, of which I am usually in agreement.


Not in the least. Nor when it comes to ejecting spent rounds.


I will have to check, but I think I like the weaver bases because I was able to get the scope lower and closer to the bore of the barrel. I use both one and two pieces on my hunting rifles and a one piece on my 1000ya rifle. I think if you are going to get some moa on a rail, you have to go one piece.


What size bell have you on the banner? Nothing bad to say about Bushnell.



It is a handy option and nice to have, however, expensive. I looked in to changing over a 700 once. After pricing a new stock and bottom metal, I was not far off of a new rifle.

Have you bases at the moment?

Have you a discipline in mind: hunting, lamping, target, or general merriment?

I think you are set for now. Buy a few boxes of ammo and get out and shoot.

I've a 50mm bell on the bushnell.

When it comes to a discipline, I think I'll have a little for column A,B,C & D

Bad_alibi

Can I ask what thread should the barrel be cut in is it (1/2x28)

Cass

1/2" unf This way its common and you can buy and sell accessories easily.