Tyson Fury Hate Crime - Really?

BattleCorp

http://www.independent.co.uk/sport/general/boxing/tyson-fury-police-question-boxer-homosexuality-comments-hate-crime-a6765366.html

Tyson Fury is apparently in trouble with police over an alleged hate crime. I've looked at his comments. While they wouldn't be everyone's cup of tea, what he said wasn't what I would consider to be a hate crime. He expressed an opinion, an unpopular one, but nothing I would consider to be criminal.

I don't believe this but if I said "I hate gays", how is that a hate crime? What crime has been committed?

If I said "Lets kill gays", then yes, I reckon that would be a hate crime.

Am I wrong about this?

smash

BattleCorp wrote: »

I don't believe this but if I said "I hate gays", how is that a hate crime? What crime has been committed?

The crime of hatred?

BattleCorp

smash wrote: »

The crime of hatred?

I hate turnips. Does that count?

smash

BattleCorp wrote: »

I hate turnips. Does that count?

No, they're not real people!

BoJack Horseman

When the media say "police investigation"... what the reality is, is that the police have said they will "get around to taking a statement from a complainant."

So.... something the old bill do 10,000 times a day.

Kev W

BattleCorp wrote: »

http://www.independent.co.uk/sport/general/boxing/tyson-fury-police-question-boxer-homosexuality-comments-hate-crime-a6765366.html

Tyson Fury is apparently in trouble with police over an alleged hate crime. I've looked at his comments. While they wouldn't be everyone's cup of tea, what he said wasn't what I would consider to be a hate crime. He expressed an opinion, an unpopular one, but nothing I would consider to be criminal.

I don't believe this but if I said "I hate gays", how is that a hate crime? What crime has been committed?

If I said "Lets kill gays", then yes, I reckon that would be a hate crime.

Am I wrong about this?

It's not that his comments are being treated as a hate crime, it's that he's been accused of a hate crime following his comments. They're separate incidents.


Edit to add: On further inspection I was wrong, some idiot has actually accused him of a hate crime based purely on his comments.

NachoBusiness

What did he say, exactly? I can't read the whole article, I'm wearing a towel.

cowboyBuilder

I agree, his comments are idiotic, I wouldn't agree with them,
but it's not inciting to hatred or commit acts of violence against anyone.

Let him have his opinion.

seamus

Any private citizen is entitled to make a complaint to the police about the behaviour of any other citizen.

In this case a single person has made a complaint about Tyson Fury's remarks. It doesn't mean he's in trouble with the police, it doesn't even mean they're going to talk to him about it. Total non-story.

The guy sounds like a dick anyway. Wouldn't surprise me if he's in the closet. People who really hate homosexuals are often just trying to mask their own homosexuality.

smash

cowboyBuilder wrote: »

I agree, his comments are idiotic, I wouldn't agree with them, but it's not inciting to hatred or commit acts of violence against anyone.

Mr Fury, who is still in the running for the sports Personality of the Year award after winning the world heavyweight boxing title, has appeared to compare gay people with paedophiles on several occasions.

He's a public figure and a role model. His words are listened to by a lot of people. Public announcements to his fans that gay people are wrong, or evil or whatever he said is "inciting to hatred".

hatrickpatrick

Another pathetic chapter in the modern PC brigade's attempt to kill free speech.

The guy is an absolute douchebag of epic proportions, but he can say whatever the hell he wants.

tommyboy2222

Generation Snowflake. SJWs are idiots.

robertpatterson

seamus wrote: »

Any private citizen is entitled to make a complaint to the police about the behaviour of any other citizen.

In this case a single person has made a complaint about Tyson Fury's remarks. It doesn't mean he's in trouble with the police, it doesn't even mean they're going to talk to him about it. Total non-story.

The guy sounds like a dick anyway. Wouldn't surprise me if he's in the closet. People who really hate homosexuals are often just trying to mask their own homosexuality.

By that logic people who really love homosexuals are really heterosexual

murphyebass

God he indo really is a rag of a paper.

Outside of that this is a complete non story.

The man is an idiot.

What he said is hit opinion and nothing more.

recylingbin

seamus wrote: »

The guy sounds like a dick anyway. Wouldn't surprise me if he's in the closet. People who really hate homosexuals are often just trying to mask their own homosexuality.

So what you're saying here, unless I'm misinterpreting you, is that gays are horrible and two faced?

Duggy747

He's entitled to his opinions, as idiotic as they are, just as much as others are to point out why they're idiotic.

smash

hatrickpatrick wrote: »

The guy is an absolute douchebag of epic proportions, but he can say whatever the hell he wants.

Can he though? Because I'm sure if someone said they hated travellers there'd be an awful backlash against them! People can't just go around spouting hatred and not expect to get called up on it.

Kev W

smash wrote: »

Can he though? Because I'm sure if someone said they hated travellers there'd be an awful backlash against them!

Backlash, sure, but not calls for an arrest!

osarusan

Just saying it doesn't make it crime surely, as long as it doesn't constitute incitement and so on.

He'd have to do something, and it be shown that what he did was down to hatred, for it to be a hate crime.

Badly Drunk Boy

The petition to have his name removed from the BBC Sport Personality Of The Year by some gay group is probably part of this campaign against him. He sounds like a bit of a neanderthal but I don't know why people get themselves worked up about it. And I'm sure some elements of the media will downgrade him from being English to an Irish traveller if the campaign gathers enough momentum. :pac:

http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-35031110

Kev W

Badly Drunk Boy wrote: »

The petition to have his name removed from the BBC Sport Personality Of The Year by some gay group is probably part of this campaign against him. He sounds like a bit of a neanderthal but I don't know why people get themselves worked up about it. And I'm sure some elements of the media will downgrade him from being English to an Irish traveller if the campaign gathers enough momentum. :pac:

http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-35031110

One person called for his arrest, it's not a "campaign".

His name should be removed from the SPOTY running. If it were Athlete of the Year it would be a different story but to give him the Sports Personality of the Year Award after spewing his venom like that would be tantamount to approval of what he's said.

murphyebass

Badly Drunk Boy wrote: »

The petition to have his name removed from the BBC Sport Personality Of The Year by some gay group is probably part of this campaign against him. He sounds like a bit of a neanderthal but I don't know why people get themselves worked up about it. And I'm sure some elements of the media will downgrade him from being English to an Irish traveller if the campaign gathers enough momentum. :pac:

http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-35031110

So we'd have a world heavyweight champion boxer yay!

recylingbin

Kev W wrote: »

One person called for his arrest, it's not a "campaign".

His name should be removed from the SPOTY running. If it were Athlete of the Year it would be a different story but to give him the Sports Personality of the Year Award after spewing his venom like that would be tantamount to approval of what he's said.

ERM, they gave it to Ryan giggs one year...

Kev W

recylingbin wrote: »

ERM, they gave it to Ryan giggs one year...

What did he do beforehand that should have disqualified him?

c_man

Let's sort it out in the ring.

recylingbin

Kev W wrote: »

What did he do beforehand that should have disqualified him?

He displayed no discernible personality.

Who is Tyson Fury?

FTA69

Unfortunately these kind of negative perceptions are often the result of being devoutly religious; homophobia is engrained in all the world's major religions and that's just a fact of life. Evander Holyfield said last year that he disagrees with homosexuality as the Bible says so and he's a Born Again Christian, he's full of sh*t but it is his religious beliefs at the end of the day. I imagine if you asked Mo Farah or Amir Khan their positions on homosexuality you would get a similar, if more diplomatic, answer on the subject - but yet these are often held up as role models for young people.

Fury, Holyfield et al should by all means be challenged on their negative comments regardless of what they were based on, as should anyone else coming out with such tripe. But at the end of the day shouting them down, calling the cops and calling on them to be banned off the telly/barred from Croke Park etc isn't going to advance gay rights etc one bit.

BattleCorp

smash wrote: »

He's a public figure and a role model. His words are listened to by a lot of people. Public announcements to his fans that gay people are wrong, or evil or whatever he said is "inciting to hatred".

Nah, can't agree with you there mate.

Kev W

Deleted User wrote: »

Who is Tyson Fury?

What is Google?

BattleCorp

smash wrote: »

Can he though? Because I'm sure if someone said they hated travellers there'd be an awful backlash against them! People can't just go around spouting hatred and not expect to get called up on it.

If I said that I hate travellers, call me up on it all you like, but what crime have I committed?


I haven't wished anything bad on them, haven't encouraged anybody else to hate them or commit crimes against them? How is saying you hate something/someone a crime here in Ireland?

cowboyBuilder

Kev W wrote: »

What did he do beforehand that should have disqualified him?

Think he beat up his wife really badly ...

He is not entitled to say what he wants. At least he couldn't here. The Incitement to Hatred Act does refer to words which are threatening or abusive or insulting and intended or likely to stir up hatred against certain groups.

I'm not saying he has committed the offence, merely that this "he can say what he wants" is incorrect, assuming the legislation in the UK is similar.

Letree

smash wrote: »

The crime of hatred?

I hate nikki minage. Maybe i could be done for incitement to hatred, sexism and racism too.

Duggy747

Deleted User wrote: »

Who is Tyson Fury?

It literally says it in the headline of the article what he does.

BattleCorp

Deleted User wrote: »

He is not entitled to say what he wants. At least he couldn't here. The Incitement to Hatred Act does refer to words which are threatening or abusive or insulting and intended or likely to stir up hatred against certain groups.

I'm not saying he has committed the offence, merely that this "he can say what he wants" is incorrect, assuming the legislation in the UK is similar.

If I stood up in a room and said "I hate travellers/gays/red heads", have I committed a crime here in Ireland?

Where is the incitement to do anything in that statement?

Kev W

Duggy747 wrote: »

It literally says it in the headline of the article what he does.

Yeah but if you don't know who a famous person is it makes you look cool and smart. Somehow.

Letree

BoJack Horseman wrote: »

When the media say "police investigation"... what the reality is, is that the police have said they will "get around to taking a statement from a complainant."

So.... something the old bill do 10,000 times a day.

The media are the real s**t stirrers in this regard.

Nodin

BattleCorp wrote: »

http://www.independent.co.uk/sport/general/boxing/tyson-fury-police-question-boxer-homosexuality-comments-hate-crime-a6765366.html

Tyson Fury is apparently in trouble with police over an alleged hate crime. I've looked at his comments. While they wouldn't be everyone's cup of tea, what he said wasn't what I would consider to be a hate crime. He expressed an opinion, an unpopular one, but nothing I would consider to be criminal.

I don't believe this but if I said "I hate gays", how is that a hate crime? What crime has been committed?

If I said "Lets kill gays", then yes, I reckon that would be a hate crime.

Am I wrong about this?

Waste of time. Him, Klitschko and the IBF should be arrested for crimes against boxing.

smash

BattleCorp wrote: »

If I said that I hate travellers, call me up on it all you like, but what crime have I committed?

I haven't wished anything bad on them, haven't encouraged anybody else to hate them or commit crimes against them? How is saying you hate something/someone a crime here in Ireland?

He's a role model. By this very nature he is encouraging people to do as he does and believe what he believes. That is inciting hatred.

Nodin

BattleCorp wrote: »

If I stood up in a room and said "I hate travellers/gays/red heads", have I committed a crime here in Ireland?

Where is the incitement to do anything in that statement?

Well it incites travellers, gays and red heads to kick the shite of ye. Christ help ye if theres a gay red headed traveller in the room.

Jayop

His comments live on c4 could perhaps be construed as a crime when he called someone gay and threatened to beat them up, but the beating up was in the context of the boxing ring.

He's a dope regarding to this gay stuff but imo a personal opinion regardless of how odious shouldn't be illegal, and if asked in an interview about those opinions you should be able to be honest.

Medusa22

Hmm, I don't know. I don't believe his comments could be considered a hate crime. They certainly display his homophobia and bigotry and his idiocy, but I don't think his is trying to incite hatred against gay people. I do think though that he is a famous person who has fans and has a platform to speak on these issues so he really should consider what he says before he says it, he might hold those views but personally I think he should keep them to himself. Unfortunately, he has every right to express them, even if I think it is misguided.

Hammer89

cowboyBuilder wrote: »

Think he beat up his wife really badly ...

He rode his brother's wife for eight years.

AlanG

FTA69 wrote: »

Unfortunately these kind of negative perceptions are often the result of being devoutly religious; homophobia is engrained in all the world's major religions and that's just a fact of life. Evander Holyfield said last year that he disagrees with homosexuality as the Bible says so and he's a Born Again Christian, he's full of sh*t but it is his religious beliefs at the end of the day. I imagine if you asked Mo Farah or Amir Khan their positions on homosexuality you would get a similar, if more diplomatic, answer on the subject - but yet these are often held up as role models for young people.

Fury, Holyfield et al should by all means be challenged on their negative comments regardless of what they were based on, as should anyone else coming out with such tripe. But at the end of the day shouting them down, calling the cops and calling on them to be banned off the telly/barred from Croke Park etc isn't going to advance gay rights etc one bit.

I totally disagree with his comments and I am no fan of many aspects of traveler culture but if you look at his background and upbringing he has achieved something remarkable, not just winning the title but getting where he has with no criminal record. He has little education, was raised in a violent home with no stability, his father was in prison and he has suffered more discrimination than most gay people in Western Europe. He focused on boxing and religion which has brought him success. Most of what he said in public would be the view of many religious leaders and most of those running to be the next US president. His main problem is that he is an Irish Traveler and he is not eloquent enough to drape his views behind double meanings.

He seems like a smart guy, if people engaged him instead of attacking him he could probably be converted and be a voice of tolerance among his peers. It's amazing how many people speak of tolerance for religion but attack a traveler with religious views.

Mantis Toboggan

Well he was just reciting the Bible so not sure where all this hate crime nonsense is coming from. The people criticising Fury wouldn't dare criticise the church.

Fury is an easy target, outspoken Irish Gypsy, with little fanbase. Before this **** storm he was a journalists dream, speaking with any of them and famously doing one and two hour interviews and talking about everything and anything under the sun. No media training, no reading scripts for sky sports, no education, yet he's one of the most fascinating sportspeople currently around. He's very intelligent. However behind his back journos were laughing at him. Big fat gypsy isn't going to win anything.

He talked the talk then walked the walk. He devised a plan to take down Klitschko, the man nobody could beat, almost everyone said it couldn't be done. Yet he went out and proved everyone wrong. Suddenly, the big fat gypsy is the undisputed heavyweight champion of the world and the journals cannot stomach it. They then turn against him, every interview is scrutinised and 30 seconds here and there are taken from his hour long interviews to undermine him. His religious beliefs are used against him as a stick to beat him with. Hence he's made to look like an evil person with hate for everyone when he's anything but.

BattleCorp

smash wrote: »

He's a role model. By this very nature he is encouraging people to do as he does and believe what he believes. That is inciting hatred.

Not being a legal person but I would have thought that the law applies equally to everybody, whether they are a role model or not.

I didn't hear him encouraging others to believe what he believes.

Jayop

AlanG wrote: »

I totally disagree with his comments and I am no fan of many aspects of traveler culture but if you look at his background and upbringing he has achieved something remarkable, not just winning the title but getting where he has with no criminal record. He has little education, was raised in a violent home with no stability, his father was in prison and he has suffered more discrimination than most gay people in Western Europe. He focused on boxing and religion which has brought him success. Most of what he said in public would be the view of many religious leaders and most of those running to be the next US president. His main problem is that he is an Irish Traveler and he is not eloquent enough to drape his views behind double meanings.

He seems like a smart guy, if people engaged him instead of attacking him he could probably be converted and be a voice of tolerance among his peers. It's amazing how many people speak of tolerance for religion but attack a traveler with religious views.

Great post

BattleCorp

AlanG wrote: »

He seems like a smart guy, if people engaged him instead of attacking him he could probably be converted and be a voice of tolerance among his peers. It's amazing how many people speak of tolerance for religion but attack a traveler with religious views.

Not very smart when he says in public that the best place for a woman is "in the kitchen or on her back".

Blackwell

smash wrote: »

No, they're not real people!

I know a few...

Kev W

Tyson Fury wrote: »

Well he was just reciting the Bible so not sure where all this hate crime nonsense is coming from. The people criticising Fury wouldn't dare criticise the church.

Nonsense. He wasn't reciting the Bible and the idea that Fury's critics wouldn't dare criticise the church is preposterous.

Fury is an easy target, outspoken Irish Gypsy, with little fanbase. Before this **** storm he was a journalists dream, speaking with any of them and famously doing one and two hour interviews and talking about everything and anything under the sun. No media training, no reading scripts for sky sports, no education, yet he's one of the most fascinating sportspeople currently around. He's very intelligent. However behind his back journos were laughing at him. Big fat gypsy isn't going to win anything.

He talked the talk then walked the walk. He devised a plan to take down Klitschko, the man nobody could beat, almost everyone said it couldn't be done. Yet he went out and proved everyone wrong. Suddenly, the big fat gypsy is the undisputed heavyweight champion of the world and the journals cannot stomach it. They then turn against him, every interview is scrutinised and 30 seconds here and there are taken from his hour long interviews to undermine him. His religious beliefs are used against him as a stick to beat him with. Hence he's made to look like an evil person with hate for everyone when he's anything but.

He thinks homosexuality should be illegal. Journalists did not make him say that. Do you agree or disagree?